Tonight's Opportunity For a New Party to be Born (Full Version)

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Mercnbeth -> Tonight's Opportunity For a New Party to be Born (9/9/2009 10:28:07 AM)

There are few times when circumstances set up unique opportunities for success; tonight is one of them. All it would take would be for a few men and woman of integrity in Congress to walk out of tonight's speech.

They leave, and hold a press conference, simulcast on the web announcing the formation of a new party with the following platform:

  • We will accept no campaign funds from any PAC or special interest groups.
  • Addressing the issue the President addressed tonight we propose the following:
    • Employers will be responsible to provide insurance for ALL full and part time employees at their cost.
    • All unemployed will be covered under an enhanced Medicare/Medicaid program; called 'US Care'.
    • US Care will be formed based upon the worlds best and most comprehensive insurance program in the world - the one which insures us, the members of Congress and all other Federal employees. In fact we will assign the managing administrators for that program to the conversion task of dismantling the existing program and merging it with the new US Care entity. The goal being that the poorest and most underprivileged of our citizens will have the same coverage as the most privileged holding the auditing powers. Participation in the US Care program commits the user to having all medical malpractice claims heard by a 5 person arbitration committee compromised of one individual from the AMA, ABA, AFL-CIO, Government Employees Union, ACLU.
    • Existing insurance companies will not be able to terminate coverage for a pre-existing condition.
    • The current top 5 health insurance companies will meet and in 30 days create 'boiler-plate' documents for administration and record keeping. It will be used by all insurance companies and health care providers.

  • We propose closing GITMO tomorrow and releasing all currently held prisoners back to their country of origin immediately with the apologies of the US Government.
  • We will withdraw from Afghanistan immediately.
  • We will begin withdraw from Iraq immediately.
  • We will establish a military presence on our borders.
  • We will increase enforcement of all current documented workers laws increasing the penalties against employees to include cost for deportation, fines, asset forfeiture, and imprisonment for owners and officers of companies employing undocumented workers.
  • ALL government bureaucracies will submit balanced budgets and no additional funds beyond the balanced budget will be provided.
  • Tax exempt status for all "religious" organizations will be repelled.
  • ALL "non-profit" and "not for profit" organizations will be required to manage to a zero balance annual budget, on a three year reporting basis.
  • Representing duplicity and overlapping of 'States Rights' the following Cabinet positions and bureaucracies will be closed:
    • Department of Health & Human Services
    • Department of Education
    • Department of Housing & Urban Development
    • Federal Communications Commission (Censorship should be in the hands of parents not government.)

  • We will only approve a Balanced Budget
  • Affirmative Action and Equal Employment Opportunity Act will be eliminated.
  • We will commit to building 100 nuclear power plants for producing energy in the next 5 years. We would fast track development and construction by prohibiting any environmental litigation associated with implementation and construction.
  • We will initiate a national intercity transportation program. Formulating a 'contest' for service providers with the best plan getting the contract. We would fast track development and construction by prohibiting any environmental litigation associated with implementation and construction.

I'm sure there would be more to add, like reviewing the Department of the Interior's position regarding oil drilling and mining existing US resources to remove the pressure of importing foreign oil. I think it would be wise to use the French nuclear plant design based upon their history of success.

There must be a few members of Congress with integrity who may not be household names today, but would be tomorrow if they seized the opportunity. The problem may be that, since they currently impotent anyway, the lead may come from members currently listed as Republican. You know the prejudice and bigotry that would generate; however if one or two from the other side of the aisle have the guts to break away it may take off.

Timing couldn't be better. A little more than a year from now would be a good time to benchmark membership and candidates to run in the off year election. I have a sense that there is enough frustration with the status quo and the lack of distinction between the existing political parties to make this work. Doing it tonight, provides a forum to get attention; which is the biggest problem any of current third party options has to overcome.

Thinking of a name of this new political party took the longest. However I think I came up with a good one -

The LIBERAL PARTY

So named because it returns the word from its current bastardized common usage. Liberal can go back to representing the freedom to do the most with your life encumbered as little as possible by government regulation and taxes represents the liberty and freedom this country was founded.

Hey....I can dream can't I?




popeye1250 -> RE: Tonight's Opportunity For a New Party to be Born (9/9/2009 12:11:12 PM)

Merc, sounds good to me!
Imagine that, a party that wants to abide by the wishes of The People instead of "special interests!




pahunkboy -> RE: Tonight's Opportunity For a New Party to be Born (9/9/2009 12:41:07 PM)

I missed Larouches webcast- I hope it is in the archive.




