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RE: The source of WIITWD? - 8/13/2009 1:31:41 PM

Acer49

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quote:

ORIGINAL: stella41b

This has been partly inspired by two threads 'If the tables were turned' by allthatjaz here and CallaFirestormBW's 'Humanity? Responsibility?' thread over in Politics and Religion.

Now let's assume that everything is reduced to zero - that there is no equipment, no 'fetish' clothing, no floggers, no whips, no ropes, no restraints, no St Andrews Crosses, nothing, nada, just you the person in fact just human beings.

What effect would that have on your relationships? Would you still be able to remain a part of WIITWD and include it as a part of your lifestyle? Would you be able to still maintain a successful relationship involving a dynamic or WIITWD?

Take away the trappings and the sex, some will stay, but many would leave

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(in reply to stella41b)

Post #: 21

RE: The source of WIITWD? - 8/13/2009 1:32:46 PM

LaTigresse

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The fun toys, gizmos, etc......don't really matter much to me. It's all about the power exchange.

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(in reply to stella41b)

Post #: 22

RE: The source of WIITWD? - 8/13/2009 4:31:26 PM

DemonKia

Posts: 5521
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From: Chico, Nor-Cali
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FR, after read thru

*pouty face, whiny tone*

I like my toys. *stomps foot* I'm not giving them up.

Okay, I was kinky long before I had a trousseau of toys, but I was also making 'pervertibles' out of everyday objects long before I was participating in the out-&-kinky world . . .. . . &, anymore, as a top I have a certain desire that bottoms have their own kit of toys they like, that as part of exploring / figuring out their own stuff they acquire toys to meet their needs . . . . . .

Also, I'm sufficiently self-aware as a fetishist (& / or egoistic enough) to notice there's a significant amount of fetishizing out in the vanilla world, in the anthropological sense of the term if not the psych sense . . . . . Individual autos, for instance, are quite fetishized, notably so here in the US . . . . .. & it's not just objects that can be fetishized, obviously or not so -- other much fetishized entities / abstractions are 'religion' & 'employment / work / business' . . . . . Some people seem to have fetishized aspects of relationship, such as the initial crush / rush / falling-in-love part, & plenty have fetishized particular sexual activities such as masturbation, oral or anal sex, etc ..... 'Fetish' is a construct of the human mind, not some intrinsic quality of any given object or abstraction . . . . . .

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Post #: 23

RE: The source of WIITWD? - 8/13/2009 4:50:10 PM

pyroaquatic

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Of course.

If WIITWD is rice, the toys are spice.

However.

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As your desire is, so is your will.
As your will is, so is your deed.
As your deed is, so is your destiny.
-Brihadaranyaka Upanishad IV.4.5

(in reply to DemonKia)

Post #: 24

RE: The source of WIITWD? - 8/13/2009 5:29:24 PM

leadership527

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It's interesting to me how different people took the question and what it meant to them. I'm seeing at least two major themes here... I think... It's kind of like looking through a muddy window though.

_____________________________

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I didn't so much "enslave" Carol as I did "enlove" her. - Me
I want a joyous, loving, respectful relationship where the male is in charge and deserves to be. - DavanKael

(in reply to pyroaquatic)

Post #: 25

RE: The source of WIITWD? - 8/13/2009 5:38:22 PM

Prinsexx

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quote:

ORIGINAL: leadership527

It's interesting to me how different people took the question and what it meant to them. I'm seeing at least two major themes here... I think... It's kind of like looking through a muddy window though.

I agree. It's because (sorry Stella if I am second guessing you) it's as if what Stella asks doesn't quite folloe the headliner.
My view is; ofcourse if all the toys were taken away the dynamucs would remain. (A whole lot of fetish development, electro development and fahionista trends would have gone to waste so to speak) but again what is the source of WIITWD.
So going to change it to WIITID (since I cannot speak for anyone else) and therefore am also assuning that I take out everyone else as well as all the toys...hold on stay with me.
The source of MY bdsm, M/s, D/s and so forth has to be my libido...(in the sense of life energy which is inclusive of sexual energy).
And my libido is kinked...skewed...well bent...it takes a kinked route from its source to my behaviour.

