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Play Rape ..... Hard Limit! - 8/7/2004 3:04:23 PM   
ThorsHammer


Posts: 49
Joined: 1/1/2004
Status: offline 		Question for "ya' all."

One of the "activities" listed here is "play rape." For me, this is a "very very hard limit" for myself as a Dominant. Not only is it something I won't do, it is something I can't do!

A person eho was very close to me was brutally raped. She was beaten so badly that she lay in the hospital for many many weeks. Inspite of working with a counsellor (sp) she eventually took her own life. I saw the agony she experienced and the devistation it cause her husband and children.

I realize that each of us has our own limits. I, in no way, cast any dispursions upon anyone who enjoys "play rape."

Does anyone else have "play rape" as a hard limit? If so, would you care to share the reasons why.

Donn
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RE: Play Rape ..... Hard Limit! - 8/7/2004 3:09:36 PM   
NightDaughter


Posts: 264
Joined: 1/23/2004
From: Ontario, Canada
Status: offline 		I do to a degree have Rape Play as a limite, as far as it goes to the actaul idea of a take down scene renactment type deal, as I've been in the rape situation a couple of times in my life and for me the flashbacks are noth worth it.

Now on the other hand, I am now just starting to be able to tell my Master to "rape me" when we are playing, it comes out with a stutter as its not easy to say, but he enjoys it cause he knows I tust him with my life.

One thing i can say though is that if he ever wonted to do a take down scene, I would not be part of that picture in any way shape or form, since for me that is a hard limit.

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NightDaughter
My Blog - http://www.livejournal.com/users/nightdaughter/
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(in reply to ThorsHammer)
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RE: Play Rape ..... Hard Limit! - 8/7/2004 4:19:35 PM   
starshine


Posts: 40
Joined: 7/28/2004
From: London
Status: offline 		I was "attacked" when I was 14 - to this day I can't say for sure if it was rape or attempted rape as I had had my drinks spiked to the point where I almost lost consciousness. I do remember kicking, struggling and giving him hell so I like to think that he didn't get as far as he wanted.

However, it took me over 20 years to be able to even mention it to anyone, so "play rape" would be a very, very hard limit for me. I'd go so far as to say that I consider it a total no go area and anyone forcing it would find themselves no longer on the Xmas card list.

In fact, the attack could be one reason I still have occasional trouble in telling myself its "more than ok to submit". Ho hum, *that* can be left for another thread, don't want to hijack this one!

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RE: Play Rape ..... Hard Limit! - 8/7/2004 5:25:45 PM   
kiki blue


Posts: 315
Joined: 1/16/2004
From: Brisbane, Australia
Status: offline 		I don't, it's something I will try with someone I deeply trust. It's just another form of control play.

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RE: Play Rape ..... Hard Limit! - 8/7/2004 5:30:31 PM   
MistressDREAD


Posts: 2943
Joined: 1/1/2004
Status: offline 		Play Rape
concensual carnal knowledge through the
use of force or threat of force for
violent infringement on the personal
dignity of an individual for desired feelings.
hmmm lets look at these two words together
they pretty much conterDICK each other
where one is done for enjoyment the others
done for power and intimadation using sex.
what are the results of play:
power
enjoyment
happiness
excitment
gratification
casualness
acceptance
actions that brings others
together in a positive way

what are the results of rape:
guilt
powerlessness
not feeling safe
denial of feelings
shock
anger
health risks
loss of sexuality
loss of sensuality either masculine or feminine
withdrawn from others
depression

what are the needs of those whom desire to
experiance both aspects of the words
Play Rape?
on the Dominant side:
power
aggression
denie and evade fact
power over sexuality
power over emotions
power over reactions
power in control thru force
power over a lifeforce

on the suplicant side:
use of sexuality against will
shock to emotions to feel
feeling the physical and
emotional reactions of the act
excitment thru loss of power
feeding the mindset of no value
hold guilt for act not in control of

Many whom get into the act of play rape regardless if
man or woman, Dominant or sub/slv are people whom have
assault in their past. Be it physical assault or sexual
assault or any kind of violence inflicted with power and
be they on the giving or recieving end of the violence.
The bottom line is to feel the natural adrenilyn rush gained
by such an act. Many whom practice this kink also incorperate
abduction with in the play rape scene.
What does this mean? Its important with in Our Culture to
understand that in the World today 1 in every 3 Woman are raped
violently against their wills and 1 in 7 Men with 90% of both
being heterlsexual which dispells the myth that its the homosexual
that are the main rape victims. These statistics are where
those same Lifestylers come from in the need to again gain the
* feel * they had which for what ever reason peeked their bodys
reactions chemically and this is again a desired feeling. Of course
this is not what the majority whom were violently raped desire and
is not the norm but then again We are not a part of the Lifestyle because
We are normal every day people in what We choose to practice but
only a few whom have turned a terrible experiance into one thats
enjoyed no matter how weird this sounds for self preservation. This
is why We are Living with in the grasps of Alternate Lifestyles because
We partake concensuallly in that which by societys standards is insane.

