RE: What is Monogamy? (Full Version)

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sweetwhisper -> RE: What is Monogamy? (12/24/2005 7:45:22 AM)

i just don't get what the problem is... you want "high monogamy", who is saying different? or rather, who says you can't or shouldn't have that? It'syour choice, if you are a straight female searching for a straight male that wants to remain that way and not seek others outside of your relationship, i don't see who would coerce you or try to change that in any way.

Just because you seek a dom and are in this lifestyle doesn't mean you have to be bisexual or poly, and i don't think anyone really assumes that either. There's someone out there for everyone, just don't settle. A year ago, after being divorced for 3 happy years and not wanting to have anything to do with men, i came to the time in my life where i felt ready to begin looking for someone who would meet my needs. i came to terms with the fact that i could easily spend the rest of my life alone if i did not find the person that had all of the qualities i looked for - It was a pretty long list, and i actually thought that chances were slim to none that i would actually find the right person for me - He had to be local somewhat, because i was not going to relocate outside of the state or anywhere too far, he had to be in the lifestyle, had to be a dom, i wanted someone i could have the right chemistry with, someone i had things in common with, someone with a good sense of humor, and that was a big priority, someone with the same views tho not exact but at least basically the same over all values and views on life, politics, religion, etc etc.... although i was never picky about looks i was very picky about height, (since i love tall men [:)] ) i wanted someone who already had "unmentionables" since i have one and i figured that a.) i don't want anymore and b.) he'd have a better understanding of what it is like to have them and wouldn't have unrealistic expectations as far as that's concerned.... well, there were probably a few other things but i can't remember now. Since i was in no rush, i had no plans on settling (because of the fact my first marriage was so rotten i didn't want to go through that again) i made a promise to myself that if the right man for me didn't come along, screw it - i'd be just fine on my own. A week or so after posting my profile on collarme, i met the man which is now my Master & husband - He is everything i was looking for and much much more - i had my list of limits at the time too, but was open to explore and was open to have those limits pushed if the person was right for me. He certainly pushed all of my limits, i gave myself to Him 100%, i considered myself straight before i met Him and He was sincere with me from the start that He would expect me to explore other women, i have done so and have actually enjoyed it very much.Was i coerced? No. when i gave myself to Him i gave myself to Him entirely, mind body & soul, sounds cliche but that's the way it's been for us - i was very choosy about whom i submitted to but once i did find the right one i let go of all hang ups, limits, etc... because there was trust there and unmeasurable love,respect, devotion, loyalty...All in all, candy, to each their own, continue your search and don't astray from what it is you search for, once you do find the right one for you, you will be glad you didn't settle for another.

Best of luck!

Merry Christmas!




Mercnbeth -> RE: What is Monogamy? (12/24/2005 7:51:46 AM)

No heavy pain...

No public play---

No bi-sexuality...

No marks...

Monagamy...

Seeking financially independent, smart, mature, unattached male between 45-55, with no baggage, no history, who will not challenge any of my limits, who will only agree with me, who will be sensitive to my sensitivity and not make me cry, who accepts my intolerance, my lack of understanding, and my lack of appreciation for any perspective, any experience, or any challenge contrary to what I KNOW is true.

Is it possible to find a qualifying partner at a BDSM site? Would this person more likely be a dom or sub?




MizSuz -> RE: What is Monogamy? (12/24/2005 7:53:18 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: afmvdp

Love, despite what some people try to force others to believe is not of a limited supply, it is boundless and endless. Ask anyone who has lost a loved one and was able to love again, did that mean they did not love the prior with all their heart because they are able to love another? How could the heart hold so much love as to be given fully and absolutely to more than one person? That makes no sense. And yet it is nonetheless. Does a mother who has more than one child suddenly have to split the ammount of love they have for both children between them and her husband? So thus love is limited? Or is she able to still somehow manage to love all her children and her husband with the same entirity of her heart?

