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Where do we draw the line? - 8/24/2009 12:40:05 PM   
LillyoftheVally


Posts: 1826
Joined: 7/22/2009
Status: offline 		There have been a few threads, such as the abortion one, which assumed that talking to folk on a kink site will elicit responses more 'open minded' than anywhere else. I find this interesting, because you see to me we are just a group of people, some nice, some not, some young, some old, some left wing some right wing, etc etc.

So I wonder then can we really ever expect standard responses? Do we all draw the moral and ethical line in different places? 'Should' we as members of an 'alt' grouping be more laid back? Do we owe it to bdsm to be welcoming and encouraging of different kinks? Or are there still boundaries? It is true that many folk not involved in wiitwd would think us disgusting, so for that reason does it change how we view the world?

Just some general pondering.

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RE: Where do we draw the line? - 8/24/2009 1:04:17 PM   
Lockit


Posts: 11292
Joined: 5/7/2007
Status: offline 		For the most part people I know are more curious about how I live and relate to my men than think I am some barbarian nutzoid. I am pretty sure a few have been... let's say... turned. lol

I will always have my line in the sand and how I might think of, judge or whatever is situational. I cannot stop being who I am and what life has created in me from my experiences. I think we forget sometimes that people will have standards or morals that they hold true to and will bring things up thinking that becasue we are kinky, that anything goes. Anything may go for many... but they are typically not going to be invited to dinner at my house. How I treat them, accept them or their kink or whatever is too situational to comment on and yes... I have been called closed minded and unfair. I can live with that.

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RE: Where do we draw the line? - 8/24/2009 1:05:09 PM   
leadership527


Posts: 5026
Joined: 6/2/2008
Status: offline 		In my experience, people are people. But I will say that watching some of the threads here, I have certainly gotten a better understanding of why labels are so feared among other things. My general observation is that the whole your kink is not mine but it's OK is mostly lip service.

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I didn't so much "enslave" Carol as I did "enlove" her. - Me
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RE: Where do we draw the line? - 8/24/2009 1:08:28 PM   
NuevaVida


Posts: 6707
Joined: 8/5/2008
Status: offline 		I'd imagine the responses are something of a bell curve.   You have a larger group who thinks similarly and you have smaller groups who might be more conservative or more liberal with their "kink", for lack of a better word.  My mind has certainly expanded from learning the mild and extreme versions of things (as well as everything in between) and having lived through some of the things I have, I'm certainly more open to what others do.  Sure I have my own boundaries and opinions of certain lifestyle choices, but my thinking is far less narrow than it used to be.

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RE: Where do we draw the line? - 8/24/2009 1:18:26 PM   
kiwisub12


Posts: 4742
Joined: 1/11/2006
Status: offline 		Why does the fact that i like thick, thuddy canes, and to serve my Sir mean that i should be accepting of every goofy thing that Joe Blow may think up.

Yes, i accept and/or tolerate others kink- does that mean i have to accept every dictate of President Obama,  Jerry Fauwell (sp?) or Glen Beck in the quest to be open-minded?  Apart from one little - but very important - part of my life, i am no different than anyone else in this world. I have opinions that are based on info. that i have garnered through my life.

As my Sir is want to say - you can do anything at my house - but if i don't want to watch , i can and will leave the room.
Sometimes the best we can do is leaving the room.

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RE: Where do we draw the line? - 8/24/2009 1:20:48 PM   
LaTigresse


Posts: 26123
Joined: 1/15/2006
Status: offline 		My morals are my own. While I would love for everyone else on this planet to share them, that is not realistic.

If I see something happening that is morally wrong, to me, and harming someone/thing, chances are I am going to do something about it. Whether others agree with me or not.

If I see something, that I see as being, gross/yucky/sick/wrong, but no one is being harmed, chances are I am going to get my ass outta there.

If someone asks my opinion, I am going to give it.

The thing is it's not a line, between black and white, most of the time. It's case by case and usually a shade of gray.

