RE: For those that voted for our latest President.. (Full Version)

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Brain -> RE: For those that voted for our latest President.. (8/16/2009 10:29:55 AM)

FUCK HIM HE SOLD OUT! RALPH NADER WAS RIGHT

White House appears ready to drop 'public option'
By PHILIP ELLIOTT, Associated Press Writer
49 mins ago

WASHINGTON – President Barack Obama's administration signaled on Sunday it is ready to abandon the idea of giving Americans the option of government-run health insurance as part of his ambitious health care proposal.

Facing mounting opposition to the overhaul, administration officials left open the chance for a compromise with Republicans that would include health insurance cooperatives. Such a concession is likely to enrage his liberal supporters but could deliver Obama a much-needed win on a top domestic priority opposed by GOP lawmakers.

Officials from both political parties reached across the aisle in an effort to find compromises on proposals they left behind when they returned to their districts for an August recess.

Obama has been pressing for the government to run a health insurance organization to help cover the nation's almost 50 million uninsured, but Republicans remain steadfast in arguing against it.

Health and Human Services Secretary Kathleen Sebelius said that government alternative to private health insurance is "not the essential element" of the administration's health care overhaul. The White House would be open to co-ops, she said, a sign that Democrats want a compromise so they can declare a victory on the showdown.

"I think there will be a competitor to private insurers," Sebelius said. "That's really the essential part, is you don't turn over the whole new marketplace to private insurance companies and trust them to do the right thing."

Obama's top spokesman refused to say a public option was a make-or-break choice for the administration.

"What I am saying is the bottom line for this for the president is, what we have to have is choice and competition in the insurance market," White House press secretary Robert Gibbs said.

Sen. Kent Conrad, D-N.D., chairman of the Senate's budget committee, pushed the co-op model as an alternative.

"It's not government-run and government-controlled," he said. "It's membership-run and membership-controlled. But it does provide a nonprofit competitor for the for-profit insurance companies, and that's why it has appeal on both sides."

As proposed by Conrad, the co-ops would receive federal startup money, but then would operate independently of the government. They would have to maintain the same financial reserves that private companies are required to keep to handle unexpectedly high claims.

Sen. Richard Shelby, R-Ala., said Obama's team is making a political calculation and embracing the co-op alternative as "a step away from the government takeover of the health care system" that the GOP has pummeled.

"I don't know if it will do everything people want, but we ought to look at it. I think it's a far cry from the original proposals," he said.

Republicans say a public option would have unfair advantages that would drive private insurers out of business. Critics say co-ops would not be genuine public options for health insurance.

Rep. Eddie Bernice Johnson, D-Texas, said it would be difficult to pass any legislation through the Democratic-controlled Congress without the promised public plan.

"We'll have the same number of people uninsured," she said. "If the insurance companies wanted to insure these people now, they'd be insured."

Rep. Tom Price, R-Ga., said the Democrats' option would force individuals from their private plans to a government-run plan, a claim that the nonpartisan Congressional Budget Office supports.

"There is a way to get folks insured without having the government option," he said.

Obama, writing an opinion piece in Sunday's New York Times, said political maneuvers should be excluded from the debate.

"In the coming weeks, the cynics and the naysayers will continue to exploit fear and concerns for political gain," he wrote. "But for all the scare tactics out there, what's truly scary — truly risky — is the prospect of doing nothing."

Congress' proposals, however, seemed likely to strike end-of-life counseling sessions. Former Alaska Gov. Sarah Palin has called the session "death panels," a label that has drawn rebuke from her fellow Republicans as well as Democrats.

Sen. Orrin Hatch, R-Utah, declined to criticize Palin's comments and said Obama wants to create a government-run panel to advise what types of care would be available to citizens.

"In all honesty, I don't want a bunch of nameless, faceless bureaucrats setting health care for my aged citizens in Utah," Hatch said.

Sebelius said the end-of-life proposal was likely to be dropped from the final bill.

"We wanted to make sure doctors were reimbursed for that very important consultation if family members chose to make it, and instead it's been turned into this scare tactic and probably will be off the table," she said.

