Creationism in zoo (Full Version)

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Esinn -> Creationism in zoo (8/15/2009 10:03:24 PM)

This is old news already - I am sure you heard:

http://www.newson6.com/Global/story.asp?S=10888260
(there is quite a bit about this on the net already.  Learn more about the 'hindu display')
This woman is running for Mayor.  Her main objective is to get a creationist(pro-religious) display up and running in the zoo which was struck down last year.  She is not concerned with crime, health care, poverty, rights for other religions or education.  She really has little experience in running a town.  However, when has that been important.  What is important is displaying creationist or intelligent design material ever where evidence based science exists.  The age old saying, "A lie repeated - to the general public becomes true."

quote:

Republican mayoral candidate Anna Falling said Tuesday that putting a Christian creationism display in the Tulsa Zoo is No. 1 in importance among city issues that also include violent crime, budget woes and bumpy streets.


What is spooky are hundreds are actually supporting her.  You caught that, right?  The #1 issue is to honor her personal god.

Posted: Aug 11, 2009 10:19 PM EDT Updated: Aug 13, 2009 12:32 PM EDT


By Ashli Sims, The News On 6

TULSA, OK -- A mayoral candidate has resurrected a controversy over Creationism at the Tulsa Zoo.

A push to exhibit the Christian story of creation at the Tulsa Zoo failed four years ago.  Republican candidate for Tulsa mayor, Anna Falling, is bringing the issue front and center.

It's the same exhibit and the same arguments, but now it is given from the bully pulpit of a candidate running for mayor.

"Some may ask why this issue during a Mayoral campaign?  And I say why not?" said candidate Anna Falling.

For Anna Falling, the road to city hall runs through the Tulsa Zoo.  She's made her Christianity central to her platform and now the exhibit depicting the Christian story of Creationism is her first campaign promise.

"Today we are announcing that God will be glorified in this city.  He shall not be shunned. Upon our election, we hereby commit to honoring Him in all ways that He has been dishonored," said Anna Falling.

Falling says God was dishonored four years ago, when the Tulsa Parks Board rejected an exhibit which borrows heavily from the first book of the Bible.  Supporters argue the zoo includes other religious icons like the Hindu god, Ganeesh, and Christianity should also have a place.

"I am surprised that has come back up again.  It was a bad idea the first time around," said Brian Cross with Friends of Religion and Science.

Brian Cross fought the exhibit the first time around.  He says the other exhibits that reference religion are not there to proselytize, but educate people about other cultures.

"They weren't put up here at the behest of any particular group in order to advance their agenda. That's the difference. She wants to promote for her religion.  The curators of the zoo want to educate," said Brian Cross with Friends of Religion and Science.

"Unless we find ways to engage the Church back into public policy decisions we will be lost as a city, state and nation," said Anna Falling.

Her speech was part sermon, part rallying cry.  And, it's already winning over some voters.

"I think she stands up very strong for her beliefs. And, I think by doing this she shows that. And, I think that's good. We need a mayor that comes up and is strong about their opinion and is not afraid to express their opinion," said Creationism supporter Angela Childress.

Anna Falling is gathering signatures to appeal to the Tulsa Parks Board about the Creationism exhibit.

A Tulsa Zoo spokesperson said in a statement that the Tulsa Parks Board resolved this issue in 2005, after a very public process involving the entire community.
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ThatDamnedPanda -> RE: Creationism in zoo (8/15/2009 10:07:45 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Esinn

This is old news already - I am sure you heard:

http://www.newson6.com/Global/story.asp?S=10888260
(there is quite a bit about this on the net already.  Learn more about the 'hindu display')
This woman is running for Mayor.  Her main objective is to get a creationist(pro-religious) display up and running in the zoo which was struck down last year.  She is not concerned with crime, health care, poverty, rights for other religions or education.  She really has little experience in running a town.  However, when has that been important.  What is important is displaying creationist or intelligent design material ever where evidence based science exists. 


In a few years, she'll be governor of Oklahoma, and getting ready to run for vice president!




