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Anger, physical, non-physical, consent, abuse - 2/12/2009 2:26:55 PM

missturbation

Posts: 8290
Joined: 2/12/2006
From: another planet
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The 'anger issues and play' thread has had me thinking. Rather than derail or hijack that thread in any way, i'm starting this one.

It seems that most / all agree that to hit out of anger is abuse. I however am going to disagree!! I've been hit out of anger before now and i'm sure i will be again by people i serve. I've been slapped / punched for answering back, not doing something quick enough, failing a task etc etc etc. I've been caned and single tailed for similar offences too, there and then whilst my Sir / Master has still been angry / annoyed.

Now by the definition of the other thread that is out and out abuse. To me it was a part of the relationship that i happily consented to.

How about non-physical angry reactions? Are they abuse? For example sitting your sub in a corner whilst angry, locking her in a cage whilst angry, sending her away whilst angry, ignoring her whilst angry etc etc. For some non-physical can be just as damaging as the physical.

Again personally i would say that for me this is not abuse either as again it is something i consented to.

For those though who are in the camp of hitting out of anger being abuse, surely they must be in the same camp for non-physical angry reactions?

Is hitting out of anger automatically abuse, consent or not?

Any other thoughts?

_____________________________

What you don't witness with your eyes, don't witness with your mouth. Proverb.

If it fit's in a toaster, i can cook it.

Buying 10 item's or less is not shopping !!

Post #: 1

RE: Anger, physical, non-physical, consent, abuse - 2/12/2009 2:39:34 PM

Antheia

Posts: 66
Joined: 2/11/2009
Status: offline

In the way you explain your feelings it makes sense. For you. In my own opinion lashing out or hitting out in anger means a lack of control in yourself . Whether you are a Dominant, Master, Mistress, Mother, Father, Teacher or what have you.
Myself , though it might hurt me emotionally, I would rather be sent to a corner, or put in a cage if my owner was angry with me rather than feel his anger in his fists.
Are either of these reactions to anger abuse? Yes and no depending on the reasons and the individuals. I know that is as clear as mud right?
I look forward to reading other peoples thoughts. Thanks for asking these questions.
A

(in reply to missturbation)

Post #: 2

RE: Anger, physical, non-physical, consent, abuse - 2/12/2009 2:59:33 PM

CreativeDominant

Posts: 11032
Joined: 3/11/2006
Status: offline

I can't wait to see the replies to this one. ~quiet smile~

It is said by many today that to hit out of anger is abuse. I am not sure you can shake those that believe that from that belief. There are those...like you and like me...who don't believe that a strike made while angry necessarily qualifies as abuse. A lot depends on the situation and the control of the one doing the striking and the type of striking that is taking place.

When my ums were small and ran out into the street in front of a car, I yanked them back and usually swatted their ass at the same time while stating loudly and firmly "DON'T do that!". Was I angry that they had disobeyed me? Yes, along with being scared of how close I had come to losing them. Did that mean that I could not be in control and correct a behavior while emphasizing the lesson in a physical manner? No, it did not. Now, some folks---other parents, some people that work for social agencies, bleeding heart people who've never raised a child but know how to tell you how to do so---see that as abusive. I didn't. And it did not take more than one or two times of that before they got the idea and kept it for a lonnnnnnnnnnnng time. Ask either one of them now if they see what their father did as abuse and they will, I am proud to note, say "No...in fact, it saved my life". But there again, I wasn't a big fan of over-indulging my children...not then and not now. I loved them, wanted them to love me but being their friend and savior from the realities of the world wasn't my primary role...being their father and the one who opened their eyes to the sometimes-harsh ways of the world was.

