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RE: Financial Control in D/s - 11/29/2008 8:21:28 PM   
VAcontroldom


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As always, I think it depends on the relationship dynamic

I feel the person most capable of managing the finances should do so, but I would expect unmarried partners to have separate accounts as well as a joint account. With account minimums down to $100 or less for most online accounts and many brick and mortar banks, it shouldn't be tough to do.

Communication is often the issue as much as the actual income and expenses. I suggest monthly, quarterly, and annual "meetings" that are set up to discuss the status of bills, investments, and budgets. Even if someone is saying they aren't interested, they are probably just intimidated, and over time they will learn.

I have a program I put people through if they are starting from scratch, starting with getting a free credit report every four months, and moving onto budgeting, etc. Within two months most everything is online and working as well as it can. Of course good process doesn't increase the inflow, although it can reduce the outflow.

I would never use lack of access to funds or any other "fear factor" to push a submissive's buttons, I prefer to inspire. But for those relationships that work well with fear, I'd make sure to negotiate a separate account for the submissive where automatic monthly deposits are made in case things don't work out






(in reply to NorthernGent)
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RE: Financial Control in D/s - 11/30/2008 11:17:39 PM   
mstrj69


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   While as a cpa I could control all the finances, I have to say that is not what I would want.  If something happens to me, she has to know how to handle the money.  To accomplish this, I would teach her if necessary.  Will I keep track of what is spent, when it is spent and for what purpose, of course.  Will I insist she have her own checking account, yes.  If she prefers a savings account, then that would be fine by me.  The last thing I want to do is take every penny she has and spend it as I see fit and leave her without any finances or the ability to handle money.
On the opposite side, if she was a CPA and I knew nothing about taking care of money, she would have the major role in our finances.  So, it depends on who is the most capable of handling the finances as to who handles the majority of them.  I have worked with people who said they knew as much as I did and wanted to handle the finances.  In the end, they had no idea as to how to make corrections or find errors the bank had made.  This inability made them much more careful however.

(in reply to VAcontroldom)
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RE: Financial Control in D/s - 12/1/2008 6:10:01 PM   
MasterTslave


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Even tho I am the slave, I have financial control in our house.  Master T is wonderful at many things, but finance is NOT one of them.  Master T has final say on things we buy, but if he wants something, he has to ask me if we can afford said item and if not, when he can...and if it is something that he really shouldn't buy, I get to tell him he is not going to get it.  Sounds a little strange for a D/s relationship, but we don't want to live in a box downtown.

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RE: Financial Control in D/s - 12/2/2008 6:21:18 AM   
silkenfire


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I got into some serious debt when I decided I should be independent and live on my own (without income or savings or employment) for 6 months.

I was frugal enough that it's a lot better than it might have been but still some crazy ideas (why did I need a 4 bed 3 bath for one person)

Anyways, I am now in a situation where I do have to spend more money than I have, and my master has tried to guide me through this. We're living together now, but legally all separate financially. He discovered that I'm a very convincing shopper and that I will indeed spend all of his money on groceries. So this month we are doing a budgeted amount for food (weekly) and watch the spending... but he gives me the money to spend when I'm the one cooking. It's difficult, made moreso by the fact that I make $400 a month in a good month and commute 87 miles 3-4 times a week, causing a large portion of my money to just be gone as gas, before you think about other necessities.I'm a graduate student so I don't have the abilitiy to work more hours.

So, financially, he is in control, in the sense that I ask before buying large things, and that he gives me money for food and pays the rent and utilities (which I can't actually afford my own real share of, and somehow he is ok with my leeching). He also covers repairs to my car. So, I suppose really, even though I have my semblance of control, he is in control because he's the one with the money in this relationship...

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RE: Financial Control in D/s - 12/2/2008 6:32:07 AM   
camille65


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It is extremely unlikely that I would ever sign over control to all my finances to my owner. However he tells me where to put the money (example, when I sold my house 8 weeks ago the sheer amount of money involved scared me and I wholly welcomed his help, boy did I ever lol), he researched CDs and MMAs for me and I followed his instructions.

My math skills are embarrassingly bad and he excels in math. He does not excel in finances so I won't hand over all controls to him, if I did so it is likely my father would have me shot... nor does my owner want the controls to everything financial. I've got complicated finances, it isn't a matter of a weekly paycheck. There are a host of IRAs and other mysterious stuff and my fathers financial team handles it all. If I didn't have access to that team I would probably beg R to take over but I would not sign over because it is family money, not really MY money.

