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Descent into hell > WHY? - 8/18/2009 11:36:02 AM   
subdirector


Posts: 5
Joined: 8/17/2009
From: Detroit
Status: offline 		20 years with a woman that was truly my first love, 10 years into it we grew apart (me being immature) we separated honorably and with mutual respect, soon after I married another and we all got along famously, in the bedroom and out, life was just a dream.

The last few years however things have been getting more aggressive in the bedroom, personally I am all about sub space and the endless pleasures of restrained multiple orgasms or the denial of such pleasures, but the girls seem to need more and more restraint and discipline, I swear to you It's like a junkie or something the more you ignore them the crazier it gets until nothing but a weekend long punishment session will calm things down.

The sex is on demand no problem there anything, anytime and they are cool with that, however the scene has gone from them needing and wanting sex as the motivation to them demanding increasingly harder restraint and punishment, that does not set well with me personally.

I am 6'1 and 275 of fighting Irish so the need to dominate a weaker individual is not in me, If I want to release some frustration the local bar has plenty of people to box with and I don't feel like a smuck after a round with one of the them, we dust ourselves off and continue partying, maybe It's an Irish thing I don't know, but to me that is justifiable as we are evenly matched physically and nobody is taking advantage of anybody.

So from a woman's perspective, what am I as a male misunderstanding here?          
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RE: Descent into hell > WHY? - 8/18/2009 11:50:57 AM   
cornflakegirl


Posts: 183
Joined: 7/1/2009
From: Arizona
Status: offline 		Figure out for sure what they want - more affection, more pain, more D/s play, more sensation, more attention, more sex, what? And then see if you can work out ways to meet those needs and yours at the same time.

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RE: Descent into hell > WHY? - 8/18/2009 12:53:20 PM   
sirsholly


Posts: 42360
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From: Quietville
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quote:

So from a woman's perspective, what am I as a male misunderstanding here?
what did she say when you discussed this with her?

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RE: Descent into hell > WHY? - 8/18/2009 1:08:43 PM   
leadership527


Posts: 5026
Joined: 6/2/2008
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quote:

So from a woman's perspective, what am I as a male misunderstanding here?

Just so you know, I don't think this is a "women" thing. In fact, none of the subs/slaves that I know well enough to comment on exhibit this behavior. Based on that, I have to speculate that whatever is going on, it's something unique to the chemistry between you and her.

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I didn't so much "enslave" Carol as I did "enlove" her. - Me
I want a joyous, loving, respectful relationship where the male is in charge and deserves to be. - DavanKael

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RE: Descent into hell > WHY? - 8/18/2009 2:27:27 PM   
cpK69


Posts: 1593
Joined: 5/9/2008
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quote:

ORIGINAL: subdirector


So from a woman's perspective, what am I as a male misunderstanding here?          



Masochists wouldn’t care how big you are, for some, the bigger the better.

The terms you describe “wanting sex as a motivation” and “demanding”, imply to me, you may not have the type of dynamic you think you do.

quote:


It's an Irish thing I don't know, but to me that is justifiable as we are evenly matched physically and nobody is taking advantage of anybody.  
 

Don’t look now, but I think you may be the one being taken advantage of.

Kim


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RE: Descent into hell > WHY? - 8/18/2009 2:35:04 PM   
shadowowl


Posts: 198
Joined: 5/31/2004
Status: offline 		Maybe they are more like a junkie then you realize.   There are sex addicts I suppose tossing in a BDSM mix into it isn't that far off base the question is maybe sex addicts annomous can help? :P  never know i suppose.

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RE: Descent into hell > WHY? - 8/18/2009 2:37:43 PM   
littlewonder


Posts: 15659
Status: offline 		Can't say I can relate. I'm not like that, never have been..maybe take a look at the type of women you're choosing?

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RE: Descent into hell > WHY? - 8/18/2009 2:51:35 PM   
lovingpet


Posts: 4270
Joined: 6/19/2005
Status: offline 		Sex addiction is possible I guess. My money is on becoming in need of the endorphines and seretonin that occurs typically when subspace is attained and, more profoundly so (biologically anyway), from pain play. As they get more and more accustomed to going to subspace regularly, their bodies' "normal" becomes altered from what it used to be. Prior to this, they were used to NOT having these surges and the physical and emotional effects of them. Now doing life without the help of them may be unpleasant and even may seem abnormal to them.

Since it is two girls, I doubt it is really much more than this, but it is possible that there could be other factors in some cases. Some people can be prone to need more attention because the biochemical alteration is assistive because of other issues. For example, I get a great deal of relief from fibromyalgia symptoms from a strong session. Other things like sleep disorders, depression, anxiety, and more may actually feel improved by play. It is not a cure, mind you, but it helps in its own way. I am not saying any of this is the case with these gals, but a good doctor's visit may be in order if you suspect anything like this. The response of just starting to find a new normal is something you will either have to accept as a consequence of the type and intensity of play you enjoy or consider some kind of alternatives.

