RE: When subspace ISN'T a warm, fluffy place...

RE: When subspace ISN'T a warm, fluffy place... (Full Version)

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JustDarkness -> RE: When subspace ISN'T a warm, fluffy place... (1/4/2009 7:15:15 AM)
quote: I don't want to be an embarassment how could you be that...putting so much research in it..trying to understand it...to please him.

mistoferin -> RE: When subspace ISN'T a warm, fluffy place... (1/4/2009 7:20:22 AM)
Yeah I know that it really just sounds silly, but when I stand at his hand I want the image I project to be one that makes him proud to have me there....and I don't know how to stand proud when I'm looking like 25 miles of bad road.

JustDarkness -> RE: When subspace ISN'T a warm, fluffy place... (1/4/2009 7:21:10 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: mistoferin Yeah I know that it really just sounds silly, but when I stand at his hand I want the image I project to be one that makes him proud to have me there....and I don't know how to stand proud when I'm looking like 25 miles of bad road. he took you for the person you are...be proud on that anndddd......he caused the result himself :P

littlewonder -> RE: When subspace ISN'T a warm, fluffy place... (1/4/2009 8:16:24 AM)
mistoferin, thanks for your postings on this subject. I think they pretty much covered how I feel when Master takes me to that place. Thank you for explaining this. It was nice to read and to know that others experience it and find it just as difficult to deal with.

KnightofMists -> RE: When subspace ISN'T a warm, fluffy place... (1/4/2009 8:23:24 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: mistoferin ...I just don't see how he could think that was sexy. I want to look my best for him and especially, when we are in front of others. I don't want to be an embarassment. Silly...I know.... Yeah Silly... just about as silly as expecting a Sadist to be all fuzzy and soft looking while he beat the living crap out of his masochist slut! In short you are holding on to expectations.. your expectations of how you should look. Personally... I thnk you have to put grace in the context of situation one is in and not context into the grace. What I mean by that is that the grace of obedience while you are serving him his meal is very different than the grace of obedience you will demonstrate while he is beating the crap out of you. To me.. there is a beautiful grace of a woman being ripped apart by the sadist she loves and is committed too. She is not there just enduring what is occuring because she is a masocist.... she is there because she enjoying giving love and pleasures to the Man she loves!.. This is Grace! Grace is not just something you see.... it's what motivates you within!

mistoferin -> RE: When subspace ISN'T a warm, fluffy place... (1/4/2009 8:44:04 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: KnightofMists She is not there just enduring what is occuring because she is a masocist.... she is there because she enjoying giving love and pleasures to the Man she loves!.. This is Grace! Grace is not just something you see.... it's what motivates you within! Thank you KoM, I really needed to hear that from someone outside of our relationship. It's not far off from what he has told me himself but when he says it my head qualifies it by thinking that he is saying it because he loves me and wants me to feel good about myself. I believe that you are right in that it is my own expectations of myself that are hard to let go of as he has told me a million times that he IS proud of me and that I meet his expectations just fine.

KnightofMists -> RE: When subspace ISN'T a warm, fluffy place... (1/4/2009 9:07:24 AM)
quote: I believe that you are right in that it is my own expectations of myself that are hard to let go of as he has told me a million times that he IS proud of me and that I meet his expectations just fine. I believe one of the biggest challenges that submissive personalities have to deal with is not living up to the Expectations of their Dominant partners but letting go of their own expectations that override the expectations of their Dominants. Some may think there is nothing wrong with this as they argue that think there is nothing wrong with a submissive having higher expectations. The problem with this is that Hierarchy of Expectations are Subjective and what you may think as higher expectations might not be to another. But more importantly... Expectations lead us in the decisions we will make. Trying riding a Trail horse! They are already ingrained with the expectations of where they should go. As a rider, getting them to go off the trail can be a real chore... but they do tend to be better once they get of off their trail. I suggest Erin that you are on a trail with how you Normally go to subspace. It might be time to let him take you off the trail and trust in his expectations off that trail.

mistoferin -> RE: When subspace ISN'T a warm, fluffy place... (1/4/2009 9:31:24 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: KnightofMists I suggest Erin that you are on a trail with how you Normally go to subspace. It might be time to let him take you off the trail and trust in his expectations off that trail. You are definitely right there. That trail is thoroughly ingrained, so much so that it is really an automatic response at this point. As I have no interest in being put out to pasture and I don't think I'm ready for the glue factory yet...I think it would be wise to heed your advice (and his) and let him take me on some new trails and control the ride. Last night we were at a play party and he was speaking with another dominant about subspace. I heard him say that the hardest part of subspace for me was staying out of it. He said that I'm "just too damn good" at it. He said that he "catches" me heading there long before he has any desire for me to depart and has to redirect me...not because he doesn't want me to go there, but because he wants the control of that....the when, the how and the where. I guess that if I look at it completely honestly I probably go because the trail IS such a familiar and comfortable place....and his trails are foreign. That makes it scary. Not because I feel that he will lead me to dangerous places but just because they are unfamiliar and I worry that I will falter on them. I think though, that while I'm afraid of faltering, it's most likely what will bring the growth that both he wants to see in me and that I also want. Change is a difficult thing sometimes but I am fortunate that I have a strong, steady hand to lead me through it.

