RE: # # Obama releases secret Bush anti-terror memos

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MasterShake69 -> RE: # # Obama releases secret Bush anti-terror memos (3/3/2009 1:01:51 AM)
so who is more like Lincoln..bush or Obama?? ;) Obama likes to be measured up to Lincoln....lol quote: ORIGINAL: rulemylife quote: ORIGINAL: FirmhandKY Yeah. Lincoln was a real bastard. He actually did it (Pretty much destroy the Union, from what I understand.), while Bush et al only discussed it. Firm What Lincoln did was wrong as well, and Bush didn't just discuss it but did the same, depending on your interpretation of the law.

MasterShake69 -> RE: # # Obama releases secret Bush anti-terror memos (3/3/2009 1:14:02 AM)
never found johns work to be scary ;) http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0000247/ quote: ORIGINAL: rexrgisformidoni John Yoo is a very scary individual. I met him at a lecture and he is almost glacial in demeanor.

MasterShake69 -> RE: # # Obama releases secret Bush anti-terror memos (3/3/2009 1:17:02 AM)
once you start with war crimes...you might find Bill Clinton and Obama falling under it too. just doa websearch for "bill clinton war crimes" AFter 8 + years not that many sites till up but there are still a few. quote: ORIGINAL: VanessaChaland No real surprises right? Any sane person knew he was the most unpatriotic lunatic sadistic asshole the US has ever seen. Maybe we will eventually make inroads into the entire Bush Cabal being charged with war crimes.

Asherdelampyr -> RE: # # Obama releases secret Bush anti-terror memos (3/3/2009 1:20:33 AM)
Bill Clinton I can see, I mean I know that he did some things that made his actual impeachment trial seem a sad joke, but Obama hasnt been in office long enough to seriously fuck up yet. One other thing, at least when Clinton left the unemployment rate wasnt nearly as bad as it is now... Maybe im a selfish prick but I dont care what our leaders do to other countries nearly as much as I care what they do to the one they are supposed to be leading.

kittinSol -> RE: Obama releases secret Bush anti-terror memos (3/3/2009 6:03:13 AM)
Spring cleaning.

kdsub -> RE: # # Obama releases secret Bush anti-terror memos (3/3/2009 6:45:31 AM)
Wasn't Lincoln a Republican?... That aside I think there is a difference between an army 10 miles from the Capitol and a terrorist attack when it comes to civil liberties ...don't you? Butch

corysub -> RE: # # Obama releases secret Bush anti-terror memos (3/3/2009 7:20:00 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: kdsub Wasn't Lincoln a Republican?... That aside I think there is a difference between an army 10 miles from the Capitol and a terrorist attack when it comes to civil liberties ...don't you? Butch There sure is a difference when your company is located in the South Tower of the World Trade Center and there was a mass killing of 3,000 innocent peoplea little over seven years ago and not 140 years ago.! It sure makes a difference when another plane hits the pentagon and another heading for the capital possibly was taken down by hero's over Pennsyvania. There were 266 people on the four planes: American Airlines Flight 11 (crashed into the WTC): 92 (including five terrorists) United Airlines Flight 175 (crashed into the WTC): 65 (including five terrorists) American Airlines Flight 77 (crashed into the Pentagon): 64 (including five terrorists) United Flight 93 (downed in Shanksville, PA): 45 (including four terrorists) There were 2,595 people in the World Trade Center and near it, including: 343 NYFD firefighters and paramedics 23 NYPD police officers 37 Port Authority police officers 1,402 people in Tower 1 614 people in Tower 2 658 people at one company, Cantor Fitzgerald There were 125 civilians and military personnel at the Pentagon. 1,609 people lost a spouse or partner on 9/11. More than 3,051 children lost parents. And assholes in this country are concerned with the civil rights of "terrorists" well fuck them ..! Only three were waterboarded .... It should have been hundreds...and than they should have been shot or burned alive, crushed, or thrown off a tall building like those poor people that day. WE are at war with people who want to destroy us..and we have a President who is blind to the risk, releases CIA documents to a civil law suit, (and what do you think that message is to people at the CIA working to prevent more attacks on US)...and millions of drones who would trade the life of one terrorist for that of George Bush being held in prison for life! The country deserves every bit of pain we are going through. We don't appreciate the wonder of our country.

