Collarspace Discussion Forums


Home  Login  Search 

A completely silly question.....


View related threads: (in this forum | in all forums)

Logged in as: Guest
 
All Forums >> [Casual Banter] >> Off the Grid >> A completely silly question..... Page: [1]
Login
Message << Older Topic   Newer Topic >>
A completely silly question..... - 1/25/2009 6:25:24 AM   
Ph0enixF1re


Posts: 91
Joined: 5/11/2006
Status: offline 		So this comes as an offshoot of the pansexual discussion, which I found quite interesting.  A question that has come up a couple of times in conversation (never had to answer personally) is this:

If you have sex with a hermaphrodite (intersexual), but only use the genetalia of your opposite gender, is it still a homosexual act?  It is only a question in a legal sense I think, because homosexual acts are typicaly defined as sex between the same gender, which a hermaphrodite is, since they have both.

A big part of the answer I suppose is how you define the basis of homosexuality....based on genetics or as a result of choice.  I am not here to argue one side or the other on that question, but it would help the context of your answer if you mention that.  Either way, it is what it is....either there is no choice or it is that persons right to choose...so please don't make assume that it matters to the question one way or the other.
Profile   Post #: 1
RE: A completely silly question..... - 1/25/2009 6:56:06 AM   
feydeplume


Posts: 935
Joined: 12/24/2008
Status: offline 		First guess? It would depend more on the inter-sexed person's birth certificate designation. I read some where, years ago, that most inter-sexed babies were classified male so even if they grow up to express more female body traits (boobs, curves, heck ovary pain with ovulation) they are legally men. 

_____________________________

Wait! Are those my pants?
If it has testicle or tires, it's gonna give you the fidgets.
Pretend I said something witty and laugh.

(in reply to Ph0enixF1re)
Profile   Post #: 2
RE: A completely silly question..... - 1/25/2009 7:10:30 AM   
DesFIP


Posts: 25191
Joined: 11/25/2007
From: Apple County NY
Status: offline 		Not unless the intersexed person self identifies as male.

_____________________________

Slave to laundry

Cynical and proud of it!


(in reply to feydeplume)
Profile   Post #: 3
RE: A completely silly question..... - 1/25/2009 7:17:57 AM   
feydeplume


Posts: 935
Joined: 12/24/2008
Status: offline 		and the person getting it on with them is also male.

I think the tricky part would be to avoid having ANY contact with the physical parts socially identified as "male" or "female" depending on the sex/gender/identity of the person getting squishy the the inter-sexed person.

Edited cause i hit ok before i finished my so-called thought


< Message edited by feydeplume -- 1/25/2009 7:20:13 AM >

_____________________________

Wait! Are those my pants?
If it has testicle or tires, it's gonna give you the fidgets.
Pretend I said something witty and laugh.

(in reply to DesFIP)
Profile   Post #: 4
RE: A completely silly question..... - 1/25/2009 7:41:04 AM   
pompeii


Posts: 934
Joined: 1/4/2007
From: Silicon Valley, San Jose, California
Status: offline 		In the United States, for a criminal act, I would wager the judge or jury would first consider the legal birth certificate designation, then the history of the individual (e.g., dress, manner, what friends call them, etc.), and most importantly, I would think, the legal team would "portray" that person as what each side thinks they are.

If the prosecution thinks one way, they'd gather up evidence where the individual "acted" that one way.

In contrast, the defense would gather up volumes of situations where the individual acted the other way.

In summary, I would think, in the USA, it could perhaps fall upon the preponderance of evidence not of what primary or secondary sexual characteristics were being enjoyed at the time the police say the act occurred but, of the manner in which the person acted in a reasonable time frame prior to the act.

(in reply to feydeplume)
Profile   Post #: 5
RE: A completely silly question..... - 1/25/2009 8:00:07 AM   
feydeplume


Posts: 935
Joined: 12/24/2008
Status: offline 		how about in a non-legal sense but in a social and personal identity sense. I guess i mean if a single sexed person who self defines as hetero or homosexual has sex with an inter-sexed person that self defines in a compatible way,  how does that single sexed person avoid the "other" bits so as to maintain their (the single sexed person) self defined orientation. WHooo that was wordy... lemme try that again.
Say a het guy has sex with an very womanly inter-sexed person, how would the het guy avoid the male bits and would he (referencing another thread about male sexuality) still "get" to call himself hetero? 

_____________________________

Wait! Are those my pants?
If it has testicle or tires, it's gonna give you the fidgets.
Pretend I said something witty and laugh.

