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Understanding Humiliation - 12/2/2008 9:57:40 PM

WomantoDomu

Posts: 1
Joined: 11/19/2008
Status: offline

After a year of a D/s relationship with my sub, I have learned that he craves and needs humiliation, (along with mild/moderate pain) I want to learn all I can about humiliation so we can grow in this area. I must say sub longing to be humiliated intrigues me and can be fun, but I really don't get it. Can someone please help me to understand how verbal humiliation feels good, tell me how being degraged is craved, what does it really do for the person who needs it. Is it more sexually arousing or mentally. I would appreciate different views about humiliation. Sure I could ask the same question about queening or cbt, but I can relate to what the sub is getting. I cannot get an understanding on how one can feel good through humiliation. HELP

Post #: 1

RE: Understanding Humiliation - 12/2/2008 10:22:52 PM

WestBaySlave

Posts: 501
Joined: 9/24/2008
Status: offline

I can only speak from my point of view and experience, and humiliation isn't my main thing, but...

Humiliation is kind of the flip side of worship. When a submissive tells their dominant that they're perfect, superior, a god or goddess and so on, they may know it to not be true, but it elevates the dominant above them, thus heightening the feeling of power exchange. Humiliation degrades, lowers, weakens in some sense the submissive's position in respect to the dominant.

It's really not about feeling bad for most people.

(in reply to WomantoDomu)

Post #: 2

RE: Understanding Humiliation - 12/2/2008 10:42:34 PM

hopelesslyInvo

Posts: 522
Joined: 2/10/2008
From: the future
Status: offline

i think of it in most cases as psychological masochism.

it's reminiscent of other things as well, maybe even tease and denial you could say; taking you up then shooting you down, back and forth like any other head game. it's definitely taxing and powerful on those of us who don't really enjoy it, but pulling you out of it is sort of like the pleasure people are awarded in the aftercare that just isn't afforded unless you need the care.

_____________________________

great minds discuss ideas; average minds discuss events; small minds discuss people.

(in reply to WomantoDomu)

Post #: 3

RE: Understanding Humiliation - 12/2/2008 11:02:05 PM

SlaveBlutarsky

Posts: 491
Joined: 10/10/2005
From: Upstate, NY
Status: offline

I'd agree it's like mental masochism, I love humiliation and don't really know why. Part of it I believe is the magnification of the dominance a woman holds over me. By degrading me, she increases the sdistance between her and i in terms of owner and slave. Another aspect of it may be the breaking down and building up concept. A woman crushed me mentally, calls me names and has me do things that make me ashamed and question my manhood, and then builds me back up to be proud of myself and my service to her.

_____________________________

Strong for all, weak for one

(in reply to hopelesslyInvo)

Post #: 4

RE: Understanding Humiliation - 12/3/2008 3:12:02 AM

SteveAndJaz

Posts: 151
Joined: 11/22/2008
Status: offline

Humiliation is a broad word with many meanings and possibly the biggest confusion in the things we do.
A man may get off on the humiliation of being told his cock is small and pathetic. For vanity reasons female subs tend not to enjoy body mocking humiliation!
A sub may get off on being scolded like a child, made to go to bed early or made to do a task the dominant knows they hate.
Humiliation could be in the form of a task... example: made to go out in very tarty clothing or sent to the wrong gender toilets in a restaurant.

As a woman I can understand the bottom two but not the top one. I would die a thousand deaths if my partner said horrible things about my body! I think I would need therapy for years after!!!. I also have to say that I have never found a female sub that likes this sort of humiliation but I have found plenty of male ones that do.

I have often wondered why some men like to be belittled regarding there pathetic body and the only thing that comes to mind is that they like to be humiliated about something that is an ongoing hangup.... e.g. a small cock.

Jaz

(in reply to SlaveBlutarsky)

Post #: 5

RE: Understanding Humiliation - 12/3/2008 7:37:39 AM

WalterRego

Posts: 276
Joined: 12/28/2004
Status: offline

Humiliation means different things to different people. I have no interest in being told my penis is small, doesn't satisfy etc. Nor being told that some aspect of my body or personality is lacking, disgusting. (and if any of those is the case, why would she be with me??)

But I do love being told to do something, accept something or wear something which is embarrassing, humiliating etc. Why? I'm not sure. Perhaps it's the inner dialogue:"Wow. She can actually make me do that? She tells me to do something I've never done or would do otherwise, but for Her, I'm actually doing it? Gee, she must have power over me. I must really want to please Her. I must be under Her thumb.. And...She enjoys seeing and exploring that power She has over me too! Hot Dawg!"

