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RE: people fixers - 12/6/2008 12:16:32 PM   
DavanKael


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quote:

ORIGINAL: ThundersCry

Fixin` or fistin`...
 
Fistin` fix`s alot of...stuff...
 
<squints without my glasses on>


Amen to that! 
  Davan

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RE: people fixers - 12/6/2008 12:20:58 PM   
lally3


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what a sweetheart! ah - is he Dom

i think it is a lesson fixers have to learn, that in attempting to fix they have to know where the cut off point is.  eventually he'll learn to avoid them  - i know i have.. lol.

everyone is right here i know.  that you cant fix the unfixable, you cant make someone happy who is determined to be miserable and you cant make people see their patterns of misery.

but i have fixed people, i do it without thinking and without emotion and i do it quite well.  ive fixed an alcoholic friend, my manipulative mother, an alocholic boyfriend, an abusive boyfriend and a serial adulterer - and a few others.  the trick is not to be emotionally involved. the moment a fixee has youre emotions to play on, youre screwed

looking at that list its hard to imagine how i could have been emotionally uninvolved, but i was - they pushed me far enough that i pulled up the draw bridge and for whatever reason that sorted them out, but in each case it was a long drawn out process.

but i dont think i meant fixing people like that.  although, i realise that in essence that is how it sounds.

i meant that as a sub, having my subbie needs fixed by a Dom, how do i as a subbie ensure that i fix my D's needs - and that being passively there doesnt feel enough sometimes.

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RE: people fixers - 12/6/2008 12:23:47 PM   
lally3


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quote:

ORIGINAL: DavanKael

quote:

ORIGINAL: ThundersCry

Fixin` or fistin`...
 
Fistin` fix`s alot of...stuff...
 
<squints without my glasses on>


Amen to that! 
Davan


from youre POV possibly

however, from this receivee's POV i can assure you that it fixes nothing except a grimace of pain and a desire to be somewhere else!

< Message edited by lally3 -- 12/6/2008 12:24:28 PM >


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RE: people fixers - 12/6/2008 1:32:58 PM   
scottjk


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quote:

ORIGINAL: lally3

i meant that as a sub, having my subbie needs fixed by a Dom, how do i as a subbie ensure that i fix my D's needs - and that being passively there doesnt feel enough sometimes.



Hmm, when he's in a bad mood, get as sexy as hell. I mean really crank up the sexuality. Nothing gets me out of a funk, or out of my anger than a one or more rounds of just plain fucking. It really makes the brain jump tracks, and it helps clear away the blinders so I can think better.



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RE: people fixers - 12/6/2008 1:43:18 PM   
LadyHibiscus


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I am a rescuer.  I am a caretaker.  I work hard to avoid both of those things!  I try to not take in strays, and to limit my generosity, regardless of its form.  It's amazingly difficult, and I honestly have to examine my motives often.  Why am I like this?  Not from any idea that I have the Answers, certainly.  I have always been an outsider, and always been on the side of the underdog.  When someone needs help, I try to help them.   Not live their life, not do everything for them, HELP them. 

I have always wanted to BE rescued, but I learned a long time ago that there is no such thing for me.  So, I try to "rescue" others, pass on what I have learned to those with similar issues, offer a listening ear.  I would dearly love to learn how to be cold and empty hearted, like so many people I meet, but I am who I am. 

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RE: people fixers - 12/6/2008 1:44:59 PM   
simpleplan2


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That's how I feel too.  I'd so love to be rescued...or at least to know what it feels like but I don't seem to be able to let that happen.

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RE: people fixers - 12/6/2008 1:49:23 PM   
windchymes


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quote:

ORIGINAL: lally3


but i have fixed people, i do it without thinking and without emotion and i do it quite well.  ive fixed an alcoholic friend, my manipulative mother, an alocholic boyfriend, an abusive boyfriend and a serial adulterer - and a few others.  the trick is not to be emotionally involved. the moment a fixee has youre emotions to play on, youre screwed



I know your intentions are good, but alcoholics/addicts are never "fixed".   They are in a pretty much eternal state of "recovering" and they have to put some degree of effort into that every day of their lives.