The idea of control is something that came out on the thread you speak of, misst. I raised it as did several other. We speak of the dominant having control of themselves and how important that is and how that is part of what the submissive yields to and yet, I have to ask: is the only type of control they are yielding to the control of the dominant who only corrects when he isn't angry, who is always on an even keel and someone who when he is...on one of those rare occasions...anything other than calm, peaceful and happy will go away until he is at least calm again? If you don't trust him/her to retain control of themselves---even when they are angry and striking you---then aren't you stating that while your dominant may be great and tis O.K. to trust him not to harm you when he is "CALM" because he is in control then, he is not to be trusted when he is "angry" because angry equates to "out of control"? Out of control anger is enragement...how many of you have seen someone who is enraged? Do they strike you as having the same control as, or being similar in behavior to, someone who've you seen when they are angry but in control of themselves? There IS a difference.

My feeling is that a lot of what is seen as abuse nowadays is not. Spanking a child is one good example. Many therapists/teachers/parents see it as abuse. I cannot say for sure but I would be willing to be that there are just as many who do not. Count me in as belonging to that camp. Colorado and other states allow for spanking of one's child. Are we all in the wrong or is it that some people can look at something realistically and not with an over-indulgent, the child-is-precious-and-must-be-coddled-right-up-until-he-has-to-face-world-and-finds-that-the-world-is-not-always-nice attitude?

I've stated before that I am not a big believer in physical punishment. My views on that have changed over the last couple of years on here but I still believe in rare use of it...in my case, used for a very serious infraction. Given that I would use it at those times only, I don't see my anger as being completely dissipated by the time I would begin the punishment.

Tis fine and dandy for many on here to speak of "all their dominant having to do to correct them is look at them". I've been with three long-term submissives and they were good submissives for the most part. But there wasn't a one of them who didn't sometimes ignore "the look" and keep right on with their offending behavior. But when I would grab their hair or slap their cheek lightly while growling "That IS enough", then they seemed to get it.

< Message edited by CreativeDominant -- 2/12/2009 3:12:53 PM >

(in reply to missturbation)

Post #: 3

RE: Anger, physical, non-physical, consent, abuse - 2/12/2009 3:06:44 PM

YourhandMyAss

Posts: 5516
Joined: 6/25/2006
From: Sacramento
Status: offline

It would be for me, I would never consent to be someone's punching bag, or to be hit or pinched or canned because I made them unhappy. Nor would I agree to be put in the corner or caged for things I felt were petty.

However if the person in question is mentally competent enough to understand what they're agreeing to and the ramifications or consequences, and they agree to it, no it's not abuse, for them, and them alone.

quote:

ORIGINAL: missturbation

The 'anger issues and play' thread has had me thinking. Rather than derail or hijack that thread in any way, i'm starting this one.

It seems that most / all agree that to hit out of anger is abuse. I however am going to disagree!! I've been hit out of anger before now and i'm sure i will be again by people i serve. I've been slapped / punched for answering back, not doing something quick enough, failing a task etc etc etc. I've been caned and single tailed for similar offences too, there and then whilst my Sir / Master has still been angry / annoyed.

Now by the definition of the other thread that is out and out abuse. To me it was a part of the relationship that i happily consented to.

How about non-physical angry reactions? Are they abuse? For example sitting your sub in a corner whilst angry, locking her in a cage whilst angry, sending her away whilst angry, ignoring her whilst angry etc etc. For some non-physical can be just as damaging as the physical.

Again personally i would say that for me this is not abuse either as again it is something i consented to.

For those though who are in the camp of hitting out of anger being abuse, surely they must be in the same camp for non-physical angry reactions?

Is hitting out of anger automatically abuse, consent or not?

Any other thoughts?

(in reply to missturbation)

Post #: 4

RE: Anger, physical, non-physical, consent, abuse - 2/12/2009 3:13:53 PM

feydeplume

Posts: 935
Joined: 12/24/2008
Status: offline

maybe a linguistic twist would help (or derail) this topic. how about *scratches head* hmm, let's see
1)Pissed out something external and just punches whatever is nearest
2) Pissed about something between the two people and hits hard with no verbalization of the offense
3)Miffed about something and using physical power to express that feeling with verbalization of the offense
4)Frustrated with repeated offenses, verbalization and physical reminder.

are there more options here than can be quantified and given a name/word so that we CAN discuss this.