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Post #: 26

RE: The source of WIITWD? - 8/13/2009 5:55:54 PM

leadership527

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Prinsexx
The source of MY bdsm, M/s, D/s and so forth has to be my libido

Wow.. Thank you. That was the thing I was sniffing around at stated clearly. That kind of made me wonder could I state the source of my M/s so clearly. The answer was "no", but it has to do with the joy of arranging a team of people into a harmonious, smoothly functioning unit.

_____________________________

~Jeff

I didn't so much "enslave" Carol as I did "enlove" her. - Me
I want a joyous, loving, respectful relationship where the male is in charge and deserves to be. - DavanKael

(in reply to Prinsexx)

Post #: 27

RE: The source of WIITWD? - 8/13/2009 6:09:13 PM

littlewonder

Posts: 15659
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Well if that's what we're getting at...where did mine come from? What source? That's easy for me.

It's back to my traditional roots of how I grew up..men were men, women were women...men were head of the household, men took the control, were the leaders, they were the power. They were the ones who toiled in the coal mines and fields. They were the ones who brought home the bacon.

It's where I'm comfortable. It feels safe and secure to me because it's what I saw and how I grew up.

When I heard people calling it bdsm it never seemed all that different to me except now some people decided they needed a name for it other than a traditional household.

(in reply to leadership527)

Post #: 28

RE: The source of WIITWD? - 8/13/2009 6:11:37 PM

kallisto

Posts: 1185
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: stella41b

This has been partly inspired by two threads 'If the tables were turned' by allthatjaz here and CallaFirestormBW's 'Humanity? Responsibility?' thread over in Politics and Religion.

Now let's assume that everything is reduced to zero - that there is no equipment, no 'fetish' clothing, no floggers, no whips, no ropes, no restraints, no St Andrews Crosses, nothing, nada, just you the person in fact just human beings.

What effect would that have on your relationships? Would you still be able to remain a part of WIITWD and include it as a part of your lifestyle? Would you be able to still maintain a successful relationship involving a dynamic or WIITWD?

Just me, the human being and him, the human being are what make the relationship. The equipment, toys, clothes, and any other material thing that we incorporate into our relationship is all extra. The 2 of us, the D/s dynamic, bond, the power exchange is WIITWD. So maintaining the relationship without all the "fluff" is the crux of "us" anyway.

(in reply to stella41b)

Post #: 29

RE: The source of WIITWD? - 8/13/2009 6:38:42 PM

DomImus

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Joined: 3/17/2009
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I enjoy the props immensely (she doesn't enjoy most of them) and would miss them greatly. It would be a big adjustment.

(in reply to stella41b)

Post #: 30

RE: The source of WIITWD? - 8/13/2009 9:17:11 PM

catize

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Well, sure!
But could he hurt me a little? Sometimes? If he wanted to?

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(in reply to stella41b)

Post #: 31

RE: The source of WIITWD? - 8/13/2009 11:03:22 PM

stella41b

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From: SW London (UK)
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I'd like to thank everybody for their responses...

But also here draw a little attention to what LadyPact pointed out, that perhaps without some of these trappings some of us may not have met each other. But then again I would have to ask you here LadyPact that had you and clip had been aware and in the same place, would you still have got to know each other?

I was actually going to go further and develop this, and ask further that assuming (God forbid this ever happens to anyone) that adversity strikes and say, you lose your job, home, income, how would that affect your relationships and your involvement in WIITWD?

I'm fairly sure that you will all in some way say that it wouldn't change much.. (I may be wrong) but this brings me to asking a further question, in that is the actual source of WIITWD what lies in us as a person (for example as Prinsexx points out, our libido) or does it come more from our awareness of what lies inside us and what lies inside each other?

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(in reply to Acer49)

Post #: 32

RE: The source of WIITWD? - 8/13/2009 11:51:02 PM

Whenready

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Joined: 3/5/2009
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My first answer was facetious - the world would end, kittens would die, toys thrown angrily from the pram yadda yadda... the secomd answer.. I did lose my job & income. It meant less frequent travel, but otherwise no change. I'm still dominant. The subs I talk to havent emasculated me for being "lesser" (kind souls that they are - thank you!)