Does that make her unfaithful to her husband that she loves her children? I would say absolutely not. So likewise how can something such as monogamy hold the same basis in someone's mind? Why is it that someone is not able to love two or more people and love them completly? Now mind you many use the guise of love or attention under a poly life a take it and run with it in a very selfish way, but in my mind if you are genuine in action and deed you can be Monogamous and Poly at the same time, because in the heart and mind you love each one totally and completly.

<snip>

The heart is not an oil refinery, it does not deal with things in limited supply, it should be given freely and openly because it is boundless and unending

<snip>

If you are being loved and loved completly why does it matter so absolutely much to you where else that mans love may be directed so long as it is not taking anything from you?



The more you love, the more you can love and the more intensely you love. Nor is there any limit on how many you can love. If a person had time enough, he could love all of that majority who are decent and just. -- Lazarus Long in Time Enough for Love (Robert Heinlein)

Some folks choose to do it one at a time (for whatever reason). To my mind it's limiting but I don't live in their skin. There is value in focusing on one but historically I end up finding it restrictive. <shrug> Some folks just can't multi task, especially where their emotions are concerned.

To own his each.






ProtagonistLily -> RE: What is Monogamy? (12/24/2005 8:08:44 AM)

quote:

Personally I side with Candystripper in the fact that I prefer monogamy. I want an exclusive relationship with one man where we grow in each other and therefore strengthen our relationship and knowledge of the other with each and every day and keep the distractions out of our lives by not dealing sexually with others.

I am not saying that is best for everyone...I simply prefer it for myself and would not want it any other way.



Prefering monogomy and being judgemental toward everyone else are 2 totally differant things.

Lily




sweetwhisper -> RE: What is Monogamy? (12/24/2005 8:18:08 AM)

I haven't read through the entire thread nor did i read through the entire thread of "Straight Woman Blues" either - but in all fairness, would you say the same thing about her being judgemental of the way others live, if instead of speaking as a straight monogamous female, she were speaking as a poly bisexual female? It's the reverse bias syndrome - I have read countless posts on people complaining that their kinks aren't acceptable, or that they embrace the fact that they are poly and that it's so much better to love more people rather than just love one person, or that they just don't get why someone would just restrict themselves to loving just one person - yet if a person says, as candy has, that they just don't get that mentality, then they are considered judgemental. hmmm.... here's a thought, what if you respect her views as much as you want yours to be respected. [;)]




OscarHargraves -> RE: What is Monogamy? (12/24/2005 8:39:19 AM)

Hi Candy,

I too would prefer a monogomous relationship.

The problem arises when one partner is unable or unwilling to satisfy the other. Love can still be there and neither one wants to break-up over one or two differences so they come to a tentative arrangement that devalues monogamy to allow the partnership to continue. In my case we decided that one or two physical acts, although extremely important to me, were not important enough to throw away 30+ years of marriage. We both wanted the marriage to go on and she decided that I could seek these physical things elsewhere. Please understand that I seperate these from love. What I do with my wife is love and has very deep meaning to me. What I do with my Sub is physical and satisfies only the base lust and urges of both of us.

I truly wish I too could have a monogomous relationship but my life partner is not willing to do some of the things that I need.

I wish you all the best in your search for your One.




IrishMist -> RE: What is Monogamy? (12/24/2005 8:49:16 AM)

quote:

The problem arises when one partner is unable or unwilling to satisfy the other


I disagree with this. 100%

In some cases, notice I said only some...this would seem to say that because my partner is unable or unwilling to satisfy me, I MUST look elsewhere. If I read or understood it wrong, please enlighten me :)

My whole marriage, my husband constantly looked at and admired other women, and would often point out to me what he found most appealing about them. It never once bothered me, because at the end of the day, when all was said and done...he went home with one person...ME.

Honestly, if a man or woman did NOT look at others of the opposite sex ( or same sex for that matter ), and did not admire them....I would be wondering what was wrong lol.




candystripper -> RE: What is Monogamy? (12/24/2005 9:39:53 AM)

quote:

excuse the fire i felt on your original response then pink.

