RE: britain wants guns back

RE: britain wants guns back (Full Version)

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variation30 -> RE: britain wants guns back (1/23/2009 4:10:33 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Owner59 We* have chosen to require clothes in public. two things. the first, I don't think there should be public property. the second, we have not. ask a nudist. quote: We* have made speed limits and other safety rules.No one accept the gov.of NJ is exempt for those rules. we have not. legislators have. perhaps you were asked about what the speed limits and safety rules should have been...but no one has consulted me. and as I remember, there were quite a few people upset about things like helmet laws...I don't think they were consulted either. quote: We* have chosen a number of rules and laws protecting us from each other and from the government.We* don`t want those laws tossed. again, I don't think you know what the word 'we' means. quote: We* have also chosen to let states regulate guns,cars,business,elections,markets,drugs/booze and goods. no...we have not...I chose to have all these things unregulated (by a government). and let's stop pretending these are done for altruistic means. the regulations of weapons through gun licenses hearkens back to jim crow laws where racists used the monopolistic power government has to strip liberties away from individuals. regulations on businesses and markets and drugs/booze and goods all are stained with rent seeking. this is true from the banning of child labor in textile mills to the banning of liquor to the granting of natural monopolies to the process of incorporating to tariffs etc. quote: There`s no such place as you describe,accept some parts of Afghanistan and Africa but you do not want to go there. * as a civil society there's no place that isn't touched by a government..so there's no place I want to go. I'll just try to live perfectly in an imperfect world.

RCdc -> RE: britain wants guns back (1/23/2009 4:12:19 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: variation30 there's no place that isn't touched by a government..so there's no place I want to go. I'll just try to live perfectly in an imperfect world. You could always try the Congo. (.editoexplaintheironyincasethatwasntunderstood.)[&:] the.dark.

Irishknight -> RE: britain wants guns back (1/23/2009 4:14:23 PM)
Can we choose to vote v30 off the island??

variation30 -> RE: britain wants guns back (1/23/2009 4:14:28 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Darcyandthedark Yes extremely bourgeois. Trade has nothing to do with your statement. You just said it was great for people to own guns if they want them as long as they can afford them. What about those that have the 'right' to have them who cannot afford them? One rule for one and one for another hey? Lovely. the.dark. so if I said to someone who can afford a bugatti 'yes you can have it if you can afford it' and someone who cannot afford a bugatti 'yes you can have it if you can afford it'...I am making two different rules? now I know those who espouse the litanies or marx are not prone to using reason...but perhaps you coudl tell me why these are two differnt laws? how about this. there are two individuals. one is attractive and can convince attractive people to sleep with him. the other is unattractive and cannot convince attractive people to sleep with him. I say to them both, yes, you can sleep with attractive people. am I making two different rules?

variation30 -> RE: britain wants guns back (1/23/2009 4:19:35 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Raechard The way it works is: you saying you are the good guy and calling him the bad guy doesn't give you the legal right to kill him. That's obvious no? I mean if we lived in your world I could kill you for numerous other unrelated reasons and just claim self defence? You can't circumvent the justice system and if you shoot someone in the back it won't look good for you. No law enforcement officer is going to slap you on the back and say good job for that, I hope. You belong to the wild west era, wanna go back there? I'm not saying this has anything to do with being a good guy or being a bad guy. all it has to do with is this: they are on my property, I sense a threat. and let's nto pretend something being legal equates to something being correct or just. and yes, there are a few policemen who are worth something. my mother had a stalker when she lived in birmingham. he lived a few houses down from us. the stalker was trying to break in the door (my father was working at night) and she called the cop who lives downt he street. the cop told her to unload her gun through the door and he and his friends would find a way to drag the body in (making it ok under castle doctrine). so yes there may be some cops who actually care about things like property rights and individual safety who would slap you on the back. but cops like this (cops who are good people) are very rare. whenever someone brings up the wild west it is very revealing. it reveals that they think in a very trite manner. a manner which ignores history and takes hollywood as a fact. you do realize that the wild west is a myth...yeah, there were some bank robberies and maybe a shoot out at a corral...but it wasn't what it was made out to be in spaghetti westerns (sorry to burst your bubble). that having been said, yeah, I'd prefer the 'wild' west.