< Message edited by WalterRego -- 12/3/2008 7:38:33 AM >

(in reply to SteveAndJaz)

Post #: 6

RE: Understanding Humiliation - 12/3/2008 8:17:18 AM

Mercnbeth

Posts: 11766
Status: offline

~ Fast Reply ~

Can you understand art? Not in the context that humiliation is an 'art form'; but in the context of understanding likes/dislikes.

Humiliation takes knowledge of a person and a deep sense of trust. It's a fantasy in most cases, because the humiliating is contrived. The subject of it, has the 'safe-word' of trust that the the facilitator appreciates the ultimate unreal situation. It's in that freedom and that trust that makes the activity sexual and sensual versus disgusting and revolting under different circumstances.

In its mildest form, the conservative religious person would never 'flash' in public, but the 'humiliation' of being forced to do so by a Dom takes away the choice and generates excitement in the act of being 'forced' to do it. Power on one side, use of power on the other; situations that create 'mind-fucks'. The deeper the trust between partners the more freedom to experience things and expand perspective. You begin to appreciate the simplest interaction. The mind is required more than a crop, cane, or flogger. Engaging the mind, having a mental intercourse to go along with the physical, is spectacular!

Humiliation is also 'basic'. A child doesn't know the humiliation of using a diaper. It takes an 'adult' mind to appreciate that the number of times one travels around the sun is relevant. What better way to get back to basics than to regress back to turning over such a basic function to another?

Whether Pallock, Chagall, Dali or Matisse and Seurat art-forms and appreciating them is a personal matter. Starting out you may enjoy Warhol, but when you decide to go deeper you may end up going back to his Renaissance art inspiration of rooted in his upbringing and ongoing religious background as a practicing practicing Byzantine Catholic. You don't need to know that to like and/or appreciate Warhol's 'Campbell's Can' or his Marilyn Monroe portrait, but to 'understand' it - it helps.

(in reply to WalterRego)

Post #: 7

RE: Understanding Humiliation - 12/3/2008 12:07:36 PM

ishyB

Posts: 555
Joined: 9/2/2008
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: SteveAndJaz
As a woman I can understand the bottom two but not the top one. I would die a thousand deaths if my partner said horrible things about my body! I think I would need therapy for years after!!!. I also have to say that I have never found a female sub that likes this sort of humiliation but I have found plenty of male ones that do.

I have often wondered why some men like to be belittled regarding there pathetic body and the only thing that comes to mind is that they like to be humiliated about something that is an ongoing hangup.... e.g. a small cock.

Greetings Mistress Jaz,

I had never realized it before, but now that you mention it, it does seem that females generally do not like that type of humiliation while many males do.
I guess I'm one of those odd exceptions then, seeing that I do enjoy being mocked about physicality’s by Master.

I have got a very broad liking of very different types of humiliation and most of it is as said pure mental masochism.
As a slave, I intensely enjoy 'being put in my place'. Being reminded that the reason why I serve is because Master is in all areas of life my superior and just a better person than me.
Humiliation helps to remind me of my own shortcomings and weaknesses, which in turn provides a sharp contrast of my idolization of him.

Now as to physical humiliation I think I like this simply because I'm feel very comfortable about how I look. There are lot of men (especially online) that suck up to me and that are easily manipulated because I've got a long pair of legs. I greatly dislike men like this. When men, especially strangers, are quick to comment positively on my looks I have the tendency to assume that I will be able to manipulate them and get what I want from them.

I much more easily impressed by a man who takes a very indifferent, uncaring attitude about my appearance.
When a man thinks I'm pretty from the get go, there is nothing left for me to work for. With a man who doesn't take how I look into account when assessing me, I will need to work to impress him. Thus any value he might see in me will be based on ME; on who I am, instead of something I cannot take credit for.

Thus when Master makes humiliating comments about my appearance, he reminds me that the reason he is keeping me is not just because he likes the way I look; but because he likes who I am, for what I really am.
The reason why I can be degraded and humiliated by him while still feeling very confident and comfortable about who I am is because I do know that he wants to keep me and sees some value in me. If this wasn't the case and I would truly belief that he thought I was worthless, my confidence would disappear as fast as an icecream in the Sahara desert.
But as things are right now, the fact that my the way I look is only a small insignificant part of on how he asses my worth makes that I feel more treasured or valued by him than I've ever felt by anybody in my life.