Once my parents are deceased that may all change, or it may not. I don't know. Hopefully the financial advisors will advise me or send me to others but its a bit too complicated for someone not trained in high finance and I'd hate to burden R with stuff that he isn't well versed in.

Heh I just realised what a non-answer my answer is!!


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RE: Financial Control in D/s - 12/13/2008 6:28:42 AM   
kneelingrebel17


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quote:

ORIGINAL: NorthernGent


A manager manages everything - whether or not you like to micro manage or supervise is an altogether different matter.


I agree with that totally. While I do expect to have a say in the major purchases, I also expect him to make the final decisions, taking into account my life goals and dreams. And I totally love ledgers and budgets.  I make them up all the time with different scenarios and stuff. I took an accounting class and I loved it, as dorky as that is. So if my Dom/husband won't eventually let me do the little day to day stuff, it would be like taking away a video game to someone else. But that doesn't mean I wouldn't have to, say, produce the monthly financials for his review.

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RE: Financial Control in D/s - 12/13/2008 8:28:47 AM   
oceanwynds


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When i was married, to my late husband, I didn't work outside the home, nor take care of the finances. After his death, I had to learn to become finanially independent. That was one of my goals when I met Sir, so he has helped me to learn to do this.  

oceanwynds

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RE: Financial Control in D/s - 12/13/2008 1:50:35 PM   
shykitty1


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A good response to someone telling you that you are not his slave because you control his finances is this.  It was his choice for me to do so, if he chose to stop having me do so it would be his choice.  the difference being :HIS CHOICE:

shykitty

(in reply to susie)
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RE: Financial Control in D/s - 12/13/2008 5:37:52 PM   
Rayne58


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I make sure our bills are paid, we each have separate accounts even though we are married, so we each have "control" over our own money   I do most of it through internet banking and He gives me His half of the bills and money for food in cash.  We take turns at paying for petrol and we each pay for our own medications (He has a lot more of those than I do). 

Handing over total control over my financial matters will always be a hard limit. 

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(in reply to shykitty1)
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RE: Financial Control in D/s - 12/13/2008 6:06:51 PM   
Phoenixpower


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my prospective Master is heavily into finance control as according to him I won't have a bank card (though he said he will think about changing that one for me *hope he will*) when I live with him and only have a weekly cash allowance which even includes that when I am out on my own, I will have to bring with me receipts...he is a fuss pot about that.

In general I have times where I do well with money and times where I do not so well. currently i am not doing that well (and my prospective master figured out today that i have 2 more credit cards then I told him before...) and we agreed I will leave my credit cards with him after our next 4 week meeting that I dont use them any further and just take my debit card with me. Might sound scary for some, but isnt as he already has online access to my normal account since 3 months and the cards I leave with him there even he can't ruin them any further anymore).

However, the reason why we decide this is as I will move to him in May (and my cats will move to him in april) and in january and april I receive big chunks student finances...so with my first part I get out of debt with my debit card and part out of it with one credit card. then I have to live 2 months mainly on my student finances as I spent so long with him and therefore cant work here during that time, so will have to get back a bit again into my overdraft (but not as much as I am now) and so when my student money in april comes in I can pay off again my debit card and most of the rest from the remaining credit cards...therefore I am almost debt free when this money arrives in april. My 2 flights for my 3 cats are already booked and paid, therefore there is no further bill coming up

If then I get some money with selling my furniture on ebay and also receive hopefully my deposit back from my flat, then I will be out of it for sure :o) and when I spend this summer with him already then I have a very tiny budget indeed until I return to UK for term times for my 3rd year of studies...I suppose... but at least my finances will be straightened out again after my disastrous year and so thats certainly a better option for me for now. Therefore this precaution is now to ensure to pull the break on hard now and I am glad that it goes this way as my life as a student is a bit too tough for me at the moment financially in expensive uk...

so therefore, I am likely to submit to someone very soon who is heavily into finance control....but right now it is a relief to me when soon I know I don't have to bother about bills anymore and hope so that my fibromyalgia gets better when my stresslevel improves...also he said in the past already that we will do precautions that I can get access to it if emergency situations would occur.


< Message edited by Phoenixpower -- 12/13/2008 6:34:53 PM >

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RE: Financial Control in D/s - 12/13/2008 8:33:25 PM   
DavanKael


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Allowing someone financial control would be one of the more difficult aspects of submission for me because I always controlled finances in my marriage and I also connote financial freedom with the ability to 'escape'if a situation gets untennable.  Certainly not something to which I would be whole-heartedly averse but one in which I would have to work through various anxieties and have massive trust (And still some sort of 'safety net'). 
  Davan

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(in reply to NorthernGent)
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RE: Financial Control in D/s - 12/13/2008 9:07:54 PM   
OrionTheWolf


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~FR~

My property does not touch money, except to accept it while performing. I handle all money, and money matters. I have power of attorney from her, and have set up a savings account with enough to re-establish herself if the need arises. While owned, she retains nothing.