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RE: people fixers - 12/6/2008 1:50:28 PM   
oceanwynds


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quote:

but i have fixed people, i do it without thinking and without emotion and i do it quite well.  ive fixed an alcoholic friend, my manipulative mother, an alocholic boyfriend, an abusive boyfriend and a serial adulterer - and a few others.  the trick is not to be emotionally involved. the moment a fixee has youre emotions to play on, youre screwed



Interesting Lally. Yes turning off the emotions is a major plus. That is something I am not able to learn to do yet.

oceanwynds

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RE: people fixers - 12/6/2008 1:52:56 PM   
BKSir


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I've been considering getting my Dear One fixed...  After all, as Bob Barker said, "Help control the pet population, have your pets spayed and neutered."

On the serious side though, I can see what you mean about 'people fixers', but, as many have said, people need to fix themselves, I just happen to be there to help hand them the right tools and put band-aids on when they scrape their knuckles.


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RE: people fixers - 12/6/2008 3:07:56 PM   
theobserver


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quote:

ORIGINAL: lally3

a thought came to me the other day and i was wondering if its something inherent in the people who walk these corridors.

its about people fixing. (and since posting this thread we've agreed that fixing is probably the wrong word because we cant fix a person, but we can help them to grow, change, develop, find inner peace, chase deamons)

ive always tried to help people, guys ive been out with, friends who are going through problems - im in there - trying to fix their problems for them.  in my line of work i have people talking to me about all sorts of problems, fears and worries, bereavement etc, i dont feel ive done enough if i havent at least tried to ease or help or advise somehow.

this isnt anything grand, im not attempting to suggest for a minute that im some sort of saint (because im not  - im a sinner from almost every stand point) but i know that D's have this in them, and what i got to thinking, since this is a place of symbiosis, of like people with like people, are we all like this or is it mainly a D thing.

edited: to change almost the entire post because it was partly bollox, partly confused and largely pointless


I say always go with your intuition, even if others may not agree. :)

As for the questions you posed, in my opinion, this can be found in many relationships ... a sort of co-dependency. People looking for (what I'll refer to as ...) a captain save-a-sub and others, looking for someone they can mold into what they want.

The latter part can also go another way ... people who feel at their best when they think they are needed. It's hard for me to articulate right now.

Although, I really do get what you were asking.




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RE: people fixers - 12/6/2008 4:14:03 PM   
lally3


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quote:

ORIGINAL: scottjk

quote:

ORIGINAL: lally3

i meant that as a sub, having my subbie needs fixed by a Dom, how do i as a subbie ensure that i fix my D's needs - and that being passively there doesnt feel enough sometimes.



Hmm, when he's in a bad mood, get as sexy as hell. I mean really crank up the sexuality. Nothing gets me out of a funk, or out of my anger than a one or more rounds of just plain fucking. It really makes the brain jump tracks, and it helps clear away the blinders so I can think better.




now that is an excellent suggestion!

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RE: people fixers - 12/6/2008 5:03:52 PM   
stella41b


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The desire to fix someone is to me nothing more than perfectionism dressed up as caring, compassion and kindness. It is a paradox, a psychological and emotional oxymoron, at best misplaced kindness, at worst delusional.

A considerable number of those confined in institutions for their own good or serving lengthy prison sentences also believe they can fix people. Some of them walk among and interact with those who feel destined or chosen.

It's not something I feel which is so characteristic of D types or s types, it's a people thing. People look around themselves, and what do they see? They see both the positive and the negative, they experience both the positive and the negative, in themselves, in their own lives, and they see this in others. If only things could be different, if only things could be better, if just maybe... Human nature I guess.

