quote:

ORIGINAL: DesFIP

Like Rayne, the constant put downs caused learned helplessness. I learned that no matter what I did, I was wrong, so it was safer never to do anything.

The problems left over into this relationship are that I am still relatively passive. It takes a perfect day for me to initiate sexual contact because I'm so afraid of being rejected meanly. I'm afraid of anticipatory service for fear of guessing wrong as to what he might like and being shot down as a result.

The scars left are many and longlasting. All from verbal and emotional abuse.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Icarys

Those that live behind brick walls will slowly starve. What you have stated is one of the reasons I said what I said earlier. You'll probably see anger issues where there might not be any. You'll live the rest of your life running from fear. Any and all of the above with I'm sure a few more possibilities will most likely be your future unless you tone it down and learn to balance those beliefs. If your happy living like that then more power to you but I wouldn't believe you were if you said it.

quote:

ORIGINAL: julietsierra

quote:

ORIGINAL: Icarys

Those that live behind brick walls will slowly starve. What you have stated is one of the reasons I said what I said earlier. You'll probably see anger issues where there might not be any. You'll live the rest of your life running from fear. Any and all of the above with I'm sure a few more possibilities will most likely be your future unless you tone it down and learn to balance those beliefs. If your happy living like that then more power to you but I wouldn't believe you were if you said it.

lol thanks Icarys for your concern.

However, to date, I am in a six year relationship with someone who meets all those parameters and exceeds them. The one "argument" we've had in six years took us six months to work through because neither of us was willing to engage in the drama our respective anger would have dredged up. We talked. We stopped. We brought it up again when we were calm and talked some more. Stopped when things started getting out of hand. He doesn't raise his voice to me. Doesn't 'get' the whole process of ranting and raving simply because we're angry. We take time to process what each has said and never shove things under the carpet. Sometimes it's difficult work, but ALL the time, it's worth it. He holds me to the same standards I hold him to. If I want to start yelling, he'll simply walk away with a promise to continue this when I'm calmer. If I would break something in anger (something I don't do), he'd expect me to a) clean it up and then b) leave. We don't fool around with indiscriminate angst and work very hard to hear the other person when they're speaking. Sometimes, we don't agree. And in those instances, we agree to disagree or of course, if it means that much to us, there are other options, up to and including walking away entirely.

I don't expect you to believe me. People who don't operate like this have very difficult times understanding the process. They can't be bothered with taking the time. Personally, I'd rather solve something than argue, so that sets the tone for the rest of our interactions. But since I've dealt with 'war zone relationships,' I have absolutely no desire to do that again. And I won't.

Quite simply, I'd rather my passions take root in love, not enmity.

juliet

quote:

ORIGINAL: MadRabbit

quote:

ORIGINAL: Icarys

Those that live behind brick walls will slowly starve. What you have stated is one of the reasons I said what I said earlier. You'll probably see anger issues where there might not be any. You'll live the rest of your life running from fear. Any and all of the above with I'm sure a few more possibilities will most likely be your future unless you tone it down and learn to balance those beliefs. If your happy living like that then more power to you but I wouldn't believe you were if you said it.

You already lost me on the whole victim mentality statement so it's not all that big of surprise I am wondering what tangent you are going off on regarding this one.

Taking a closer look at juliet's post...

quote:

ORIGINAL: julietsierra
You broke something out of anger. You're gone. You raise your voice to me instead of talk to me. You're gone. You discover that you're out of control. You're gone. If I am afraid of what you will do because you're angry, you're gone. I will never NEVER be put in a position where I have to live in fear in my own house EVER again. It also happens to be the reason I will never live with someone again either - unless it IS my own house. And I really don't care and won't care if something led up to it or not. It is what it is. You make me afraid of you and your anger, you're out.

I don't see how having a no tolerance policy to someone who doesn't have solid control over his temper equates to "living behind a brick wall".

Would selecting someone with clear signs of heavy alcoholism, drug abuse, and psychological issues as well heighten the feast of life, free from the confines of brick walls? Nobody should be with a partner who fosters feelings of fear and insecurity in them over the unpredictability of what they might do the next time you piss them off. Period.

If you interpreted her post that way, more power to you, but I don't see it that way at all. If juliet was dating me and she told me what she told me above, I would tell her it was over, because I am definitely not the kind of person she needs to be with.

You can rationalize breaking a plate and screaming with the intellectually dishonest statement of "Everyone does it!", but they are still irresponsible behaviors.

quote:

ORIGINAL: missturbation

My final bug bear is people who have never suffered abuse of any form telling others what is abusive and what is not. Again it is subjective but until you have WALKED A MILE IN MY SHOES do not presume to tell me how i am supposed to feel about something.
 

quote:

My final bug bear is people who have never suffered abuse of any form telling others what is abusive and what is not. Again it is subjective but until you have WALKED A MILE IN MY SHOES do not presume to tell me how i am supposed to feel about something.

quote:

ORIGINAL: julietsierra

Whatever your reasons, if you and I were involved and you began breaking things, what you'd have on your hands would not be pretty. See, I don't care one whit whether you're in one of the categories you've listed or the other or have found a category all of your own. All I know is that you are angry and that you're breaking things because of that anger rather than going for a walk and calming down so we can talk. And all the intellectualizing of the situation won't matter.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Icarys

No tolerance policies rarely work.