I wish you well,

ishy

< Message edited by ishyB -- 12/3/2008 12:24:51 PM >

_____________________________

I want you to know that it doesn't matter where we take this road
Someone's gotta go
and I want you to know you couldn't have loved me better
But I wanted to move on
So I'm already gone

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PoJFn_RIdkg

(in reply to SteveAndJaz)

Post #: 8

RE: Understanding Humiliation - 12/3/2008 12:22:54 PM

frenchbitchchris

Posts: 19
Joined: 11/26/2008
Status: offline

i LOVE humiliation. Obviously, i am called "french bitch" in my household. It is something i crave so intensely that i chose to be a slave over a Dominant although i have a very assertive personality.

i am not sure how to explain it but when Master slaps me or tells me to kneel in public i get such an edrenaline rush. Verbal humiliation and being put down is also huge with me.

maybe i don't know why.. it is just how i am. i have always craved it since i was really young. i loved failing classes so i could get a lecture by the teacher in front of everyone or getting my parents to yell at me in public. i even had a girlfriend who loved kicking me in the butt. that was really embarrassing... i don't know why but i loved it. it made me feel like.. a dog. --grins--

it's probably the feeling of being insignificant..

--french bitch

(in reply to WomantoDomu)

Post #: 9

RE: Understanding Humiliation - 12/3/2008 12:43:00 PM

igor2003

Posts: 1718
Joined: 1/1/2004
Status: offline

As others have said, the reasons are a little different for just about everyone. I agree with the one poster that said humiliation is kind of a mental form of masochism. I also know that I have always been a person that gets enjoyment and pride in being able to make other people happy, so if a Mistress wants to humiliate me and it makes her feel good or happy and she gets enjoyment from it, then it also makes me feel good to know that I have been able to do that for her.

(in reply to WomantoDomu)

Post #: 10

RE: Understanding Humiliation - 12/3/2008 1:26:43 PM

marie2

Posts: 1690
Joined: 11/4/2008
From: Jersey
Status: offline

To me, submission itself is one continual exercise in humiliation. But I see the meaning of humiliating equal to humbling, as opposed to being shamed, degraded or insulted. And I find actions to be more humiliating than words. For example taking off my clothes and being looked at, or not being able to speak when I want, or having to take a whipping or whatever, I find all of that to be extremely humiliating, and I have no problem with being humiliated that way. In fact, I like it, and it's a very important part of the submission for me because it all puts my head in the right place. For me it's also positive in the sense that it's like the walls or defenses are being stripped down and you can't hide anywhere, and that sort of feels like a special type of intimacy to me.

Statements, on the other hand, such as look at you, you look like a messy whore and you're just a doormat fuckhole for me to use, is something I define as degrading. In that regard, I'm very sensitive, and statements about my looks or my value (even in the context of a "scene") can hurt my feelings easily and cause me to cry immediately. I don't really have much use for that in general.
However, with the right person who can read me well, and under the right circumstances, I can deal with certain forms of degradation like being called a cunt, or being told I deserve to be fucked like a whore, or something else to that effect, but the dom has to know me well to be able to go there without fucking the whole thing up.

I think it's good for you to get ideas of how others view this stuff, but of course, it's a personal thing, and the way your sub processes humiliation can be different than the way someone else does. Maybe go slowly with it and test the waters with some different methods and see how he reacts etc.

(in reply to WomantoDomu)

Post #: 11

RE: Understanding Humiliation - 12/3/2008 2:06:35 PM

porcelain26

Posts: 181
Joined: 11/16/2007
Status: offline

For me....I think it's knowing my shortcomings...even having Master point them out to me...but then the safety and security of knowing that He wants me anyway. Nope, not perfect, not even close...but He still wants me. Like ishy, I also like the way it makes me idolize Him even more than I do already. If He can get me into that headspace and really take me apart, I end up that much more submissive, devoted, and loyal to Him. I don't know that I'm explaining this very well. It's a difficult concept for me to verbalize.

(in reply to marie2)

Post #: 12

RE: Understanding Humiliation - 12/3/2008 3:10:14 PM

greeneyedreamer

Posts: 442
Joined: 6/20/2007
Status: offline

Very nice post. thank you for putting that into words.

Dreamer

_____________________________

Dreamer, owned and ecstatically happy

I am still learning... Michelangelo, age 87

Maybe some women weren't meant to be tamed. Maybe they are suppose to run wild until they find someone just as wild to run with. Sex and the City

(in reply to Mercnbeth)

Post #: 13

RE: Understanding Humiliation - 12/4/2008 3:46:34 AM

SteveAndJaz

Posts: 151
Joined: 11/22/2008
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: ishyB

quote:

ORIGINAL: SteveAndJaz
As a woman I can understand the bottom two but not the top one. I would die a thousand deaths if my partner said horrible things about my body! I think I would need therapy for years after!!!. I also have to say that I have never found a female sub that likes this sort of humiliation but I have found plenty of male ones that do.