This is something personal to me, it bothers me constantly.. I'm Stella, transgendered, female, artistic, creative, highly developed spiritually, an intuitive empath, I don't fit in and couldn't even if I tried, and so I very much live out of the box, out there on the fringes of life, of society, I'm fortunate to have some degree of talents, awareness and knowledge, but much of this has come from years and years of worrying through sleepless nights over whether I am actually insane, gifted, chosen, deluded, a genius, or purely dysfunctional. Who am I? What am I? Why am I me? And what is the solution?

But you know maybe this is also my delusion, because other people no doubt feel the same, have the same thoughts, the same misgivings, the same doubts, I know they do, I'm sure of it, because every morning I look in the mirror and I see myself, a human being, and I look at others around me and what do I see? Human beings.

Therefore I draw the conclusion that I am an example, the only example I can be is one of humanity, nothing more. I pray and I meditate daily, committed to this notion that I have had since the age of 17 that I am a Buddhist. In everything I do, I walk the walk, talk the talk, I stare at bodies of water, I stare at clouds, saw a cloud the other day over Central London which reminded me of my soul when I was a child, wispy round the edges, deformed, out of shape, and hurting.. but then again, how can a cloud be deformed? What is the ideal formation for a cloud? Can anyone tell me?

But you know I have to live too, I am part of society, the sharp end (as I perceive it), but I know that I am imperfect in my humanity as everyone else and so I live, and I live among those who are also aware of the imperfections of themselves, of living and of society, and everything goes together to make a life.

I know from my own existence and 42 years of living on this planet that I have issues, emotional baggage, weaknesses and vulnerabilities, and whether I like it or not these things come out, they are visible, they are apparent, but these are things I am working on. Nobody else can fix me but me, and though you think you might know and understand your perspective is always going to be different from mine.

This to me cuts both ways, my clear grey eyes and soft benevolent gaze can look straight into your eyes and into your soul, and I can see what you know, what you feel, even sometimes what you think, and I see such things as fear, insecurity, vulnerability, issues, emotional baggage, but I am not you, and I can only try in some way to understand, to empathize, to use my imagination, draw on my own experience of similar experiences to see what you see, feel what you feel, but my feeling and my thinking will always differ from your's.

I have come across one or two people in my life who will tell you and claim that I am 'gifted', that I have healing powers, and if anyone here ever comes across such a person, please, at my request, do not believe them. It's not true. It is probably someone who was suffering from a headache, and so I placed my hands upon their head, talked to them softly, soothed them, helped them achieve a calmer state of mind, and the headache disappeared.

This is very simple knowledge, mind over matter. If you can control your mind and discipline your mind, then you will have full control of your body. A major cause of many minor ailments is stress, and such conditions which are stress-induced are also psychosomatic therefore it isn't me who is doing the healing, it is your belief that I am healing you, but the truth is you are healing yourself.

So why then am I 60lbs or so overweight? I am human, and therefore imperfect, and go back and read above, I have issues, emotional baggage and other crap I am dealing with about myself, and this takes time to work out. But you know all this healing and solving issues will only lead to other issues and emotional baggage, and this will continue until I die.

You see perfectionism, like death, is just like the horizon, it's there, you can see it, but as much as you try, and no matter how much you try or what you do you will never ever reach a place where you will be able to reach out that touch that horizon and hold it in your hands. It will always remain an illusion.

And so it is with fixing people. Until you become that other person, and you can live inside them, and be them, you will never be able to fix them. All you can do is fix yourself, make a note of all the successes and all the failures, all the experiences and learn from them so that you may be able to one day share those experiences with someone else so that they may see something or try something they have maybe never thought of or tried.

And though we may seek to deny it, conceal it, hide it, all of our issues, our weaknesses, our baggage, our fears, they all come out, and they come out through our own personal self-expression, through the things we think, through the words we say and write, through the ways we project ourselves, behave, conduct ourselves, it all comes out, it is all visible, and there for others to see. But it is our weaknesses, our vulnerability, our issues and our baggage which together stand as hard evidence that we are human, and we are very much alive.