< Message edited by LaTigresse -- 8/24/2009 1:21:53 PM >

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RE: Where do we draw the line? - 8/24/2009 1:24:51 PM   
Musicmystery


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Honestly, I think sometimes they should change the name of the site from CollarMe to DefineMe.


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RE: Where do we draw the line? - 8/24/2009 1:25:53 PM   
daintydimples


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Musicmystery

~FR~

Honestly, I think sometimes they should change the name of the site from CollarMe to DefineMe.




ROFL


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RE: Where do we draw the line? - 8/24/2009 1:28:01 PM   
sweetsub1957


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quote:

ORIGINAL: LillyoftheVally

So I wonder then can we really ever expect standard responses? Do we all draw the moral and ethical line in different places? 'Should' we as members of an 'alt' grouping be more laid back? Do we owe it to bdsm to be welcoming and encouraging of different kinks? Or are there still boundaries? It is true that many folk not involved in wiitwd would think us disgusting, so for that reason does it change how we view the world?



I'd like to think I'm fairly open-minded.  I've always been accepting of others' right to their own views/likes & dislikes, even though I might not agree with them.  I draw the line for myself in a certain spot but that doesn't mean I think someone is a bad person if they don't draw it in the same place.  IMO, we should be accepting of others' right to have different kinks, even if we personally are disgusted at the thought of whatever it is and would never do it ourselves.  I feel we are all people, kinky or not and as such, some will be more or less conservative/liberal than others.  My vanilla sister is very judgemental, and NOT in a good way, as to my being kinky (she does NOT know details AT ALL).  I know how that feels, so why should I judge someone else for THEIR preferences?  Even before I was kinky, I championed a person's right to have their own views/preferences, regardless of whether I concurred or not.

sweetsub1957

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An it harm none, do what ye wilt.

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RE: Where do we draw the line? - 8/24/2009 1:37:59 PM   
LillyoftheVally


Posts: 1826
Joined: 7/22/2009
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Musicmystery

~FR~

Honestly, I think sometimes they should change the name of the site from CollarMe to DefineMe.




What have I asked people to define? I can understand your frustration with the thread for being pontificating, something you have said a few times recently, but then if that is not an element of discussion boards, you know to discuss concepts then maybe the removal of the forum completely would be better.

In general, my OP was actually not meant to be about 'defining' simply a discussion about the idea that being involved in something 'alt' leads to people accepting all alt forms. Of course YKIOK or variations are rules on most BDSM based forums but it is more about how personally we do that.

Like NV I believe I have become more open minded the more I am exposed to different ideas, I find it interesting when having to confront established morals possibly because of the hypocrisy of upholding them. I think a forum is the best place to see this. As an observer I find it fascinating how a poster can contradict him/herself even within the same post. This has made me look at my own hypocrisy and question it. That is what this thread is 'meant' to be about. Sorry if that was unclear.

_____________________________

'My doctor says that I have a malformed public-duty gland and a natural deficiency in moral fibre, and that I am therefore excused from saving Universes.'

Nah I am not happy to see you either

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RE: Where do we draw the line? - 8/24/2009 1:43:31 PM   
Musicmystery


Posts: 30259
Joined: 3/14/2005
Status: offline 		Slow down, girl. Was neither directed at you nor criticism.

FR = Fast Reply. Joke = humorous comment, which may entail an observation.

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RE: Where do we draw the line? - 8/24/2009 1:56:18 PM   
Acer49


Posts: 1434
Joined: 8/7/2009
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: LillyoftheVally

There have been a few threads, such as the abortion one, which assumed that talking to folk on a kink site will elicit responses more 'open minded' than anywhere else. I find this interesting, because you see to me we are just a group of people, some nice, some not, some young, some old, some left wing some right wing, etc etc.