Losing home would be restrictive - phone / internet access etc - but again I would still be dominant. It is who I am.

(in reply to stella41b)

Post #: 33

RE: The source of WIITWD? - 8/14/2009 12:19:53 AM

cornflakegirl

Posts: 183
Joined: 7/1/2009
From: Arizona
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For me, the Dominants I have played with so far have been people I met in a vanilla context and enjoyed on a vanilla relationship level before digging into the BDSM side of things. However, I am meeting people here and you have a good point. If we didn't have the *stuff* would we have a site like this? Would we have munches and kink groups? Maybe not. But I think that even though it would be harder to meet other people interested in WIIWD, we would still feel that drive ourselves.

I will admit that having gone through some pretty rough patches, it can go either way. Very high stress situations either kill my sex drive or make me ache for some pain. The practical stuff intrudes though, and makes it harder to get time and space and energy to fool around.

As to your last question, I think what we want comes from all different places. Whether it's childhood experiences or the wiring in our brains we were born with or the first porn we saw, whatever, it is what it is. I sometimes feel like explorations into where kink comes from is an effort to then "fix" it. I don't care where it comes from, I guess, because I like it, I like who I am, and whever it comes from is not really part of the picture of who I am today.

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Away from the computer more often than not.

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Post #: 34

RE: The source of WIITWD? - 8/14/2009 8:23:59 AM

Andalusite

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Joined: 1/25/2009
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I like toys, and my Master and I use several of them. If we couldn't get more, that wouldn't be a big deal, if we needed to give up the ones we have, we could use our hands and pervertables. Imagination and what you do with it is more important than the specific implement.

(in reply to cornflakegirl)

Post #: 35

RE: The source of WIITWD? - 8/14/2009 10:00:29 AM

LaTigresse

Posts: 26123
Joined: 1/15/2006
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quote:

ORIGINAL: stella41b

I'd like to thank everybody for their responses...

But also here draw a little attention to what LadyPact pointed out, that perhaps without some of these trappings some of us may not have met each other. But then again I would have to ask you here LadyPact that had you and clip had been aware and in the same place, would you still have got to know each other?

I was actually going to go further and develop this, and ask further that assuming (God forbid this ever happens to anyone) that adversity strikes and say, you lose your job, home, income, how would that affect your relationships and your involvement in WIITWD?

I'm fairly sure that you will all in some way say that it wouldn't change much.. (I may be wrong) but this brings me to asking a further question, in that is the actual source of WIITWD what lies in us as a person (for example as Prinsexx points out, our libido) or does it come more from our awareness of what lies inside us and what lies inside each other?

Way back when I was a quiet, stubborn little girl that would rather be by herself than go with the flow, doing what others thought she ought to. I was raised in a fairly conservative and religious home. Taught that a girl grows up, marries and submits to her man. She honours and obeys him. Well I tried that shit and just couldn't do it. It just wasn't in me. I rebelled constantly!

So, many decades and crazy times later I have discovered that through, two marriages, two female lovers, acknowledging my preferred sexuality, been wealthy, been dirt poor, raised kids, and lots of other stuff that would fill a fat novel. I am am STILL, at my core, that quiet and stubborn little girl that would rather be alone than compromise the core of who she is.

I don't need a submissive or slave to be me. Who I am, while ever learning and evolving, still stays ME. And anyone that wants to have a successful relationship with me, had better understand that about me. I don't make a big fuss, no foot stomping or temper tantrum, but if you even begin to TRY to start ordering me around, playing the "I am the boss!" game and you will find yourself talking to a wall. A wall that will be looking back at you with eyebrows raised and, if you haven't pissed her off, an amused look on her face. (If she is pissed, there will be no amusement to go with the raised eyebrows.)

All the other stuff, well that is the gravy, the dessert. I don't HAVE to beat on someone to have a happy life or even a successful relationship. As long as I am the person with a minimum of 51% of the control. The control is my dark chocolate.

(gotta have it)

Those that know me best have often mentioned, I am always going to be a bossy, mean woman. It's one of my more endearing qualities. And most of them are vanilla.

_____________________________

My twisted, self deprecating, sense of humour, finds alot to laugh about, in your lack of one!