Is this such a bad thing to have on display? Is it not the case that it is our weaknesses, our issues and our baggage which provide us with opportunities to reach out to others, to share, to interact, and to give and receive acts of kindness, of understanding, of compassion, of acceptance, of friendship and of love? Do we not desire these things for our own emotional wellbeing, fulfillment, happiness, to remind us that we are human and very much alive?

This is why I do not require fixing, from anyone, nor will I ever attempt to fix anyone else. I don't need to. I have yet to come across a person who I find unacceptable as a human being. I have yet to come across a person who honestly doesn't need or accept acceptance, understanding, kindness, compassion, friendship or love and who is resistant to such things.

This to me is what life is all about, acceptance, understanding, learning, kindness, compassion, friendship, and love. Life is about truth and beauty.

The horizon is there to tell me where I am and which direction I need to be going in. Perfection is an illusion which serves the same purpose for me in my life.

Edited to remove and check insecurities about my thinking.


< Message edited by stella41b -- 12/6/2008 5:05:46 PM >


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RE: people fixers - 12/6/2008 5:04:40 PM   
lally3


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quote:

ORIGINAL: windchymes

quote:

ORIGINAL: lally3


but i have fixed people, i do it without thinking and without emotion and i do it quite well.  ive fixed an alcoholic friend, my manipulative mother, an alocholic boyfriend, an abusive boyfriend and a serial adulterer - and a few others.  the trick is not to be emotionally involved. the moment a fixee has youre emotions to play on, youre screwed



I know your intentions are good, but alcoholics/addicts are never "fixed".   They are in a pretty much eternal state of "recovering" and they have to put some degree of effort into that every day of their lives.


yes, i agree totally and you cant fix that for anyone and the struggle never goes away - eternal state of recovering is a depressingly accurate description. 

my friend lapses, my mother lapses - but then they fight back - it is an eternal state of struggle, defeat, struggle, beat.  both would be dead by now i think if everyone had given up on them though.



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RE: people fixers - 12/6/2008 5:07:38 PM   
lally3


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quote:

ORIGINAL: oceanwynds

quote:

but i have fixed people, i do it without thinking and without emotion and i do it quite well.  ive fixed an alcoholic friend, my manipulative mother, an alocholic boyfriend, an abusive boyfriend and a serial adulterer - and a few others.  the trick is not to be emotionally involved. the moment a fixee has youre emotions to play on, youre screwed



Interesting Lally. Yes turning off the emotions is a major plus. That is something I am not able to learn to do yet.

oceanwynds


 it takes practice - trouble is im too good at it now.  i can feel myself switch off emotionally at the slightest trigger, which isnt so good - a wall goes up and im buggered if i know how to break it down.

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RE: people fixers - 12/6/2008 5:20:33 PM   
oceanwynds


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This got me thinking about when I use to work as a drug abuse counselor. When a few of my clients where in trouble, I would just take them home with me. Poor hubby, shaking my head, had to enforce in me that I could not do that. I really was a major codependent person way back when. Wanting to fix everyone, and give them a second chance. In the end, I didnt fix anyone.

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RE: people fixers - 12/6/2008 5:24:26 PM   
lally3


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And so it is with fixing people. Until you become that other person, and you can live inside them, and be them, you will never be able to fix them. All you can do is fix yourself, make a note of all the successes and all the failures, all the experiences and learn from them so that you may be able to one day share those experiences with someone else so that they may see something or try something they have maybe never thought of or tried.

And though we may seek to deny it, conceal it, hide it, all of our issues, our weaknesses, our baggage, our fears, they all come out, and they come out through our own personal self-expression, through the things we think, through the words we say and write, through the ways we project ourselves, behave, conduct ourselves, it all comes out, it is all visible, and there for others to see. But it is our weaknesses, our vulnerability, our issues and our baggage which together stand as hard evidence that we are human, and we are very much alive.

