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[Poll]

Penmanship: Outdated or Vital Skill?

Everyone should know cursive!

57% (28)

Who cares if it's cursive or print if you can read it?

34% (17)

No one writes anymore, who cares?

6% (3)

What's cursive?

2% (1)

Total Votes : 49

(last vote on : 3/27/2009 6:52:18 PM)
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Penmanship: Outdated or Vital Skill? - 3/25/2009 7:39:24 PM

LadyHibiscus

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I was flipping through a magazine in my office lobby and saw a little essay on penmanship, and how the author felt it was outdated and unnecessary in These Modern Times. Everyone types, right? So who needs cursive writing?

Well, I think that everyone needs cursive writing, whether they do it well or not. There's seven billion people on this planet, and I SWEAR to you that not all of them own a computer. Yeah, lots of them write in ideographs, but those folks cherish calligraphy!

Fine motor control? You don't get it all from typing!

NEATNESS COUNTS! I don't think that kids need to match the copperplate style of the handwriting book, but dagnabbit, if you can get by with sloppy work when you're ten, what will you do when you're thirty?

DinosaurHib

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RE: Penmanship: Outdated or Vital Skill? - 3/25/2009 7:43:04 PM

FelineFae

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i don't know how to vote on this. i love writing. With enough flurishes i can even fake knowing how to spell.

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RE: Penmanship: Outdated or Vital Skill? - 3/25/2009 8:05:07 PM

sappatoti

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I agree with you LadyH but, unfortunately, the local school district (perhaps even the state?) doesn't seem to.

Two of my nieces, seniors in high school, never learned cursive handwriting throughout their schooling (they've been in the same public school district their entire career). They can do a good approximation of printing but cannot cursively write. The really sad thing is they have a difficult time reading other peoples' cursive writing (physicians don't count for this post)!

I have decent cursive writing (so I've been told) and it's quite legible, but whenever I send handwritten cards or notes, they don't get read because the girls tell me they cannot decipher my handwriting. If I print out the notes, they understand them just fine. Not having kids myself I was not made aware that public schools were no longer teaching cursive handwriting... either writing it or being able to read it.

This is truly a sad statement.

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RE: Penmanship: Outdated or Vital Skill? - 3/25/2009 8:34:23 PM

LadyHibiscus

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The article mentioned the argument that if no one learns cursive then how will we read old documents like the Constitution, say, in their original? Oh, someone will have that all typed out, was the pat response.

This makes me sad, and reminds me of something out of an Asimov story...

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RE: Penmanship: Outdated or Vital Skill? - 3/25/2009 8:44:41 PM

FelineFae

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There are schools that don't teach it??? What the fritz???

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RE: Penmanship: Outdated or Vital Skill? - 3/25/2009 8:45:21 PM

NYLass

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It's a sad state of the times when a young person can't even sign their own name. I asked a young man opening an account with me (I'm a customer service rep in a bank) to sign the signature card. He was 20 and wasn't able to put a signature on a card. I feel this is just the beginning of the dumbing down of civilization.

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RE: Penmanship: Outdated or Vital Skill? - 3/25/2009 8:52:04 PM

LinnaeaBorealis

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That'll teach me to vote before reading the thread. Maybe.

I do a combination of cursive & printing, sort of. A lot like my Father's handwriting, except my signature is illegible due to a job in the medical field where I had to sign it dozens of times daily & it just sort of deteriorated. So I was thinking, what's the difference, as long as it's legible? But I'm old & I learned cursive in school, in fact I learned the Palmer Method, where you make spirals & things in preparation for learning the actual cursive letters. It never occurred to me that there are people who can't read cursive. I find that appalling. I can understand not requiring children to use cursive in school, but to not teach it??? That's a little like not teaching them how to read at all. Oh, wait! That happens too.

Then again, are we the dinosaurs, not really in touch with all the changes of the modern world? I think a lot when I'm driving down the road in the truck & sometimes the changes I have seen astound me. And make me feel some days that maybe I've lived just a little too long. Because lots of those changes don't seem like progress to me.