_____________________________

Wait! Are those my pants?
If it has testicle or tires, it's gonna give you the fidgets.
Pretend I said something witty and laugh.

(in reply to CreativeDominant)

Post #: 5

RE: Anger, physical, non-physical, consent, abuse - 2/12/2009 3:17:01 PM

CreativeDominant

Posts: 11032
Joined: 3/11/2006
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: YourhandMyAss

It would be for me, I would never consent to be someone's punching bag, or to be hit or pinched or canned because I made them unhappy. Nor would I agree to be put in the corner or caged for things I felt were petty.

I don't recall misst or myself stating anything about using anger as an excuse to turn your submissive into a punching bag?
As for you agreeing to be put in the corner or caged for things you felt were petty...stop and think about that for a second, YHMA: if you are deciding that something you have done is petty rather than your dominant deciding something you've done is petty...who is running the dynamic in at least that instant?

quote:

However if the person in question is mentally competent enough to understand what they're agreeing to and the ramifications or consequences, and they agree to it, no it's not abuse, for them, and them alone.
quote:

ORIGINAL: missturbation

The 'anger issues and play' thread has had me thinking. Rather than derail or hijack that thread in any way, i'm starting this one.

It seems that most / all agree that to hit out of anger is abuse. I however am going to disagree!! I've been hit out of anger before now and i'm sure i will be again by people i serve. I've been slapped / punched for answering back, not doing something quick enough, failing a task etc etc etc. I've been caned and single tailed for similar offences too, there and then whilst my Sir / Master has still been angry / annoyed.

Now by the definition of the other thread that is out and out abuse. To me it was a part of the relationship that i happily consented to.

How about non-physical angry reactions? Are they abuse? For example sitting your sub in a corner whilst angry, locking her in a cage whilst angry, sending her away whilst angry, ignoring her whilst angry etc etc. For some non-physical can be just as damaging as the physical.

Again personally i would say that for me this is not abuse either as again it is something i consented to.

For those though who are in the camp of hitting out of anger being abuse, surely they must be in the same camp for non-physical angry reactions?

Is hitting out of anger automatically abuse, consent or not?

Any other thoughts?

< Message edited by CreativeDominant -- 2/12/2009 3:18:46 PM >

(in reply to YourhandMyAss)

Post #: 6

RE: Anger, physical, non-physical, consent, abuse - 2/12/2009 3:29:20 PM

SimplyMichael

Posts: 7229
Joined: 1/7/2007
Status: offline

It isn't the act or the emotion behind but the ultimate motive. Are you trying to control someone by the use of fear.

(in reply to CreativeDominant)

Post #: 7

RE: Anger, physical, non-physical, consent, abuse - 2/12/2009 3:40:19 PM

CreativeDominant

Posts: 11032
Joined: 3/11/2006
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: SimplyMichael

It isn't the act or the emotion behind but the ultimate motive. Are you trying to control someone by the use of fear.

Exactly. If your motive is to control through fear only of your greater strength, then in my world, I would class it as abuse. However, fear is not a bad motive...when I struck my ums in the manner noted above, my MAIN motive was to correct their behavior but I wanted them to feel fear...fear of what could happen if they failed to listen to "Daddy" whether it be my bringing my hand down again the next time they did not or fear of being run over and all that THAT could do to them.

(in reply to SimplyMichael)

Post #: 8

RE: Anger, physical, non-physical, consent, abuse - 2/12/2009 3:43:18 PM

YourhandMyAss

Posts: 5516
Joined: 6/25/2006
From: Sacramento
Status: offline

Cd, Hitting me because he's angry, to me would be using me as a punching bag. I didn't say she said anything about punching bags, I did though, and it's my opinion he'd be treating me like a punching bag using me to express his anger on, by hitting.

And I can't speak for any one else's relationship, but in mine I am allowed to voice opinions, If I felt he was being petty I'd be free to say so. An we can discuss it. All though if he's angry we may be discussing it later, and if he agrees he was being petty after a discussion he'd apologize and we'd go on going on as always.