_____________________________

When speaking of slaves people always tend to ignore this definition "One who is abjectly subservient to a specified person or influence."

(in reply to DavanKael)
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RE: Financial Control in D/s - 12/13/2008 9:09:01 PM   
KnightofMists


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quote:

ORIGINAL: berrysurprise

In your opinion when and how do you think it can work?



It works when the individuals in the relationship are doing it the way that is best for them.  That specific approach is going to be different and unique from relationship to relationship. 

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Knight of Mists

An Optimal relationship is achieved when the individuals do what is best for themselves and their relationship.

(in reply to berrysurprise)
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RE: Financial Control in D/s - 12/13/2008 9:53:22 PM   
slavejali


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Master is fully in control of our finances. I spend money on stuff we need to run the house thats just part of my job role. Any large purchases though I have to ask Master.....im still upset about the lounge he wouldnt let me buy...that was a year ago...........grrr

Master just corrected me, it was 6 months ago.

< Message edited by slavejali -- 12/13/2008 9:54:40 PM >


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(in reply to KnightofMists)
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RE: Financial Control in D/s - 12/14/2008 12:18:07 AM   
MisterMonster


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quote:

Someone on page one wrote: In terms of a typical M/s relationship I suppose we have thinks a bit upside down. I control all of the finances both personal and for Master company. It is his choice to have it that way as I am a Finance Director and it makes his life easier which I guess is what it is all about.

I have been told by some here that that means I am not really his slave as I control that area of our lives but as it is something he has told me to do then it works for us.


Y'know, in Feudal Japan, money was considered beneath contempt to a man, so as a result the wife would handle the finances, so much so that the husband wouldn't even ask about it.

So, yeah. The sub handling the money isn't so far fetched a concept.

As to Dear Ol' Mr. Monster? Christ, I hope my slave wouldn't look to me for our financial security...I'm terrible with that shit, really. I'd rather I just put the money in her hands, and not really worry about it. Seriously.

(in reply to slavejali)
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RE: Financial Control in D/s - 12/14/2008 7:35:04 AM   
lronitulstahp


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    In past relationships, my finaces weren't ever discussed.  Even Doms i've dealt with trust me to be pretty responsible financially.  i suppose because i've managed to do well financially for the most part in the past.

The TDHO has expressed some interest in things when He feels that i am not doing what is best for me financially.  He has advised me about a couple things, but not in a heavy handed way.  When He asks a question about something, He expects an upfront answer, and He dispenses His advice in a way that lets me know the difference between a suggestion and an order.  

He is always very good about explaining anything He asks or tells me.  He doesn't have any access to my money or private account info, but He did advise me about strengthening my retirement accounts, streamlining and improving my portfolio,  and about improving interest rates and repairing damage done to my credit rating after my divorce. i appreciate Him showing His care in such ways....

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RE: Financial Control in D/s - 12/14/2008 11:51:43 PM   
DomDG


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quote:

ORIGINAL: susie

In terms of a typical M/s relationship I suppose we have thinks a bit upside down. I control all of the finances both personal and for Master company. It is his choice to have it that way as I am a Finance Director and it makes his life easier which I guess is what it is all about.

I have been told by some here that that means I am not really his slave as I control that area of our lives but as it is something he has told me to do then it works for us.


BULLSHIT as to what someone else said.  I feel a slave that has a skill should use it to help their owner in their life.  To follow that thought I guess I would be a sub for being the one that cooks in our house.  I have a skill there, and a passion for it, but I am the Dom in this house,

If your Master told you stop doing the finances and you refused, that would be an unsubmissive thing.  But for you to do what HE has asked you just reinforces your service to him.


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D
A sub with too much time on her hands should spend more on their knees.

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RE: Financial Control in D/s - 12/15/2008 12:14:21 AM   
DomDG


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quote:

ORIGINAL: berrysurprise

Just wondering what the thoughts are regarding financial control in D/s?

In your opinion when and how do you think it can work?



I can only say that in our life I tend to be 'in control' of the finances, but that's more because we are very Daddy/daughter.  I pay the bills, I make up the shopping list, etc. She asks me before she makes purchases above lunch, etc because she doesn't want to stress our finances too much. 