Just because you are well educated, articulate, and can use big, fancy words, properly........does not mean you are right!

(in reply to stella41b)

Post #: 36

RE: The source of WIITWD? - 8/14/2009 11:28:27 AM

LadyPact

Posts: 32566
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: stella41b

I'd like to thank everybody for their responses...

But also here draw a little attention to what LadyPact pointed out, that perhaps without some of these trappings some of us may not have met each other. But then again I would have to ask you here LadyPact that had you and clip had been aware and in the same place, would you still have got to know each other?

I was actually going to go further and develop this, and ask further that assuming (God forbid this ever happens to anyone) that adversity strikes and say, you lose your job, home, income, how would that affect your relationships and your involvement in WIITWD?

I'm fairly sure that you will all in some way say that it wouldn't change much.. (I may be wrong) but this brings me to asking a further question, in that is the actual source of WIITWD what lies in us as a person (for example as Prinsexx points out, our libido) or does it come more from our awareness of what lies inside us and what lies inside each other?

I would have to lean towards saying yes, Stella. As clip is also a very service minded sub, it's completely possible that we could have met under that context as well. While clip and I are a wonderful match in regards to S/m, there are other elements that are also a part of our dynamic. If there weren't, I'd have kept him just as a bottom when I wanted to top, and there would be no D/s structure.

In our case in particular, we have gone through at least some of the aspects you've mentioned. The deployments really do suck at times. Incomes have varied. I just recently relocated across the country and that is having an effect, at least on Me, as I'm working on finding a lifestyle community somewhere here in the area. Of course, these things have had less of an effect due to the fact that it is already an established dynamic or if there were less commitment from all of those involved.

_____________________________

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(in reply to stella41b)

Post #: 37

RE: The source of WIITWD? - 8/14/2009 11:55:39 AM

DesFIP

Posts: 25191
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From: Apple County NY
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Most of our life is boringly vanilla as is. Do we go to the grocery store before or after the hardware store across the street? He always goes to the hardware store first. Me? I figure if the food sits for an extra three minutes, who cares. But we go to the hardware store first because that's the way he likes it.

I'd still not be buying Edy's Summer Edition Peach Pie Ice Cream because he believes ice cream must have some chocolate. I can decide between fudge ripple or mint chocolate chip, but it always has chocolate.

However I would object to never getting the ropes back.

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Post #: 38

RE: The source of WIITWD? - 8/14/2009 12:36:05 PM

petmonkey

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Joined: 7/7/2009
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quote:

I was actually going to go further and develop this, and ask further that assuming (God forbid this ever happens to anyone) that adversity strikes and say, you lose your job, home, income, how would that affect your relationships and your involvement in WIITWD?

ORIGINAL: stella41b

This did happen to Us, more or less. Additionally, when things were looking up, We lost some possessions during a break-in, some of them WIITWD related (Oh, irreplaceable symbolic jewelry and underpants collection, how i miss you!).
i don't think these events made Sir lose any part of His core personality nor me any part of mine. It did affect how our personalities and positions in the relationship were expressed to each other, but Our dynamic didn't include a contract with absolutes --it was right and expected that it should adapt to new situations and continue. The relationship had to stretch and grow because of the extremely heightened level of adversity We were encountering for the first time as a couple. We're still working out the kinks (pun so intended here, it hurts. Wait . . . no, no, that was all i had in me). To be ridiculously Polly Anna about it, experiencing this cosmic jest was a plus for Us, ultimately. We needed a big, bad-ass storm to see if We can weather one together.

spelling!

< Message edited by petmonkey -- 8/14/2009 12:47:21 PM >

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Post #: 39

RE: The source of WIITWD? - 8/14/2009 2:37:09 PM

littlewonder

Posts: 15659
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quote:

adversity strikes and say, you lose your job, home, income, how would that affect your relationships and your involvement in WIITWD?

We've both had areas and we will have areas in our lives that will affect us as described above but it hasn't affected our dynamic. It's only affected that it's made it harder for us to see each other more often and for longer periods of time.

Imo it's made us both stronger and better people and brought us even closer together because we're both here for each other through thick and thin and we both know that shit happens and you just learn to deal with it the best you can.

(in reply to petmonkey)

Post #: 40

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