YES straight woman can be part of bdsm,,,I am STRAIGHT, i have never been w/ another woman in my life sexually and inviting one into play w/ Masteer doesnt have to include physicla intimacy....but you seemed to have missed that point.
i can top in public a woman .....in a scene w/ master and myself...no sex, not touching ,just pure mental and whipping, restraining under masters direction....


perhaps you meant *others* in general and not me.....

(as to the rest, no hit n run pink...words still stand on past threads,)

so lets not hijack/and loose this thread, as it can be quite valuable lets just go back to that peaceful place

fyreredsub


Thank you for the compliment on the Op. i must tell you, the behaviors you describe exceed the bounds of monogmy as i use the word. Doesn't make them wrong; and you can go on calling yourself monogamous if you choose, but i would not act as you would...and variety should be a good thing here.

candystripper




candystripper -> RE: What is Monogamy? (12/24/2005 9:44:54 AM)

quote:

High Monogamy??!! This type of term Disgust me.... it's no better that the references,Those universal claims that Slave is better than Sub... Bi is better than straight.... that Poly is better than Monogamy, Men are better than women. Fact is we have our individual perferences that are best for us as an individual... But when we use terms and label that imply valuations better and beyond those of others...... These type of self-serving one-up-man-ships terminologies reflect an intense defensiveness and even prejudical view upon others.

I know a few people that will not be involving themself in this discussion, a thread that is fundamental flawed before it even begins.

Knight of Mists


KoM, Your criticism hurts me; i hold You in some high regard. i cannot see where i have ever claimed superiority over anyone else. i have said i do not interest myself in how others' rum their lives, apart from learning more about BDSM. i have said i do not feel High Monogamy will be a popular choice, but it is my choice. In a million years i would never discard Your friendship because You are poly; and i'm interested in anything You care to share about being poly. All i ask is that You can accept me too.

candystripper




candystripper -> RE: What is Monogamy? (12/24/2005 9:50:51 AM)

quote:

Why is it necessary to claim your form of monogamy is superior: High Monogamy?

Everyone else is below you?

Why not something like "Strict" or "Restrictive" that doesn't include an inherent value judgement?

I have trouble believeing a lawyer didn't do this by accident.

JohnWarren


Seems i have imperiled many friendships because of a poor choice of words. i can explain (in private) why i'm on low energy...and High Monogamy was the terminology my girlfriends and i used in Florida...it is not meant to suggest superiority; but rather extra dedication.

Let me off with some corner time, John. i like You too much to lose a friendship this way.

candystripper




truesub4u -> RE: What is Monogamy? (12/24/2005 10:02:39 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: IrishMist

Hmm, Candy...it's way too early in the morning for such discussions :P

An opinion, and that is all this is...my own POV

I am monogamous. There is no question about that. I could NEVER share a man on an ongoing basis with another woman. I am just too possessive, and too emotional to do so. Does that mean that I am opposed to him having another on occassion. Absolutly not. And it does not contradict what I just said about me being monagamous. When I am with someone, I want only one thing. And that is to make him happy. If that means that he wants to bring another woman home for the night, then I am all for it, because his happiness is more important than a small amount of discomfort I may feel. It in no way means that he is cheating, or that he is looking to 'add' to our family. It just means that he has differnet sexual appetites, and I should go out of my way to appease those. Now you may say...what about YOUR happiness, is that not just as important? Of course it is. But his happiness fuels mine. I feed off his. The happier he is, the happier and more content that I am. If that makes me a fool, then by god, I embrace my foolishness.


.



Thank you Irish, I was sitting here reading the threads, trying to come up with this answer as well. Just coffee hadn't kicked in yet.. LOL
But I would rather know he wants something, someone, and we discuss this, share this. Know this. So I don't have to feel him cheating on me. It's not cheating on me if I know, or see and agree.




IrishMist -> RE: What is Monogamy? (12/24/2005 10:04:21 AM)

quote:

Seems i have imperiled many friendships because of a poor choice of words.


