RE: people fixers

RE: people fixers (Full Version)

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CallaFirestormBW -> RE: people fixers (12/6/2008 8:00:21 AM)
My first marriage was sufficient to convince me that there is no such thing as 'fixing' another person. There is also no such thing as 'bringing a person to their potential'. These things are -internal- in a person. While someone external can provide the means, the motivation has to come from inside, or no amount of effort on the external person's part is going to effect that change. I will admit that a great deal of what I do has to do with teaching discipline, and that this can help people with their lives far beyond any servitude to our household. I also spend a great deal of time providing pastoral care in the community. However, I think that the difference between me now, and me in my 20s is that I realize that I can't fix someone... I can't give them motivation or make them do the work... the real momentum needs to come from within that person. These days, I tend to wait for people to come to -me-, and only try to help as long as they're putting in the primary effort... so more of a support than an impetus.

daddysliloneds -> RE: people fixers (12/6/2008 8:22:05 AM)
i know a select few dominants that wish to try to fix, repair, save, and/or be their submissives therapists; it's what they live for... fortunately, not all doms feel that need; unfortunately, a lot more of them want to be the saviour, hero, white knight, then even i was aware of until recently... so, i guess i'm going to be single for a much longer time than what i originally anticipated; like forever! i don't need fixing dammit!

oceanwynds -> RE: people fixers (12/6/2008 9:03:54 AM)
I use to be a regular attendee to coda meetings. I try not to fix another anymore, though I still have to becareful with that. If a person tells me if they want help in changing something, I check for a few things in their conversation, so I can tell if they are serious. Tell-tail signs for me are: arguing for their limitations, their problems are always worst then another and last they blame everyone around them for their problems, their bad day, year..etc. These things tell me they aren't ready to invest time in making their life better. I will walk away then, for nothing that can be said will be heard. oceanwynds

celticlord2112 -> RE: people fixers (12/6/2008 9:06:41 AM)
quote: a thought came to me the other day and i was wondering if its something inherent in the people who walk these corridors. Inherent in *all* here? Probably not. There are some here who have sincere desires to help others and make the lives of others better. There are some who are addicted to the "white knight" syndrome and want to "save" all the poor helpless subbies of the world. And then there are some who are selfish, self-centered twits who are just in it for the sex. As for the rest--who knows?

dombrs -> RE: people fixers (12/6/2008 9:23:25 AM)
I have done pretty well for myself in my career by being a fixer. This has transfered into my personal life and it is not something you want. D/s or vanilla as soon as you come across as a people fixer you attract all kinds of baggage.

lally3 -> RE: people fixers (12/6/2008 9:34:59 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: loveandlight87 lally, You are making perfect sense!!! "sometimes, when im talking to a D and he tells me all the things he wants to do for his sub, the whys and wherefores, the giving often to the point of aching need, a gap, a deep abiding need to nurture and give themselves - it makes me wonder what it is i can give in return and is it enough to just be there in my capacity as me - is that enough, is there something more that i am giving other than my submission and if so what is it? am i missing something because sometimes i worry that there is an imbalance of provision." Do you mean that because you feel like you are getting so much from them in terms of emotional/physical satisfaction, you feel so loved and cherished and all that other good stuff, that you wonder 'wow, I am getting all of this, but what are they getting from me???" I feel that way sometimes. I feel like Sir brings so much to my life, how in the world can me just being me possibly give him as much in return. Sometimes submission feels somewhat passive. We all know it isn’t, but it can feel that way at times. This can feel like you aren’t actively contributing. Because the D’s natural role in the relationship is more active (as opposed to passive) it almost seems like they are adding more to the relationship. Is that what you mean? love yes, that is - and i was going to use the word passive too, but i chickened out [:D] - but i do feel passive sometimes and i do feel sometimes that im recieving so much and returning so little, that just bringing me into the mix cant possibly be enough - even, oddly enough, during a discipline hiding, he's putting in all the work and all i have to do is take it - sometimes i feel i should be doing more, that just being a willing participant (and sometimes not so willing) is very unimaginative of me. ive asked and been told numerously that they get off on directing, leading, de-muddling, reorganising, setting a person straight on their road again. im not saying thats pure ultruism atall, there needs to be symbiosis and acceptance of someone taking that role in your life and runing with it - but its about as close to ultruism as ive ever come across - sometimes there really isnt any other agenda other than seeing their subbie trucking along more effectviely, happily and knowing theyd put them there. thats so cool. possibly because i am a nurturer too its a bit odd to be on the receiving end for me and not be able to reciprocate - and so hence the question i came up with here. can we, do we reciprocate more than just being there (passively) i spose in a way if i was going to parrallel it any way its like being in bed with a guy and doing nothing else but lie there and let him do all the work.