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RE: Penmanship: Outdated or Vital Skill? - 3/26/2009 4:45:11 AM

sambamanslilgirl

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penmanship is becoming outdated because of the technology age - texting, emailing, IMming etc have replaced handwritten letters and notes.

i remember during grade school we had to learn penmanship and cursive writing with ink and pens (before requiring ball point pens in 8th grade) these days, they begin penmanship in pre-K. my hunny bunny has typing class(yep, in her school they start them young on the "home" keys) as well as writing excersises. when she enters 3rd grade, it will be penmanship however her school is thinking about going paperless for homework assignments.

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RE: Penmanship: Outdated or Vital Skill? - 3/26/2009 5:38:04 AM

LadyHibiscus

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Paperless in the THIRD GRADE? {boggle}

It's a different world, I can dig that, but it's not fully an AMERICAN world, and not a well off American world, either. Narrowing skill sets lessens versatility. And I swear to you all, nothing good ever came of a PowerPoint presentation.

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RE: Penmanship: Outdated or Vital Skill? - 3/26/2009 5:51:32 AM

DesFIP

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Fine motor skills come with age, teaching an 8 year old cursive takes a lot more time and practice than it is worth. Unfortunately, there's no place for it in a high school course which is where it ought to be done.

Beyond that, nothing more complex than a grocery list gets handwritten anymore. I still use a date book but most people keep appointments in a blackberry.

Kids grow up using computers in and out of school. And power point presentations are easy for a 10 year old.
The Man is talking about needing a web page for business. He's avoiding doing it but both his youngest and mine can do it. His has to do one for a computer class and mine has the software on his laptop, just follow the prompts and it's a snap. For them.

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RE: Penmanship: Outdated or Vital Skill? - 3/26/2009 6:20:36 AM

calamitysandra

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Changes in scripts are natural and have already occurred over time. Might well be that cursive writing is getting as outdated as Sütterlin or Fraktur script already are. So what?

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RE: Penmanship: Outdated or Vital Skill? - 3/26/2009 6:39:25 AM

SultryItalian

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quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyHibiscus
And I swear to you all, nothing good ever came of a PowerPoint presentation.

The only thing more mind-numbing than watching a PowerPoint, is making a PowerPoint!

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RE: Penmanship: Outdated or Vital Skill? - 3/26/2009 6:53:50 AM

MsFlutter

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Penmanship can still be part of a first impression and (in my world) is still a vital skill !

As a kid, I was always fascinated by my grandmother's copperplate script. An aunt used a straight-edge when she wrote. My male relatives were mechanical engineers and draftsman. I grew up surrounded by impeccable penmanship so scribbling was not an option !

My teachers insisted on holding penmanship contests. Lori M always beat me out of first place. Now that I think about it, her handwriting suggests that she was neurotic and unable to trust people - serves her right for always taking that prize away from me!

It is painful to see any cursive that resembles hieroglyphics. Unless I'm in a tearing hurry (or wearing a band-aid on my writing hand), I do my part to hold up the family tradition :)

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RE: Penmanship: Outdated or Vital Skill? - 3/26/2009 7:10:57 AM

Aylee

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I do not have copperplate penmanship, however I have been complimented on it multiple times throughout my life. It is a faster to write than it is to print, however.

When I was in college, I would only print my class notes if I was bored or tired, as it would help me stay awake and alert. Or I would use printing as an emphasis for something (easier than searching for a different colored pen.) However, I am also trying to imagine printing essays into a bluebook instead of writing them, and my mind boggles.

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RE: Penmanship: Outdated or Vital Skill? - 3/26/2009 7:42:05 AM

sunshinemiss

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I cherish the cursive written letters from my mom, my niece, my sister, etc.

However, we already have big and little letters. We have a million fonts that are used in writing.

Sorry Hibalicious, but cursive is going the way of hand written letters... They are obsolete... But I STILL USE THEM.

what's your address? I'll write you a love letter, cursive, pictures, a letter to hold onto with a red ribbon around it, in a box, hidden beneath the bed to be cherished.

hugs and stuff,

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RE: Penmanship: Outdated or Vital Skill? - 3/26/2009 7:46:38 AM

LaTigresse

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I read the same article, Newsweek or New York Times Magazine.

