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RE: Threatening or encouraging? - 12/14/2008 9:31:22 AM   
IrishMist


Posts: 7480
Joined: 11/17/2005
Status: offline 		Ask yourself one question.

Would YOU allow another to do this to YOU?
How would YOU handle such a situation?

_____________________________

If I said something to offend you, please tell me what it was so that I can say it again later.


(in reply to DeviantDestiny25)
Profile   Post #: 41
RE: Threatening or encouraging? - 12/14/2008 11:01:54 PM   
Aszhrae


Posts: 1030
Joined: 3/31/2008
Status: offline 		I am sorry... but I cannot believe that any mistress who is always there for her pet, encouraging her etc. would allow another, present or not, to disrupt what she does for her pet and allow her pet to be abused.  Someone messes with my pet... and there will be hell to pay...HELL I tell you!  I could not, would not be with anyone who abused another like that and it wouldn't be the pet being shown to the door... but the abuser.

It came up about 2 weeks ago. Master was being particularly nasty by threatening to toss me from a second story balcony. Mistress was at work and master decided that it was his opportunity to humiliate me again. Girl was so upset, girl ran away. Now mistress has given girl a cell phone, so when it happens girl can call her and tell her. Mistress was pissed when she came home. Now girl does not think she is worth mistress and master become split up because master's mistreatment of girl. Mistress told master, harm my pet again and I'm leaving. Girl has never seen master so apologetic. Girl still gets publicly humiliated but since mistress threatened to leave, master has not touched me since.
Master does sneak a drink once and while, sees me look and just simply says,'He doesn't care if mistress finds out'
Mistress knows this is not a healthy environment for me anymore. Whatever girl is to get done, girl has to get done very quickly. Girl quite believes mistress, master is a bomb about to go off.
It has come down to this, labor for master, do not provoke, do not ask questions, do not even meet masters gaze when he speaks to girl, earn your allowance, save your allowance.
Not my place, but girl worries for mistress. If girl is not here to keep master distracted, Master's hostility will focus upon Mistress. Mistress knows, once girl is gone, mistress is going to their daughters. Mistress told girl she has had enough. Master is becoming cruel and even mistress realizes this.

Rather strange evening tonight. Mistress invited master and girl out for dinner. Mistress had girl sit across from master. Not a word was spoken between master and my self before, during and after the meal. Not sure why, but it made me rather uncomfortable. Could not wait to get back, do a small chore in the bathroom and the confine my self to my room.

Do not provoke, do not ask questions, do not meet master's gaze when he speaks to girl, earn your allowance and save your allowance, so girl can get the hell out of here.

(in reply to Lockit)
Profile   Post #: 42
RE: Threatening or encouraging? - 12/15/2008 1:40:01 AM   
WinsomeDefiance


Posts: 6719
Joined: 8/7/2007
Status: offline 		Being open, transparent and vulnerable is something I strive for.  No, not in all things.  I'm typically guarded and reserved.  Even shy at times.  With Him, I'm not.  I just crave the intimacy and connection I feel when I'm laid bare before him, and the contentment of embracing the truth that he knows and accepts that most intimate part of me. 

When manipulative tactics such as was stated in your OP are used, it is done so in a confrontational and threatening way that would have me naturally re-erecting my protective guards.  This is simply counter-productive to the need I have to surrender myself, and so I see it as detrimental over all.  Certainly NOT encouraging.  I simply would not find myself mastered by someone who manipulated me in that fashion, because anyone who did that could not get close enough to that feminine slaves nature I possess, to do so. 

I can't surrender from behind a barricade.  I've tried before.  It was unsatisfactory, and I failed at the attempt.

Please understand that I don't mean to over-romanticize my reactions.  I just know that 11+ years ago, the man I loved more than my own life sat across from me and unprovoked, in a calm detached tone, broke my heart  with these few words, "You are a worthless fucking bitch, you know that?  No one but me will ever want you."  No one should ever feel that way.  It is a lonley, guarded place within which to exist, when the alternative is so infinitely more beautiful.  I never want to go back to being that guarded again, and so I cherish every second of my transparency with  Him, becuase it is offered and received from a place of acceptance.  In my mind, it is the difference between manipulative control, and  genuine mastery. 