Of course some may thing that means I am in controll and not him, and perhaps they're right, but I never went for the route of do it because I said so, I was always more we're equals I have a say too.

quote:

ORIGINAL: CreativeDominant

quote:

ORIGINAL: YourhandMyAss

It would be for me, I would never consent to be someone's punching bag, or to be hit or pinched or canned because I made them unhappy. Nor would I agree to be put in the corner or caged for things I felt were petty.
I don't recall misst or myself stating anything about using anger as an excuse to turn your submissive into a punching bag?
As for you agreeing to be put in the corner or caged for things you felt were petty...stop and think about that for a second, YHMA: if you are deciding that something you have done is petty rather than your dominant deciding something you've done is petty...who is running the dynamic in at least that instant?

quote:

However if the person in question is mentally competent enough to understand what they're agreeing to and the ramifications or consequences, and they agree to it, no it's not abuse, for them, and them alone.
quote:

ORIGINAL: missturbation

The 'anger issues and play' thread has had me thinking. Rather than derail or hijack that thread in any way, i'm starting this one.

It seems that most / all agree that to hit out of anger is abuse. I however am going to disagree!! I've been hit out of anger before now and i'm sure i will be again by people i serve. I've been slapped / punched for answering back, not doing something quick enough, failing a task etc etc etc. I've been caned and single tailed for similar offences too, there and then whilst my Sir / Master has still been angry / annoyed.

Now by the definition of the other thread that is out and out abuse. To me it was a part of the relationship that i happily consented to.

How about non-physical angry reactions? Are they abuse? For example sitting your sub in a corner whilst angry, locking her in a cage whilst angry, sending her away whilst angry, ignoring her whilst angry etc etc. For some non-physical can be just as damaging as the physical.

Again personally i would say that for me this is not abuse either as again it is something i consented to.

For those though who are in the camp of hitting out of anger being abuse, surely they must be in the same camp for non-physical angry reactions?

Is hitting out of anger automatically abuse, consent or not?

Any other thoughts?

< Message edited by YourhandMyAss -- 2/12/2009 4:16:05 PM >

(in reply to CreativeDominant)

Post #: 9

RE: Anger, physical, non-physical, consent, abuse - 2/12/2009 3:43:19 PM

catize

Posts: 3020
Joined: 3/7/2006
Status: offline

quote:

It is said by many today that to hit out of anger is abuse. I am not sure you can shake those that believe that from that belief. There are those...like you and like me...who don't believe that a strike made while angry necessarily qualifies as abuse. A lot depends on the situation and the control of the one doing the striking and the type of striking that is taking place.

I think, in general, anger is an emotion that gets a very bad rap because it does bring to mind violent acts. It is the violence that we fear, and get it mixed up with all aspects of anger.
I have felt angry many times in my life, but only a very few times did I feel my anger was out of control. Even then, I had enough control that I didn’t harm or do damage to anyone or anybody.
My example would be when driving I often get quite pissed at other driver’s stupidity. I am very angry that they endangered me or my passengers, but I don’t lose control of myself.
It is possible to feel anger yet manage yourself quite well. I just don’t want to be hit if they can’t manage to keep it within the confines of safety!

_____________________________

"Power is real. But it's a lot less real if it's not perceived as power."
Robert Parker, Stranger in Paradise

(in reply to CreativeDominant)

Post #: 10

RE: Anger, physical, non-physical, consent, abuse - 2/12/2009 3:46:05 PM

silkncarol

Posts: 318
Status: offline

I agree with You here on this CD Sir.... i can trust my Dominant when his mood is even keeled and when he's angry....and even occasionally if he's enraged.....but like you said, the control he exhibits while expressing those emotions is a key factor to me. I don't want to be used as his "escape" valve and punching bag while he's angry...i don't want to be controled through fear and intimidation....walking on eggshells while waiting for a blow to land over some imagined or real misbehavior i or someone else may have done to set him off.......