To me personally it really doesn't matter. I can see both sides of the issue. I write mostly in cursive, with my own weird tweak on it. Yet, I remember how really rediculous those classes seemed when I was doing them. I honestly don't see a need to have the ability or lack thereof, being graded in school.

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RE: Penmanship: Outdated or Vital Skill? - 3/26/2009 7:48:51 AM

Sasy

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Altho I remember winning several penmanship ribbons in school ( Catholic school thing I think) I answered who cares as long as it is ledgible. I worked in school offices for several years, All the absent notes are filed in the students yearly jacket. I would venture to say 95% were totally illegible, which made it extremely hard to figure out who's jacket got what. After several hours of filing one day, I acquired a massive headache. while in the nurses office getting several tylenol , she looked at me and I swear she snickered as she said " Doing absences excuses are you" I laughed which only made my head hurt worse. She told me to follow her and she showed me yet another jacket that was titled WHO THE HELL KNOWS. Seems that I was not the only one that couldnt read most of the notes.

Since my arthritis has set in so bad now my handwriting falls far short of those days when every one told me how pretty it was.... .I now PRINT all the notes I send to school ....

< Message edited by Sasy -- 3/26/2009 7:49:41 AM >

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RE: Penmanship: Outdated or Vital Skill? - 3/26/2009 9:15:32 AM

ArmoredOne

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My 6th grade teacher said something once during penmanship class that stuck with me. Yes, an actually section of the class time was dedicated to nothing more than penmanship, but then again, it was also a DoDDS education system, so that might have something to do with it.

"A tidy hand is a tidy mind."

Even after numerous years of alcohol abuse and drug abuse, I still have a fairly tidy mind and a tidy hand when it comes to writing. My contribution to the next generation, however, can't seem to read script to save their lives. I leave notes for them to do something if I am not going to be available to micromanage their freetime, and when I come back home, I am barraged with a host of complaints that they can't read my handwriting. The senior of the reproduced ones can't even seem to write his name in script without it looking more like he was trying to write it during an earthquake, even with a guiding line to set the letters on. Granted, I came into the game with him and his sibling, but still, but the time that you are able to get your first driver's liscence, you should be able to at the very least sign your name in script. Even his printing is deplorable, but at least slightly more legible.

But as to a good reason for learning how to do script in a clean hand, how about turning in homework handwritten. If the teacher can't read it, how can he/she grade it properly?

I, for one, would flunk any student that couldn't write clearly. I don't care how digital the universe becomes in the future, frankly. Handwriting is a mark of who you are and the attention to detail that you are willing to give to a project, be it homework, a job or anything else. Perhaps I am a bit too demanding, but demanding someone's absolute best, be it penmanship or job performance, is something that is fast retreating from the lexicon of America itself.

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RE: Penmanship: Outdated or Vital Skill? - 3/26/2009 1:46:43 PM

LadyHibiscus

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quote:

ORIGINAL: ArmoredOne

Perhaps I am a bit too demanding, but demanding someone's absolute best, be it penmanship or job performance, is something that is fast retreating from the lexicon of America itself.

This is my biggest argument pro-penmanship---and truly, I don't care if your writing matches the Palmer book (or that godawful D'Nealian!) as long as it is LEGIBLE. To say, oh, we use text or computers is an absurd cop out. I have a calculator, does that mean I need never learn arithmetic? Evidently so, considering that few can even make change anymore!

When I was in grad school the first time (1985) getting my education degree, I dared to say that if we were graduating kids from high school unable to read, write, fill out a job app, and balance their checkbooks, we were doing them a grave disservice. That the "higher level thinking skills" that were the fad then were genuinely beyond the reach of half of the student population. I was roundly mocked for being a DINOSAUR, just because I felt that our regular students should get the same kind of education as our sped kids---but like WOW, we call it ADL's and such with the sped kids! Fooey.

StegosaurusHib

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RE: Penmanship: Outdated or Vital Skill? - 3/26/2009 1:50:04 PM

girlygurl

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Not that I do much of it these days, but I think everyone should know cursive. I loved to write when I did it.

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