RE: Young submission and its consequences (Full Version)

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barelynangel -> RE: Young submission and its consequences (8/9/2009 10:09:21 AM)

grins ASS U ME Pirate -- see because You presumed wrong -- my judgement is based on my own experience being bloody and bleeding and my surprise was that this is a 16 year old kid she could probably HELP by calling the cops.  And yeah i WOULD see it as an issue if she was some 20 year old dating a 16 year old because to me THAT does indicate self-esteem problems.  This is the age they need to be taught right from wrong before its too late when they are 30.

Yes i am passing judgement on her not calling the police and but MORE SO BECAUSE SHE SEEMS TO BE making excuses for him.  However, when she said he was 16 and earlier she said her daughter was an adult -- calling the police could very well cause her daughter MORE issues than him. 

You are seriously sad if you think this is about US and Britan.  To me, this is about her daughter being bloody and bruised calling her at 3 AM due to being abused and a mother trying to make excuses and denial for not standing up to the punk when it MAY do some good being 16 and all.  Sometimes teenagers DO learn when someone takes a chance and calls the police.  IF you remotely read my earlier post you will see i told her i did understand about hoping about the army but if the ARMY doesn't know then they may not help him but instead his getting away with it may advocate future problems.

So get off your silly beef with the US Pirate i notice you bring this up a lot in discussions, which is usually why i ignore your posts.    Perhaps instead of being bias towards Americans you maybe see the CONCERN in the posts -- no not for the mother -- but for the daughter because yeah, it would be hell if she called the police and got arrested herself.  If there is NO DANGER OF THAT because they wouldn't arrest her --- then to me prinnsex should call the fucking police and have them come talk to her daughter -- AT THE VERY LEAST insist she get a restraining order.

So take your BS someplace else Pirate -- you don't impress me trying to put words in my mouth and judgments on me i am not making.

angel



JonnieBoy -> RE: Young submission and its consequences (8/9/2009 10:15:16 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Starbuck09

You also have a duty of responsibility to report this to the army anyway prinsexx


Not under this jurisdiction she doesn't (just translating)

Pirate



Starbuck09 -> RE: Young submission and its consequences (8/9/2009 10:17:26 AM)

I didn't realise that jonnie I thought the same law applied here as in America. In that case I retract that statement, though she should still inform the police/army of this as an exercise in personal moral judgement. At least in my opinion.



JonnieBoy -> RE: Young submission and its consequences (8/9/2009 10:17:49 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: sirsholly

quote:

It really makes me laugh how so many US citizens EXPECT foreigners to play by their rules all the time, now THAT ... ... is ignorant.
how are we expecting that, Jonnie?


"so many" does not mean "all" Holly [;)]

Pirate



JonnieBoy -> RE: Young submission and its consequences (8/9/2009 10:20:49 AM)

Hey ... you know me well enough ... 'tis cool.

(btw : the gun thing ... a soldier coming home with one that someone mentioned too ... that doesn't work the same either)

(always happy to help if I can, it can throw a new light on things sometimes)

Pirate



Kalista07 -> RE: Young submission and its consequences (8/9/2009 10:21:08 AM)

Prinsexx,
In an earlier post you said the following:
Most of the problems of submission and indeed slavery are resolved NOT by s types being in therapy but by being in relationships to domminants who do not abuse them, do not walk away when the going gets tough and most importantly i believe have compassion enough to be able to assess and see the world from their submissives point of view. 
i must tell you i take exception to that..because that it exactly what it took for me. i was seriously making some stupid, dangerous and deadly decisions for myself to try and get my 'submissive needs' met. Some of those needs included me putting myself in a situation in which i ended up being assaulted, beaten, raped, and a few other unspeakable things...At that point i had to take responsibility for myself..For putting myself in that position to be harmed. i had to take a look at myself and where my needs and rights and safety would all mesh.. The reality was i had to get some therapy so that i could become healthy..Otherwise i knew i would end up with a sick dom. By making the decision to get into therapy, get honest, get real..get healthy i made the decision to increase the possibility that i would increase the chance that i would find someone who would be healthy.  After all, the reality is you don't attract what you want..You attract what you are.
Kali

eta: pirate You have cmail



Prinsexx -> RE: Young submission and its consequences (8/9/2009 10:23:02 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: barelynangel

So take your BS someplace else Pirate -- you don't impress me trying to put words in my mouth and judgments on me i am not making.

angel

So much anger insdie of you...
and you see Jonnie does impress me because of the time he has spent actually talking to me by phone on this one.
But please carry on with the conflict if it makes you feel better.
It seems to be the way that so many people do things these days.