Again you see a meaning that's much more in depth than what I was going for. I simply meant give a little room to breathe as my own personal belief. I don't let someone I'm with get away with yelling at me but I also know that the majority of people get stressed and act out in ways that she had posted she would not allow.

Mark my words..there will be a time when He or even she gets to a point in their relationship that they become overstressed and it won't always work like it is now.
What will she do then? What I perceived in her way of thinking was that there is no room for mistakes.

What it sounds like to me is that both of them deal with things in a wonderful manner and I'm happy for them. Honestly, despite what she has said, I can understand how something at least very close to that is possible.

I've had relationships where there was essentially no arguing and absolutely no yelling. The reason for that is because the females were such docile people and that put me at extreme ease. I knock that one up to compatibility.  We simply worked well together.

quote:

ORIGINAL: LaTigresse

quote:

ORIGINAL: Icarys

No tolerance policies rarely work.

Again you see a meaning that's much more in depth than what I was going for. I simply meant give a little room to breathe as my own personal belief. I don't let someone I'm with get away with yelling at me but I also know that the majority of people get stressed and act out in ways that she had posted she would not allow.

Mark my words..there will be a time when He or even she gets to a point in their relationship that they become overstressed and it won't always work like it is now.
What will she do then? What I perceived in her way of thinking was that there is no room for mistakes.

What it sounds like to me is that both of them deal with things in a wonderful manner and I'm happy for them. Honestly, despite what she has said, I can understand how something at least very close to that is possible.

I've had relationships where there was essentially no arguing and absolutely no yelling. The reason for that is because the females were such docile people and that put me at extreme ease. I knock that one up to compatibility.  We simply worked well together.

"No tollerance policies rarely work."

I am going to have to call total bullshit on this. I also find it extremely humorous on a forum where many involved in M/s relationships post. My relationships are full of "no tollerance". Oddly enough they are relationships that rarely involve anything close to yelling or breaking of things. I actually find the opposite difficult to imagine.

All relationships are based upon certain expectations, whether communicated or not. If one person communicates their expectations, and stands firm, the other/s have a choice to either comply or walk away. It doesn't require any yelling or childish behaviour to communicate either point of view. It is just what many people come to expect or find as "normal" so they cannot imagine it to work any other way.

My grandparents never yelled, neither did my parents. Neither woman was compliant or docile. One relationship was a longterm, till death do us part, sucessful, relationship. The other was hideously fucked up. Yet, again, no abuse, of any sort, was ever visible. I grew up completely ignorant of the potential for nastiness, people that love one another, are capable of. Talking, communication, creating rules and boundaries and lots of love and affection, both verbal and physical, were my norm. Therefor that was how I expected others to behave. Anything else was immature and should be corrected. I have never EVER had any respect for an adult that cannot control their reactions to anger or other potentially destructive emotions and behaviours.

To say that it is impossible to live a life, as an adult, like that, is rediculous. I've seen too many beautiful human beings prove the opposite.

quote:

ORIGINAL: missturbation

I've been reading this thread but other than the odd comment pretty much tried to stay away from it for various reasons.
 
One of the reasons is the mentality of  people that claim people who have suffered abuse, subtle or otherwise are weak and will play the victim. It always seems to be a generalisation, a sweeping statement and whilst true for some victims of abuse, it's not for everyone. 
 
Another reason is the attitude that sharing stories of abuse doesn't help anyone. This one really riles me. Even if hearing anothers experiences only makes you realise you are not alone in your suffering it is worth it. If it helps you to see there are ways out then it's doubly worth it. If it helps you personally to talk about your experiences it has to be a good thing right?
 
What is and what is not abuse is purely subjective. If i feel throwing a plate at a wall is abusive behaviour then it IS and it is up to me to deal with the situation appropriately. If i feel throwing a plate at a wall is not abusive then it ISN'T.
 
My final bug bear is people who have never suffered abuse of any form telling others what is abusive and what is not. Again it is subjective but until you have WALKED A MILE IN MY SHOES do not presume to tell me how i am supposed to feel about something.
 

quote:

ORIGINAL: NuevaVida

quote:

ORIGINAL: Darcyandthedark


And there you have it.  It's therapeutic.  It's comfort.  But don't place is all (the back patting) on those that share, but those that deal effectively.  Again I will repeat.  It's not what occured, it's how you deal.
 
the.dark.

And it's also a pissible door that someone might knock on and say, "Hey, I am going through something similar...can you help point me to a direction out because until I heard your story, I thought I was alone in this."

I know you & I often agree and sometimes don't, and that's cool, and it's obviously your perogative that you want to call this comfort and "back patting."  What's hard is that your own posts seem to be subtly cutting down those who have posted in this thread without directly saying so.  I have to ask, if what we are saying is an example of abusive, and is heartbreaking to you, why have you returned to keep reading and posting here?

quote:

ORIGINAL: missturbation


One of the reasons is the mentality of  people that claim people who have suffered abuse, subtle or otherwise are weak and will play the victim. It always seems to be a generalisation, a sweeping statement and whilst true for some victims of abuse, it's not for everyone. 
 
 

quote:

ORIGINAL: GreedyTop

it's not always that easy to just walk out, LAM.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Lordandmaster

Yes, I'm aware of that.  In fact, I said exactly the same thing just now: http://www.collarchat.com/fb.asp?m=2361048.

At this point it's impossible for Lam to write anything on this thread without someone immediately responding that I must be wrong because I'm male and have never been abused.

quote:

ORIGINAL: GreedyTop

it's not always that easy to just walk out, LAM.