(in reply to pompeii)
Profile   Post #: 6
RE: A completely silly question..... - 1/25/2009 8:14:47 AM   
YoursMistress


Posts: 894
Joined: 12/17/2008
Status: offline 		For me, it is very sad that so many consider it important to characterize or define a relationship ( or congress ) between two people as a "this" or a "that".  One could certainly imagine or fantasize homosexual relations during a heterosexual act.  Does that make it homosexual?  The labels we apply, that seem so important to us, ultimately have no real bearing on the feelings experienced by two people.  While we are seemingly hellbent on separating people into categories, there are innumerable categories that we could use just as easily (does having sex with Debbie make me a debbisexual?)  Having been raised as a Catholic, I remember the same frustrations with people thinking " if you are a Catholic, then you must believe so-and-so.  The application of a label is, to me, a shortcut to assumptions about a person when we are unwilling or unable to invest enough time to understand and appreciate the person.  (Sorry if I ranted a little, no offense intended toward the OP)

yours


_____________________________

May your service of love a beautiful thing; want nothing else, fear nothing else and let love be free to become what love truly is. -- Hadewijch of Antwerp

As a rule, I don't like to make general statements.

(in reply to feydeplume)
Profile   Post #: 7
RE: A completely silly question..... - 1/25/2009 10:47:24 AM   
ALAstella


Posts: 253
Joined: 12/3/2008
Status: offline 		How about going by what gender the person identifies themself as, as in a whole, complete person, and not by their individual body parts?

I mean we are still talking about a human being, are we not?

_____________________________

The Resident Artistes (by GT)

New Year's Day 2009.
When you don't understand the reason why, that's love.

http://www.simply-q.org
http://www.q-fringe.org

(in reply to Ph0enixF1re)
Profile   Post #: 8
RE: A completely silly question..... - 1/25/2009 2:25:42 PM   
NYLass


Posts: 409
Joined: 12/30/2008
Status: offline 		Just use the "I thought she had a really big clit" line.

(in reply to ALAstella)
Profile   Post #: 9
RE: A completely silly question..... - 1/25/2009 3:01:43 PM   
stef


Posts: 10215
Joined: 1/26/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Ph0enixF1re

If you have sex with a hermaphrodite (intersexual), but only use the genetalia of your opposite gender, is it still a homosexual act?  It is only a question in a legal sense I think, because homosexual acts are typicaly defined as sex between the same gender, which a hermaphrodite is, since they have both.

While it may be commonly depicted in Japanese comics, true hermaphrodism where the individual has complete functioning sets of both male and female genitalia is not something you're ever likely to encounter in your lifetime.  You would be better off spending your time contemplating who would win if Batman and Aquaman got into a fight, because that's much more likely to happen.

~stef


_____________________________

Welcome to PoliticSpace! If you came here expecting meaningful BDSM discussions, boy are you in the wrong place.

"Hypocrisy has consequences"

(in reply to Ph0enixF1re)
Profile   Post #: 10
RE: A completely silly question..... - 1/25/2009 3:47:38 PM   
popeye1250


Posts: 18104
Joined: 1/27/2006
From: New Hampshire
Status: offline 		Wow, how have I lived for so many years without knowing the answer to this question?

_____________________________

"But Your Honor, this is not a Jury of my Peers, these people are all decent, honest, law-abiding citizens!"

(in reply to Ph0enixF1re)
Profile   Post #: 11
RE: A completely silly question..... - 1/25/2009 4:29:11 PM   
slaveboyforyou


Posts: 3607
Joined: 1/6/2005
From: Arkansas, U.S.A.
Status: offline 		Yep, this is definitely a silly question.  It reminds me of guys who insist they're not gay, because they're exclusively pitchers not catchers. 

(in reply to Ph0enixF1re)
Profile   Post #: 12
RE: A completely silly question..... - 1/25/2009 4:39:59 PM   
Madame4a


Posts: 2045
Joined: 2/4/2008
From: Washington, DC area
Status: offline 		sex... having sex... has nothing to do with orientation... sex is a physical act and can sometimes come down to simply a matter of friction...

_____________________________

You're crazy bitch
But you f*ck so good, I'm on top of it
When I dream, I'm doing you all night
Scratches all down my back to keep me right on

(in reply to Ph0enixF1re)
Profile   Post #: 13
RE: A completely silly question..... - 1/25/2009 6:33:30 PM   
Carnae7


Posts: 72
Joined: 11/29/2008
Status: offline 		Wow!!!  I am rather shocked at the level of ignorance being displayed in this post.  I think the OP and some of the responders seriously need to really learn what an intersexed person is and is not, or else just refrain from posting about this topic. 

quote:

While it may be commonly depicted in Japanese comics, true hermaphrodism where the individual has complete functioning sets of both male and female genitalia is not something you're ever likely to encounter in your lifetime.

As stef said above, I can guarantee there is absolutely NO SUCH THING as a person having BOTH male and female genitalia, functioning or otherwise!  If you see any such thing in porns, or wherever, you can best believe one of the sets of genitalia is false.  Intersexed people have a hard enough time in this society without reading shallow, ignorant comments that perpetuate falsehoods.

quote:

I think the tricky part would be to avoid having ANY contact with the physical parts socially identified as "male" or "female" depending on the sex/gender/identity of the person getting squishy the the inter-sexed person.