I have often wondered why some men like to be belittled regarding there pathetic body and the only thing that comes to mind is that they like to be humiliated about something that is an ongoing hangup.... e.g. a small cock.

Greetings Mistress Jaz,

I had never realized it before, but now that you mention it, it does seem that females generally do not like that type of humiliation while many males do.
I guess I'm one of those odd exceptions then, seeing that I do enjoy being mocked about physicality’s by Master.

I have got a very broad liking of very different types of humiliation and most of it is as said pure mental masochism.
As a slave, I intensely enjoy 'being put in my place'. Being reminded that the reason why I serve is because Master is in all areas of life my superior and just a better person than me.
Humiliation helps to remind me of my own shortcomings and weaknesses, which in turn provides a sharp contrast of my idolization of him.

Now as to physical humiliation I think I like this simply because I'm feel very comfortable about how I look. There are lot of men (especially online) that suck up to me and that are easily manipulated because I've got a long pair of legs. I greatly dislike men like this. When men, especially strangers, are quick to comment positively on my looks I have the tendency to assume that I will be able to manipulate them and get what I want from them.

I much more easily impressed by a man who takes a very indifferent, uncaring attitude about my appearance.
When a man thinks I'm pretty from the get go, there is nothing left for me to work for. With a man who doesn't take how I look into account when assessing me, I will need to work to impress him. Thus any value he might see in me will be based on ME; on who I am, instead of something I cannot take credit for.

Thus when Master makes humiliating comments about my appearance, he reminds me that the reason he is keeping me is not just because he likes the way I look; but because he likes who I am, for what I really am.
The reason why I can be degraded and humiliated by him while still feeling very confident and comfortable about who I am is because I do know that he wants to keep me and sees some value in me. If this wasn't the case and I would truly belief that he thought I was worthless, my confidence would disappear as fast as an icecream in the Sahara desert.
But as things are right now, the fact that my the way I look is only a small insignificant part of on how he asses my worth makes that I feel more treasured or valued by him than I've ever felt by anybody in my life.

I wish you well,

ishy

Thats what I love about forum posts. They get out to a much wider audience. Thanks for that ishyB. I think you have a very good point when you say that you are very comfortable with your body.

(in reply to ishyB)

Post #: 14

RE: Understanding Humiliation - 12/4/2008 12:19:07 PM

Chgolostnlooking

Posts: 46
Joined: 10/21/2008
Status: offline

I love verbal humiliation. And, if my chin was held so I was forced to look RIGHT AT "Her" while she was talking to me, just spitting out the words... Well. Yes.

I think (at least to me), the humiliation is about being under the microscope. "You call that a good job?". When it's right, I can practically feel the energy given off by Her, with me struggling to be as accommodating as I can. "Do it right!" - "Yes Ma'am".

Let me end with I don't crave the body humiliation that some men do - but I do love a good talking to. I love doing a task, being told it's not right, re-applying myself and then being told it's a good job. The give and take. Anyway, that's just my opinion.

(in reply to SteveAndJaz)

Post #: 15

RE: Understanding Humiliation - 12/4/2008 1:41:58 PM

oceanwynds

Posts: 1044
Joined: 8/24/2006
Status: offline

I do not like humilation, and it is one form of punishment Sir will use on me. The last time he did that was when he made me type up my last punishment and then email it to a mutual friend/slave of ours. Talk about experiencing humbleness after that.

oceanwynds

(in reply to Chgolostnlooking)

Post #: 16

RE: Understanding Humiliation - 12/25/2008 2:52:37 AM

servant4superior

Posts: 5
Joined: 12/24/2008
Status: offline

At it's root humiliation, both etymologically and as a fetish, is about being humbled or humbling a person. Not to be confused with degradation which may be employed to humiliate someone and is often what people mean when they talk about humiliation.

quote:

how verbal humiliation feels good

One of the more overt ways we express ourselves is through language. When you verbalize something it effects you and it effects those that hear it. Think of it in terms of positive reenforcement. Often people with low self esteem are instructed to repeat something positive to themselves. The reason this works at all is because verbalizing something makes it more real then simply thinking it. It's simple yet profoundly effective. And the opposite is also true. Simply put, the more they hear it from you the more real it feels to them, which is exciting and therefore feels good.

quote:

how being degraged is craved

I crave being degraded because I lose a sense of myself that inhibits me.