The Moral end to a Immoral act
Alltho both Men and Woman Rape
the 99% is done by Men towards
Woman, Men towards men, Men towards
children, and Men towards animals.
The question of why some men rape
is thus connected to the question
of why sexual violence and aggression
is an overlooked action and is tolerated.
This connection exists at a double
intersection: between attitudes and
actions, between violence and notions
of masculinity and power. Men are
all connected to these intersections
because this is where they have grown
up as men.
Men have the power collectively to end rape.
Unfortunately, so far, this male
collective appears to be composed mainly
of men who rape, men who hold attitudes
similar to rapists, and men who
undoubtedly do care in their own personal
lives, yet remain quiet in the community
where rape occurs and only speak up againt
it when it effects them personally.
(RR-PTSD) and (PTSD) are disorders caused
by rape and can be fed by playrape if those
of assault never gained a phychotherapists
help in recognizing the symptoms an get help.

PlayRape is not a limit for Me and I have
been a acting partner in its application
in a concensual scene. My playrape acts
have been Dominant Woman on slave men only.
JMO
My statistics shown are from the rapecrisiscenter of the USA.
http://www.rapecrisiscenter.com

Men's Resource Center
12 Southeast 14th
Portland, OR 97214
(503) 235 - 3433

Men Stopping Rape
306 North Brooks Street
Madison, WI 53715
(608) 257 - 4444

(in reply to starshine)
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RE: Play Rape ..... Hard Limit! - 8/7/2004 6:04:35 PM   
Sinergy


Posts: 9383
Joined: 4/26/2004
Status: offline 		It is not something I generally do.

While I am extremely good at it. Technically it qualifies as taking my work home
with me.

Sinergy

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RE: Play Rape ..... Hard Limit! - 8/7/2004 6:54:08 PM   
Estring


Posts: 3314
Joined: 1/1/2004
Status: offline 		Dread I resent your asserting that most men are either rapists, sympathetic to their feelings or don't say anything. Once again you are putting out feelings as facts. The fact is that most men find rape just as horrible and reprehensible as women do. Yes, most rapes are commited by men, but the vast majority of men do not rape or condone it.

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RE: Play Rape ..... Hard Limit! - 8/8/2004 7:15:14 AM   
iwillserveu


Posts: 1633
Joined: 1/1/2004
Status: offline 		I have to agree with EString on this. Dread, wich submissive males do you think have rapists hearts?

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RE: Play Rape ..... Hard Limit! - 8/8/2004 8:38:07 AM   
MizSuz


Posts: 1881
Joined: 1/1/2004
Status: offline 		It's not really something I'm fond of. I get much more of a thrill out of someone giving me consent, or begging, for something they would never otherwise do or give to someone.

So for me part of the reason for doing wiitwd is the consent. You could say it's a kink.

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“The more you love, the more you can love—and the more intensely you love. Nor is there any limit on how many you can love. If a person had time enough, he could love all of that majority who are decent and just.”
- Robert Heinlein

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RE: Play Rape ..... Hard Limit! - 8/8/2004 4:41:51 PM   
Poenice


Posts: 15
Joined: 7/18/2004
Status: offline 		ok, a few thoughts on this very interesting thread.

1. recently I have had the delight to witness Resistance Play in a scene and I was wondering how this was different than Play Rape. I saw knife play, the girl pinned against the wall, and even a boot to the head. all in all, it was very consensual and very emotional. but if it simply is described as Resistance play, and not Play Rape, I would be curious as to how?

2. on the idea of those being involved in Play rape having some sort of violent past, I agree with that as a majority, but not subject to the whole.
Myself, I am interested in Play Rape and have just recently begun this play with my girl. in her past, there was violence, but with the trust that her and I have built over the years, whatever 'violence' occurs between us, only increases the endorphines and the emotional investment in the scene. both of us find that the harder, the better. (Myself, on a side note, have not had violence in My past, rather a quiet little existance, <smiles>)

3. just because Play Rape occurs in a scene does not mean that either party is not capable of being a romantic, sensual person. Some may feel those with a fantasy for Play Rape, are sick, twisted people with the need to hurt or be hurt. on the contrary, I feel it is just another way to please your partner and be pleased at the same time.

that about ends the thought process at this time, more to come I am sure.

