quote:

ORIGINAL: LaTigresse

I just thought of something that may help you to understand and feel better about this situation.

Get to know some of the dominants around here and what makes them who they are. Realize that some of us are quite nice, most of the time. Even the most sadistic of us. Take time to learn how different each of us are in our approach to the beating and whipping. How we look at our responsibilities, accountabilities for our actions. Take the time to learn about the human beings behind the monster label.

Then, begin to read the threads and pay close attention to the words of the submissives, slaves, and masochists. How the whippings and beatings are processed by them, what it means to them.

You will realize that each of us, on both ends of the whip, have very very different mindsets of the how's, why's and what's. What your friend gets from her time with this guy may be very very different than another person that enjoys basically, the same things. Once you can wrap your mind about the whole thing a big better, take the time to talk to your friend about how she processes what she does. The answers might be very enlightening.

The information to be found, amidst all the chatter, on these forums can be priceless. I didn't find it in time to have it make a difference in a relationship, I hope a different outcome for you.

Edited to add after reading the post just before this one...............

Ego is an ugly thing sometimes. Just remember, we cannot be everything to everyone, no more than they can be for us. Each person in our life brings something different to share with us. We all have different friends, one that we may enjoy watching movies with, another we may spend our time doing a shared sport with, yet another we may savour intensely personal chats with. Not every friend can enjoy doing or being, everything to us.

This friend of yours, she has another person that she shares something with she cannot share with you. It doesn't make you any less important to her, or her to you.

quote:

ORIGINAL: lovingpet

I have to wonder two things.  What is it that makes you think she needs saving from herself?  Is she mentally ill in some way and you believe this man is exploiting her?  If she is of sound mind, then understand those soft emotions and that "polypeptide poisoning" are things that she is choosing.  In general, when a person enters subspace (call it what you will), it is a time when the responsibility of the dominant is magnified even more.  He has to decide when enough is enough.  Often, just the fact she has gone there means a dominant will bring it to a close and begin the process of helping her come back up safely and reassuring her she is cared for.  She has to trust this man before she can ever enter a scene with him because there can come a time where her judgement is impair or she is otherwise unable to advocate for herself.  Do you trust her to have selected her partner with care? 

The second point revolves around this ego thing.  You state that you want those parts of her she can only seem to give over to her dominant.  You wonder if it is a flaw of character that she cannot give those parts to you.  No.  She is respecting who you are.  You do know there are a lot of needs and parts of her that are nourished by others that you can NEVER give her, too right?  You could not help her with her needs that she fulfills with women.  You are not her spouse, and that bestows some special honors all its own.  You are fixated on this one dynamic.  It makes me think that there is something drawing you to this.  You can proclaim your disgust all you want, but the relationship they have speaks to you somehow.  You want your cake and eat it too.  You want to have such a relationship, but you still want to hold to your morality that tells you this has to be so wrong.  I actually do believe in morals and integrity, but I have had to learn the difference between righteous indignation and self-righteousness.

I go with others who have said to stick around and get to know people and really dig in deeper.  If you want to understand her and the relationship she has with this man, then a few websites and a couple of books is not going to be enough.  Cultivate relationships with both submissives and dominants.  Look for people who are both serious about this and seem still quite human.  I, too, offer an open inbox should you choose to use it.  I was hard on you earlier and I apologize.  This strikes a nerve with me as such attitudes are way to close to home for me right now.  Seek to understand her.  Do not judge or condemn her.

lovingpet

quote:

ORIGINAL: lovingpet

I think OP is having a moment!  [:)]

Okay, yes it is a very basic biological function this subspace thing.  Yes anyone could potentially make anyone else go there consentual, but would it be wise to willing allow it with some random stranger?  And that bag of leather tricks and that enjoyment of her little whimpers is what makes it fun to go there.  It is risk. 

I have more or less said from post one that you are attempting to control her in your own way.  Now see where this all leads you.  I think you have a long wonderful, albeit frightening journey ahead of you!

And LaT.... what is so funny about tap tap tap???  I've been here over a year and I don't have a clue!  LOL

lovingpet 

quote:

ORIGINAL: celess

cosand, i think the real issue and it may have already been said is that you do not have that control of the part of her that is drawn to a Dominant man. you make it clear it is something that you can do but not because ur into the lifestyle but more of getting what you want, manipulating the situation, and so forth. the problem is that you cannot hold on to her as you can with ur own wife.  ur wife is a part of you but this woman is a deep emotional and physical connection that is free to do anything she wishes. i am also not really sure if this is about D/s or BDSM. But could this simply be a male issue that she is running into the arms of another man that completes her? something for some reason she isn't getting from you? her desire to submit to a man and make herself vulnerable would be utterly disgusting because ur relationship with her is on a different level. could it be that you wish that she looks at you and simply feels you are enough. well the reality is, you are not. she desires something much more deeper and as you have said you have to decide if this is something you can deal with. u r not married to her thus there are no real boundaries there. however she does find security and boundaries with a dominant partner. whether you like the idea of BDSM or not is therefore no the issue. it is a matter of whether you are willing to continue a relationship with someone who sees something different in her relationship with you compared to the relationship with her dominant? remember ur opinion about what she does and who she does it with is not truly yours to decide...the only decision u need to make is do you accept her and can u still continue with this kind of relationship knowing she has a dominant partner?

best of luck

quote:

ORIGINAL: lovingpet

Ever considered meeting the man?  If it is that much of an issue, then it may go a long way.

I will be blunt.  He DOES meet "simplistic need to subjugate a woman to gain sexual arousal".  She also DOES surrender her will to this man.  That is one of the major premises of their relationship.  There is a such thing as a D/s thing being totally about the control and sex and nothing more.  This is usually agreed upon.  Could this man not be proper in how he takes responsibility?  Sure.  It is possible.  If this woman is as together as you claim her to be, however, she would not having dealings with someone less than honorable.  And lets say this again for clarification.  She WANTS to be used.  She WANTS to be degraded.  At least, she wants these things to the limits she specifies within a given relationship.

Let me really put things on its head.  How would you feel if SHE were the dominant party?  How would that affect your thinking?  Just curious.

lovingpet

quote:

ORIGINAL: lovingpet

That is where personally getting to know some real life dominants..good ones... is important.  I have yet to take up the whip as a dominant despite my desire to do so.  Why?  It is because I am that concerned with harming the submissive.  It is a major block for me.  I have talked to men who have the same issue.  They also tend to be afraid that, despite their good intentions, that they are somehow evil for doing this and liking it.  That particular issue transcends gender and role boundaries in all honesty, as do most of the hang ups that are felt as one transitions into all this. 

I just have to restate that these men (provided it is a good, stable partner) are not prone to violence or are violent.  Violence implies a lack of self control.  A good dominant is constantly keeping him/herself in check and monitoring his/her partner.  Some of the sweetest, quietest, gentlest souls I know weild a flogger as part of their sexual enjoyment.  I am still fairly new, so my acquaintences are not biased to be more D/s folks.  My dominants are exceptional kind, sweet people and extremely protective of me.

I will remind you how destructive double standards are.  I will also let you in on a little secret, there are lots of consentual double standards in D/s (defined by the couple of course) in a lot of cases.  Just a thought as you kind of begin again to skirt your own possible proclivities.

lovingpet