lally3 -> RE: people fixers (12/6/2008 9:53:00 AM)
so many brilliant responses! - i dont agree though, that you cant fix people[:)], you can and some people do need to be fixed. they need that one person at that moment in their lives to show them by example, teach them through cause and effect that theyre behaviour is self harming and is destroying only them. there are unfixable people and they are the ones you walk away from, but there are alot of people who just need to see the world in a different way. you might not fix them straight away, but down the line, youre input sinks in, your influence has an impact, even if it is passive.

loveandlight87 -> RE: people fixers (12/6/2008 10:40:54 AM)
LA nailed it. Even though we might feel as though things are not equal, that really isn't the point - to weigh things like that. Each person, submissive or dominant, is unique. Each gives of that uniqueness and thus creates the special relationship wherein, as LA stated so succinctly, it is (hopefully) fulfilling for each. Knowing that intellectually and translating that emotionally is sometimes challenging when you are hard wired to be a giver. It helps me to know that because it feels so good to give to one I care for, I want to give my partner the opportunity to experience that feel good that comes with giving. Remembering that makes it easier to accept those gifts (emotional) from Sir. As far as fixing ... there are times when folks come into my life, and I suppose me into theirs, at an opportune time to learn some lesson or grow in some way or address an issue that I've had. Now did they fix me? No, I did that. But did they present the right chemistry, set of circumstances to set it up for me to do the work? Maybe. The Universe does crazy things like that sometimes. love

NihilusZero -> RE: people fixers (12/6/2008 10:47:32 AM)
This is always a weird topic for me....one I find more fueled by what people think they should think about it rather than what actually is. Surgeons fix our innards all the time and there is no concept of eternal debt that we are manacled to about it...no suggestion of necessary dependence. It's only when the psyche and emotions are spoken of that there is this taboo notion of 'being fixed' that lingers...as if the very idea that someone else could be the source of something inside us getting fixed means we somehow lose a part of ourselves (and our persona/individuality?) in the process.

CNJDom -> RE: people fixers (12/6/2008 10:48:48 AM)
lally: I think we try to fix others, and for some it's nearly a fault. We don't want to see things out of whack. I have been guilty of fixing others, and I have viewed it as helping others with problems. Some are receptive and others are just not helpable.. The trick is that I have seen, that if there IS a problem and they want to change and take care of the problem, then it's doable. They have to have the realization and desire to be fixed and adjusted. That's the only way it is going to work. If they don't have it in them for this change, then no matter how you try, or desire, you will not fix them through helping them. I feel that is good avoid those crying for help and not willing to make the effort, but I will let them know this is why I am not going to help first. They need to want it first... just like counseling and therapy is....

Rover -> RE: people fixers (12/6/2008 10:53:16 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: NihilusZero This is always a weird topic for me....one I find more fueled by what people think they should think about it rather than what actually is. Surgeons fix our innards all the time and there is no concept of eternal debt that we are manacled to about it...no suggestion of necessary dependence. It's only when the psyche and emotions are spoken of that there is this taboo notion of 'being fixed' that lingers...as if the very idea that someone else could be the source of something inside us getting fixed means we somehow lose a part of ourselves (and our persona/individuality?) in the process. Actually, when I make reference to this sort of dynamic in BDSM relationships, it's not at all like you describe. In your examples, you assume that the fixee actually gets fixed. It's been my experience that when it comes to folks seeking out BDSM in order to be fixed, or to fix those in need, the desired outcome is not (and cannot be) achieved. In other words, at the end of the day, no one and nothing has been fixed. John Edited to add that in many instances, greater harm has been done. Which is not surprising when laymen take on the guise of professionals.