Poenice

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RE: Play Rape ..... Hard Limit! - 8/8/2004 9:54:18 PM   
rain


Posts: 319
Joined: 4/13/2004
Status: offline 		This is a fascinating thread to me: i have, like many others, been a rape victim, twice- in fact- however, the idea of play rape actually appeals to me.

This is contradictary, and i'm aware of that, but, for me- the idea of play rape is satisfying. The reason is b/c, when rape occurs in real life, the victim does NOT have control over the situation, HOWEVER, if a rape scene is negotiated, and played out to the satisfaction of the sub....for me, i'd enjoy it b/c in the scene, i would ALLOW my partner control- in essence i'd have control over the scene- and it frees me from guilt as well b/c the rape is "forced." i'm not sure if that makes sense, but i've had rape fantasies since i was a teenager, and although being raped in reality was traumatic, i feel that if i were to negotiate that scene with someone i trust, it puts the power back in my hands.

i'm not sure i articulated that well, but maybe someone out there gets it.

And please do not misunderstand, when i was raped, (non-consentual) it was terrifying and traumatic- if i were to negotiate the scene however, well, the idea is a turn on- for me......

~rain~

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RE: Play Rape ..... Hard Limit! - 8/8/2004 11:04:38 PM   
topcat


Posts: 1675
Joined: 1/31/2004
From: Tidewater, VA
Status: offline
quote:

I saw knife play, the girl pinned against the wall, and even a boot to the head.


M. Poenice-

I want to clarify here- it was HER boot to MY head. She was resisting, I was pushing. I didn't put the boot to her.

Just wanted to make that clear. And, BTW, I did want to make clear, out here in public, that you were an Excellent caddy/ second for the scene, and I was impressed that when the boots were flying that you didn't back off. Thanks- could not have done it without you.

Stay warm,
Lawrence

< Message edited by topcat -- 8/8/2004 11:05:47 PM >

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RE: Play Rape ..... Hard Limit! - 8/9/2004 12:16:51 AM   
jillwfsub4blkdom


Posts: 375
Joined: 7/2/2004
Status: offline 		This is just my opinion but i truly can't get into any role playing situations. Possibly because of my profession being accounting and i have a tendency of seeing things as black or white (no pun intended) and no in-between. i also find the idea of rape so abhorrent that i couldn't possibly be involved in that kind of scene.

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"It's the moment that transcends
Our physical into a more spiritual level of understanding" - Musiq

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RE: Play Rape ..... Hard Limit! - 8/9/2004 12:42:50 AM   
baileythorne


Posts: 264
Joined: 6/6/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Poenice

1. recently I have had the delight to witness Resistance Play in a scene and I was wondering how this was different than Play Rape. I saw knife play, the girl pinned against the wall, and even a boot to the head. all in all, it was very consensual and very emotional. but if it simply is described as Resistance play, and not Play Rape, I would be curious as to how?

Poenice


There was no penetration. No sex = no rape. Though I really considered begging him to fuck me when he bent me over the bench afterward and was nice enough to give me more of the cane that I wanted. My ass was on fire and I wanted to add that primal element. But I guess if you beg, it isn't rape either. Even if you cry during the act.

Thanks for being there to help. :-) I wish there was a dungeon in New York that allowed penetration. You might have to come to SF to witness a "play rape" in a public space. It's legal here.

--bailey

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Love like you've never been hurt.

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RE: Play Rape ..... Hard Limit! - 8/9/2004 12:51:40 AM   
baileythorne


Posts: 264
Joined: 6/6/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: topcat

quote:

I saw knife play, the girl pinned against the wall, and even a boot to the head.


M. Poenice-

I want to clarify here- it was HER boot to MY head. She was resisting, I was pushing. I didn't put the boot to her.

Just wanted to make that clear. And, BTW, I did want to make clear, out here in public, that you were an Excellent caddy/ second for the scene, and I was impressed that when the boots were flying that you didn't back off. Thanks- could not have done it without you.

Stay warm,
Lawrence


My boot to Lawrence's head.

Goes like this: tie girl to cross with both hands at one point. Piss off girl. Girl kicks boy. Boy grabs foot and holds it. Girl now has two points secure and removes second foot from floor and attempts to wrap it around boy's neck. She figures she will make a harder target higher up in the air. However, girl's aim isn't quite right and she misses- landing the boot smack up against the boy's head. OUCH! Boy is calm and doesn't retailate against girl (maybe his brains were still spinning around). Boy moves out of reach of girls feet.

