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Self Esteme, & the sub/slave - 7/18/2009 8:53:26 AM

vasha

Posts: 99
Joined: 2/20/2009
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now, i lothe generaliseing... most of the time its very wrong. however, it seems to me.. and feel quite free to correct me if you believe i am wrong.. that many, or even most, subs/slaves have some kind of self esteme issues. yes? no? why is this? thoughts?

Post #: 1

RE: Self Esteme, & the sub/slave - 7/18/2009 9:10:19 AM

Drakontos

Posts: 167
Joined: 5/20/2009
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quote:

ORIGINAL: vasha

now, i lothe generaliseing... most of the time its very wrong. however, it seems to me.. and feel quite free to correct me if you believe i am wrong.. that many, or even most, subs/slaves have some kind of self esteme issues. yes? no? why is this? thoughts?

zaphira would have to say that you are wrong. Most do NOT have self-esteem issues. Some do, Most do not. All too often, we only focus on those who show all the signs of no self esteem and forget about those who do not show any signs. zaphira thinks that this is why so many believe that the majority have these issues. Just zaphira's thoughts though.

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Drakontos
zaphira

Live with honor; serve with grace and beauty

(in reply to vasha)

Post #: 2

RE: Self Esteme, & the sub/slave - 7/18/2009 9:10:24 AM

IronBear

Posts: 9008
Joined: 6/19/2005
From: Beenleigh, Qld, Australia
Status: offline

I really can't buy into this, not having completed a world wide study of all the sub/slaves. However based on those sub/slaves I do know, I'd have to say that possibly hale of them have self esteem issues and the other half know and are happy with who and what they naturally are. I actually know more Dominants who have self esteem issues though.

Edited to add:

Just remember that certainly from a slave perspective, if he or she has really committed and been collared, they are often more vulnerable to being hurt and having self esteem damaged by a foolish or unkind comment from their Master or Mistress. Not sure how this works with the submissive though.

< Message edited by IronBear -- 7/18/2009 9:13:09 AM >

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Master of Bruin Cottage

http://www.bruincottage.org

Your attitude, words & actions are yours. Take responsibility for them and the consequences they incur.

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(in reply to vasha)

Post #: 3

RE: Self Esteme, & the sub/slave - 7/18/2009 9:11:07 AM

slavekal

Posts: 1486
Joined: 7/20/2004
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Well...we all fall prey to generaliseing once in a while, but I haven't noticed any more self esteme issues in slaves than anyone else.

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(in reply to vasha)

Post #: 4

RE: Self Esteme, & the sub/slave - 7/18/2009 9:12:56 AM

OrionTheWolf

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Joined: 10/11/2006
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I think that many people, whether they are sub or slave, have self esteem issues. There may be a higher percentage that are subs or slaves, but that would take a study to determine. It could be that some of the things they do, others see as truly degrading, when in fact they are feeding a need to serve and getting exactly what they need.

Personally I make sure to improve the self esteem of my slaves, as it makes them more valuable to me and my house. Only when they have other severe emotional issues, will there be a problem in increasing their self esteem. Usually it comes from assisting them in accepting who and what they are, and disregarding the judgments of mainstream society.

_____________________________

When speaking of slaves people always tend to ignore this definition "One who is abjectly subservient to a specified person or influence."

(in reply to vasha)

Post #: 5

RE: Self Esteme, & the sub/slave - 7/18/2009 9:13:48 AM

mnottertail

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Joined: 11/3/2004
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To my esteemed colleagues...............

esteme might be a name, it might be an asian steamed dish of some sort, or it might be just me, but it will not build your self respect one whit.

R

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Have they not divided the prey; to every man a damsel or two? Judges 5:30

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Post #: 6

RE: Self Esteme, & the sub/slave - 7/18/2009 9:14:24 AM

CallaFirestormBW

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Joined: 6/29/2008
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It has been my experience that some individuals who choose to submit to another's direction do so because they do not feel confident about themselves or about their capacity to make decisions, but it is -also- my experience that fewer than a third of the servants I've dealt with have -had- such issues.

Most of the servants I've dealt with have had a good sense of self, and healthy self-esteem, and have submitted not out of some sense of failure on their part, but because they genuinely see their strengths as being those 'behind the scenes' -- not as the decision-maker. Many of the people on the yielding side of the kneel that I've dealt with have been perfectly -capable- of making decisions and knew it... but they -preferred- not to, if they could find someone to take that role whom they felt was worth following.

There is this delusion out there that if one is not The Leader then one is, somehow, diminished. However, no leader would successfully complete a project unless there were people skilled in taking direction and turning it into results. It is -this- mindset that I find most often among those who have chosen to live in service to me.