There is a level at which those chemical surges can create their own "addiction" I suppose, and helping them keep it in check is part of being responsible. Craving and desiring more is pretty common, but demanding seems very out of place and had best have a stop put to it. By your post, they are clearly pushing you too hard. Taking back the reigns and getting things in hand is necessary. If they push you into anger, what will happen then? This is for their own good and you have got to get a handle on all this. There is nothing wrong with them wanting and craving what you do with them. Becoming more iron fisted may even enhance that! Get a good handle on these girls and let them know who's going to do what to and for whom. I think it will help a lot.

lovingpet

< Message edited by lovingpet -- 8/18/2009 2:56:48 PM >

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RE: Descent into hell > WHY? - 8/18/2009 2:53:05 PM   
mnottertail


Posts: 60698
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Status: offline 		Try rising on the third day again, that's a bitch too.

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RE: Descent into hell > WHY? - 8/18/2009 6:04:13 PM   
DavanKael


Posts: 3072
Joined: 10/6/2007
Status: offline 		Yeah, gotta communicate on this one.  I know it messes with the fantasy world and such but it's one of those must-do things if one is going to have more than a transitory dynamic.  Talk with your partner. 
  Davan


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RE: Descent into hell > WHY? - 8/18/2009 6:11:25 PM   
DarkSteven


Posts: 28072
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Status: offline 		I am absolutely dead serious about this.  Develop a mutual hobby like Scrabble, hiking, or anything else that puts the two of you together for chunks of time and conversation.

The two of you have grown apart to a degree and you've noticed it in the bedroom.  But I get a detached sense of the entire relationship.  Maybe that's why your woman wants you to dial up the intensity, so she can feel.




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The small-breasted ones want larger breasts. The large-breasted ones want smaller ones. The straight-haired ones curl their hair, and the curly-haired ones straighten theirs...

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RE: Descent into hell > WHY? - 8/18/2009 6:40:08 PM   
lovingpet


Posts: 4270
Joined: 6/19/2005
Status: offline 		Oh, I guess I didn't give my usual speech. Yeah, communication! We can only make guesses here. Talk to these gals! And yes, you've got to find ways to get better connected with them. Talking is the start of that. Like DS suggested, getting on in more areas than just the sex is another. Relationships get boring as hell when it's just one dimensional.

lovingpet

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RE: Descent into hell > WHY? - 8/18/2009 10:42:59 PM   
DesFIP


Posts: 25191
Joined: 11/25/2007
From: Apple County NY
Status: offline 		Talk to her honestly about your needs not matching. Maybe go to a club together where she can get her pain needs met and go home with you for sex and affection.

Just as you have every right not to want to do the kinds of things she likes, she has every right to want those things. Talk about your mismatched desires and how you could both get your needs met.

And yes, unmet needs build up in you until you will absolutely need them and now. If she was getting them met regularly she might not need it so much rougher once every few months or whatever the time scale is.

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RE: Descent into hell > WHY? - 8/18/2009 11:48:32 PM   
subdirector


Posts: 5
Joined: 8/17/2009
From: Detroit
Status: offline 		Wow I really don't know what to say, as you can see this is my first post here, well anywhere for that matter. I had no idea such a community existed as dumb as that might sound, it just really never dawned on me such a place would exist.

First off I need to Thank you all for considering my situation and sharing your personal experiences with me so openly and honestly, every post has brought a little more understanding to the problem and lot of solid points were made.

Communication the single most important thing and I Suck at it, I have no clue how to bring up the 800 pound Gorilla in the room and quite honestly we all just sit around and pretend it does not exist. Case in point, our wedding night 10 years ago my first wife had breakfast with us in the morning. It's been like that ever since, whenever she needs peace she shows up, hangs around for a few days then goes home until she needs a break from reality again, a constant up and down of emotions all the way around. She can be so sweet oh so sweet. Mother Teresa on one hand and Pandora's box on the other.     

The last few years has not been good for any of us War Market crash everything crashed, when stress brings me down I focus on work and tend not to be there emotionally my ego problem always got to be the bad ass, show no emotion as the world burns down around us type bravado, what a waste.

quote:

Don’t look now, but I think you may be the one being taken advantage of.
Kim

That is true on a lot of levels but can you truly take advantage of the willing.

quote:

I am absolutely dead serious about this.  Develop a mutual hobby like Scrabble, hiking, or anything else that puts the two of you together for chunks of time and conversation.

The two of you have grown apart to a degree and you've noticed it in the bedroom.  But I get a detached sense of the entire relationship.  Maybe that's why your woman wants you to dial up the intensity, so she can feel.
DarkSteven

I cant remember when the last time we did anything other than work and limited local stuff, a very valid point chunks of time and conversation have been lacking severely no real quality time. Vacation to the shore would be all that, funny that would have never dawned on me work work work you know

The feeling something part, I can really relate to that when it all gets to much, Like a bat outa hell you just got to feel something anything no matter the consequences.

quote:

Try rising on the third day again, that's a bitch too.
mnottertail

Blew coffee all over the monitor, wicked wit like that just kills me.  