Esinn -> RE: Creationism in zoo (8/15/2009 10:09:27 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: ThatDamnedPanda

quote:

ORIGINAL: Esinn

This is old news already - I am sure you heard:

http://www.newson6.com/Global/story.asp?S=10888260
(there is quite a bit about this on the net already.  Learn more about the 'hindu display')
This woman is running for Mayor.  Her main objective is to get a creationist(pro-religious) display up and running in the zoo which was struck down last year.  She is not concerned with crime, health care, poverty, rights for other religions or education.  She really has little experience in running a town.  However, when has that been important.  What is important is displaying creationist or intelligent design material ever where evidence based science exists. 


In a few years, she'll be governor of Oklahoma, and getting ready to run for vice president!


Oh snap!




FullCircle -> RE: Creationism in zoo (8/16/2009 5:47:05 AM)

Have you seen that film "The Mist"?

This woman sounds a bit like that religious nut in that, quickly that turned into people being fed to the monsters as a form of sacrifice. People shouldn't elect such people to deal with a crisis because it never ends well.

So you have a problem with the wrong impression being given to people in a place that gives the impression wild animals are happy in cages? Most zoos justify their existence in terms of breeding programmes etc. and I can’t dispute that I suppose.




Esinn -> RE: Creationism in zoo (8/16/2009 7:11:16 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: FullCircle



So you have a problem with the wrong impression being given to people in a place that gives the impression wild animals are happy in cages? Most zoos justify their existence in terms of breeding programmes etc. and I can’t dispute that I suppose.



Possibly you are an idiot.

The purpose of zoos:
conservation, environmental education and entertainment.

Zoos have become the last refuge for many species and their captive breeding programs.

You can go get a PHD in zoology.  That would take a little thinking.
http://catalog.ou.edu/courses/zoology_courses.htm

So, save yourself the effort and learn about what the purpose of Zoos are - that will take some effort too, you do not seem up to it either.

I will even shake it for you next time you take a piss in Indianapolis.  Until then if you are so inclined in learning the purpose of zoos here is a 101 for kids:
http://www.biaza.org.uk/resources/library/images/goodzoo.pdf


I take my kid to learn.




Esinn -> RE: Creationism in zoo (8/16/2009 7:15:21 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Esinn

quote:

ORIGINAL: FullCircle



So you have a problem with the wrong impression being given to people in a place that gives the impression wild animals are happy in cages? Most zoos justify their existence in terms of breeding programmes etc. and I can’t dispute that I suppose.



Possibly you are an idiot.

The purpose of zoos:
conservation, environmental education and entertainment.

Zoos have become the last refuge for many species and their captive breeding programs.

You can go get a PHD in zoology.  That would take a little thinking.
http://catalog.ou.edu/courses/zoology_courses.htm

So, save yourself the effort and learn about what the purpose of Zoos are - that will take some effort too, you do not seem up to it either.

I will even shake it for you next time you take a piss in Indianapolis.  Until then if you are so inclined in learning the purpose of zoos here is a 101 for kids:
http://www.biaza.org.uk/resources/library/images/goodzoo.pdf


I take my kid to learn.

I just do not understand.  There are thousands of books, hundreds of college level classes, millions of characters of information on the net.  Before people start spewing ignorance it is best to look before ya splat.  Your second sentence demonstrated you somewhat get this?

[:-]

It has nothing to do with 'justifying existence'.




Arpig -> RE: Creationism in zoo (8/16/2009 7:34:23 PM)

Why is creationism an issue only in North America?




cornflakegirl -> RE: Creationism in zoo (8/16/2009 7:55:25 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Arpig

Why is creationism an issue only in North America?


Is it an issue in Canada, too? I thought it was a pretty uniquely USA thing.




Arpig -> RE: Creationism in zoo (8/16/2009 7:59:01 PM)

Not much of an issue, but we have our own homegrown creationists as well.




MarsBonfire -> RE: Creationism in zoo (8/16/2009 8:21:23 PM)

Stupidity, like hydrogen, is an element of the universe that exists everywhere.




lioncub -> RE: Creationism in zoo (8/16/2009 8:23:02 PM)

Oh wow. On principle, I wish they could put down the idea by making people understand ow silly it is. However, that is unlikely to happen. They should just put up the display to stop her from becoming Mayor (if she has any actual winning potential), and deal with it later. Choose your battles, man.




Rule -> RE: Creationism in zoo (8/16/2009 11:35:11 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Arpig
Why is creationism an issue only in North America?