I will be honest Candy...if I was to take these posts that you had written, and just react blindly to them...yes, I would feel as if you were placing your own views and ideas high above those of others. You state your points, and you do so very well, but at the same time...I got the feeling from reading these that you looked down on others who participated in what you consider to be 'cheating', whether it be with permission or not. ( Even though I KNEW that you were not really 'looking down on us' )

The only reason why I do not take offense is because I know that you did not mean for your words or your intentions to sound that way, so I am able to brush the feeling of being put down aside. I do not mean this to hurt you, or to offend you...only to maybe explain why some do take offense at your words ( but I can only speak for myself...in a kind of generalized way )

We each express ourselves in various ways; sometimes I get angry, upset, and just downright rude with certain posts; other times, I just take it in stride and smile my way through it. But I always try to listen, read, and hear what someone else is trying to say, even when their words do not always express that. :)




IrishMist -> RE: What is Monogamy? (12/24/2005 10:07:00 AM)

quote:

It's not cheating on me if I know, or see and agree.


But see, thats where the different dynamics kick in. For me, I do not have to agree or disagree. He does not even have to discuss it with me. If it makes HIM happy, that is ALL THAT MATTERS. It may be mentioned in passing, he may ask my ideas and how I feel about it...but in the end, it matters not if I say yes or no.




truesub4u -> RE: What is Monogamy? (12/24/2005 10:14:11 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: afmvdp

All this talk of Monogamy is basing it purely off of sexual basis. Can someone not cheat in their heart or mind? Is that to be considered being unfaithful as well?


Jimmy Carter was once asked... if he ever cheated on his wife. His quote........

"Only in my mind"




truesub4u -> RE: What is Monogamy? (12/24/2005 10:16:54 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: IrishMist

quote:

It's not cheating on me if I know, or see and agree.


But see, thats where the different dynamics kick in. For me, I do not have to agree or disagree. He does not even have to discuss it with me. If it makes HIM happy, that is ALL THAT MATTERS. It may be mentioned in passing, he may ask my ideas and how I feel about it...but in the end, it matters not if I say yes or no.



I agree with you Irish.... I just know that being upfront about it all makes it easier. I know Master will do what he wants, when he wants, with whom he so desires. At the begining of our relationship, this was discussed is all.




thetammyjo -> RE: What is Monogamy? (12/24/2005 10:22:02 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: sweetwhisper

Just because you seek a dom and are in this lifestyle doesn't mean you have to be bisexual or poly, and i don't think anyone really assumes that either.


I'd say that monogamous is the assumption on most people's minds -- thus the discussion section just for poly folks because we aren't the "norm".





MizSuz -> RE: What is Monogamy? (12/24/2005 10:27:33 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: candystripper

KoM, Your criticism hurts me; i hold You in some high regard. i cannot see where i have ever claimed superiority over anyone else. i have said i do not interest myself in how others' rum their lives, apart from learning more about BDSM. i have said i do not feel High Monogamy will be a popular choice, but it is my choice. In a million years i would never discard Your friendship because You are poly; and i'm interested in anything You care to share about being poly. All i ask is that You can accept me too.




I don't think anyone is critical of your preference. I think what you are seeing is criticism of and reaction to your presentation. If what you want is "high" then does it mean that anything that doesn't coincide with your preference is "low"?

You make it very easy to assume you are judgemental even while giving non-judgementalism proper lip service. Examples would be calling your own preferences "high," reacting vehemently as "no way, no how" if someone even asks if you are bi or curious, assuming that people who share their own preferences with you is them telling you how you should be. Your justifications for not being poly or bi smack of condescension, not personal preference. I liken it to the individual who proclaims their support of desegregation but secretly harbors eversion to mixed couples or wouldn't think of living in a mixed neighborhood (even if they can't admit it to themself). That is your presentation, as I see it.

Granted, it's assumption but that is what I see folks responding to; and then I see you react defensively to their reactions. Nice little drama game with you in complete control. Of course, we could affectionately call it "debate" but why sugar coat it?

