quote:

What truth? What evidence is there that Crowley is a racist? The fact that He tried to prevent the death of a black athlete? yeah, sounds like racism to me.

quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl

and i cant believe you honestly think only blacks have had this experience! some of us can think for ourselves and grow to understand as we mature that not everything is racially motivated

quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl

No one said, least of all me, that racism isnt still a problem. Coming from the south, i thought southerns was some of the most racist people i would ever meet. I moved up north and found out how wrong my thinking was. I grew up in the military. I was not allowed to view people by color. I wasnt taught that way. My older brother used the "n" word once. He could not sit for a week.

But if i allowed racism to color my world every time i got pulled over, would i be able to determine if it was racism or my own actions that were causing the problems?

I am still waiting for someone to explain to me where race became an issue and how the actions of the Cop could be seen as rasict.

quote:

ORIGINAL: OrionTheWolf

The call can establish reasonable suspicion, but not probable cause. In the scenario you asked about, the officer sees firsthand, which then establishes probable cause. This is some extra reading of a Congressional Memo on the subject here .

quote:

ORIGINAL: kdsub

I hope you understand your comment does not make sense... the call WAS the reason for the visit...the call WAS for a burglary in progress...The officer DID see two men forcing the front door...But all our speculation is just that... At least until the police release the audiotapes...Yes there are tapes and when they come out we will know which is telling the truth.

It will be fun to see a racist Harvard Professor’s career blow up in his face…or see the racist Cambridge Police exposed.

Butch

quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl

His anger started before he even identified himself. It started when the Cop asked for identification, and didnt let up. Tell me, would YOU not expect a cop to ask you for identification if someone called and said your home was being broken into?

As far as Gates being well known... he isnt.. unless you travel in those circles.

quote:

A white police sergeant who arrested renowned black scholar Henry Louis Gates Jr. was the campus police officer who tried to save the life of former Boston Celtics player Reggie Lewis.
Sgt. James Crowley was a campus police officer at Brandeis University when Lewis, who was black, collapsed and died during an off-season workout in July 1993. Crowley administered CPR, trying to resuscitate the dying Lewis.

http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2009/07/23/national/main5182351.shtml

Yeah, people.. we got a HUGE time racist here!

Hardly. Its time to drop the racist angle from the Cop's end. Not all racists are white.

quote:

ORIGINAL: kdsub

Of course this is where we disagree...to me the probable cause is obvious...and would hold up in any reasonable court of law...

quote:


Now I am not talking about the arrest but the actions of the officer to determine if a crime was commented. I have already stated I thought the arrest, although allowed under the law, was not prudent and a result of anger at the officer’s treatment by Gates.

Butch

quote:

ORIGINAL: Gwynvyd

I am still amazed at how blind most people, esp. white Americans are to prejudice. No.. we do not have absolute deprivation any more. Blacks can hold jobs, go to school ect. However it is still prevalent in our society to hold back what we see as a subordinate race or group.

The call brought the officers to the residence. That much is true. As well it should have. Even if he were white.

Everything changed when the officer arrived. Yes the professor shouldnt have refused to show his ID. ~ years of racial profilling prob. effected how he felt about showing his id in his own home. The officer had the right to ask him out onto the porch. The resident had the right to refuse. He even had the right to refuse showing his ID. Once he showed his ID with the current address the officer should have turned around and left. No matter what was said. You can not arrest someone for being a jerk. They have to be doing something unlawful, or dangerous. He was doing neither. The officer also by state law had to give him his name and badge number. That is a law. I can understand how Mr. Gates would be pissed off, and wanting this information. Even though it is not a law in Florida when asked I had to give my full name and badge number when asked due to department rules. His being arrested was an asine mistake that had to legal basis. I would say as an ex LEO that it was because the officer was mad at being yelled at and possibly because Mr. Gates is black.

People outside of law enforcement can say what they like... but most will have no clue.

We just have to be honest with ourselves here folks.

Gwyn

quote:

ORIGINAL: OrionTheWolf

quote:

ORIGINAL: kdsub

Of course this is where we disagree...to me the probable cause is obvious...and would hold up in any reasonable court of law...

Actually do some research and you may find this incorrect. Findlaw has some good resources. This is also why when cops are called to a prowler/possible burglary, they do not enter unless they see forced entry.

quote:


Now I am not talking about the arrest but the actions of the officer to determine if a crime was commented. I have already stated I thought the arrest, although allowed under the law, was not prudent and a result of anger at the officer’s treatment by Gates.

Butch

Actually the investigation starts with reasonable suspicion, which the officer had. There is a distinct difference between resasonable suspicion and probable cause. There are several good sites that explain the differences, and how they effect police procedure.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Gwynvyd

I am still amazed at how blind most people, esp. white Americans are to prejudice. No.. we do not have absolute deprivation any more. Blacks can hold jobs, go to school ect. However it is still prevalent in our society to hold back what we see as a subordinate race or group.

The call brought the officers to the residence. That much is true. As well it should have. Even if he were white.

Everything changed when the officer arrived. Yes the professor shouldnt have refused to show his ID. ~ years of racial profilling prob. effected how he felt about showing his id in his own home. The officer had the right to ask him out onto the porch. The resident had the right to refuse. He even had the right to refuse showing his ID. Once he showed his ID with the current address the officer should have turned around and left. No matter what was said. You can not arrest someone for being a jerk. They have to be doing something unlawful, or dangerous. He was doing neither. The officer also by state law had to give him his name and badge number. That is a law. I can understand how Mr. Gates would be pissed off, and wanting this information. Even though it is not a law in Florida when asked I had to give my full name and badge number when asked due to department rules. His being arrested was an asine mistake that had to legal basis. I would say as an ex LEO that it was because the officer was mad at being yelled at and possibly because Mr. Gates is black.

People outside of law enforcement can say what they like... but most will have no clue.

We just have to be honest with ourselves here folks.

Gwyn

quote:

"MUNICIPAL CODE CAMBRIDGE, MASSACHUSSETTS Chapter 9.08.010 Disorderly conduct--Profanity and insulting language.

No person shall behave himself in a rude or disorderly manner, or use any indecent, profane or insulting language in any street or public place. No person shall make or cause to be made, any unnecessary noise or noises in any public street, private way or park, so as to cause any inconvenience or discomfort for the inhabitants of the City."