Is this such a bad thing to have on display? Is it not the case that it is our weaknesses, our issues and our baggage which provide us with opportunities to reach out to others, to share, to interact, and to give and receive acts of kindness, of understanding, of compassion, of acceptance, of friendship and of love? Do we not desire these things for our own emotional wellbeing, fulfillment, happiness, to remind us that we are human and very much alive?

This is why I do not require fixing, from anyone, nor will I ever attempt to fix anyone else. I don't need to. I have yet to come across a person who I find unacceptable as a human being. I have yet to come across a person who honestly doesn't need or accept acceptance, understanding, kindness, compassion, friendship or love and who is resistant to such things.

This to me is what life is all about, acceptance, understanding, learning, kindness, compassion, friendship, and love. Life is about truth and beauty. (quote from stellas beautiful post)

 
people can help people simply by being who they are, by example, we all learn from each other - the steady honesty of just being who you are to someone else can anchor them.
 
if you or i or anyone else has helped anyone and most of us have at some time or another, it has been by being ourselves.  usually thats all it takes, that and the fact that they recognise something in you that they wish to be/have/comprehend.
 
it starts a journey, a process for them - beyond that its up to them.
 
ive never actively tried to fix anyone - all that i do is detach myself from the bits i dont like, embrace the bits i do like and remove myself completely when it all gets too shitty.  for some reason i cant explain thats worked for some people in my past.
 
ocean - you made me smile.  i remember being parked up on a road in london, lost and wondering which way to go, when a drunk opened my passenger door and climbed in.  i told him to fuck off, no way was i taking him home. in the end i had to drag him out physically - i am a compassionate person usually, but that was taking the piss!





< Message edited by lally3 -- 12/6/2008 5:40:06 PM >


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RE: people fixers - 12/6/2008 5:26:20 PM   
YourhandMyAss


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Daddy would get mad at me for not respecting he's in a bad mood and pestering him. As that is what he'd see it as. Pestering.


quote:

ORIGINAL: scottjk


Hmm, when he's in a bad mood, get as sexy as hell. I mean really crank up the sexuality.


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RE: people fixers - 12/6/2008 5:32:58 PM   
sparkyRBF


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quote:

sometimes, when im talking to a D and he tells me all the things he wants to do for his sub, the whys and wherefores, the giving often to the point of aching need, a gap, a deep abiding need to nurture and give themselves - it makes me wonder what it is i can give in return and is it enough to just be there in my capacity as me - is that enough, is there something more that i am giving other than my submission and if so what is it? am i missing something because sometimes i worry that there is an imbalance of provision.


Yes, i believe that is enough.  For a s to let the D be the D.   To continue to accept the D and therefore allowing the D's natural self to be free.  It has been my experience that some D's hold back doling out little bits of themselves to see how the s is going to react to them.  The more accepted they feel, the more they release their fears of rejection and allow themselves to be free.  So yes, just being you, just being accepting of them and accepting of what they want to give you feeds that need they have and makes it enough.   In my non professional opinion that is.

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RE: people fixers - 12/6/2008 6:50:50 PM   
DavanKael


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I do not believe you can fix others.  To quote a guy I knew, "people are either obstacles or vehicles" and we can choose which of these they are in our lives but we can not make them exert the effort to fix what needs fixing about themselves nor can we do it for them; we can be a support of they choose to allow us and we choose to offer ourselves as such.  There is also the old Biblically-oriented but broadly applicable saying of "give a man a fish and he'll eat for a day, teach a man to fish and he'll eat for a lifetime". 
  Davan

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RE: people fixers - 12/6/2008 7:48:49 PM   
NihilusZero


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quote:

ORIGINAL: DavanKael

I do not believe you can fix others.

Obviously people need to be their own catalysts (and there may even be exceptions to that), but...even considering the tenuous structure of it in the first place, the entirety of psychology falls into question if the above is the case. no?

< Message edited by NihilusZero -- 12/6/2008 7:49:18 PM >


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