Personally, I would never be more than an acquiantance of someone with your mindset. It's not that I have anything personally against you, you seem to be quite intelligent and articulate, certainly erudite; it's just that your view is too narrow for me. (Now, didn't that sound judgemental when in fact I was only stating a personal preference?)

See what I mean?




candystripper -> RE: What is Monogamy? (12/24/2005 10:27:47 AM)

quote:

KoM, glad I saw this before I replied. Really, you said everything I was trying to say. I couldn't agree more that the premise is fundementally flawed.

However, as a student of language, I find that too often it is easy for the misguided to use certain terms to try to elevate themselves and look as if they know what they are talking about when they simply don't have the experience to back up their claims. It's easy to eat up bandwidth with big bold fonts and shocked responses, but when the rubber hits the road, no one's going to be able to intellectualize WIIWD; and if you think you can, you are putting yoruself at a serious disadvantage.

I think those who strive to intellectualize BDSM as a concept and call themselves participants are ruining things more than helping. Unfortunately, the sub vs. slave conversation is as universally nausiating as all of the other 'pecking order' conversations going on right now.

My experience (and when I say that I'm talking about primary experience, not what I think or what I heard someone say or conjecture of some kind) has been that those who are so hell bent on trying to present themselves as better than everyone else are really people who are insecure and don't have much experience. I stay away from them. There is a big differance in kink between asking questions in order to learn more, and doing so in an attempt to discount everyone else and get people to see only one point of view. Folks who continually judge others don't last very long has been my experience.

Honestly, what other people do in the name of monogomy or polygamy isn't really any of my business. What I do based on what my Dominant and I have negotiated as the parameters of our relationship is.

Lily


There was no effort made to place "High Monogamy" above anyone else's pattern of living and to claim there was is to be an alarmist. If you read my entire Op, you would know i think everyone deserves respect and that i realise many BDSM'ers do not practice monogamy of any kind.

Nonetheless i though a discusion of the different versions of monogamy would be useful, given what happend on the "Straight Woman Blues" thread at the end. "High Monogamy" is just a term my girlfriends and i used to describe a type of behaviors which we did not want included in our relationships. More than one couple divorced over porn addictions or cyber-buddies while i was still in Florida. Consequently, we did not want such behaviors in our relationships.

Once again, i find the animus you have mustered up to be based on vapor; if you dislike me; block me. If you dislike straight, monogamous people, don't include them in your life. Why you're so intolerant escapes me. i am always mystified by the intolerance of BDMS'ers at times.

But don't just flame people.

candystripper




candystripper -> RE: What is Monogamy? (12/24/2005 10:32:24 AM)

quote:

Hmm, Candy...it's way too early in the morning for such discussions :P

An opinion, and that is all this is...my own POV

I am monogamous. There is no question about that. I could NEVER share a man on an ongoing basis with another woman. I am just too possessive, and too emotional to do so. Does that mean that I am opposed to him having another on occassion. Absolutly not. And it does not contradict what I just said about me being monagamous. When I am with someone, I want only one thing. And that is to make him happy. If that means that he wants to bring another woman home for the night, then I am all for it, because his happiness is more important than a small amount of discomfort I may feel. It in no way means that he is cheating, or that he is looking to 'add' to our family. It just means that he has differnet sexual appetites, and I should go out of my way to appease those. Now you may say...what about YOUR happiness, is that not just as important? Of course it is. But his happiness fuels mine. I feed off his. The happier he is, the happier and more content that I am. If that makes me a fool, then by god, I embrace my foolishness.

IrishMist


Your version of monogamy is no better than mine; except that yours is working for you and mine would work for me. But you know i like you; differences in how you choose to run your personal life don't affect that.

candystripper




candystripper -> RE: What is Monogamy? (12/24/2005 10:37:01 AM)

afmvdp, i can respect your position...we can both be correct...for ourselves. There are different types of relationships; i know what i want and don't want...and You seem to have things well in hand as well. So i am not trying to change Your mind; just asking for mutual respect.

candystripper




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