Dame Calla

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***
Said to me recently: "Look, I know you're the "voice of reason"... but dammit, I LIKE being unreasonable!!!!"

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(in reply to vasha)

Post #: 7

RE: Self Esteme, & the sub/slave - 7/18/2009 9:18:45 AM

IrishMist

Posts: 7480
Joined: 11/17/2005
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quote:

ORIGINAL: vasha

now, i lothe generaliseing... most of the time its very wrong. however, it seems to me.. and feel quite free to correct me if you believe i am wrong.. that many, or even most, subs/slaves have some kind of self esteme issues. yes? no? why is this? thoughts?

Everyone suffers from issues in regards to their self esteem from time to time. Everyone. What keeps others from seeing it though is how a person deals with it. Some people handle the issues better than others; that's all.

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If I said something to offend you, please tell me what it was so that I can say it again later.

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Post #: 8

RE: Self Esteme, & the sub/slave - 7/18/2009 9:21:06 AM

chiaThePet

Posts: 2694
Joined: 2/4/2007
Status: offline

OK, seriously,

No, really,

Alright alright alright,

Okay I'll bite,

What's Esteme?

Besides an Italian sauna.

chia* (the pet)

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Love is a many splendid sting.

You can stick me in the corner, but I'll probably just end up coloring on the walls.

(in reply to vasha)

Post #: 9

RE: Self Esteme, & the sub/slave - 7/18/2009 9:23:18 AM

mnottertail

Posts: 60698
Joined: 11/3/2004
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Well, Chia----

I know that Mako used that line quite a bit in the movie, The Sand Pebbles, so it might be something to do with a ship.

From the esteme wauw,
Tzi Ma

< Message edited by mnottertail -- 7/18/2009 9:28:39 AM >

_____________________________

Have they not divided the prey; to every man a damsel or two? Judges 5:30

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Post #: 10

RE: Self Esteme, & the sub/slave - 7/18/2009 9:40:29 AM

MasterSlaveLA

Posts: 3991
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: vasha

it seems to me... that many, or even most, subs/slaves have some kind of self esteme issues. yes? no? why is this? thoughts?

Being completely honest, most of the subs/slaves I know do have "issues"... some are self-esteem related, others are not. Then again, many of my 'nilla friends have "issues" as well; so my answer is... from a personal perspective, I'd tend to agree many/most subs/slaves have "issues" (self-esteem being but one), but from a scientific perspective, there's no reliable evidence to support the premise.

As a side note... here's an interesting article I once read on kink and abuse:

The Connection Between Kink and Abuse
http://www.hotlanta.com/sirreal/KinkAndAbuse.htm

_____________________________

It's only kinky the first time!!!

(in reply to vasha)

Post #: 11

RE: Self Esteme, & the sub/slave - 7/18/2009 9:43:58 AM

SlyStone

Posts: 398
Joined: 12/23/2006
From: Chicago
Status: offline

quote:

it seems to me.. and feel quite free to correct me if you believe i am wrong.. that many, or even most, subs/slaves have some kind of self esteme issues. yes? no? why is this? thoughts?

Saying something inflammatory like that means nothing unless you can provide some substantiated evidence that you are correct. So rather then just make the statement, how about telling us why you think your statement is true.

Because as Irish said everyone has esteem issues at one time or another, it is part of being human. So it is not that issues exist, it is how we deal with them and grow.

And in my judgment learning and doing anything well and anything that brings you happiness is the way to develop and boost ones self esteem. And I see no reason to believe that becoming a good sub or a good slave or a good dominant for that matter would be somehow precluded from that growth process.

_____________________________

Life shrinks or expands in proportion to one's courage.

Anais Nin

(in reply to vasha)

Post #: 12

RE: Self Esteme, & the sub/slave - 7/18/2009 9:51:13 AM

TurboJugend

Posts: 481
Joined: 6/15/2009
Status: offline

Could it be we think they have more issues..because we are here so often? Could it be that sub/slaves are more open when talking.

As said before vanilla or lifestyle..people do have issues. But I admit..when talking to subs/slaves...indeed enough seem to have esteem issues..and follow a Master as soon as they get some attention ( and get used..and the circle is complete).

(in reply to SlyStone)

Post #: 13

RE: Self Esteme, & the sub/slave - 7/18/2009 10:33:54 AM

DesFIP

Posts: 25191
Joined: 11/25/2007
From: Apple County NY
Status: offline

Because we're human?
Most human beings I know, who are not sociopathic, have self esteem issues. We know we aren't the smartest people in the world because no matter how bright you are, you have met someone smarter. We all know people who have better fashion sense, flatter abs, better joke telling abilities. Et cetera.