kdsub -> RE: # # Obama releases secret Bush anti-terror memos (3/3/2009 7:30:39 AM)
Corysub would you like me to list all the military and civilian casualties of the Civil War... there was a difference..one demanded survival actions while the other didn't.. that is my point. Butch

slaveboyforyou -> RE: # # Obama releases secret Bush anti-terror memos (3/3/2009 7:42:19 AM)
Kdsub, Lincoln didn't suspend Habeus Corpus because of the Confederacy. He suspended it because of Union sympathizers, otherwise known as "Copperheads." Union generals wanted to hang them without the fuss of jury trials. In the same vein, the Bush administration was worried about people inside the U.S. working with these fanatical pricks. I wonder why they might worry about that....hmmm. John Walker Lindh, Adam Gadhan (the little punk turned bearded Islamist that makes videos for these assholes.). You know people like that, or terrorist cells operating in the U.S.

Termyn8or -> RE: # # Obama releases secret Bush anti-terror memos (3/3/2009 8:12:52 AM)
fr The President does have the power to override the Constitution due to Admiralty Maritime Jurisdiction, which has been in place all of our lives. That is unless you are seventy six years of age or older. T

kdsub -> RE: # # Obama releases secret Bush anti-terror memos (3/3/2009 8:26:19 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: slaveboyforyou Kdsub, Lincoln didn't suspend Habeus Corpus because of the Confederacy. He suspended it because of Union sympathizers, otherwise known as "Copperheads." Union generals wanted to hang them without the fuss of jury trials. In the same vein, the Bush administration was worried about people inside the U.S. working with these fanatical pricks. I wonder why they might worry about that....hmmm. John Walker Lindh, Adam Gadhan (the little punk turned bearded Islamist that makes videos for these assholes.). You know people like that, or terrorist cells operating in the U.S. Sure he did... without the Confederacy there would not be Copperheads. Bush should have been worried...so was I... but there was no need to go to the extremes he did... There was no terrorist army outside Washington. That is my only point… there was a need in Lincoln’s time… it was for survival… There was not that need after 911. He handled it badly… I’m sure he thought he was doing what was necessary…but as with a lot in his tenure…he was wrong. Butch

Coldwarrior57 -> RE: # # Obama releases secret Bush anti-terror memos (3/3/2009 8:28:53 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: FirmhandKY quote: ORIGINAL: rulemylife quote: ORIGINAL: rexrgisformidoni John Yoo is a very scary individual. I met him at a lecture and he is almost glacial in demeanor. I think they all were pretty scary in trying to put forth the idea that the President can override the Constitution. Yeah. Lincoln was a real bastard. He actually did it (Pretty much destroy the Union, from what I understand.), while Bush et al only discussed it. Firm No facts there please you know the rule , Just innuendo and scurrilous lies.

Coldwarrior57 -> RE: # # Obama releases secret Bush anti-terror memos (3/3/2009 8:41:29 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Asherdelampyr Bill Clinton I can see, I mean I know that he did some things that made his actual impeachment trial seem a sad joke, but Obama hasnt been in office long enough to seriously fuck up yet. One other thing, at least when Clinton left the unemployment rate wasnt nearly as bad as it is now... Maybe im a selfish prick but I dont care what our leaders do to other countries nearly as much as I care what they do to the one they are supposed to be leading. YET? have you looked at the national debt? he alone in the past 30 +days has added 1,200,000,000,000.00 dollars to it. Just wait to see what he does in the next 30 days!