So I wonder then can we really ever expect standard responses? Do we all draw the moral and ethical line in different places? 'Should' we as members of an 'alt' grouping be more laid back? Do we owe it to bdsm to be welcoming and encouraging of different kinks? Or are there still boundaries? It is true that many folk not involved in wiitwd would think us disgusting, so for that reason does it change how we view the world?

Just some general pondering.


I try to treat others as I wish to be treated. I will accept your kink as long as I believe that all involved are consenting and that it is safe, I however, may not associate with you if your ethics and morals make me uncomfortable whether you are part of this lifestyle or not. While we are "alt" that does not mean we have higher, lower or even different ethics and morals than any other segment of society. People outside this lifestyle view us with many different emotions most are, sadly negative. If I cared about the world I would feel sad that they are not accepting and that they feel they somehow have the right to pass judgement on others

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RE: Where do we draw the line? - 8/24/2009 1:59:40 PM   
MarcEsadrian


Posts: 852
Joined: 8/24/2008
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: LillyoftheVally

Do we all draw the moral and ethical line in different places? 'Should' we as members of an 'alt' grouping be more laid back? Do we owe it to bdsm to be welcoming and encouraging of different kinks?


Given that anyone with any experience in dealing with the quilt that is humanity's morals will conclude there is no standard of right and wrong thinking among all that can be agreed upon, I doubt we'll see this nice idea manifest any time soon. But that is not to say we should not strive toward better rounded thinking and acceptance, less hypocrisy and more tolerance. I know I'm comforted that the intolerance of newcomers (and others who should know better by now) in this forum and others like it is no reflection upon the reality I live or the company I keep. For if we were to give credence to the naysayers who often frame their arguments in terms of what is or is not a "healthy, well adjusted relationship", or "drawing lines in the sand", the "alts" in our lifestyles would be rather impoverished ones, indeed.

Edited to add: On that line of thinking, I would warn newcomers hoping to glean shared wisdom and bits of truth from this board away from the popularity game. There are a few "celebrities" in these forums who have demonstrated fairly narrow views on certain subjects. Consider everything read here carefully, and keep an eye out for inane and uninvited moralizing that derails threads and reduces the possibility of intellectual exchange into trite gibberish.



< Message edited by MarcEsadrian -- 8/24/2009 2:16:29 PM >

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RE: Where do we draw the line? - 8/24/2009 2:05:46 PM   
LadyPact


Posts: 32566
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: leadership527

In my experience, people are people. But I will say that watching some of the threads here, I have certainly gotten a better understanding of why labels are so feared among other things. My general observation is that the whole your kink is not mine but it's OK is mostly lip service.

Personally, I think it should come with a qualifier.  In other words YKINMKAYKWNIM.  Meaning, your kink is not My kink and your kink will not involve Me. 


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Beach Ball Sized Lady Nuts. ~ TWD

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RE: Where do we draw the line? - 8/24/2009 2:15:19 PM   
IrishMist


Posts: 7480
Joined: 11/17/2005
Status: offline
quote:

So I wonder then can we really ever expect standard responses? Do we all draw the moral and ethical line in different places? 'Should' we as members of an 'alt' grouping be more laid back? Do we owe it to bdsm to be welcoming and encouraging of different kinks? Or are there still boundaries? It is true that many folk not involved in wiitwd would think us disgusting, so for that reason does it change how we view the world?


Despite our liking of an alternative way of living; we are still human beings. All too often, it is 'expected' that since we are members of this site, that we must therefore, be more tolerating, more open minded, more..more..more...something. It's just not going to happen.

Just because I like to be abused, does not automatically mean that I agree or disagree with abortion.

Just because I like to be abused, does not automatically mean that I am going to 'be ok' with someone else's kink.

Just because I like to be abused, does not automatically mean that my own code of ethics, morals, ideas, boundaries, limits, etc etc...are going to become meaningless.

Just because I like to live a certain way, does not give others the expectation that I automatically like to live THEIR way.

Just because, just because, just because...it can go on and on.

Being the way I am simply means that I am the way I am. It does not give the expectation of 'I am more' anything.