NihilusZero -> RE: people fixers (12/6/2008 11:06:58 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Rover Actually, when I make reference to this sort of dynamic in BDSM relationships, it's not at all like you describe. In your examples, you assume that the fixee actually gets fixed. It's been my experience that when it comes to folks seeking out BDSM in order to be fixed, or to fix those in need, the desired outcome is not (and cannot be) achieved. In other words, at the end of the day, no one and nothing has been fixed. John Edited to add that in many instances, greater harm has been done. Which is not surprising when laymen take on the guise of professionals. You know...I was gonna type something here...and it dawned on me it would have that very same 'idealistic' tone to it. [8D] chuckle So, the ineptitude of the fixer aside (which can be just as much a fault of the fixee if they expect a plumber to fix the electrical layout of the house), do we (contrary to mass notion) grant that nearly every facet of who we are is probably fixable? And since whether something emotional needs to be fixed is a purely subjective issue, anything is game?

Rover -> RE: people fixers (12/6/2008 11:21:10 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: NihilusZero You know...I was gonna type something here...and it dawned on me it would have that very same 'idealistic' tone to it. [8D] Oh, hell's bells... you deny me such fun. quote: So, the ineptitude of the fixer aside (which can be just as much a fault of the fixee if they expect a plumber to fix the electrical layout of the house), do we (contrary to mass notion) grant that nearly every facet of who we are is probably fixable? And since whether something emotional needs to be fixed is a purely subjective issue, anything is game? Actually, I wouldn't say that everything, or everybody, is fixable. Some folks I've met (in my fixer days) were (I believe) simply beyond the help of anyone... professional included. John

scottjk -> RE: people fixers (12/6/2008 11:21:19 AM)
This is a thorny question, no doubt about it. I'll have to admit, I'm a fixer. I'm hesitant to admit it, though. That's be cause there seems to be a contemptuous view of it. I don't think it's meant to be abusive, more along the lines of, "You REALLY don't want to go down that road, my friend." Being who I am, I try to remain optimistic only because I'm cursed with non-selective empathy. :) (Or blessed, it depends on your point of view.) The problems with issues is that they take up a lot of time that would otherwise be used for the relationship. I've got my issues, she's got hers, and it's to be expected. Just try to deal with the issues as they come, deal with them quickly, (as well as wisely) so we can get back to enjoying life and each other. Sadly, it's easier said than done. I'm not bragging when I say that I can resolve most issues pretty easily, financial, physical, emotional and so on. (Not all though, I recognize that.) The problem with resolving some one elses issues is this: The desire to be independant at any cost. We learn this as children, we see it in the media, it's drilled into our heads EVERY day. For some reason, we make it an unspoken rule that it's shameful to ask for, or to recieve help. We MUST be individuals at any cost. We MUST be independant. We MUST be self sufficient. We MUST, we MUST, we MUST! The idea of working together gets drowned out. So, that is when 'fixers' like me get into trouble. As a dom, more accurately as a master, I have a sense of responsibility for the welfare of my sub. I want her to do well, get more out of life and to avoid the stress that IS avoidable. It doesn't always work out that way, though. (I'm really thinking this over as I type this.) Most of my relationships fail simply because of that misunderstood word: dependance. It gets thrown around too much, and used inappropriately. As naturally social beings, we are, by definition, dependant on each other for many things, if you think about it. We get into trouble when we fight against it for the wrong reasons, or because of simple ignorance. We tend to abuse people for trying to help, as well. I could be wrong, though. I hope I'm wrong. I want to be wrong. :) If I am, and I can confirm it, I'll know what I have to do. [:D]