Starbuck09 -> RE: Young submission and its consequences (8/9/2009 10:25:33 AM)

Prinsexx there is no point in being flippant towards someone who has given you advice on a thread where you asked for it. If the advice is not to your liking then than the person for it and ignore it.



Prinsexx -> RE: Young submission and its consequences (8/9/2009 10:26:36 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Kalista07

.  After all, the reality is you don't attract what you want..You attract what you are.
Kali

Are you a mother?
If so this will be useful advice to hold onto when you children emerge into adulthood.



LadyPact -> RE: Young submission and its consequences (8/9/2009 10:27:12 AM)

I'm afraid the folks on this thread will have to forgive Me.  I just couldn't tolerate reading the entire thread.

This is not BDSM.  It is not Dominance, submission, Mastery, or slavery.  It's abuse.  There are few things that tick Me off more than anyone trying to interchange any of the above.

I don't know what things are like in the UK, but I know how they work here, and I know exactly what I would do.  I'd be keeping My daughter with Me, and I'd be taking pictures.  I'd let the boy enter the Army.  I'd let him think everything is fine and he got away with what he did to My kid.

As soon as he was in, I'd report him.  He'd be in the Army now and it would be a Federal Offense.  It may piss My daughter off to no end, but I'd see him in Leavenworth before it was over.

Better for her to hate Me and live, than to die at his hand.



sirsholly -> RE: Young submission and its consequences (8/9/2009 10:27:24 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: JonnieBoy

quote:

ORIGINAL: Starbuck09

You also have a duty of responsibility to report this to the army anyway prinsexx


Not under this jurisdiction she doesn't (just translating)

Pirate

now think about this. If an officer/recruiter/whatever were to get a call from a civilian, complaining that her daughters love interest was abusive prior to his enlistment...how much credence would said official give to the report?

There is no police report to back up the complaint. There are no hospital reports showing the daughter was injured. No photos of the injuries. There is simply a woman (who if she values her license is NOT reporting this young man as a therapist) that may sound like a parent is pissed off that this young man rejected her daughter for a career.



Prinsexx -> RE: Young submission and its consequences (8/9/2009 10:28:14 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Starbuck09

Prinsexx there is no point in being flippant towards someone who has given you advice on a thread where you asked for it. If the advice is not to your liking then than the person for it and ignore it.

Great advice I didn't ask for. Off topic also so I shall move on.



hlen5 -> RE: Young submission and its consequences (8/9/2009 10:32:05 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Prinsexx

 ........And the side of this that no one seems to want to address is that women abuse too........

..... he didn't deserve some slut of a prick tease following him around the streets last night.


I'm surprised I can see it so clearly from both sides. But I can.
[/quote]
 
 I'm pretty surprised, too.



Starbuck09 -> RE: Young submission and its consequences (8/9/2009 10:32:12 AM)

You are doing it again prinsexx and I have to say that you yourself appear to have lot of surface anger. I have given you all the advice I can think of on the previous page. If you would like we can discuss that.



barelynangel -> RE: Young submission and its consequences (8/9/2009 10:33:25 AM)

Prinnsex you are absolutely correct -- i am ANGRY at you and on behalf of for your daughter  -- i have been where your daughter is and i had friends who chalked it up to i was his slave and allowrd me to make excuses to myself when the slavery was actually over and i continued to try and stay his slave.  I chalked it up to i was his slave.  I tried to remain his slave when the mastery was removed and the abuse began.  I also know if it wasn't for his best friend taking the decision out of BOTH our hands -- he removed me from my former Master finally -- i would be dead.  because that is where my own made up thoughts of what submission was and slavery meant brought me -- i was willing to let him kill me if that made him happy.   I saw it as a thought process instead of INSTINCTS to listen too -- in otherwords i ignore my get out now instinct in lieu of saying -- i am a slave thoughts.  Ironically, i worked for the prosecuting state's attorney's office and after 5 years of happiness in being his slave -- i refused and made excuses for him when the abuse started and he lost control of himself.  If i hadn't and instead saw it for what it was instead of attempting to justify it within slavery and my submission to him -- things may not have progressed as they did.  Someone intervened on my behalf Prinnsex because i was incapable of making that decision. 