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RE: Descent into hell > WHY? - 8/19/2009 6:01:17 AM   
cpK69


Posts: 1593
Joined: 5/9/2008
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: subdirector

quote:

Don’t look now, but I think you may be the one being taken advantage of.
Kim


That is true on a lot of levels but can you truly take advantage of the willing.



Now see, you're already learning.

Kim

_____________________________

Humility is where weakness and strength meet and humanity begins.

one voice

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RE: Descent into hell > WHY? - 8/19/2009 7:35:58 AM   
lizi


Posts: 4673
Joined: 2/1/2009
Status: offline 		You say you're bad at communicating but here you laid all of this out for a group of total strangers.... It's not so bad really - the communication - and it's completely necessary. I had a good relationship going but the communication problems killed it off. He found it difficult to do and even when I tried going to the guy to talk I felt unwelcome. You can't do a relationship much less a D/s relationship without communication.

Try saying things in a round about way. You mentioned your first wife being there the day after you got married. You could look at your wife and say how do you feel about so and so stopping over here today? She could tell you and it goes from there, the ball is rolling. You don't have to expose yourself totally to have a decent conversation, just talk...about anything. And here's a good technique to try for the harder things, try sitting side by side with someone when you're talking instead of facing them...sounds silly but sometimes the eye to eye contact is daunting and you can feel more free (and therefore talk more easily) if it's not there.

DarkSteven mentioned developing things outside of sex to do together...it's another way to just start talking. I'm telling you, just start with the talking on ANY subject and the other stuff will start to come and it'll be easier to do. You don't really have to have the 'quality' time you mentioned -although it's nice it can also be a pressure. Just open your mouth and start talking about anything when you get home today. Then make sure to keep it up whenever you're with the people you care about. Take it a bit farther at some point and talk about something more important. You have to start somewhere right?

< Message edited by lizi -- 8/19/2009 7:40:00 AM >

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RE: Descent into hell > WHY? - 8/19/2009 7:46:27 AM   
angelikaJ


Posts: 8641
Joined: 6/22/2007
Status: offline 		If  you are having trouble sorting it out on your own, there are kink-friendly therapists.

Kink Aware Professionals 

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RE: Descent into hell > WHY? - 8/19/2009 10:49:29 PM   
subdirector


Posts: 5
Joined: 8/17/2009
From: Detroit
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: lizi
You say you're bad at communicating but here you laid all of this out for a group of total strangers....

Spent some time reading previous thread's to see if anyone else had experienced the same situation while getting a feel for the culture, Get what you Give is the vibe I sense here maybe it's the weed hell I don't know, you all just seem like a real easy going bunch so it was easy to speak freely and I don't have to live with you all either and that is a Huge motivating factor.

Hell hath no fury like that of a woman scorned and quite frankly the 3 women in my life scare the hell out of me, If I piss 1off  It becomes 2 and when 2 can't break me they involve my mother. Oh Yes and that's not all, Mom is single and has been since my birth, 1st wife is single and my current wife generally puts up with my shit because I mow the lawn and lift heavy things, so you can imagine me against the witches of Salem and I am the whipping post for all previous male infractions real or imagined I must take the shit for it.

Counseling you say went for years thought my head was all messed up, not so much me but the dynamic of the situation co dependency, empty nest syndrome and so forth learned a lot however I was the only one that would go to more than a few sessions seems a marriage counselor only needs a 2 year degree how could they possibly know anything was the story and they would stick to it collectively and that's the problem once they come to a conclusion It's over.

So I don't know it seems to boil down to this for me anyways, pay them all a little more attention and have some conversations beyond the weather, You know what really burns my ass though is the fact when a woman has a problem they already know the answer, I have seen it some posts around here too and it is frustrating when a man has a problem we legitimately don't have a clue and seek conversation about it, however it seems when ever a woman has a problem and wants to speak to her man about it, they have already come to a conclusion figured out amongst one another. It's like there is a union or something and these are just protocols to dealing with a male to see if he is really listening or not, or is it just shits and giggles cuz were slow.    





 




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RE: Descent into hell > WHY? - 8/20/2009 3:38:56 AM   
littlewonder


Posts: 15659
Status: offline 		Reading your further posts I'd say you have some pent up hostility towards women and that right there is your problem.

Stop putting women down, stop choosing the women you do and you may find life a little easier on you.

Maybe take a break from women for awhile...do other things in life that make you happy because in all honesty...until you get that chip off your shoulder women will continue to treat you the way you don't want.

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RE: Descent into hell > WHY? - 8/20/2009 4:38:59 AM   
DesFIP


Posts: 25191
Joined: 11/25/2007
From: Apple County NY
Status: offline 		You know, if the night after my wedding his ex felt capable of walking right in, that right there would tell me he had no healthy boundaries. I'd be resentful and damned sure I had made a mistake. I might stay there for six months or so but I would never again fully respect him.

You have no healthy boundaries with your mother, or your ex. You talk about your ex with more fondness and affection than you do your present wife. You appear incapable of committing to anyone fully.

Work on your own issues. I suggest ACOA meetings, inexpensive and you will learn early that you aren't that special and deserving as you think you are.

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