I'm all for the grabbing hair, slapping my cheek lightly, growling in my ear kinda discipline.....
It would definitely get my attention and i'd be such a good girl..<wicked grin>

quote:

ORIGINAL: CreativeDominant
The idea of control is something that came out on the thread you speak of, misst. I raised it as did several other. We speak of the dominant having control of themselves and how important that is and how that is part of what the submissive yields to and yet, I have to ask: is the only type of control they are yielding to the control of the dominant who only corrects when he isn't angry, who is always on an even keel and someone who when he is...on one of those rare occasions...anything other than calm, peaceful and happy will go away until he is at least calm again? If you don't trust him/her to retain control of themselves---even when they are angry and striking you---then aren't you stating that while your dominant may be great and tis O.K. to trust him not to harm you when he is "CALM" because he is in control then, he is not to be trusted when he is "angry" because angry equates to "out of control"? Out of control anger is enragement...how many of you have seen someone who is enraged? Do they strike you as having the same control as, or being similar in behavior to, someone who've you seen when they are angry but in control of themselves? There IS a difference.

_____________________________

We attract hearts by the qualities we display. We retain them by the qualities we possess.

Shoes can change your life................. Cinderella

(in reply to CreativeDominant)

Post #: 11

RE: Anger, physical, non-physical, consent, abuse - 2/12/2009 3:46:13 PM

agirl

Posts: 4530
Joined: 6/14/2004
Status: offline

It depends what spin you put on it. I get whacke when I've pissed him off. If I've annoyed him he'll give me a right old beating as soon as he's out of earshot of anyone else. Abuse?..... somehow I do not think so.

Sometimes I think * I'd beat me too, if I was him*...lol

agirl

(in reply to missturbation)

Post #: 12

RE: Anger, physical, non-physical, consent, abuse - 2/12/2009 3:46:28 PM

missturbation

Posts: 8290
Joined: 2/12/2006
From: another planet
Status: offline

quote:

In the way you explain your feelings it makes sense. For you. In my own opinion lashing out or hitting out in anger means a lack of control in yourself . Whether you are a Dominant, Master, Mistress, Mother, Father, Teacher or what have you.

I would hedge my bets though that most submissives have been slapped for a misdeameanour and that some of those slaps were out of anger. I have hit my um in anger in the past, I lost control at the time too i will openly admit it. Is that necessarily abuse?

quote:

It would be for me, I would never consent to be someone's punching bag, or to be hit or pinched or canned because I made them unhappy. Nor would I agree to be put in the corner or caged for things I felt were petty.

In my opinion consent or non-consent makes all the difference. I have consented to being someones punchbag when they are angry. As long as its agreed i don't see the problem.

quote:

However if the person in question is mentally competent enough to understand what they're agreeing to and the ramifications or consequences, and they agree to it, no it's not abuse, for them, and them alone.

Agreed.

quote:

maybe a linguistic twist would help (or derail) this topic. how about *scratches head* hmm, let's see
1)Pissed out something external and just punches whatever is nearest
2) Pissed about something between the two people and hits hard with no verbalization of the offense
3)Miffed about something and using physical power to express that feeling with verbalization of the offense
4)Frustrated with repeated offenses, verbalization and physical reminder.

are there more options here than can be quantified and given a name/word so that we CAN discuss this.

Sorry you've lost me.

quote:

It isn't the act or the emotion behind but the ultimate motive. Are you trying to control someone by the use of fear.

Fear is not necessarily an unhealthy emotion.

_____________________________

What you don't witness with your eyes, don't witness with your mouth. Proverb.

If it fit's in a toaster, i can cook it.

Buying 10 item's or less is not shopping !!

(in reply to Antheia)

Post #: 13

RE: Anger, physical, non-physical, consent, abuse - 2/12/2009 3:50:16 PM

missturbation

Posts: 8290
Joined: 2/12/2006
From: another planet
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: agirl

It depends what spin you put on it. I get whacke when I've pissed him off. If I've annoyed him he'll give me a right old beating as soon as he's out of earshot of anyone else. Abuse?..... somehow I do not think so.