And a person absolutely cannot have sex with an intersexed person and 'just avoid having any contact with certain physical parts", as intersexualism is more about which gonads a person has and which secondary sexual traits emerge as the person enters puberty. 

One of the most famous intersexed persons I know of is Jamie Lee Curtis.  She was not raised to specifically be one gender or another.  Thankfully, her parents let her grow up and determine which gender she felt she could most relate to in our very judgemental society and which gender she should display in said society.  While it is fortunate that she had verrry understanding and supportive parents, it is a sad commentary on our society that we want to force people to conform to our narrow ideas, and shove them into boxes or assign labels.  I would have thought that all of us in this lifestyle would be against trying to force others into certain molds, because as a group, we often fail to 'properly' fit into certain categories ourselves.

For those who are honestly interested in learning more about intersexed people, please start with Wikipedia, and then follow through with the references provided.  I think you'll be amazed to learn how very narrow your current understanding is of what constitutes true intersexualism. 

_____________________________


How far is Heaven? Only as far away as my Master.

(in reply to Madame4a)
Profile   Post #: 14
RE: A completely silly question..... - 1/25/2009 6:47:59 PM   
slaveboyforyou


Posts: 3607
Joined: 1/6/2005
From: Arkansas, U.S.A.
Status: offline
quote:

One of the most famous intersexed persons I know of is Jamie Lee Curtis.  She was not raised to specifically be one gender or another.  Thankfully, her parents let her grow up and determine which gender she felt she could most relate to in our very judgemental society and which gender she should display in said society.  While it is fortunate that she had verrry understanding and supportive parents, it is a sad commentary on our society that we want to force people to conform to our narrow ideas, and shove them into boxes or assign labels.  I would have thought that all of us in this lifestyle would be against trying to force others into certain molds, because as a group, we often fail to 'properly' fit into certain categories ourselves.


The story about Jamie Lee Curtis being intersexed is an urban legend.  It has no basis in fact; it's a rumor. 
http://www.snopes.com/movies/actors/jamie.asp

You might not want to use gossip when you lecture others on ethics. 

< Message edited by slaveboyforyou -- 1/25/2009 6:48:24 PM >

(in reply to Carnae7)
Profile   Post #: 15
RE: A completely silly question..... - 1/25/2009 7:43:12 PM   
aravain


Posts: 1211
Joined: 8/26/2008
Status: offline 		Legally it depends on what it says on their birth certificate (M or F) to define if it's homosexual or heterosexual.

I wish there were 'other' and 'none' options, too

(in reply to Ph0enixF1re)
Profile   Post #: 16
RE: A completely silly question..... - 1/25/2009 9:19:50 PM   
Madame4a


Posts: 2045
Joined: 2/4/2008
From: Washington, DC area
Status: offline 		uhmm.. how does that work?  legal gender has nothing to do with orientation... there is no such thing as legal orientation

quote:

ORIGINAL: aravain

Legally it depends on what it says on their birth certificate (M or F) to define if it's homosexual or heterosexual.

I wish there were 'other' and 'none' options, too



_____________________________

You're crazy bitch
But you f*ck so good, I'm on top of it
When I dream, I'm doing you all night
Scratches all down my back to keep me right on

(in reply to aravain)
Profile   Post #: 17
RE: A completely silly question..... - 1/25/2009 11:19:55 PM   
aravain


Posts: 1211
Joined: 8/26/2008
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Ph0enixF1re
It is only a question in a legal sense I think, because homosexual acts are typicaly defined as sex between the same gender, which a hermaphrodite is, since they have both.


That's what I was responding to |^|

In places where homosexuality is still illegal (or where 'sodomy' laws include any sexual contact between two men and are prosecuted), any *actual* sexual contact would be the legal way of deciding it *shrug* In this case, a man who has sex (even if he doesn't touch the IS person's dangly bit) with an IS that has a M on their birth certificate, legally they would be able to be prosecuted if homosexuality, or homosexual acts, were illegal.

I wasn't trying to be contrite ;)

EDIT: Note to self: don't let the ends of words fly too far away at 2:20am


< Message edited by aravain -- 1/25/2009 11:20:46 PM >

(in reply to Madame4a)
Profile   Post #: 18
Page:   [1]
All Forums >> [Casual Banter] >> Off the Grid >> A completely silly question..... Page: [1]
Jump to:





New Messages No New Messages
Hot Topic w/ New Messages Hot Topic w/o New Messages
Locked w/ New Messages Locked w/o New Messages
 Post New Thread
 Reply to Message
 Post New Poll
 Submit Vote
 Delete My Own Post
 Delete My Own Thread
 Rate Posts




Collarchat.com © 2025
Terms of Service Privacy Policy Spam Policy

0.090