Respectfully,
WinD

< Message edited by WinsomeDefiance -- 12/15/2008 2:03:05 AM >

(in reply to Aszhrae)
Profile   Post #: 43
RE: Threatening or encouraging? - 12/15/2008 5:21:34 AM   
Vinmier


Posts: 41
Joined: 12/5/2008
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: DeviantDestiny25

There has been a lot of discussion about whether or not you should threaten to dismiss a submissive permenantly and tell them that nobody else will ever accept them as they are as a means of encouragement. I am not so sure whether this is a good idea...it has been suggested to me but I just dont know...as submissives how would you feel if a mistress was to threaten you with that?                                                                                                   


It sounds to me like you don't think it's a good idea either, hence the general outcry that it's not a good thing. I am a male submissive, and I know my Lady would never say this to me. To me, this is not encouragement. It's a way to tear someone down, taking the thing that they are trying to do for you, and throwing it away. As for how I would feel if she threatened me with this? Probably not much after the initial shock. Just numbness as I would write a letter to her, telling her how bad it hurt me to hear her say that. If she said it again, then I would merely take it as a sign she did not want me, pack my things, and bid her farewell.

As many posters have stated, there are much better ways to encourage your submissive. Praise works well for me personally. I like to know I'm doing a good job for my Lady, and it makes me beam when she tells me so. If she thinks that I am deficient in an area, she will discuss it with me and we find a suitable way of teaching me. It's how we build trust, and connect with one another.

(in reply to DeviantDestiny25)
Profile   Post #: 44
RE: Threatening or encouraging? - 12/15/2008 6:35:54 AM   
bdaile


Posts: 69
Joined: 12/8/2008
Status: offline 		There is no way that that could be construed as encouragement. It is emotional abuse, plain and simple, and I for one would not put up with it for a minute. I was in an emotionally abusive relationship for almost four years, and was only able to leave after he threatened to kill me when I told him I might have been pregnant. Never again will I allow myself to be treated that way. In my opinion, if you have to resort to treating your sub/slave like that, you don't deserve to have one.

_____________________________

~brittany~

(in reply to Vinmier)
Profile   Post #: 45
RE: Threatening or encouraging? - 12/15/2008 7:58:08 AM   
Aszhrae


Posts: 1030
Joined: 3/31/2008
Status: offline 		Girl knows other sub/slaves can relate to what happens almost daily here.
During the day laboring for master the guards go up. As mistress tells me, master wants an automaton, give him one, mistress told girl to be cold.
Girl really does not like it. Thankfully girl can look forward to mistress' familiar comforts in the evening.
Sometimes girl gets a complete day or two to self. Those days are for chores, but again they are days where it's just girl. Get what you can get done before master steps through the door. If your chores incomplete, doesn't matter, just go to your room and stay there. Complete them when master leaves or when mistress gets home.
It is the avoidance game.
Today is so very cold, girl is ill, mistress gave me a gift *smiles*. Master asked mistress for girl to labor for him. Girl and cold do not get along. 95F(35C) is light sweater weather for girl. Not 51F(-11C), with a breeze that makes it feel like 0F(-18C). If everyday was 110F(43C) and dry, girl would love it immensely.

[If you don't believe me about how cold it is, just ask someone else that resides her in BC]

(in reply to WinsomeDefiance)
Profile   Post #: 46
RE: Threatening or encouraging? - 12/15/2008 8:43:04 AM   
littleone35


Posts: 2828
Joined: 2/17/2005
Status: offline 		Fast Reply

I did not read all the responses but the it  is emotional abuse.  I for one would not stand for it i would walk away.  What works for me is positive renformencent.  I do something really well or right that i have benn strulgging  with let me know.  Why be negitive when postivity works so much better?

Matt's littleone

(in reply to Aszhrae)
Profile   Post #: 47
RE: Threatening or encouraging? - 12/15/2008 8:48:50 AM   
SageFemmexx


Posts: 240
Joined: 1/2/2007
Status: offline 		Think about the number of women held in marriages by threats like that--do as I say or I'll throw you out....and no one else would want you anyway.....

The person doing the threatening is not only an emotional abuser but has issues of maturity and control. Holding anyone through threats and fear makes for a bad relationship. After awhile, the person being threatened stops caring and shuts down. They know in their gut it's only a matter of time before they are out on their ear no matter what they do.

Sage.

(in reply to natasha66)
Profile   Post #: 48
RE: Threatening or encouraging? - 12/15/2008 8:50:43 AM   
Mercnbeth


Posts: 11766
Status: offline
quote:

...tell them that nobody else will ever accept them as they are...


an extremely abusive asshole this slave was in a relationship with once told her something along those lines.  he prefaced it with "after i am done with you..."
 
at the time, it wasn't encouraging...it was downright depressing, and the context wasn't meant as encouragement, the intent was debasement.
 
after leaving the relationship, those words rang in this slave's ears when she would cry over the wasted years spent hoping he would change BACK to the way he was when we got together.
 
after the grieving, this slave used those words as a reverse mantra.  she wouldn't allow him a long distance "win" for that struggle for this slave's self confidence/worth/esteem after pulling herself up from the despair of that failure.
 
intent means everything.