DCWoody -> RE: Tonight's Opportunity For a New Party to be Born (9/9/2009 1:32:12 PM)

Nice fantasy, but can't see it happening.....it's only my opinion but I think the way the us system is set up will always lead over time to a polarising two-party system.....what you need first is a reform party, but can ya see a party espousing massive changes to the constitution getting anywhere?




scarlethiney -> RE: Tonight's Opportunity For a New Party to be Born (9/9/2009 1:56:19 PM)

 As much as I hate having to agree with you, you have a very well thought out plan here.  I would like to think that both parties could come to this conclusion together.

Sadly, I don't see that happening. 

I/We can hope though.




OrionTheWolf -> RE: Tonight's Opportunity For a New Party to be Born (9/9/2009 3:03:30 PM)

Hey Merc,

I like what I see so far. I might actually become a registered party member if this party were to come into existance, and carry through with these things.

BTW, where would this party stand on the Federal Reserve?




Mercnbeth -> RE: Tonight's Opportunity For a New Party to be Born (9/9/2009 3:19:04 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: OrionTheWolf

Hey Merc,

I like what I see so far. I might actually become a registered party member if this party were to come into existence, and carry through with these things.

BTW, where would this party stand on the Federal Reserve?

Hey back at 'ya Orion!

It doesn't consider off shore fishing rights either!

I don't think there is enough gold in the entire world to cover the paper being floated by the USA to consider going back to the gold standard. However, and without much thought applied to the answer, I'd say that by requiring a balanced budget the influence of the Fed to influence corporate and individual success and failure would be mitigated. I will represent that one thing for sure; if you fail - you earn the consequences, and won't get one penny in bail out money.

Remember this is my own personal pipe dream, and unfortunately, an exercise in futility. Unfortunately neither of us can join or register as a member of this mythical party. I doubt we would even get to see the concepts debated.




MusicalBoredom -> RE: Tonight's Opportunity For a New Party to be Born (9/9/2009 4:26:29 PM)

I would consider myself a "liberal" and I agree with all of those points completely.  (except we have to have the FCC to govern, license and enforce the use of radio frequencies but I don't think you object to that part).  Nice post!




Mercnbeth -> RE: Tonight's Opportunity For a New Party to be Born (9/9/2009 5:05:28 PM)

quote:

I would consider myself a "liberal"
Yeah - I always thought I was Liberal too even with all the accusations of being a write wing conservative N... (nope won't go there!)

quote:

except we have to have the FCC to govern, license and enforce the use of radio frequencies but I don't think you object to that part
No - having the FCC, do what they were chartered to do in the first place wouldn't be a problem.

Maybe that points to a way to gut a lot of bureaucracy; stop them from setting policy and force them to do the work they were charted to do in the first place taking away any arbitrary language currently used to justify expanding the scope of their authority powers.




SpinnerofTales -> RE: Tonight's Opportunity For a New Party to be Born (9/9/2009 5:25:07 PM)

I have to admit, I'd join that party...complete with party hat and noise maker. 




servantforuse -> RE: Tonight's Opportunity For a New Party to be Born (9/9/2009 5:57:00 PM)

If anyone wants to license and regulate the radio frquencies, maybe we should cut off all funding to PBS for a start.




Arpig -> RE: Tonight's Opportunity For a New Party to be Born (9/9/2009 10:00:28 PM)

I got to hand it to you Merc...when you dream, you dream big [:)]




FangsNfeet -> RE: Tonight's Opportunity For a New Party to be Born (9/10/2009 12:34:59 AM)

It's so easy a Cave Man can do it.




Louve00 -> RE: Tonight's Opportunity For a New Party to be Born (9/10/2009 4:55:31 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Mercnbeth

There are few times when circumstances set up unique opportunities for success; tonight is one of them. All it would take would be for a few men and woman of integrity in Congress to walk out of tonight's speech.

They leave, and hold a press conference, simulcast on the web announcing the formation of a new party with the following platform:
  • We will accept no campaign funds from any PAC or special interest groups.
  • Addressing the issue the President addressed tonight we propose the following:
    • Employers will be responsible to provide insurance for ALL full and part time employees at their cost.
    • All unemployed will be covered under an enhanced Medicare/Medicaid program; called 'US Care'.
    • US Care will be formed based upon the worlds best and most comprehensive insurance program in the world - the one which insures us, the members of Congress and all other Federal employees. In fact we will assign the managing administrators for that program to the conversion task of dismantling the existing program and merging it with the new US Care entity. The goal being that the poorest and most underprivileged of our citizens will have the same coverage as the most privileged holding the auditing powers. Participation in the US Care program commits the user to having all medical malpractice claims heard by a 5 person arbitration committee compromised of one individual from the AMA, ABA, AFL-CIO, Government Employees Union, ACLU.
    • Existing insurance companies will not be able to terminate coverage for a pre-existing condition.
    • The current top 5 health insurance companies will meet and in 30 days create 'boiler-plate' documents for administration and record keeping. It will be used by all insurance companies and health care providers.