So yeah, i get angry when i see others make excuses instead of helping.  If you see that as WRONG, so be it.  I am angry with you and disgusted with Jonnie as it seems he advocates your enabling.  The fact that you see my anger as something wrong is very telling.  As i said before - - LOOK at your daughter.

angel



Apocalypso -> RE: Young submission and its consequences (8/9/2009 10:34:16 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: JonnieBoy
Not under this jurisdiction she doesn't (just translating)

Pirate

What's that view based on?  I know from experience that's not the law as regarding groups like Childline.  This is obviously slightly different however, so you may well have more specialist knowledge.

(I am pretty sure that not reporting it could, at the least, be seen as a failure in 'duty of care' by Social Services).




JonnieBoy -> RE: Young submission and its consequences (8/9/2009 10:35:28 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: barelynangel
SHE SEEMS TO BE making excuses for him.

Which is "arguably" ... part of the cycle of relationship abuse ... I see no "concern" in dealing with THAT by being quite so judgmental. [;)]

quote:

ORIGINAL: barelynangel
So get off your silly beef with the US Pirate

BS ... ? ... you just belong to a different school of thought ... IMO: nothing, nowhere and nobody is perfect ... (not even me [;)] [sm=evil.gif])

quote:

ORIGINAL: barelynangel
So take your BS someplace else Pirate -- you don't impress me trying to put words in my mouth and judgments on me i am not making.

angel


Hate to disappoint ... but I'm really not trying to impress you, fuck me ... over inflated sense of self-importance or what !

Pirate



Prinsexx -> RE: Young submission and its consequences (8/9/2009 10:35:37 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: sirsholly

quote:

ORIGINAL: JonnieBoy

quote:

ORIGINAL: Starbuck09

You also have a duty of responsibility to report this to the army anyway prinsexx


Not under this jurisdiction she doesn't (just translating)

Pirate

now think about this. If an officer/recruiter/whatever were to get a call from a civilian, complaining that her daughters love interest was abusive prior to his enlistment...how much credence would said official give to the report?

There is no police report to back up the complaint. There are no hospital reports showing the daughter was injured. There is simply a woman (who if she values her license is NOT reporting this young man as a therapist) that may sound like a parent is pissed off that this young man rejected her daughter for a career.


At last some sense.
Also: the streets are littered with stuff like this going on on a Saturday night. The E R rooms are packed full of young girls and drunken louts.
There were no witnesses.
I will lose her trust...at least she phoned me and I got her home.
If i intervene in their relationship believe me she will take his side and not mine.
If I report him to the Police nothing will happen except a warning.
I do not want to press charges even if i did it would ruin the sheer effort this younfg man has put into turning his life around. And believe me it is a remarkable turn around. He will learn to pick on men of his own size in the Army rather than young women. It will be the finest lesson he will ever learn.
There is a very very fine line between this happening as an act of bodily harm and this happening as an expression of sheer grief between them that he is going away. Too young to vote but old enough to have consensual sex and die for his country.
The difference between how it is being viewed here is layered, layer upon layer of morality and conformist values about teenage behaviour/the obligatory nature of therapy and indeed submissiveness. In my opinion.
 



sirsholly -> RE: Young submission and its consequences (8/9/2009 10:37:50 AM)

quote:

(I am pretty sure that not reporting it could, at the least, be seen as a failure in 'duty of care' by Social Services).

parents can be charged with failure to protect their children. It is hard to prove normally, but freakin' impossible without some sort of documentation.



Kalista07 -> RE: Young submission and its consequences (8/9/2009 10:38:22 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Prinsexx

quote:

ORIGINAL: Kalista07

.  After all, the reality is you don't attract what you want..You attract what you are.
Kali


Are you a mother?
If so this will be useful advice to hold onto when you children emerge into adulthood.


Jonnie,
Just in case You weren't aware...THIS is why You are having to spend most of today defending prinsexx. Because when people try and be helpful and relate their experience, strength, and hope...what do they get? They get spit in the face...

Prinsexx... i do not think i have treated you in the manner in this thread in which you have just treated me. i do not think i deserved it nor do i think it was warranted. No, for the record i do not have children. No, for the record i am not medically capable of having children. But, by fucking god i will tell you this. IF i did have children i for damn sure would not treat them like you are. Incidentally, it is interesting that i actually was attemtping to help... And did only relate my experience in this matter...and yet i was still attacked..Speak of projection much??!!
Kali



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