KnightofMists -> RE: When subspace ISN'T a warm, fluffy place... (1/4/2009 10:07:11 AM)
Erin I would suggest that you staying on the familiar trail vrs striking out on an unfamiliar one is more a conditions of not having to think to walk on one as oppose to be scared or intimidated about going to the other. Further to that... I would suggest that you focus on keeping your mind mentally alert when you know he has a desire to take you off that familiar path. You don't have to think to travel that familiar path.. you go on autopilot and you will find yourself there. It is that lack of mental alertness or mindlessness that is allowing to drift right into the engrained behaviors. Increasing your focus on mental alertness is going to be the step to stop you from going to autopilot... in time you will find yourself building a new path with your Master. As a note...you never lose your familiarity of the old path. But... you will learn a new one with equal familiarity.

opposingtwilight -> RE: When subspace ISN'T a warm, fluffy place... (1/4/2009 10:11:50 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: mistoferin Does anyone else out there have a similar experience and if so, is there anything that you do to make that transition easier? Kind of. I have never seen subspace as a warm fluffy place so I always felt a little weird when people would describe it that way and my personal experience was always so much different. I just go with it, though. Thanks for sharing this. It helps me feel less weird. :)

loveandlight87 -> RE: When subspace ISN'T a warm, fluffy place... (1/4/2009 5:07:24 PM)
Mistoferin, This was a powerful thread for me. You explained the feelings eloquently and beautifully. Thank you Thank you. And KnightofMists, great insights! Reading the exchange between you two has the synapses firing for both Sir and me. love

KnightofMists -> RE: When subspace ISN'T a warm, fluffy place... (1/4/2009 9:00:34 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: loveandlight87 Reading the exchange between you two has the synapses firing for both Sir and me. This is one of the things that I find most rewarding and positive about forums like this. Constructive and thoughtful dialogue between individuals on a given issue can be beneficial for not just those participating in the discussion but for those sitting by watching it. If I only had a nickel for each person that made comments like yours to me .... well... I just might have enough to use the pay phone.

mistoferin -> RE: When subspace ISN'T a warm, fluffy place... (1/4/2009 9:13:50 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: loveandlight87 Mistoferin, This was a powerful thread for me. You explained the feelings eloquently and beautifully. Thank you Thank you. And KnightofMists, great insights! Reading the exchange between you two has the synapses firing for both Sir and me. love You're welcome....and I have to agree, KoM does have great insights and his advice is very appreciated by me.

KnightofMists -> RE: When subspace ISN'T a warm, fluffy place... (1/4/2009 9:22:44 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: mistoferin You're welcome....and I have to agree, KoM does have great insights and his advice is very appreciated by me. thank you... but I am only sharing insights that I have gained through the experiences with Alandra over many years and validated with the growth of my relationship with Kyra. Not unlike others that have shared their insights from their experiences that have benefited me. I like to think of situations like this as times that I can return the favor that was given to me over the years.

joyride -> RE: When subspace ISN'T a warm, fluffy place... (1/4/2009 9:30:53 PM)
i've had similar experiences. Like you, it was based on the type of pain and the overall mood of the experience. When i'm in that place, the absolute last thing i want is the typical type of aftercare - the kind that includes lots of resting together and cuddling and general closeness. When i'm in that space, i've found that i just want to be left alone. That being said, he still wants to make sure that i'm going to be ok, and on some level i still want to know that he's there. What i've found that works really well for me is to be put in a cage. i'm a fan of cages in general, they can be a very safe place for me, so it makes sense in my case. We had a big dog crate that worked wonders for this, with a dog pillow on the floor of the cage. When he was done with me, he'd put me in the cage and cover the cage with a big blanket. Wouldn't say a word, just walk away and go watch TV. This way i had my safe space in my cage, but i could hear the TV so i'd know he was there. Depending on how much time he thought i needed - and he would usually be able to tell by how hard he'd pushed me - he'd come back in half an hour to an hour. if i responded coherently to his questions, he'd take me out of the cage and let me sit on the floor with my head in his lap, or curled up next to him on the couch. If all he got in response was a mumble or a groan, he'd leave me in there for a little while longer, until i was ready to come out. This worked really well for us. We both got the time we needed to cool off and come down, and then we both got the closeness we needed to reconnect after such an experience. Thanks for prompting such a pleasant memory. i hope you find what works for you.