I suspect it is due to an environmental factor. Forty years ago I might have speculated that it was the leaded petrol, but I seem to recall that there has been no lead in petrol for decades. An alternative might be the chlorinated drinking water - but of course no sane person drinks chlorinated drinking water. Perhaps it is caused by the fluoride added to the drinking water?




rightwinghippie -> RE: Creationism in zoo (8/17/2009 1:45:58 AM)

I don't know, I think the Creationist exhibit at the zoo would be rather interesting. A few of em locked in cages, with signs showing thier natural habitat and interesting facts about thier bizzare beliefs.




rightwinghippie -> RE: Creationism in zoo (8/17/2009 1:50:19 AM)

Arpig, I have a theory about that. A while back it was demanded that all religous instruction be taken out of public schools. Anyone who studies the history and theology of Christianity and the Bible has a very hard time falling for the Fallacy of Literalism. It's a rather new phenomenom. In the wake of the enforced ignorance, scammers and hucksters were able to step in and teach nonsense. Just my own crazy theory.




FullCircle -> RE: Creationism in zoo (8/17/2009 5:40:20 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Esinn
Possibly you are an idiot.

The purpose of zoos:
conservation, environmental education and entertainment.

Zoos have become the last refuge for many species and their captive breeding programs.

You can go get a PHD in zoology.  That would take a little thinking.
http://catalog.ou.edu/courses/zoology_courses.htm

So, save yourself the effort and learn about what the purpose of Zoos are - that will take some effort too, you do not seem up to it either.

I will even shake it for you next time you take a piss in Indianapolis.  Until then if you are so inclined in learning the purpose of zoos here is a 101 for kids:
http://www.biaza.org.uk/resources/library/images/goodzoo.pdf
I take my kid to learn.

Survival of the fittest if they can't survive a changing environment tough shit right? Is human beings preserving things part of the natural selection process? You Esinn contradict yourself by promoting natural selection but then saying some creatures deserve to live beyond the changing environment caused by humans. Aren’t you being a bit romantic about it? As for education well you don’t have to go to a zoo to learn about a creature now do you? Are dinosaurs in the zoo? Also how does a creature being in a zoo tell us anything about their natural ecology in the wild when they aren’t in the wild?

If I put you in a box with only raw potatoes to eat does it confirm you like raw potatoes, if the box contains an ugly woman does it confirm you will only breed with ugly women in a box environment? Will you display half of the behaviour and social patterns you would if you wasn't in the box? You learn nothing from zoos, you learn by observing things in their natural environment and by cutting things open.

Entertainment is a mute point since we all have our own idea of entertainment and mine isn't watching wild animals perform tricks for humans.

If you was to ask me what I believe I’d say I believe in theory of evolution and believing in it means I’m virtually powerless to save something for its natural extinction although human compassion prevents us from realising this and we even try to reverse breed things that became extinct years ago (not sure why? Human sentimentality?).

A far better way of saving creatures is by changing ourselves because we are largely the reason why so many creatures are coming to the verge of extinction. Changing ourselves means other creatures wouldn't have to adapt to us but we'd rather not try this why but instead continue with breeding programmes for animals that are coming to the verge of extinction because of us and will do so again in time if we don't change?

Where is the logic in this Mr Vulcan trying to breed something to live in an environment that it has been proven it can't survive in rather than changing the environment?




FullCircle -> RE: Creationism in zoo (8/17/2009 7:13:35 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Esinn
Possibly you are an idiot.

Regarding this I'd like to think anything were possible and so therefore think you should never let your lack of imagination determine what questions you ask or the answers you seek.




kittinSol -> RE: Creationism in zoo (8/17/2009 7:24:42 AM)

Where do they get these people [X(] ?




FullCircle -> RE: Creationism in zoo (8/17/2009 7:29:45 AM)

Harvester. Ever been in one of those places? They reek of Christianity.
IMOSHO




Hillwilliam -> RE: Creationism in zoo (8/17/2009 8:35:53 AM)

Thank (insert convenient deity here) that didnt happen in Tennessee.  We have enough right wing religious nutbags here.  It's good to know there are some other places with crazier ones.




mnottertail -> RE: Creationism in zoo (8/17/2009 11:25:12 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Hillwilliam

Thank (insert convenient deity here) that didnt happen in Tennessee.  We have enough right wing religious nutbags here.  It's good to know there are some other places with crazier ones.


Well, I think that the right wing religious nutbags already had their asses handed to them, and will try it out in another state.

John Scopes




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