(in reply to DeviantDestiny25)
Profile   Post #: 49
RE: Threatening or encouraging? - 12/15/2008 6:36:38 PM   
Aszhrae


Posts: 1030
Joined: 3/31/2008
Status: offline 		It would have not been a struggle to be out and on my way to serve another mistress, but over the last 3 years, not only had girl's savings been used to help mistress (and master) recover from their car accident but they managed to spend all that girl earned for the 6 months girl was loaned out. Now with 9 months remaining in service, girl has a whole of expenses and what allowance girl gets goes into girl's own account. Mistress helped girl set up, even mistress does not have access.
If girl was to leave now 'littleone35' girl would not have a pot to piss in or a place to go.
To anyone's next question. No, girl has not had contact with personal family for 19 years.
Girl is at master's mercy, which is why mistress has girl avoiding master unless it can not be avoided. Which is why girl was also given a cell phone to contact mistress when master is on the warpath.

(in reply to littleone35)
Profile   Post #: 50
RE: Threatening or encouraging? - 12/15/2008 11:20:54 PM   
AlexandraLynch


Posts: 778
Joined: 3/24/2008
Status: offline
quote:

I think the OP is asking how can you inspire a sub to be better other than manipulation


You make them want to make you happy, give them opportunities to succeed in doing so, and reward them for doing so. You make them understand that you care about them and have their total best interest in mind. You communicate.

I've discovered in life that you get what you give.


(in reply to Lockit)
Profile   Post #: 51
RE: Threatening or encouraging? - 12/16/2008 6:59:33 AM   
greeneyedreamer


Posts: 442
Joined: 6/20/2007
Status: offline 		Wouldn't work for me, but I am not at all into humiliation. Positive reinforcement works for me. The more I get the more I want to please and please.

Dreamer

_____________________________

Dreamer, owned and ecstatically happy

I am still learning... Michelangelo, age 87

Maybe some women weren't meant to be tamed. Maybe they are suppose to run wild until they find someone just as wild to run with. Sex and the City

(in reply to natasha66)
Profile   Post #: 52
RE: Threatening or encouraging? - 12/18/2008 1:01:22 PM   
GoddessTeaze


Posts: 1125
Joined: 10/14/2006
From: The Netherlands
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: CatdeMedici

For sub who is into humiliation, verbal abuse and torment, Im sure it would thrill them-otherwise, personally--I find it abusive and childish.

What a nonsense you are saying here. Humiliation hasn't got anything to do with abusive, and just shitty behavier. Humiliation is based upon a Deep commitment within Bdsm which starts with trust and respect, and for Me Love is the basic of that.

I've met so many abused subs on here, who met those so called pathetic wankers, which say they are Dominants, It's amazing what they do with them, in the name of Bdsm.

But No it's not how you treat the one you love, and care about, think about how you yourself want to be taught something, that's not with threaten or anything which comes close. Use your brain !!!

That's called pure abuse, and shows what a louzy person you're
if ya use such and truly Nothing else.

B safe you subs out there.

Warm Greetingz

GoddezzT`


_____________________________

~* The only disability in life is a bad attitude. ~Scott Hamilton*~

~*Beauty is not in the face; beauty is a light in the heart. ~Kahlil Gibran*~

(in reply to CatdeMedici)
Profile   Post #: 53
RE: Threatening or encouraging? - 12/18/2008 2:09:21 PM   
bratnwranglers


Posts: 113
Joined: 5/24/2007
Status: offline 		to me that is simply playing on one's emotionals in an abusive manner and simply not healthy, so if it was done to me, that would be the end of the relationship. how could you ever trust or respect someone with your entire being after they threaten to leave on a whim, thats how you build resentment not trust. just my two cents :)

(in reply to GoddessTeaze)
Profile   Post #: 54
RE: Threatening or encouraging? - 12/18/2008 3:58:26 PM   
kiwisub12


Posts: 4742
Joined: 1/11/2006
Status: offline 		Just a thought   -   never threaten something that you are not willing to carry through on.
After all, if someone said this and then didn't carry the threat out, then all credibility is lost.

If a "dominant" said this to me, i would take him up on it. Been on the abused end of a relationship - never again!