Sometimes I think * I'd beat me too, if I was him*...lol

agirl

Lol

_____________________________

What you don't witness with your eyes, don't witness with your mouth. Proverb.

If it fit's in a toaster, i can cook it.

Buying 10 item's or less is not shopping !!

(in reply to agirl)

Post #: 14

RE: Anger, physical, non-physical, consent, abuse - 2/12/2009 3:56:38 PM

YourhandMyAss

Posts: 5516
Joined: 6/25/2006
From: Sacramento
Status: offline

agirl, there are times I feel the same way sometimes lol.

quote:

ORIGINAL: agirl

Sometimes I think * I'd beat me too, if I was him*...lol

agirl

(in reply to agirl)

Post #: 15

RE: Anger, physical, non-physical, consent, abuse - 2/12/2009 3:59:22 PM

YourhandMyAss

Posts: 5516
Joined: 6/25/2006
From: Sacramento
Status: offline

Yup. Exactly. As I said if you consent to it, then no problem there at all.
My dad always said when refering to the dogs, a little fear when you're a small dog is a healthy thing.

And basically he means that when you fear the out come of something, say eating your master's shoes, then you won't eat the shoes because you know you'll find the out come unpleasant lol.

quote:

ORIGINAL: missturbation

In my opinion consent or non-consent makes all the difference. I have consented to being someones punchbag when they are angry. As long as its agreed i don't see the problem.

quote:

It isn't the act or the emotion behind but the ultimate motive. Are you trying to control someone by the use of fear.

Fear is not necessarily an unhealthy emotion.

(in reply to missturbation)

Post #: 16

RE: Anger, physical, non-physical, consent, abuse - 2/12/2009 4:09:36 PM

QuixoticErrant

Posts: 260
Joined: 2/1/2009
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: missturbation

The 'anger issues and play' thread has had me thinking. Rather than derail or hijack that thread in any way, i'm starting this one.

It seems that most / all agree that to hit out of anger is abuse. I however am going to disagree!! I've been hit out of anger before now and i'm sure i will be again by people i serve. I've been slapped / punched for answering back, not doing something quick enough, failing a task etc etc etc. I've been caned and single tailed for similar offences too, there and then whilst my Sir / Master has still been angry / annoyed.

Now by the definition of the other thread that is out and out abuse. To me it was a part of the relationship that i happily consented to.

How about non-physical angry reactions? Are they abuse? For example sitting your sub in a corner whilst angry, locking her in a cage whilst angry, sending her away whilst angry, ignoring her whilst angry etc etc. For some non-physical can be just as damaging as the physical.

Again personally i would say that for me this is not abuse either as again it is something i consented to.

For those though who are in the camp of hitting out of anger being abuse, surely they must be in the same camp for non-physical angry reactions?

Is hitting out of anger automatically abuse, consent or not?

Any other thoughts?

Please let me repost and elaborate on a post I made in the other thread.

Never, NEVER play when you are angry. The first rule of being a Dom is mastering yourself. If you are having a bad day, congratulations, you are an adult. Do not have a childish tantrum and break your toys. More importantly, your submissive is a person, have the dignity to not see them as a toy. If you don't have the self respect, self control and inner strength to get this, you have no business being on the top side. The reason you have no business is that you do not respect yourself or others enough to take full responsibility for yourself and your actions. Your sub is not your punching bag to blow off steam. It is one thing to discipline in the tight confines of play in a way that heightens tension by seeming displeased. It is another to actually be angry and feel the lashes are a release of that anger. No, the release should be of something else that you both crave.

The second rule is that she or he is trusting you to use the control properly. They may belong to you, but you have an obligation to not forget that they are people who care about you. If you just use her as a punching bag, you remove the "her" from the equation.