loveandlight87 -> RE: When subspace ISN'T a warm, fluffy place... (1/4/2009 9:32:14 PM)
* warm fuzzies

DominaSmartass -> RE: When subspace ISN'T a warm, fluffy place... (1/4/2009 9:34:10 PM)
First of all, thanks for posting. This thread really got to me, as a sadist, who doesn't always want subspace to be a warm and fluffy place, I can relate (from the other side.) And I know it's been said by others cause I read the thread before posting, but I'll reiterate: those times when I knew my submissive was truly suffering were some of the most amazing scenes of my life. Real fear, real pain, raw emotions, all without the comfort of yummy endorphin highs or sweet words, those are what get me off sometimes. It is primal and sometimes I just have to have it. So of course I appreciate the hell out of the submissive who gives himself to me so I can go there/take him there. quote: ORIGINAL: mistoferin So there I stand, the object to absorb the intensity of those urges. My proven methods of processing the pain will not work then so I feel defenseless. I, too, feel like a miserable failure at those times when that panicky anxiety is welling up inside me and those acid tears start to fall. I cannot speak for your Sir, but for me, THIS is fucking hot. This is what I'm in it for. Not for you to feel miserable or like a failure of course, but for the person I'm with to succumb to his anxieties and fears, to really be in a place of terror and pain where it's not at all fun, but to go with me as far as I'll push because he belongs to me and this type of play is one of the strongest reinforcements of that bond of ownership that I can feel. I had experiences like this with my boy, who is no longer with me - and I've never experienced it before him, or since. For both of us, the light, fun, sexy, sensual, playful stuff was fun and hot too, but he never felt more like "mine" and I never felt more like his owner than the times when it was "my night" so to speak. Like I said, I can't speak for your Sir but if he gets anything similar from these experiences as I did from mine, then you are nowhere close to being a failure, no matter how messed up your makeup or hair get.

marie2 -> RE: When subspace ISN'T a warm, fluffy place... (1/4/2009 10:13:03 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: mistoferin There definitely is red hot anger. I think it comes in the moment he says "this is going to be my night". It's not that I don't want him to have his nights...certainly I do. Actually, I want desperately for him to have that kind of satisfaction for himself come from every one of our encounters. But, when he says those words it's kind of like I feel like I am being hung out there alone defenseless against the assault that I know is to come. I know immediately that none of the very familiar pathways I take through the course of a scene are going to be available and I know that the entire thing will test me to find a way to endure. I know that the emotional connection will be severed... erin, I don't have much to contribute to the topic of subspace of any kind. I can relate to some of what you describe, but not to the same extent, so I'm not even going to go there, as I don't feel like I can offer much in that regard. However, I did notice something that stuck out to me, and what I'm about to say may or may not be helpful, but I hope it is. From what you said, it seems as if the words "this is going to be my night" could be triggering you to enter a particular frame of mind..."as soon as he says those words, I know this, I know that", etc. It's almost as if you've made up your mind, when he says that, that it's going to suck for you. I'm not suggesting this is all in your head, or trying to minimize your experience. What I'm saying is that sometimes when we have a negative experience, we anchor that experience to something that was said or seen at that time. Then everytime we hear or see that same trigger, we come to expect the same reactions, the same feelings, the same emotions, and the same experience. The words "I'm sorry, baby but...." immediately implies that he's going to do something that you won't enjoy, he's even using apologetic words before he starts. And when he speaks those words, it seems to bring you right into that state. Maybe he could say something different to you on "his" nights; something that might help you re-associate those sadistic-all-about-him scenes into something that you could view more positively. (Unless part of it is that he wants you in that anxious headspace. I wasn't clear on that)

mistoferin -> RE: When subspace ISN'T a warm, fluffy place... (1/4/2009 10:37:06 PM)
Oh yes Marie, it absolutely is a trigger that immediately sends me into a different headspace. It's such a profoundly different headspace that I would almost liken it to being on the same team and suddenly being told that you have to play against each other. I'm pretty sure that switch in headspace though is exactly what he is going for when he says those words.

marie2 -> RE: When subspace ISN'T a warm, fluffy place... (1/4/2009 10:50:04 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: mistoferin I'm pretty sure that switch in headspace though is exactly what he is going for when he says those words. In that case, you're fucked.

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