I think this topic is really less about 'control' and more about personality.  Some people would rather not deal with mundane and it's very easy to let someone else do it.  Some have to micro manage everything.  The difference would be when a financial micro manager would have to 'let go' and let the Dom do as he saw fit.

I do think sometimes it is also a way a slave gives their everything to their owner.

So now that walked all of that around in a big looping circle, I think my answer is...  what every works for whoever is in the relationship.


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D
A sub with too much time on her hands should spend more on their knees.

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RE: Financial Control in D/s - 12/15/2008 8:44:42 AM   
SirDominic


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quote:

Financial Control is the FIRST Control...
Controling The Finances is the quickest way to establish the dynamics of a relationship.


Horse Hockey! But then I am no God, so maybe it is different with a GODdess. Financial control smacks of being a Control Freak.

But then, it is unclear to me what this topic is actually about. Are we talking about relationships where there is a mutual account everyone has access to, and one person is the controlling party? Or are we talking about someone handing over all their financial assets to the other. First good. Second bad. Very, very bad.

This happens in a lot of vanilla relationships too. One person holds all the money cards, effectively making the other completely financially dependent on them. If they break up, the latter has no assets, no credit, often no ability to get a decent job.

Ideally there is a mutual account for shared expenses, and both parties have their own personal accounts, so both have a credit history.

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(in reply to Devi40F)
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RE: Financial Control in D/s - 12/15/2008 12:00:14 PM   
IronBear


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From: Beenleigh, Qld, Australia
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Rover

quote:

ORIGINAL: berrysurprise

Just wondering what the thoughts are regarding financial control in D/s?


I think it's great for those who enjoy it, and structure it sufficiently.

quote:


In your opinion when and how do you think it can work?


I think it works well in situations that are very similar to traditional vanilla relationships in which the head of household had full financial control.  First being a level of trust that has been developed over time and with good reason... not trust that has materialized out of thin air because a collar is offered and accepted.
 
From a legal standpoint, I believe it's important to have property and accounts in both names so as to avoid probate in the event of death, and allow access in the event of medical incapacity.  You might also consider a small, personal, emergency account for the unthinkable.
 
Beyond that, most of the particulars should be negotiated (really thought out and negotiated) and agreed to amongst the partners.  Depending upon what is involved (house, car, bank account, retirement fund, etc) this could be a far more important decision than accepting a collar.
 
John


Generally I believe John has nailed all the crucial aspects. I would like to add though that my experience is exclusively in the M/s arena and not the D/s one. My object is two fold with a girl in a collar (either a Bruin Cottage Collar or my Personal Collar):  
  1. Firstly I want to  ensure that she has some form of ongoing fiscal safety net which is increasing by regular deposits.
  2. Secondly I will want her to contribute to the running costs of the home (Food, Utilities, Internet (if she is a regular user) and Cable TV etc). This will vary from an equal share split between all residents to a token amount.



  My methodology is simple in which she either brings home her wage packet (cash) or her wages are paid into a joint account. With her beside me, the contribution is transferred into the housekeeping account run jointly by myself and my wife Lady Neets. Then most of the balance it transpired into her (the slave’s) personal bank account leaving a small amount which is her allowance and which she can draw against any time with permission. Since her personal account is accessed only by her it is safe but I will do irregular checks and will site and check her statements as they arrive. Not a matter of lack of truest but it is a matter of me taking an active interest in her financial security.


  Because Lady Neets and I are married, there is no thought of a slave needing to have a financial interest in any of my property unless I choose it to be so. In the event of my death (unlikely until the next millennium), documents would be signed and a copy left in my safe with the other left as an addendum to my will.



quote:

ORIGINAL: oceanwynds

When i was married, to my late husband, I didn't work outside the home, nor take care of the finances. After his death, I had to learn to become finanially independent. That was one of my goals when I met Sir, so he has helped me to learn to do this.  

oceanwynds


Interesting comment lass. My wife grew up in a Military home (she is an Army Brat) which was based on the 1950's style family where her Father handled all the finances leaving her with no idea how to work a household budget etc. I have, to train her to handle out finances in the advent of my death, so that no bastard can rip her off (she is a soft touch and has a huge heart), supervised her dealing with all our finances and even thoiugh I could see situations which were going to cost us, I let her make those mistakes (after ensuring that the loss was not devistating) and thus she learned and learned well.... She is one tough cookie now which is good,



_____________________________

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Master of Bruin Cottage

http://www.bruincottage.org

Your attitude, words & actions are yours. Take responsibility for them and the consequences they incur.

D.I.L.L.I.G.A.F.

(in reply to Rover)
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