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How important is protocol? - 1/15/2004 9:43:30 PM   
DarkQuin


Posts: 46
Joined: 1/1/2004
Status: offline 		How important is protocol to your relationship?

Quin
Profile   Post #: 1
RE: How important is protocol? - 1/16/2004 9:44:53 AM   
shai^tana


Posts: 24
Joined: 1/8/2004
Status: offline 		Master DarkQuin:

Protocol in the Gorean relationship is well documented in such items as the stylized "serves" and names of common items the Master may choose to incorporate into language He may use This may be seen in such as "blackwine" (= coffee). Also, positions can be seen certainly to be protocol items Gorean slaves are trained to recognize and perform if the Master desires such.

This girl also understands that many Masters choose particular established, behaviours protocols/routines/rituals that they find pleasing or of benefit to the slave. They may be enacted to instruct the slave, to affect their attitude or mindset, or may become enduring behaviours and actions that the Master wishes. One example may be for a slave who works outside the home, upon return home each day, that the slave is to immediately change into slave garb and shed the outside world trappings, thus assisting her to more tangibly recognize the difference in her returning to the home environment, and provide her with a "bridge" of time in which to let go of those issues based in the work world, and embrace her slavery in a more direct manner in preparing for the return of her Master to the home.

It is this girl's understanding, that according to general education theory, when attitudes/outlooks/beliefs are reinforced by patterned specific behaviours, the learning is more profound and more easily corrected or rewarded. Thus it would seem from this point of view that protocols can be seen to be excellent learning/reinforcement tools, and of value in a relationship between Master and slave.

Protocols also may be used simply because the Master gains pleasure from the comfort of a known quanitity and an expectation of how something will be done. Perhaps also, He may simply enjoy looking at His slave in a certain position, or having her wait in a particular way to be fed at His feet, or such other preferences.

shai^tana

(in reply to DarkQuin)
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RE: How important is protocol? - 1/16/2004 11:54:49 AM   
Voltare


Posts: 841
Joined: 1/1/2004
From: Santiago, Chile
Status: offline 		The Kinkolitically correct answer would of course be 'however important you wish for it to be.' Myself, I enjoy a high degree of protocol, with flexible expectations (that, as a Dominant, I have complete authority over) that permit comfortable conversation. A woman is lovely on her knees, but it gets a bit difficult for her to do so for three hours discussing philosophy, if she's not used to being on her knees. Protocol, honestly, should only enhance the relationship - not rule it.

Stephan

(in reply to DarkQuin)
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RE: How important is protocol? - 1/16/2004 1:33:43 PM   
EStrict


Posts: 729
Joined: 1/11/2004
Status: offline 		Hello Sir,

My personal views on protocol is they are wonderful things within the context you practice them. My problem with them is the expectaions of others. By that I mean, I know people who tell their slaves, they will address ANY man as Sir or Master, and ANY none slave female as Ma'am or Mistress. Submissives are not slaves, so they have to be called Ma'am. Male subs are Sir. Vanilla strangers are Ma'am or Sir.

It's wonderful you want to have strict protocols for your property to follow, but what gives you the right to make other's accept your decision on this? It is the equivalent of dragging a nilla into a scene.

There are boards that say all domanints are to be called Sir or Ma'am. They are not boards I will join, for the simple fact it does not fit in with my own beliefs. The only two women I call Ma'am are my mother and grandmother, and neither of them are dominant in any way, shape or form.

The protocol that occurs in our home is very important,,, and is not something that we alter. However, we don't expect our guests to follow it, as it is OUR protocol, not something that fits in everyone one elses life choices. Our *houserules* (Ie, smoking only outside or in the pool table/bar area) are not negotiable. It being our house does give us the right to say it is not optional. And just as I have the option of not joining a board that requires things I am not comfortable with, people have the option of not coming to our home if they do not like the house rules.

Sandy

(in reply to Voltare)
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RE: How important is protocol? - 1/16/2004 3:55:03 PM   
Voltare


Posts: 841
Joined: 1/1/2004
From: Santiago, Chile
Status: offline 		"It's wonderful you want to have strict protocols for your property to follow, but what gives you the right to make other's accept your decision on this? It is the equivalent of dragging a nilla into a scene. "

Sandy,

I've found that there is a good deal of give and take on this matter in real life gatherings. Generally, I have 'standard' rules for my property to obey. One of these, is to see to the contentment and enjoyment of others around them, at all times. In a D/s context, this does in fact mean any self-identified dominant will be addressed as Ma'am or Sir by the property, with one notable exception "Unless told otherwise." The reason for this rule overrides any other rule I offer - there is hardly anything impolite in calling someone 'Sir' or 'Ma'am' in my mind. If the person says "no, call me 'Bob'" then the more important rule - see to the pleasure of those around you - takes precedence.

I agree with you on the concept of house rules and protocol. Perhaps you misunderstood my post to suggest that protocol was required of ALL submissives/slaves, for me to consider them to be so; I assure you this was not my intention.

Stephan

(in reply to EStrict)
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RE: How important is protocol? - 1/16/2004 4:11:54 PM   
EStrict


Posts: 729
Joined: 1/11/2004
Status: offline 		I apologize Sir, I was not clear. The *you* was a generic you. I did not believe from your post that you would try to drag other's into your scene. I hope I didn't offend you.