(in reply to bratnwranglers)
Profile   Post #: 55
RE: Threatening or encouraging? - 12/23/2008 4:58:18 PM   
SlaveBlutarsky


Posts: 491
Joined: 10/10/2005
From: Upstate, NY
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: DeviantDestiny25

There has been a lot of discussion about whether or not you should threaten to dismiss a submissive permenantly and tell them that nobody else will ever accept them as they are as a means of encouragement. I am not so sure whether this is a good idea...it has been suggested to me but I just dont know...as submissives how would you feel if a mistress was to threaten you with that?                                                                                                   


I'd be very wary if someone who legitimately cared for me said this with any seriousness.  While I kind of understand the whole breaking down/building up practice that some Dommes use, I don't agree with it for the most part. I've found that a Domme can be incredibly sadistic with their words without having to belittle me; in addition to having me completely fear and respect her without having to say a word, let alone a negative one.

For me, I believe a M/s relationship should be one of mutual benfit in which the sum of the whole is greater than the individual parts, I would never want to be with someone who didn't feel I added as much to their life as they did to me, and pffft to no one ever accepting me as is, that's just crazy talk




_____________________________

Strong for all, weak for one

(in reply to DeviantDestiny25)
Profile   Post #: 56
RE: Threatening or encouraging? - 12/23/2008 7:42:31 PM   
NuevaVida


Posts: 6707
Joined: 8/5/2008
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: DeviantDestiny25

There has been a lot of discussion about whether or not you should threaten to dismiss a submissive permenantly and tell them that nobody else will ever accept them as they are as a means of encouragement. I am not so sure whether this is a good idea...it has been suggested to me but I just dont know...as submissives how would you feel if a mistress was to threaten you with that?                                                                                                   


Been there, done that.  It was cruel and abusive and left me practically a shell of a human being.  I agree with Lockit - find someone else to suggest things to you.

I prefer the building up approach rather than the tearing down.  Set a high but reachable bar.  As the slave reaches the bar, his/her esteem and confidence will rise. Teach tools for reaching the bar if necessary.   Notice the effort and appreciate it.  Talk often, and know what going on in his/her mind and heart.  If you pay close enough attention, your slave will unknowingly guide you in exactly how he/she needs to be led.


_____________________________

Live Simply. Love Generously. Care Deeply. Speak Kindly.



(in reply to DeviantDestiny25)
Profile   Post #: 57
RE: Threatening or encouraging? - 12/23/2008 8:44:27 PM   
Aszhrae


Posts: 1030
Joined: 3/31/2008
Status: offline 		Is it threatening or encouraging to know that from here until thanksgiving next year, everything that I do, the days like christmas, I do with a contemptible master, and a mistress that has not only treated me as her pet but also like her own daughter as well.
The future I find to be both, encouraging that I will have a mistress as keen to own me as I would be to belong to my mistress. Threatening in the thought, I have absolutely no idea what is to become of me leaving the only place I have come to call home.


(in reply to NuevaVida)
Profile   Post #: 58
RE: Threatening or encouraging? - 12/24/2008 4:14:32 AM   
DarkSteven


Posts: 28072
Joined: 5/2/2008
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: lilmissdefiant

I think the OP is asking how can you inspire a sub to be better other than manipulation


I'm not certain what the OP is asking.  She offered two statements, which could be considered a tool to achieve something.  Unfortunately, she did not state WHAT they were intended to achieve.

The first statement, threatening dismissal, is fine.  But not for a minor issue.  It should be used to let your slave know that he/she has done something which is a major issue and will result in dismissal unless it is dealt with completely.  After that, it is your joint responsibility to work out a plan to address his/her behavior.  If the plan does not work, he or she gets dismissed quickly.

The second statement, stating that they will never again serve, does nothing to help you and hurts them.  I can't think of any situation in which it could be useful.

_____________________________

"You women....

The small-breasted ones want larger breasts. The large-breasted ones want smaller ones. The straight-haired ones curl their hair, and the curly-haired ones straighten theirs...

Quit fretting. We men love you."

(in reply to lilmissdefiant)
Profile   Post #: 59
RE: Threatening or encouraging? - 12/24/2008 7:47:29 AM   
myotherself


Posts: 7157
Joined: 3/9/2006
From: The cold bit of the UK
Status: offline 		As a teacher, we are told that for every word of censure, we give 5 words of praise.  I deliberately started doing this with even my very difficult classes, and the results were startling.  Children eager to please, eager to try to answer questions, doing anything they could so that I would notice them and give out even more praise.

It's made me love my job again, and I would heartily recommend that every Dom/me tries this with their sub.

For me?  Any Dom who started out telling me I had to measure up or ship out would only see my back as I walked quickly away from him

_____________________________

There's nowt so queer as folk


(in reply to DarkSteven)
Profile   Post #: 60
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