Boy's only comment, "next time we are removing your boots".

Girl hugs boy and makes it up to him when they get home ;-)


--bailey
(you had to be there, this happened in the blink of an eye... I don't think, I react. And I *love* the freedom this brings to me.)

_____________________________

Dance like no one's watching and
Love like you've never been hurt.

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RE: Play Rape ..... Hard Limit! - 8/9/2004 10:04:47 AM   
afmvdp


Posts: 494
Joined: 7/10/2004
Status: offline 		Okay, perhaps this is another off topic point but I find play rape to be a far deeper thing than many people go. Two people aggressively having sex isn't play rape. You cannot rape the willing. That's as bad as the consensual slave term in the other post. I think that the whole element of supposed "role play" doesn't work the way most people try to make it work. In order for something to feel real it has to be real, it has to have the elements of suprise, the elements of fear, the elements of true uncontrolled emotions. So in order to encite such it requires far more extensive effort than most are normally willing to put into it not from the subs point of view, they should never be subject to trying to "fake" something...that's just sad really.

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RE: Play Rape ..... Hard Limit! - 8/9/2004 10:58:08 AM   
Leonidas


Posts: 2078
Joined: 2/16/2004
Status: offline 		Hi ThorsHammer,

I have "play' just about anything as a hard limit when it comes to interacting with a slave. Just about anything that I do has a real purpose beyond sexual play.

I don't do "play rape". I do "slave rape" however. We define "slave rape" as the master of a slave subjecting a slave, and forcing the slave to yield to, their sexual will. A woman who has been made to have an orgasm that she did not try to have, and could not avoid having even if she wanted to, has been slave raped to our way of thinking about it. She has been made to submit in a very intimate way to her master's will. It has a profound effect.

Many women have rape fantasies. A way of understanding why that I would offer is that these fantasies come about because a woman's sexual desires and drives often clash with the imperative that she has been taught to be a "good girl", and the imperative not to be helpless to a man, as one feels when yielding to his will in a way that is that intimate. A force fantasy lets the woman experience that yielding (which she craves) and have it not be "her fault", because afterall, she was not in control.

Binding a woman, touching her in ways that bring her to higher and higher states of arousal, while telling her that she will, ultimately, surrender to you sexually, and that there is nothing that she can do to stop it, is an example of slave rape. It need not be violent, or even rough, just very dominating in a very intimate way.

Take care of yourself

Leonidas

< Message edited by Leonidas -- 8/9/2004 11:04:26 AM >

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RE: Play Rape ..... Hard Limit! - 8/9/2004 11:23:14 AM   
January


Posts: 891
Joined: 4/17/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: baileythorne

Girl hugs boy


! I'm trying to understand the choreography of this scene! Two hands tied up. Check. One foot grabbed by Lawrence. Check. The other foot contacts Lawrence's head. Check. He backs off. Check. Ok, so now your two hands are still tied up. Your two feet are free. And then you hug him?

My brain is spinning around! I'm imagining you're a gymnast, hugging his neck with your thighs!

January

_____________________________

[link: http://www.bookstrand.com/miss-you-sir] Miss You, Sir by January Rowe is available from Siren now! It's my latest smokin' hot bdsm romance.[/link]




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RE: Play Rape ..... Hard Limit! - 8/9/2004 12:45:32 PM   
hornywifey


Posts: 20
Joined: 8/5/2004
Status: offline 		Hi, ok even though "play Rape" is a fantasy of mine, being a woman i can also understand that it's a hard limit. is this your partner that wants to play rape? if so, maybe try discussing this with her, and maybe come to a compromise that maybe isn't too heavy for you to handle. One more thing, I am very sorry about your friend, that must have been very hard. good luck.

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RE: Play Rape ..... Hard Limit! - 8/9/2004 1:00:28 PM   
January


Posts: 891
Joined: 4/17/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Leonidas
A woman who has been made to have an orgasm that she did not try to have, and could not avoid having even if she wanted to, has been slave raped to our way of thinking about it.


That's it? The slave only gets ONE orgasm?

You Gorean men sure are miserly.

January

_____________________________

[link: http://www.bookstrand.com/miss-you-sir] Miss You, Sir by January Rowe is available from Siren now! It's my latest smokin' hot bdsm romance.[/link]




(in reply to Leonidas)
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