RCdc -> RE: britain wants guns back (1/23/2009 4:21:08 PM)
Forget the bugatti. Lets talk about guns and machettes and bombs. It is a ridiculous surmise to pitch freedom of arms as you have - to protect property and self - and yet deny that same right to those who cannot afford it. Yes you are making different 'rules' as you so put it. At least have the ability(in the UK we would call it balls) to say, if you want a gun and can afford it cool instead of fluffing it up with the whole 'protecting what is mine' rubbish. I would have had more agreement with you had been straight up. However you are not so much 'guns for those that want them' but more 'guns for those that can afford them so we can shoot the bastards that cannot'. the.dark.

susie -> RE: britain wants guns back (1/23/2009 4:24:18 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: variation30 I'm not saying this has anything to do with being a good guy or being a bad guy. all it has to do with is this: they are on my property, I sense a threat. and let's nto pretend something being legal equates to something being correct or just. and yes, there are a few policemen who are worth something. my mother had a stalker when she lived in birmingham. he lived a few houses down from us. the stalker was trying to break in the door (my father was working at night) and she called the cop who lives downt he street. the cop told her to unload her gun through the door and he and his friends would find a way to drag the body in (making it ok under castle doctrine). so yes there may be some cops who actually care about things like property rights and individual safety who would slap you on the back. but cops like this (cops who are good people) are very rare. whenever someone brings up the wild west it is very revealing. it reveals that they think in a very trite manner. a manner which ignores history and takes hollywood as a fact. you do realize that the wild west is a myth...yeah, there were some bank robberies and maybe a shoot out at a corral...but it wasn't what it was made out to be in spaghetti westerns (sorry to burst your bubble). that having been said, yeah, I'd prefer the 'wild' west. Actually I see that as anything but being a policeman who is worth something. Not only did he break the law but incited your mother to do so as well. Astonishing that you think that is an aceptable way to behave.

Irishknight -> RE: britain wants guns back (1/23/2009 4:24:42 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: variation30 whenever someone brings up the wild west it is very revealing. it reveals that they think in a very trite manner. a manner which ignores history and takes hollywood as a fact. you do realize that the wild west is a myth...yeah, there were some bank robberies and maybe a shoot out at a corral...but it wasn't what it was made out to be in spaghetti westerns (sorry to burst your bubble). Okay. You can stay on the island. At least there would be someone around to talk history instead of Hollyweird.

Marc2b -> RE: britain wants guns back (1/23/2009 4:34:15 PM)
quote: If you got the irony, it shows that you're in the wrong country [8D] . Huh?

Raechard -> RE: britain wants guns back (1/23/2009 4:35:02 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: variation30 I'm not saying this has anything to do with being a good guy or being a bad guy. all it has to do with is this: they are on my property, I sense a threat. Not good enough reason. quote: and let's nto pretend something being legal equates to something being correct or just. I'd hope laws were based on moral values. Some are to do with taxes obviously but required for the functionality of Government. quote: and yes, there are a few policemen who are worth something. my mother had a stalker when she lived in birmingham. he lived a few houses down from us. the stalker was trying to break in the door (my father was working at night) and she called the cop who lives downt he street. the cop told her to unload her gun through the door and he and his friends would find a way to drag the body in (making it ok under castle doctrine). so yes there may be some cops who actually care about things like property rights and individual safety who would slap you on the back. but cops like this (cops who are good people) are very rare. The problem with that idea is the fact Columbo might turn up and ask why the blood stains lead in from the outside and what these scuff marks are? A crime scene isn't so simplistic as: lets measure how many millimetres the body is from the threshold. quote: whenever someone brings up the wild west it is very revealing. it reveals that they think in a very trite manner. a manner which ignores history and takes hollywood as a fact. you do realize that the wild west is a myth...yeah, there were some bank robberies and maybe a shoot out at a corral...but it wasn't what it was made out to be in spaghetti westerns (sorry to burst your bubble). that having been said, yeah, I'd prefer the 'wild' west. I use it as a metaphor, the fact it is or isn't something I describe it as is beside the point, you get the imagery. I could equally say do you want to live in Iraq? Am I supposed to be able to tell the difference between a criminal that doesn't respect the sanctity of human life and a law abiding citizen that doesn't respect the sanctity of life?