  • We propose closing GITMO tomorrow and releasing all currently held prisoners back to their country of origin immediately with the apologies of the US Government.
  • We will withdraw from Afghanistan immediately.
  • We will begin withdraw from Iraq immediately.
  • We will establish a military presence on our borders.
  • We will increase enforcement of all current documented workers laws increasing the penalties against employees to include cost for deportation, fines, asset forfeiture, and imprisonment for owners and officers of companies employing undocumented workers.
  • ALL government bureaucracies will submit balanced budgets and no additional funds beyond the balanced budget will be provided.
  • Tax exempt status for all "religious" organizations will be repelled.
  • ALL "non-profit" and "not for profit" organizations will be required to manage to a zero balance annual budget, on a three year reporting basis.
  • Representing duplicity and overlapping of 'States Rights' the following Cabinet positions and bureaucracies will be closed:
    • Department of Health & Human Services
    • Department of Education
    • Department of Housing & Urban Development
    • Federal Communications Commission (Censorship should be in the hands of parents not government.)

  • We will only approve a Balanced Budget
  • Affirmative Action and Equal Employment Opportunity Act will be eliminated.
  • We will commit to building 100 nuclear power plants for producing energy in the next 5 years. We would fast track development and construction by prohibiting any environmental litigation associated with implementation and construction.
  • We will initiate a national intercity transportation program. Formulating a 'contest' for service providers with the best plan getting the contract. We would fast track development and construction by prohibiting any environmental litigation associated with implementation and construction.

I'm sure there would be more to add, like reviewing the Department of the Interior's position regarding oil drilling and mining existing US resources to remove the pressure of importing foreign oil. I think it would be wise to use the French nuclear plant design based upon their history of success.

There must be a few members of Congress with integrity who may not be household names today, but would be tomorrow if they seized the opportunity. The problem may be that, since they currently impotent anyway, the lead may come from members currently listed as Republican. You know the prejudice and bigotry that would generate; however if one or two from the other side of the aisle have the guts to break away it may take off.

Timing couldn't be better. A little more than a year from now would be a good time to benchmark membership and candidates to run in the off year election. I have a sense that there is enough frustration with the status quo and the lack of distinction between the existing political parties to make this work. Doing it tonight, provides a forum to get attention; which is the biggest problem any of current third party options has to overcome.

Thinking of a name of this new political party took the longest. However I think I came up with a good one -

The LIBERAL PARTY

So named because it returns the word from its current bastardized common usage. Liberal can go back to representing the freedom to do the most with your life encumbered as little as possible by government regulation and taxes represents the liberty and freedom this country was founded.

Hey....I can dream can't I?


I'd sign up.  Hell, I'd vote for ya, if you run, too!!   [sm=smile.gif]




awmslave -> RE: Tonight's Opportunity For a New Party to be Born (9/10/2009 2:29:24 PM)

quote:

Employers will be responsible to provide insurance for ALL full and part time employees at their cost.


I have never understood why are employers  involved in health-care? Would it be enough if they pay a decent salary? They do not have magic funds that come somewhere else than profits from business operations.
Can anybody explain this?




Mercnbeth -> RE: Tonight's Opportunity For a New Party to be Born (9/10/2009 3:11:23 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: awmslave
quote:

Employers will be responsible to provide insurance for ALL full and part time employees at their cost.

I have never understood why are employers  involved in health-care? Would it be enough if they pay a decent salary? They do not have magic funds that come somewhere else than profits from business operations.
Can anybody explain this?


I'll give it a try...

First, you know of course right now they aren't right? The manifesto is only for discussion purposes. DISCLAIMER OVER

You can take the response in two directions; the history of employer/employee relationship in the US or why I propose it as an idea to address the current health care issue.

The historical path takes too long and would end up high-jacking the thread. The short version is that the benefit was an employer compromise to stem the growing tide of the US moving to socialism during the last Depression. The decision was made by the 'movers & shakers' of the time that the best way to stem the tide of that movement was to give some desired goals to the workers as union concessions. After WWII when the job markets boomed, non-union workers and service providers were "given" that benefit as a incentive for employment. The cost wasn't such a big deal in those days. Ironically, because of the success of 'voluntary', or employer provided health-care, the US health system diverged from Europe which instead went directly to 'nationalized' health care after WWII.