Sebelius spoke on CNN's "State of the Union" and ABC's "This Week." Gibbs appeared on CBS' "Face the Nation." Conrad and Shelby appeared on "Fox News Sunday." Johnson and Price spoke with "State of the Union." Hatch was interviewed on "This Week."


http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/us_health_care_overhaul;_ylt=AiCBd4UwAcFkt7TBClMO6cus0NUE;_ylu=X3oDMTM1Z3NnaTR0BGFzc2V0A2FwLzIwMDkwODE2L3VzX2hlYWx0aF9jYXJlX292ZXJoYXVsBGNwb3MDMQRwb3MDMwRwdANob21lX2Nva2UEc2VjA3luX3RvcF9zdG9yeQRzbGsDZnVsbG5ic3BzdG9y




CallaFirestormBW -> RE: For those that voted for our latest President.. (8/16/2009 10:45:50 AM)

Yeah, you're right -- if you have to bend over and take it up the ass this badly just to get something CLEARLY NECESSARY through the breach, then you might as well roll over and call yourself f*cking useless.

Thank you SOOO much all of you right-wingers who have now -assured- that people who are holding on by their fingernails have your hob-nailed boots kicking us free.

A completely disgusted DC





MarsBonfire -> RE: For those that voted for our latest President.. (8/16/2009 11:03:21 AM)

Yes, thanks to the Death Eaters' "flash mobs" at the town hall meetings, they've utterly disrupted the debate over healthcare reform. So it's come down to mob rule: whomever can stir up the biggest, loudest bunch of yahoos... wins.

Just another example of why I will NEVER support a republican. They have become counter to the American democratic ideal.

If only they had propsed a REAL alternative. If only they had debated the differences between the Dem and the hypothetical GOP plans in the public square. (Like they are supposed to!) Then at least I'd have some sort or respect for them. But they didn't. Instead, they opted for the pitchfork and torches mentality. How is anyone supposed to respect and support this kind of crap?

"A riot is an ugly thing... And I think it's about time that we had one!" -the GOP




housesub4you -> RE: For those that voted for our latest President.. (8/16/2009 11:05:19 AM)

Yea, I no longer support O'bama, he just showed me what an ineffective leader he is, 60 votes and nothing




UncleNasty -> RE: For those that voted for our latest President.. (8/16/2009 11:09:14 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Mercnbeth

Didn't vote for him, but the pragmatic results speak for themselves:
  • Ongoing occupation of Iraq
  • Escalation in Afghanistan
  • Unemployment up
  • Another $787 Billion going to corporate failures
  • Home foreclosures continuing and increasing in some areas
  • Prices of houses, and with it personal equity down
  • Polarizing politics
  • GITMO still open for business
  • More Financial Institution Failure MORE FAILURE
  • City Finances on the critic list. CHICAGO CLOSED


From a position of having a filibuster proof Congress he's a bigger failure, thus far, than AIG, GM, and the other executives whose bonuses his policies facilitated. The good news, is it's exposed the 'Obamites' for what they are, blind followers of a Party who rationalize that its somehow better than any alternative. Reduces now to only using name calling in attempting to distract, because there is no power held by the opposition. If only they would appreciate that as long as whoever is President is serving he same paymasters, special interests and PACs, maybe there could be some of that "CHANGE!" they thought they voter for this time. Obama is no more, and no less, a lackey than any who have been in that office since 1988.


I am not of any particular political affiliation. I don't see many, if any on the national level, that are advocating for we the people. In short I don't trust any of them. 

Yes GITMO is still open, and further there are worse facilities in Afghanistan that barely register a blip in the mainstream media. No talk of closing them that I've heard.

Foreclosure rates continue, and we're looking for a couple of new waves to start hitting. That element is far from over (and that is the element that has been credited as being the cause of the financial troubles). Also the loan mod programs he has put in place are a dismal failure, and will continue to be so. He seems to have no real understanding of how the "crisis" developed and without that knowledge will be ineffectual at solving it. I also wonder about his interest in solving it at all. Among his first appointments was Geitner of Sec. of Treasury. I pretty much lost all hope when he took that step as Geitner was among the folks that had power and control as the crisis developed.

This year, according to a source I saw just yesterday, we've had 77 bank failures. Still more to come. And it looks as though we'll have many more next year, as well as having foreclosures continue at close to record numbers. These numbers are not as bad as during the S&L crisis of the 80's but they are still very significant. How significant will only become known over time.

Real unemployment is about 19%. Likely it will continue to climb as some of these "other shoes" fall. If we're not already in a self perpetuating downward spiral we're very close to that.

Had McCain been elected I'd be saying many of these same things. As I said I have no party affiliation. I also fail to see much difference between our two major parties.