All it guarantees, from ME, is a better understanding of others. This understanding does nothing but allow ME to be more comfortable around those who are not 'mainstream' also.

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If I said something to offend you, please tell me what it was so that I can say it again later.


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RE: Where do we draw the line? - 8/24/2009 2:48:54 PM   
porcelaine


Posts: 5020
Joined: 7/24/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: LillyoftheVally

So I wonder then can we really ever expect standard responses? Do we all draw the moral and ethical line in different places? 'Should' we as members of an 'alt' grouping be more laid back? Do we owe it to bdsm to be welcoming and encouraging of different kinks? Or are there still boundaries? It is true that many folk not involved in wiitwd would think us disgusting, so for that reason does it change how we view the world?

Just some general pondering.


i don't believe we're more accepting, tolerant, or willing to be open minded than any other group with shared interests. people bring their biases, prejudices, icks, and every conceivable notion they had prior to discovering this lifestyle and all the ones they gained thereafter. you've spent 'x' number of years living and thinking in a certain manner. that will not change overnight. for the most part many aren't seeking to change it either.

personally i could care less what people do with their time or their orifices. they're not mine to own, clean, or claim. if you like it, i love it. and if its twisted enough i might enjoy watching.

porcelaine


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RE: Where do we draw the line? - 8/24/2009 2:53:47 PM   
RavenMuse


Posts: 4030
Joined: 1/23/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: LaTigresse

My morals are my own. While I would love for everyone else on this planet to share them, that is not realistic.

If I see something happening that is morally wrong, to me, and harming someone/thing, chances are I am going to do something about it. Whether others agree with me or not.

If I see something, that I see as being, gross/yucky/sick/wrong, but no one is being harmed, chances are I am going to get my ass outta there.

If someone asks my opinion, I am going to give it.

The thing is it's not a line, between black and white, most of the time. It's case by case and usually a shade of gray.


She did it again and saved Me typing....... What She said!


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This above all: to thine own self be true,
And it must follow, as the night the day,
Thou canst not then be false to any man.

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RE: Where do we draw the line? - 8/24/2009 2:59:53 PM   
IronBear


Posts: 9008
Joined: 6/19/2005
From: Beenleigh, Qld, Australia
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: LillyoftheVally

Do we all draw the moral and ethical line in different places? 'Should' we as members of an 'alt' grouping be more laid back? Do we owe it to bdsm to be welcoming and encouraging of different kinks?


Fuck No!!!!! I draw the line here at precisely the same place anywhere else either on line of off line and stand to defend that line. I will however depending on where the line is drawn discuss my stance according to the local lingo such as here in the terms of BDSM and kink. In many other areas when I may be discussing my stance on something like abortion or child education, I will leave BDSM references out because there is no need to create many migraines and cardiac issues in the rain hearted of wowser land.


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Master of Bruin Cottage

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Your attitude, words & actions are yours. Take responsibility for them and the consequences they incur.

D.I.L.L.I.G.A.F.

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RE: Where do we draw the line? - 8/24/2009 3:10:27 PM   
Falkenstein


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Maybe it is because I am a typical continental European, but I think that hypocrisy is not a bad thing, if used correctly.

While I was shocked by the kind of moral depravity that some American politicans (read republicans) have shown while professing the stearnest values and stopping president Clinton of working, I prefer to turn a (or two) blind eye whenever I can for my friends and aquaintances who may have lifestyles or affairs that would shock mainstream mores or mine. For example, I would never invitate a friend with his mistress instead of his wife. Same sex partners, on the other hand are welcome, because I dine on a round table ;-)

Decorum is everything, after liberty, of course.





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Part of that power which still
Produceth good, whilst ever scheming ill.

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RE: Where do we draw the line? - 8/24/2009 3:16:54 PM   
mrbob726


Posts: 155
Joined: 4/15/2007
From: Illinois
Status: offline 		In the US, it matters not what party affliation a politician has - all are corrupt - not just republicans - 

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