RE: Metaphors (Full Version)

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HatesParisHilton -> RE: Metaphors (7/15/2009 12:19:41 AM)

many people with asperger's are brilliant, IQ's clocking in over 150, etc., and apserger's can be very light, in fact can go undiagnosed for decades.

I have three friends with asperger's, one is VERY successful and works for national internet technology interests, without people like him, internet here would be "ghetto".

he has never understood a metphor in his life, according to himself, he just knows how to fake it until someone (like me) breaks it down into a concrete equation of symbols and tropes (which s what a metaphor is, basically)




Brain -> RE: Metaphors (7/15/2009 12:30:25 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Kalista07

We rarely argue...Mostly because he refuses to engage with me on that level... However, it just seriously enrages  me when we watch a movie, television program, listen to music, or talk about a book where someone is using a metaphor.  For some reason metaphors somehow do not process in my brain. Like not at all. i'm not really stupid..i mean i have a masters degree.  i don't understand why i just can not comprehend these little bastards and why most everyone else in the free world can.  Any ideas on why i can not get this? Any suggestions for how i can learn about these or is it just pretty much hopeless?
Kali


All the world's a stage,
And all the men and women merely players;
They have their exits and their entrances; — William Shakespeare
In this example, "the world" is compared to a stage, the aim being to describe the world by taking well-known attributes from the stage




Brain -> RE: Metaphors (7/15/2009 12:47:53 AM)

By the way, I want to start a discussion on health care because Obama wants to pass a bill before Congress recesses the end of August. Can somebody please tell me how to start a discussion on health care. How do I do it exactly? Where is the webpage you go to if you want to start a discussion on a new topic?




HatesParisHilton -> RE: Metaphors (7/15/2009 12:50:00 AM)

here,or politics and religion section.




Arpig -> RE: Metaphors (7/15/2009 12:56:50 AM)

Politics & Religion, most definately...and expect to hear from me a lot in that thread....well expect to hear from me a lot in most any thread in that section, being the opinionated bastard I am.




Kalista07 -> RE: Metaphors (7/15/2009 1:47:34 PM)

i'm *fairly* certain i don't have asperger's...although i've been wrong like a bazillion other times today... It's seriously gotten to the point where we can not even talk about metaphors. For example, i told Him that i had posted this..He asked how people were responded. i summarized everyone's response and He smiled.  i decided it was best at that time to walk out of the room and not  express my *metaphor* for how i was feeling..... bah.
Anyway, as i'm typing this i asked Him for an example of something recently that we watched that most everyone else would have gotten that was a metaphor for something else that i wouldn't have gotten..He informed me: True Blood= human and vampire interaction was apparently metaphoric interaction for racism and homosexuality....WTF??!! i really don't know how a person's mind can make those kind of corelations...
Kali





sappatoti -> RE: Metaphors (7/15/2009 1:56:27 PM)

With regards to True Blood, I wouldn't even begin to know where to look for a metaphor in that. I'm not a fan of vampire type films so any of the popular culture surrounding vampires is lost on me. In this case, I am as lost as you Kali when it comes to identifying and understanding the metaphor(s).

Now, if we were to talk about the metaphors contained in Star Trek: The Original Series, I can identify and understand many of the metaphors that show presented regarding the Cold War that was taking place in real life back during those days.




Kalista07 -> RE: Metaphors (7/15/2009 2:00:41 PM)

DAMN it Sappa!!!!!!!

You are not really trying to tell me the original Star Trek is really about the cold war are you???!!!

Kali




ThatDamnedPanda -> RE: Metaphors (7/15/2009 2:02:13 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Kalista07
Anyway, as i'm typing this i asked Him for an example of something recently that we watched that most everyone else would have gotten that was a metaphor for something else that i wouldn't have gotten..He informed me: True Blood= human and vampire interaction was apparently metaphoric interaction for racism and homosexuality....WTF??!! i really don't know how a person's mind can make those kind of corelations...



Which  goes to another point - people see lots of metaphors that really aren't metaphors. The human mind is constantly seeking out patterns, and it's so hardwired to find them that it often sees patterns and connections that aren't really there. So it's quite possible that in a lot of the circumstances in which you're the only one not "seeing" a metaphor, you're actually the only one in the room who's seeing the situation for what it actually is. Just a thought.




slavegirlbc -> RE: Metaphors (7/15/2009 2:12:16 PM)

i have low level Asperghers and i see metaphors and symbolism very easily, to the point that i came up with connections in a major novel in an essay, and my english teacher asked me to develop it into a thesis, as no one else had seen those connections in the work.

aspergers is a set of talents, attributes and particular gifts, not a disability.

slave alice




sappatoti -> RE: Metaphors (7/15/2009 2:14:13 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Kalista07

DAMN it Sappa!!!!!!!

You are not really trying to tell me the original Star Trek is really about the cold war are you???!!!

Kali



First and foremost, Gene Roddenberry wanted to tell a series of good action stories, sort of like the westerns of the day; just put in a space setting. As to whether he intended many of the episodes to be metaphors for the Cold War, I have no immediate knowledge or ready reference to that. I do know that many, many fans have long believed that many of the episodes were metaphors; trying to put the intricacies of the Cold War into terms that the less political viewers of Star Trek would understand. That doesn't mean those metaphors were intentional. It only means that many, many people saw the similarities between the episodes and what was going on in the real world at the time.