Sandy

(in reply to Voltare)
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RE: How important is protocol? - 1/16/2004 7:04:18 PM   
MizSuz


Posts: 1881
Joined: 1/1/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Voltare

"Unless told otherwise."



Good stuff, that.

Rule #1 - You MUST take care of yourself if you are to adequately take care of me.

To paraphrase a dear friend from Long Island (props to Lawrence) "Everything we really need to know about getting along in a D/s social situation we learned in kindergarten. Don't touch others unless they request it, don't play with other people's toys unless given leave to, be polite to everyone, don't pick your nose in public..."

General good manners will usually do the trick.

Now, that doesn't preclude the occasional extended period of severe restriction, limitations and protocol requirements. I'm reminded of a pre-collaring weekend in which one of my requirements of the collaree-to-be was to always have his head lower than mine when he was in the same room as me. He was much taller than me to begin with, but then I spent a good deal of the weekend lounging on the floor at the opposite end of the largest room in the house - making him play step-and-fetch-it for me while getting many chores done in preparation for his collaring ceremony.

ha! That was a nice memory.

I like protocol, but I require good manners, honesty and open communication. Everything else tends to take care of itself in the general day to day.

< Message edited by MizSuz -- 1/16/2004 7:05:00 PM >

_____________________________

“The more you love, the more you can love—and the more intensely you love. Nor is there any limit on how many you can love. If a person had time enough, he could love all of that majority who are decent and just.”
- Robert Heinlein

(in reply to Voltare)
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RE: How important is protocol? - 1/23/2004 7:50:31 PM   
MistressDREAD


Posts: 2943
Joined: 1/1/2004
Status: offline 		HMMmmm Id say protocol is just as important as
Free Thinking, rules, regulations, communication,
integrity and honor in My *ALifestyleA* relationships.

(in reply to DarkQuin)
Profile   Post #: 8
RE: How important is protocol? - 5/31/2004 10:06:26 PM   
MistressDREAD


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RE: How important is protocol? - 6/1/2004 12:35:51 PM   
sub4hire


Posts: 6775
Joined: 1/1/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: DarkQuin

How important is protocol to your relationship?

Quin


I feel it depends upon the couple. Or three, whatever it may be. If its important to them. Then its important. Myself and my Dominant follow certain protocal. Nope, its not necessarily what half or 1/4 of the rest of the world follows. It's more like mutual respect. Then again I may be wrong, most may follow it.

(in reply to DarkQuin)
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RE: How important is protocol? - 6/10/2004 8:46:35 AM   
MrThorns


Posts: 919
Joined: 6/4/2004
Status: offline 		I feel that certain protocols are essential to my relationship, however they are not essentail to every relationship. I live with my slave in a 24/7 relationship, however I am not Domming her 24 hours a day, seven days a week. For the most part, we function as most any vanilla couple would, aside from a few light protocols.

We have established "High protocol days" in my home, where a girl is expected to maintain various positions, refrain from making eye contact, be objectified, etc. Our lives are simply too busy to maintain that level of protocol for an extended period, so we set aside times in the week to go into high protocol.

At parties or munches we maintain an elevated level of protocol, depending upon what kind of party we are attending, house rules, etc.

I believe that protocols are necessary, however the level of that protocol is dictated by the people within the relationship and what works best for them

~Thorns

(in reply to sub4hire)
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RE: How important is protocol? - 12/24/2004 9:47:46 PM   
MistressDREAD


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RE: How important is protocol? - 12/25/2004 1:10:02 AM   
Lordandmaster


Posts: 10943
Joined: 6/22/2004
Status: offline 		OK, you dug up a six-month-old thread to add THIS?

quote:

ORIGINAL: MistressDREAD



(in reply to MistressDREAD)
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RE: How important is protocol? - 12/25/2004 10:41:00 AM   
RealityFix


Posts: 156
Joined: 8/12/2004
Status: offline 		It's as important as you make it.

As long as the dynamic is sound, I just prefer to see behavior in accord with what respect I have earned through my actions.

The rest is merely window dressing, so long as that is there.

(in reply to Lordandmaster)
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RE: How important is protocol? - 12/26/2004 12:54:26 PM   
DePhocas


Posts: 1
Joined: 1/1/2004
Status: offline 		Many people get confused when talking about Protocol. They confuse Protocol with "Protocol Styles" (like High Protocol D/s styles or the Gorean style), "Etiquette", "Rituals", "Ceremonials" and simple good manners.

All of the above are VERY different from each other and, yet, closely linked (i.e. a series of ceremonials linked together form a ritual and several rituals linked together can become protocol or etiquette).

Protocol is NOT community protocol. It isn't meant as a dictate of how a group interacts but, rather, the interactions between partners specifically. There is a golden rule of Protocol : "the leader makes protocol".

My two cents.


DePhocas

(in reply to RealityFix)
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RE: How important is protocol? - 12/26/2004 4:04:09 PM   
MC2044


Posts: 31
Joined: 8/8/2004
Status: offline 		"Protocol? What protocol?"

I agree with MizSuz, MrThorns, and DePhocas.

(in reply to DePhocas)
Profile   Post #: 16
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