lally3 -> RE: people fixers (12/6/2008 11:38:14 AM)
sorry NZ\|, can you be a bit more succinct - ive had some wine and in there is something interesting but i cant get my fuzzed brain to grapple with it. Rover, i agree that maybe there are alot of people who come to bdsm, possibly more subs than D's looking to get fixed. in a way i might well be one of them, in that im chaos and whilst my previous Sir was able to motivate me into fixing some of that myself, my basic self inflicted ineptitude persists and it will take me and only me to sort it out in an ongoing way with or without someone kicking me along. ive talked to D's whove met messed up subs who bounce off one D after another, exorcising some level of imbalance that can only, ultimately be fixed by themselves but take the beatings and concensual abuse in a never ending turmoil of catharsis and abreaction. but...., in there, surely are those, that in seeking that catharsis and abreaction eventually do reach a eureka moment. i would argue that the boards and sites across the internet are brim full with subs who have gone through a great deal in their 'journey' of finding themselves and finding that place where they are fixed, they have bounced off other peoples walls and finally come to some realisation of what and who they are and why. i dont think it is such a dismal prognosis and i do think that people fixing (yes im back to that word lol) is possible here, if not with you or the next person, but somewhere along the line the penny drops - maybe not for everyone, but for some.

lally3 -> RE: people fixers (12/6/2008 11:46:10 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: LuckyAlbatross Trying to compare what we give in order to make it come out equal is a sure way to come up short :) Relationships are supposed to make our lives more fulfilled than if we were single- why else have them? That doesn't mean we get into them to be fixed or to fix, and for many people that's nothing to do with what their relationship is. love, hi [:)] yes, i read that and agreed totally - she's a wise bird! quid pro quo (whatever that means and im sure someone will come along and translate) but i know it suggests that to attempt to try and equal another is just a never ending journey until it finally expires. you can almost checkmate a person, simply by giving in return, you can stem the flow and sometimes you need to just take what they give and not try to return it, a bit like a compliment really. maybe its just getting around the whole, 'im ok and im enough' thing is a personal journey i need to fix myself [:D]

Rover -> RE: people fixers (12/6/2008 11:48:16 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: lally3 Rover, i agree that maybe there are alot of people who come to bdsm, possibly more subs than D's looking to get fixed. in a way i might well be one of them, in that im chaos and whilst my previous Sir was able to motivate me into fixing some of that myself, my basic self inflicted ineptitude persists and it will take me and only me to sort it out in an ongoing way with or without someone kicking me along. As is the case with so many things, I believe there may be several definitions of what constitutes "fixing". Lots of people live their lives in (relative) chaos. But they live and they function. Are there areas that many folks would like to improve upon within themselves, and their lives? Sure, but they function. I'm talking about those that are not functioning. And you know who they are. Their lives are not chaos, their lives are a trainwreck. They are in a constant and unstoppable downward spiral. They are admittedly (and thankfully) uncommon. And it is so tempting for fixers to want to reach out and lend a hand. But the end result is not the improvement of the fixee's life; rather the destruction of the fixers. It's life, and a relationship, headed for the lowest common denominator. John

ThundersCry -> RE: people fixers (12/6/2008 11:55:21 AM)
Fixin` or fistin`... Fistin` fix`s alot of...stuff... <squints without my glasses on>

peppermint -> RE: people fixers (12/6/2008 11:57:55 AM)
My youngest son is a people fixer. He always chooses the girls who have issues such as depression. He thinks if he can just love them enough they will be all better. His compulsion to fix might also be the reason he has been in one failed relationship after another. It usually takes him a couple years before he figures out she isn't going to change and be all better just because he wants it to happen.

DavanKael -> RE: people fixers (12/6/2008 12:15:29 PM)
Hi, Lally---- You create thought-provoking threads, thank you. :> I often find that I attempt to offer strength to those with whom I closely relate and the more close I am with a person, the more likely I am to naturally 'fill inthe blanks' or augment areaas of less strength as do I allow them to do this for me. It strikes me as symbiotic. I will say, too, though, that it can become extreme to the point of enabling and even co-dependence which, in honesty, I can allow to happen in some instances. Moderation, moulation, an no, I don't think it's a D or an s thing; I think it could apply to either. Davan

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