I find it irresistibly compelling. When it's done just right it's so powerful that I lose control and that is ultimately what excites me about it. It's this danger but the risk seems minimized because if I can hold on to that feeling then perhaps nothing else would matter.

quote:

what does it really do for the person who needs it

On it's own I think it does very little. To me one of the reason humiliation play needs to be very carefully handled is because it is a build up. So in a sense imagine asking the same question, except about teasing someone. What does the tease do for someone? On it's own it only frustrates them but because it's ultimate goal is not the tease but the release of that build up the answer is clear. What's not often understood about humiliation is it's the same thing. It's a tease but not one that leads to release of orgasm but to release of self.

quote:

Is it more sexually arousing or mentally

I would have argued that it's more mental then sexual but I've been humiliated be people who knew just what to do to me and found myself insanely horny and excited for weeks after.

quote:

I would appreciate different views about humiliation.

I know a lot of people see it as more about degradation or more RACK then SSC but I don't believe it to really be just part of one's kinky arsenal. It's really a whole thing unto itself and to understand it there are uncomfortable things that need to be faced, at least in my opinion.

- First, that it is self destructive to want to be humiliated and that's okay. The self is overrated.
- Secondly, that for some people name calling may be the absolute limit of how far they want to go but that humiliation is really about wanting to be stripped of ones inhibitions and that it's taboo because the things that limit us are the things we think of as sacred. Our feelings of worth, importance and individuality.
- Lastly, that humiliation does not require a deep knowledge of the person your humiliating as much as it does a keen observation about what gets them to a state where they lose their inhibitions.

quote:

how one can feel good through humiliation

A person who likes to be humiliated isn't just asking to be insulted or degraded. What makes them feel good is the process of opening up to being less about themselves and more about another person or situation hence letting that become greater then them.

(in reply to oceanwynds)

Post #: 17

RE: Understanding Humiliation - 12/25/2008 3:04:18 AM

E2Sweet

Posts: 649
Joined: 7/8/2008
From: TopLeftCornerOf, OH, USA
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: WomantoDomu
....I cannot get an understanding on how one can feel good through humiliation. HELP

Uggh, this is such a complex topic too. Humiliation is going to be a minefield for any dominant that wants to go there with me, and I think its safe to say every submissive is different in their loves and hates regarding humiliation play.

I really don't have anything concrete to offer you other than to listen carefully to your submissive and hear what they are saying regarding this stuff. I think that would most likely be the best path for you to understand how to push your submissive's humiliation-yummy-buttons.

.. and I doubt if a lot of what you'll find out will carry over from your current sub to any other.

Good luck!

_____________________________

E2Sweet™
"If it doesn't make you smile then chances are you're not doing it right."

(in reply to WomantoDomu)

Post #: 18

RE: Understanding Humiliation - 12/25/2008 4:38:06 AM

iwearpanties

Posts: 509
Joined: 7/21/2005
Status: offline

its intresting how one subs love and likes or craveing can be another subs worst nitemare ?

(in reply to E2Sweet)

Post #: 19

RE: Understanding Humiliation - 12/25/2008 6:08:45 AM

GoddessTeaze

Posts: 1125
Joined: 10/14/2006
From: The Netherlands
Status: offline

quote:

Can someone please help me to understand how verbal humiliation feels good,

Humiliation is based upon a deep commitment, between the D/s. My girl loves humiliation, and why? Because she knows she is truly treasured by Me, and it has so nothing to do with her shortcomings, that's just low if someone will use such, and will hurt someone deeply instead of using it wisely.

It has gotto do with selfasteem, if that's in balance with the sub,
then there is a basic for humiliation.

It's a big way of mindfucking the one you love,
in many many ways, and push them deeper into subspace.

I Love it, and have seen more men into it then woman,
but again, I believe that has to do with selfasteem.
The smallclit humiliation for instance
it will make them feel
more submissive if that's pointed out,
especially cuckolds.

I know a sub who was always always very proud of his member,
and now he has grown to be a cuckold, and
truly feels it's worth nothing anymore
since his Mistress won't fuck him
anymore, because She prefers big dicks.

It's a huge mindfuck, and again, not for
everyone, but I know that My girl,
and exgirls loved it,
and it made them very wet,
as Im sure she will while reading My post!

It's something to build up, slowly together.

I wish you allot of fun,
and hope to hear how it's working out for you both.

Warm Greetingz

GoddezzT`

_____________________________

~* The only disability in life is a bad attitude. ~Scott Hamilton*~

~*Beauty is not in the face; beauty is a light in the heart. ~Kahlil Gibran*~

(in reply to WomantoDomu)

Post #: 20

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