I understand how you feel with regards to metaphors. There is an episode from Star Trek: The Next Generation that was completely about trying to learn a metaphorical language (if the crew of the Enterprise didn't, Picard would die... anyway...). The episode title is "Darmok" and it took me quite a few viewings just to understand the premise of this episode. Now that I understand it, it's my favorite TNG episode of all time, just because it dealt with learning how to interpret a metaphorical language, which has helped me become clearer in my normal, every day language skills (I hope).

If you get the chance to find this episode somewhere, you may wish to view it. Don't worry or get frustrated if you don't get it on the first viewing. It will take many viewings to begin to make some things clear. That, and a lot of patience (and popcorn).




Tals -> RE: Metaphors (7/15/2009 2:33:05 PM)

Darmok and Jalad at Tanagra!  Okay nerd moment has passed.




peachgirl -> RE: Metaphors (7/15/2009 4:07:00 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Kalista07

Anyway, as i'm typing this i asked Him for an example of something recently that we watched that most everyone else would have gotten that was a metaphor for something else that i wouldn't have gotten..He informed me: True Blood= human and vampire interaction was apparently metaphoric interaction for racism and homosexuality....WTF??!! i really don't know how a person's mind can make those kind of corelations...
Kali



wtf is right, I watch that show fairly faithfully and totally don't get that at all.  I don't think the writing is that intelligent.

now "Six Feet Under"...that was a different show completely, but I could at least get what they were trying to say.




Kalista07 -> RE: Metaphors (7/15/2009 6:39:50 PM)

Okay, you people are seriously killing me here..Peachgirl, could you please enlighten me as to the metaphors in sixfeet under.
damn..i'm seriously feeling like maybe i should just stay in my house or in a cardboard box...
Why can't people just say what they  mean and mean what they say?
Kali




angelikaJ -> RE: Metaphors (7/15/2009 6:53:10 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: ThatDamnedPanda

quote:

ORIGINAL: Kalista07
Anyway, as i'm typing this i asked Him for an example of something recently that we watched that most everyone else would have gotten that was a metaphor for something else that i wouldn't have gotten..He informed me: True Blood= human and vampire interaction was apparently metaphoric interaction for racism and homosexuality....WTF??!! i really don't know how a person's mind can make those kind of corelations...



To state the obvious...perhaps he overcomplicates things.

Which  goes to another point - people see lots of metaphors that really aren't metaphors. The human mind is constantly seeking out patterns, and it's so hardwired to find them that it often sees patterns and connections that aren't really there. So it's quite possible that in a lot of the circumstances in which you're the only one not "seeing" a metaphor, you're actually the only one in the room who's seeing the situation for what it actually is. Just a thought.





peachgirl -> RE: Metaphors (7/15/2009 8:42:51 PM)

ok, I'll be the first to admit, my memory is not set up to remember specifics on tv shows...but I felt a lot of kinship for the characters in Six Feet Under.  there were several times when something would happen or appear, and I would be like "wow!  I get that!"

I did find a couple of links for you check out.

https://www.msu.edu/~vanlooka/six_feet_under.pdf

http://thoughtsonstuff.blogspot.com/2005/12/six-feet-under-nate.html

the second one is excellent, I'll be re-reading it several times, I'm sure.  it's just a great analysis of a/the central character.




philosophy -> RE: Metaphors (7/16/2009 12:15:03 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Kalista07

Anyway, as i'm typing this i asked Him for an example of something recently that we watched that most everyone else would have gotten that was a metaphor for something else that i wouldn't have gotten..He informed me: True Blood= human and vampire interaction was apparently metaphoric interaction for racism and homosexuality....WTF??!! i really don't know how a person's mind can make those kind of corelations...




....first off, a metaphor is not the thing itself. However it is a tool used to illuminate something else.
True Blood is a good example. One could write about racism and homophobia in LA. It's been done before. In fact it's probably been done too many times, because each iteration adds to a generalised collective understanding. Eventually, a blunt forthright telling of a story encounters so much resistence from that collective understanding that nothing new can be said. This is where metaphor comes in. We take the shape of the story, and retell it in another context. Now it's not the LGBT community looking for equal rights, but vampires. Now, if we'd left it as an LGBT story, all that would happen is that those who already know what side of the divide they fall on take nothing from the story. By recasting the story we've allowed people to examine the issues and partially bypassed pre-existing biases.

Metaphor is a highly useful tool. However, i bet you do get them...you just don't realise it. For instance if you have a tatto, what was it like getting it done? If your answer wasn't, 'it was like getting a tattoo' then you used a metaphor.
What does love feel like? The instant your answer refers to something that isn't love, then you're moving into metaphor territory.

A metaphor is a map, not the territory itself. However maps can tell us things about the territory that walking on it doesn't give us.

Oh, and to clear up the birds and the bees thing. Basically, in a tight laced repressed society one can't talk openly about sex and reproduction. However, we can look out the window and see things reproduce that don't have obvious willys or ladies front bottoms :) So we don't say sex, we point at how birds give rise to other birds. How bees give rise to other bees. It's not accurate, but at least we're talking real reproduction and not pointing at babies delivered by Stork airways.




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