Owner59 -> RE: britain wants guns back (1/23/2009 4:36:20 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Irishknight Can we choose to vote v30 off the island?? Irish Knite,.. The tribe has spoken....

kittinSol -> RE: britain wants guns back (1/23/2009 4:37:45 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Marc2b quote: If you got the irony, it shows that you're in the wrong country [8D] . Huh? If you hadn't gotten the irony, it would have meant that you were in the right country.

variation30 -> RE: britain wants guns back (1/23/2009 4:39:47 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Darcyandthedark Forget the bugatti. Lets talk about guns and machettes and bombs. It is a ridiculous surmise to pitch freedom of arms as you have - to protect property and self - and yet deny that same right to those who cannot afford it. Yes you are making different 'rules' as you so put it. At least have the ability(in the UK we would call it balls) to say, if you want a gun and can afford it cool instead of fluffing it up with the whole 'protecting what is mine' rubbish. I would have had more agreement with you had been straight up. However you are not so much 'guns for those that want them' but more 'guns for those that can afford them so we can shoot the bastards that cannot'. the.dark. how am I denying anyone a right? denying a right is prohibiting an individual from excersizing an action. how am I doing that? and I think the bugatti is an excellent theme for this as it's extraordinary price puts this in perspective. I say that any individual should be able to own any property he desires. this goes from heroin to fully automatic weapons to cars that drive over the speed limit. I don't see there being a difference between 'guns for those that want them' and 'guns for those that can afford them'. I am, of course, ignoring your emotional suffix added to the relevent point.

variation30 -> RE: britain wants guns back (1/23/2009 4:43:18 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: susie Actually I see that as anything but being a policeman who is worth something. Not only did he break the law but incited your mother to do so as well. Astonishing that you think that is an aceptable way to behave. I don't work under the assumption that our government is full of enlightened ubermensch and the law reflects their perfection. the law is more than a little flawed, as are the people who protect it. looking at anything from seatbelt laws to laws against homosexual marriage to drug laws to castle doctrine restrictions...this should be obvious. sodomy is illegal in alabama. I would be inciting an individual to break the law if I said 'sure steve, I think adam's a great guy. go sleep with him.' and I think that's more than acceptable.

DomKen -> RE: britain wants guns back (1/23/2009 4:46:19 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: variation30 the first, I don't think there should be public property. No public property? No commons at all? Have you actually thought this through?

variation30 -> RE: britain wants guns back (1/23/2009 4:47:32 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Raechard Not good enough reason. ok. why not? do you disagree with self-defense? that is to say that violence is ok so long as you are defending against someone who aggressed against you. quote: I'd hope laws were based on moral values. Some are to do with taxes obviously but required for the functionality of Government. I'd hope that to. unfortunately hope doesn't equate to reality. quote: The problem with that idea is the fact Columbo might turn up and ask why the blood stains lead in from the outside and what these scuff marks are? A crime scene isn't so simplistic as: lets measure how many millimetres the body is from the threshold. he might. I'm not claiming that birmingham's finest would be fooled by the forensic evidence. I'm saying that they may be decent enough men to turn a blind eye. quote: I use it as a metaphor, the fact it is or isn't something I describe it as is beside the point, you get the imagery. I could equally say do you want to live in Iraq? no. you coudln't say iraq because iraq has a government wheras the wild west was mostly free of such things. quote: am I supposed to be able to tell the difference between a criminal that doesn't respect the sanctity of human life and a law abiding citizen that doesn't respect the sanctity of life? yes, you are. one aggresses against another's body and property whereas another doesn't.

variation30 -> RE: britain wants guns back (1/23/2009 4:48:44 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: DomKen quote: ORIGINAL: variation30 the first, I don't think there should be public property. No public property? No commons at all? Have you actually thoufght this through? yes.

DomKen -> RE: britain wants guns back (1/23/2009 4:50:50 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: variation30 quote: ORIGINAL: DomKen quote: ORIGINAL: variation30 the first, I don't think there should be public property. No public property? No commons at all? Have you actually thoufght this through? yes. Have you found away around death by dehydration? what about starvation?

susie -> RE: britain wants guns back (1/23/2009 4:54:58 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: variation30 quote: ORIGINAL: DomKen quote: ORIGINAL: variation30 the first, I don't think there should be public property. No public property? No commons at all? Have you actually thoufght this through? Interesting idea! So how do you walk from one place to another? Who owns the roads you drive on? Maybe I can put in a bid for the Grand Canyone or I always fancied owning Lake Powell. yes.

susie -> RE: britain wants guns back (1/23/2009 4:59:16 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Darcyandthedark I want to see all these people who want to own guns in the UK posting. Because obviously they must exist... don't they?[&:] the.dark. Well I see we have all been shocked by the stampede of those in the UK wanting to own guns!!! UM NOT

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