rulemylife -> RE: # # Obama releases secret Bush anti-terror memos (3/3/2009 8:49:52 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: corysub And assholes in this country are concerned with the civil rights of "terrorists" well fuck them ..! Only three were waterboarded .... It should have been hundreds...and than they should have been shot or burned alive, crushed, or thrown off a tall building like those poor people that day. WE are at war with people who want to destroy us..and we have a President who is blind to the risk, releases CIA documents to a civil law suit, (and what do you think that message is to people at the CIA working to prevent more attacks on US)...and millions of drones who would trade the life of one terrorist for that of George Bush being held in prison for life! The country deserves every bit of pain we are going through. We don't appreciate the wonder of our country. I guess I could make the same argument. You don't seem to appreciate that it is the rule of law and the principles this country was founded on that made it what it is. Those principles don't include blind, lawless revenge. We had the backing of the entire world after 9/11, but Bush's attitudes and actions lost us the respect and moral high-ground that we always could be proud of. Not to mention the policies he instituted will come back to bite us in the ass. Preemptive war? Have you thought how this radical change in U.S. policy can be used as justification by other nations for launching their own invasions? The treatment of the prisoners? Have you thought about how we will not be able to claim torture when our own troops are subjected to waterboarding and sleep deprivation?

Termyn8or -> RE: # # Obama releases secret Bush anti-terror memos (3/3/2009 9:01:12 AM)
"Have you thought how this radical change in U.S. policy can be used as justification by other nations for launching their own invasions? " You know Vladimir Putin has said exactly that to the media, in public and all. Other countries are pissed, not pissed enough to drop bombs, but they are very unhappy with us. And now the failed economic policies are dragging down other countries' economies, they are not all happy about that either. We have never had so many enemies, and now it appears that we better watch our friends. THAT'S why we couldn't have McCain, no matter how bad Obama may be. T

rulemylife -> RE: # # Obama releases secret Bush anti-terror memos (3/3/2009 9:55:54 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Termyn8or "Have you thought how this radical change in U.S. policy can be used as justification by other nations for launching their own invasions? " You know Vladimir Putin has said exactly that to the media, in public and all. Other countries are pissed, not pissed enough to drop bombs, but they are very unhappy with us. And now the failed economic policies are dragging down other countries' economies, they are not all happy about that either. We have never had so many enemies, and now it appears that we better watch our friends. THAT'S why we couldn't have McCain, no matter how bad Obama may be. T Yeah, I know. I didn't think of it till you brought it up, but he made many comments like that regarding the invasion of Georgia. Though I'll take issue with you on "how bad Obama might be". But that's a different argument.

DomKen -> RE: # # Obama releases secret Bush anti-terror memos (3/3/2009 10:07:54 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Termyn8or fr The President does have the power to override the Constitution due to Admiralty Maritime Jurisdiction, which has been in place all of our lives. That is unless you are seventy six years of age or older. T No. There is no such and there never has been. Don't read tax protester sites and believe their ludicrous claims based on flag fringes.

truckinslave -> RE: Obama releases secret Bush anti-terror memos (3/3/2009 10:09:04 AM)
IMO, as soon as you become other than a true pacifist (one who can say, and mean: "I would watch a man armed with a knife kill my wife and children rather than shoot him"), as soon as you accept that violence has a legitimate place in the world, you arrive at: "war is diplomacy by other means" and "the end justifies the means". I am not a pacifist. Pres Hussein has thus far seen the light as far as denying rights to prisoners in Afghanistan and wiretaps are concerned; I'm very pleasantly but cautiously surprised. As far as torture, give me an hour with ten of them. The last nine will tell the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth; the key being to use their religious beliefs against them.

Mercnbeth -> RE: Obama releases secret Bush anti-terror memos (3/3/2009 10:18:04 AM)
*~ Fast Reply~* It's good that these are published, they make for good and distracting material. Could that be the reason they were published? Anyway, it will give people something to read while waiting in the Administration's policy generated, and Congressionally funded, unemployment lines; or sitting in a courtroom listening for their bankruptcy filing number to be called by the Clerk.

slvemike4u -> RE: # # Obama releases secret Bush anti-terror memos (3/3/2009 10:22:39 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: kdsub Corysub would you like me to list all the military and civilian casualties of the Civil War... there was a difference..one demanded survival actions while the other didn't.. that is my point. Butch [sm=applause.gif]

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