Now look - that is a VERY short version and more was left out than included, but if you want more details do a historical search on the US labor movement starting in the 1920s - 30s.

Getting back to today, assigning the expense at the employer level does a couple of things. First, it takes the burden of administration and cost control out of the hands of the government which has no concept of budgeting and administration. Noteworthy in the President's speech last night, again missed by most, was he was going to fund a big chunk of it by cutting back on; quoting the President (click on it and it will take you to the text of the speech) "this plan would eliminate is the hundreds of billions of dollars in waste and fraud". No current health insurance company could survive such an admission from its CEO. Hell, the CEO couldn't survive admitting it. Yet, somehow putting more administration responsibility in the hands of the same administrators and increasing the use by 46 Million people will eliminate the problem. You buying that?

Businesses can't be taxed, neither can this expense be added on to them to impact their bottom line. Any bottom line impact will just work it way back up the P&L and be added to the end unit cost. As a result everyone will pay in increased service charges and/or fees. However, if you increase the pool the cost from the insurance company should go down.

For instance, I pay about $250/month per employee for the health coverage or about $45,000 per year. I know my people pretty well and I would guess that claims for the past 3 years averaged less than half that amount, or about $22,000. Now some of that 'extra' has to be put in reserve for 'catastrophic' claims; cancer, heath attack, etc. However for discussion purpose lets say net of that and expenses it produces a current 'profit' to my company of $5,000. On my floor there are 10 other similar businesses, but only 3 others pay for their employees. If all 10 business had to buy insurance the pool of 'healthy' workers gets greater and the cost should be less.

"Should" would be the word to focus upon and here is where administration and management comes into play. A bureaucrat, whose only existence is pushing papers, will get a renewal bill increasing premiums under those conditions and just pay it. An owner, or a manager whose income and/or bonus is reliant on the bottom line, will challenge and/or shop to keep the pressure on the source. Existing anti-trust regulations, if enforced, will insure that price fixing non-reflective of the growing pool of insured and the reduction of the premium to claims ratio.

Bottom line it is the best method to accomplish the goal of universal coverage at the lowest expense to the citizen base.

Appreciating that its a complicated question I hope I provided some insight to consider.




OrionTheWolf -> RE: Tonight's Opportunity For a New Party to be Born (9/10/2009 3:55:53 PM)

Wow Merc, you covered it pretty well. I have tried to explain this same thing to business owners, and the way things stand they of course only see an increase in their expenses. Now combine this with reducing health cost, and improving actual health care (see my topic here ), and we could actually have the best health care system in the world. Maybe that is too big of a dream.




awmslave -> RE: Tonight's Opportunity For a New Party to be Born (9/10/2009 4:53:42 PM)

quote:

Getting back to today, assigning the expense at the employer level does a couple of things. First, it takes the burden of administration and cost control out of the hands of the government which has no concept of budgeting and administration.


I do not know well US current system. Does employer pay directly to health service provider or is there an additional health insurance company involved? I suspect the employer involvement is inefficient way of doing things. In any case, why can not everybody buy insurance direct from a heath insurance company?  I do not see where the government needs to be involved.




tazzygirl -> RE: Tonight's Opportunity For a New Party to be Born (9/10/2009 5:16:35 PM)

Anyone with a pre-existing condition would either be denied coverage, or pay rates triple what others do.

The government involvement, according to the planners, would drive down cost through competition, as well as lower the rates of those who pay now by getting rid of the uninsured coverage part of any plan.

Between Medicare and Tricare, its been shown they can bargain for lower rates than private insurance companies.




Mercnbeth -> RE: Tonight's Opportunity For a New Party to be Born (9/10/2009 5:21:55 PM)

quote:

Does employer pay directly to health service provider or is there an additional health insurance company involved?
Yes
quote:

I suspect the employer involvement is inefficient way of doing things. In any case, why can not everybody buy insurance direct from a heath insurance company?
It isn't. Buying the same coverage I coverage I have as an individual would cost more. Buying it though a 'group' plan spreads the insurance risk. As a result the individual, or per unit, cost goes down. It's the same concept behind the reduced cost if every employee was required to provide coverage on a smaller scale.

Why would you think that the employer involvement makes the purchase "inefficient"? The employer is only contributing to paying the premium. The employer does not get involved with insurance administration or access beyond the macro decision of which insurance company to use and the level of coverage. There are a few different insurance companies to choose as an employer and an infinite variety of coverages currently available. As an individual you don't have access to the same variety of companies or coverage. Also as an individual you are currently subject to 'pre-existing' condition exclusions. As a member of a 'group' those exclusionary provisions usually don't apply.




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