And most importantly, none of us have escaped childhood without having been teased about something which leaves us with a lingering dread of being unfairly attacked.

The fact that bullying was until recently accepted as natural in any school environment means none of us want to be exposed to such a thing again. And even school systems that claim to have a zero tolerance on it don't live up to it when a kid gets hurt.

_____________________________

Slave to laundry

Cynical and proud of it!

(in reply to TurboJugend)

Post #: 14

RE: Self Esteme, & the sub/slave - 7/18/2009 10:54:55 AM

TurboJugend

Posts: 481
Joined: 6/15/2009
Status: offline

quote:

Because we're human?

But that would mean the OP should have similar experience with "vanilla's".
(still the answer is yes :P )

(in reply to DesFIP)

Post #: 15

RE: Self Esteme, & the sub/slave - 7/18/2009 11:47:01 AM

sweetsub1957

Posts: 2201
Joined: 4/28/2009
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Well, I loathe generalizing too & that being said, I think some subs/slaves have self-esteem issues, but then so do some of any other group of people. I don't think subs/slaves have the corner on the market in other words. The real question is, how does one handle their issues?

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Member: Lance's Fag Hags.

"That's not just a chip on her shoulder, that's the whole potato!" ~Lady Angelika~

In lowering yourself to talking behind my back, you're perfectly positioned to kiss my ass.

An it harm none, do what ye wilt.

(in reply to vasha)

Post #: 16

RE: Self Esteme, & the sub/slave - 7/18/2009 12:27:37 PM

oceanwinds

Posts: 530
Status: offline

I basically have a healthy case self esteem, even as a submissive. At times in life mountains are thrown at us that catch us off balance, for me at least. I been honored to have achieved the nickname from so many, phoenix. I might fall and nothing but ashes are remaining, but guaranteed, this girl will rise from her own ashes.

I don't see this either as a submissive condition. I have seem over and over so namy Doms, and a few on here who must drive a point home or thump their chest, which always is an indication they dont have an ounce of self esteem. I dont take pitty on these people they just dont know any better. They think they are all that and in reality their words prove the opposite.

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I know where I came from and where I am today. I am forever grateful to all that touched my life. Thank you all and especially you, Goddess.

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Post #: 17

RE: Self Esteme, & the sub/slave - 7/18/2009 12:33:39 PM

CelticPrince

Posts: 3613
Joined: 4/15/2005
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: vasha

now, i lothe generaliseing... most of the time its very wrong. however, it seems to me.. and feel quite free to correct me if you believe i am wrong.. that many, or even most, subs/slaves have some kind of self esteme issues. yes? no? why is this? thoughts?

quote:

now, i lothe generaliseing... most of the time its very wrong. however, it seems to me.. and feel quite free to correct me if you believe i am wrong.. that many, or even most, subs/slaves have some kind of self esteme issues. yes? no? why is this? thoughts?

vasha,

None that would draw my interest!

CP

(in reply to vasha)

Post #: 18

RE: Self Esteme, & the sub/slave - 7/18/2009 12:50:40 PM

littlesarbonn

Posts: 1710
Joined: 12/3/2005
From: Stockton, California
Status: offline

I'm going to come out in disagreement as well. I have zero self-esteem issues. Well, except for when I'm around people who are better than me. And there do appear to be quite a few of them. Like everyone that posted in this thread. I wish I was as good as them, or could live up to being able to post like them. But aside from them, I'm pretty strong on self-esteem. Well, there are a couple of others, too, now that I think about it. I remember they posted in other threads. Other than them, I'm pretty much good to go. Now that I think about it, I do want to say that I wish I was as good as most of the people who post on these boards. Those people are so much better than me, and I wish I was a lot more like them. So, aside from them....and all the people who have profiles on the other side...I'm pretty much good to go on the whole self-esteem side. Of course, away from the boards is a bit different because in the real world, those people who live the lifestyle are OBVIOUSLY better than me, and I can only wish I was allowed in their company. Come to think of it, I think the people who aren't even into the scene have it so much better, and I wish I had their confidence.

But aside from those few exceptions, I have to say I completely disagree with the poster...although the poster seems kind of impressive, too.....

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Post #: 19

RE: Self Esteme, & the sub/slave - 7/18/2009 1:02:37 PM

gift4mistress

Posts: 165
Joined: 6/30/2009
Status: offline

I like how this discussion is closed only to the sub/slaves as if all other humans don't have issues. In my opinion every person, animal, planet, and everything else in existence has some battle to fight. You may argue that a higher percentage of subs/slaves will have severe self esteem issues than the rest of the population. But, I personally believe that everyone has self esteem issues to some extent.

I don't know why I picked this smiley; I thought it was funny.

(in reply to CelticPrince)

Post #: 20

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