Anger is a form of loosing control. Further, given that we play intensely as it is, if you are out of control the risk of going too far is deeply magnified. You will be even more upset in prison. Seriously, do you really trust yourself that much - and BTW if you would strike in anger, why should you trust yourself?

THE MOST DANGEROUS THING FOR A SUBMISSIVE IS A NARCISSISTIC DOM/ME.

(in reply to missturbation)

Post #: 17

RE: Anger, physical, non-physical, consent, abuse - 2/12/2009 4:18:29 PM

LovingMistress45

Posts: 271
Joined: 2/7/2009
Status: offline

I think what matters is what both people in the relationship have agreed are acceptable limits. I maintain if a sub fears his/her dominant then it is a bad relationship and most likely abusive or on the way there. However, if physical punishment is part of the relationship dynamic I don't think that means it is abuse.

I remember one time years back when I was with a submissive and he did something I did not like and I slapped his face. He quickly appologized and stated he loved me to which I replied I love you too. Now there were some that were aghast that I had slapped him and later I heard that some questioned my statement that I loved him. What they did not know was on another occassion when he had disappointed me in a public situation I had withdrawn my attention and later when we discussed what had happened as he was very upset from my reaction, he said he would rather have me slap him. This was something that worked for us. I had never been and still am not big on punishing when others are around. However, in that relationship at that time it worked for us, though it didn't happen often, but sometimes he would just get too carried away. On the other hand that probably has to do with the fact that I have always had an attraction to somewhat bratty subs and sometimes they just miss those subtle hints.

The short answer after my rambling is no I don't think it abuse, I think it is between those in the relationship to define what works for them.

(in reply to missturbation)

Post #: 18

RE: Anger, physical, non-physical, consent, abuse - 2/12/2009 4:21:40 PM

Andalusite

Posts: 2492
Joined: 1/25/2009
Status: offline

As long as it is consensual and doesn't result in serious injury, I don't think it's abusive. I think people are *more likely* to become abusive if they are angry at the person they are hitting at the time, but not necessarily that they will lose control.

I'm not interested in a punishment dynamic, and I get upset when my partner is angry at *me*, but if he's just irritated, annoyed, upset, or even a little angry from having a bad day at work/etc., I see nothing wrong with him finding surcease in playing with me. I'd probably start out with massage/etc., which would put him in a better mood to start with, but it would depend on what he wanted at the time. I wouldn't consider it any more abusive or dangerous (assuming it was someone I trusted not to become enraged) than to do the equivalent play with a male submissive after he came home from a bad day. I'm pretty sure by the time we were done, either way, he'd be feeling a LOT better!

Yes, I have done such in the past, when you're with someone for 5 years, or 3 years, people have bad days sometimes. I'd rather he feel free to express it with me, to be a bit vulnerable with me, than to suppress/hide it.

I sometimes deliberately get mildly angry during martial arts practice. The adrenaline kick gives me a little more "oomph" and makes it easier to accomplish the throws/pins/etc. on someone who is twice my size. I'm not mad at him, not out of control, not disrespectful or violent. I just tap into that emotion in a way that I find useful. I haven't done so in a scene yet, that I can think of off the top of my head, but I don't think it's unethical to do so.

Oh, and fear in play can be yummmmmmy hot in the right circumstances, with the right person.

< Message edited by Andalusite -- 2/12/2009 4:30:57 PM >

(in reply to missturbation)

Post #: 19

RE: Anger, physical, non-physical, consent, abuse - 2/12/2009 4:48:58 PM

dreamerdreaming

Posts: 2839
Status: offline

Never, NEVER play when you are angry. The first rule of being a Dom is mastering yourself.
The second rule is that she or he is trusting you to use the control properly.

[/quote]

I call bullshit, newbie. Welcome to CM, where there is no "one true way".

The above are your rules. Not mine. YKINMK. You can make all the rules you want, for your dynamic. Not for everyone else's.

I'll bet posts like yours are exactly why missturbation started her own thread.

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(in reply to QuixoticErrant)

Post #: 20

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