Uncle Nasty






CallaFirestormBW -> RE: For those that voted for our latest President.. (8/16/2009 11:19:00 AM)

quote:

Had McCain been elected I'd be saying many of these same things. As I said I have no party affiliation. I also fail to see much difference between our two major parties.


There -is- no difference. I "wrote in" for the last 5 elections, and the only thing I've seen, thus far, are a bunch of rich, self-righteous, greedy jack-offs who are spending all of their time providing direct anal stimulation to their counterparts across the aisle, practicing for the next dry ass-fuck they're planning on giving their constituents... because they wouldn't want anyone to get the idea that they are -entitled- to lube, right?

I was willing to give the benefit of the doubt, but really -- somebody somewhere HAS to stand up and say "Wait a minute, you f*ckers -- just this once you're going to use lube and LIKE it!"
I was hopeful... and still hopeful... and now... fuck it...

DC




MarsBonfire -> RE: For those that voted for our latest President.. (8/16/2009 11:31:27 AM)

Spinner, in case I haven't said it before... on the distinction between republicans and the definitions of evil, and shit suckers.... I stand corrected. You are right. Such definitions are probably redundant. (Sorry I misunderstood your previous statement.)




xBullx -> RE: For those that voted for our latest President.. (8/16/2009 11:45:12 AM)

I’ll add this to what Panda said…Who is he? He was an illusion during the primaries, then during the general and nothing has changed. He appears to be yet another of our prototypical American politicians. It’s all about power, subjugation and managing us incompetent types (so far as the elitists see us). So to highlight my feelings at this juncture with regards to this line of thinking, I’m damn suspicious of him.

Now to add to what Merc stated: I see no clear cut plans, just a bunch of rhetorical conjecture tossed into print on paper that has no clear direction, that apparently no one is reading and can be easily manipulated by the next cretin that comes along with a corrupt and controlling agenda. The Health Care agenda is not only disorganized and confusing; it has no ability to do anything beyond make a bigger mess.

What would be so hard about challenging, as a nation several consulting organizations that actually understand these problems to design a system of health care and finance that actually solves what ails us as a nation? We could offer a large cash award going to the winning concept. No bullshit agendas, just a system designed to better the nation’s healthcare system, along with the financing of the whole damn thing.

As far as I can see he’s (Obama) just a politician trying to advance the coffers of his financiers, friends and future retirement funds. That makes him 4 more years of the same, although coming down a different alley.

Note fromn the lighter side: It’s fun to watch the positional switch made by the left and the right supports. Under Obama the leftist are doing the same exact thing the rightist did under Bush. Making excuses and defending the indefensible. Screaming about the unjust attacks made against their noble champion. Blah, blah, fucking blah.

The only thing that any of these last four Presidents have been able to inspire in me is to harden my stance as an Independent American Constitutionalist. Come join Bull's IAC coalition.

I am damn proud of these MOB Americans that are annoying the shit out of the Mars, Spinner, Sanity and servant types that occupy space so far right or left against the opposition that they fail to consider anything beyond their own dogmatic existence.

In short to quote UncleNasty, “I don’t trust any of them”.

And to Obama, I’m not impressed..............at least yet, though you do have a few years left.




OrionTheWolf -> RE: For those that voted for our latest President.. (8/16/2009 2:54:15 PM)

I would be more impressed if he would:

say "No more money."
Address the issue of health costs, from the perspective of how things are handled because of insurance and Medicare.
Address the issue of the economy by pushing for incentives for more companies to create and keep jobs in the US.
Address the continued problem of foreclosures on homes.




housesub4you -> RE: For those that voted for our latest President.. (8/16/2009 3:19:50 PM)

I would be more impressed if his DAM party supported him on this.  It really makes him look like a very poor leader.  An issue very close to him, the Dems have 60 and yet can't pass the bill he wants. 

I feel like a rat leaving a sinking ship on this issue, but it was the main reason I supported him.  I think they should have brought the bill to the floor with the public option and then let the vote tell the public who is really for and aganist it.  But to take it off the table really pisses me off.






servantforuse -> RE: For those that voted for our latest President.. (8/16/2009 6:52:26 PM)

Do you think the Gitmo detainies will like it more in Cuba or in Michigan where the tempertures get well below 0 ?? How will they be able to play vollyball in the snow ?




Arpig -> RE: For those that voted for our latest President.. (8/16/2009 7:19:05 PM)

quote:

Afghanistan is a problem, we need more support from NATO allies
Some NATO allies are doing more than their fair share of the dying.




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