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Torture - 9/10/2009 10:32:09 AM

billyInAustin

Posts: 12
Joined: 10/23/2007
Status: offline

This is a different sort of topic. I have lately been wondering about real torture in the original sense. Not in the submissive sense. What I mean is this. I have been thinking it would be a great experiment to be bound and helpless and be forced to do or say things I would never so without the torture. I have some very hard limits and would have to be in very severe pain to do them.
Thoughts?

Post #: 1

RE: Torture - 9/10/2009 10:36:48 AM

daintydimples

Posts: 967
Joined: 7/6/2009
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It sounds like you're looking for wank fodder.

_____________________________

Some soften by the forced reflection that comes from loss; others harden. Which are you?

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Post #: 2

RE: Torture - 9/10/2009 10:41:02 AM

AngelGeena

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My first thought was what they did to William Wallace (Mel Gibson) in Braveheart. Made me hurt. Or anything in the SAW movies.

< Message edited by AngelGeena -- 9/10/2009 10:42:45 AM >

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Owned heart and soul, bound to MZ forever.

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Post #: 3

RE: Torture - 9/10/2009 10:41:41 AM

Blaakmaan

Posts: 374
Joined: 5/21/2007
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: billyInAustin

This is a different sort of topic. I have lately been wondering about real torture in the original sense. Not in the submissive sense. What I mean is this. I have been thinking it would be a great experiment to be bound and helpless and be forced to do or say things I would never so without the torture. I have some very hard limits and would have to be in very severe pain to do them.
Thoughts?

Well, my thought is more of a question: Do you REALLY know what torture is?

As they say, be careful what you ask for.

(in reply to billyInAustin)

Post #: 4

RE: Torture - 9/10/2009 10:43:27 AM

billyInAustin

Posts: 12
Joined: 10/23/2007
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Blaakmaan

quote:

ORIGINAL: billyInAustin

This is a different sort of topic. I have lately been wondering about real torture in the original sense. Not in the submissive sense. What I mean is this. I have been thinking it would be a great experiment to be bound and helpless and be forced to do or say things I would never so without the torture. I have some very hard limits and would have to be in very severe pain to do them.
Thoughts?

Well, my thought is more of a question: Do you REALLY know what torture is?

As they say, be careful what you ask for.

Of course. It was just a topic for discussion.

(in reply to Blaakmaan)

Post #: 5

RE: Torture - 9/10/2009 10:49:36 AM

CarrieO

Posts: 2432
Joined: 1/27/2008
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quote:

ORIGINAL: billyInAustin

This is a different sort of topic. I have lately been wondering about real torture in the original sense. Not in the submissive sense. What I mean is this. I have been thinking it would be a great experiment to be bound and helpless and be forced to do or say things I would never so without the torture. I have some very hard limits and would have to be in very severe pain to do them.
Thoughts?

Thoughts on what? The topic is actual torture, right? What's your question?

_____________________________

"No matter what happens in the kitchen, never apologize"~Julia Child~

(in reply to billyInAustin)

Post #: 6

RE: Torture - 9/10/2009 12:14:24 PM

billyInAustin

Posts: 12
Joined: 10/23/2007
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I did a really bad job on what I was trying to say. I meant play torture to make someone do something vs. submission. That is all i meant, was looking for thoughts

(in reply to billyInAustin)

Post #: 7

RE: Torture - 9/10/2009 12:38:13 PM

DesFIP

Posts: 25191
Joined: 11/25/2007
From: Apple County NY
Status: offline

One of those things that are better in fantasy then in reality.

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Cynical and proud of it!

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Post #: 8

RE: Torture - 9/10/2009 12:57:03 PM

leadership527

Posts: 5026
Joined: 6/2/2008
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I think you have no idea what the word "torture" means. If you did, you would not, under any circumstances, desire it for yourself.

_____________________________

~Jeff

I didn't so much "enslave" Carol as I did "enlove" her. - Me
I want a joyous, loving, respectful relationship where the male is in charge and deserves to be. - DavanKael

(in reply to billyInAustin)

Post #: 9

RE: Torture - 9/10/2009 12:57:49 PM

lovingpet

Posts: 4270
Joined: 6/19/2005
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You are wanting to be induced into giving up your hard limits? I don't think it really takes a torture scene to do that, just chemistry with the right person whom you trust. I have gone well beyond anything I thought I could even consider only because I found a partner who is able to take me there and who I know will help me through any consequences. I would think that torture would erode your ability to let go and cross those lines. It may well become a mental block to the very process of giving up those limits that you seek.

Torture in and of itself is not the issue. My concern lies with what you are attempting to do with it. Giving up limits normally takes trust and torture can to fly in the face of that. I would not put it past my partner to design such a session for us, but I also have a basis of trust going in. I don't have limits as such, but things that I have expressed strongly that I do not want or fear. If he chooses to go there, I have to know he has already planned for any fall out from that decision and is going to hold me up as I get through the session and all the aftermath. If I didn't know that he had, I don't know if I could possibly go through with it as much as I may desire to not hold up a wall. Torture would simply be spice for us because there is already the tacit understanding that my "limits" are in his hands. It may give us a mental edge on which to play and we greatly enjoy that. This would be an incredibly heavy session and I would need a lot of recovery time with him after.

Don't know if I really answered the question, OP, but that's how it would function for us.

lovingpet

(in reply to DesFIP)

Post #: 10

RE: Torture - 9/10/2009 1:57:53 PM

slaveluci

Posts: 4294
Joined: 3/2/2007
From: Little Rock, AR
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: billyInAustin

This is a different sort of topic. I have lately been wondering about real torture in the original sense. Not in the submissive sense. What I mean is this. I have been thinking it would be a great experiment to be bound and helpless and be forced to do or say things I would never so without the torture. I have some very hard limits and would have to be in very severe pain to do them.
Thoughts?

You mean THIS kind of torture?:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NG2zyeVRcbs

Aaaarrrgggghhhh, mercy please!!!!!

luci

_____________________________

To choose a good book, look in an inquisitor’s prohibited list. ~John Aikin

(in reply to billyInAustin)

Post #: 11

RE: Torture - 9/10/2009 2:02:37 PM

CaringandReal

Posts: 1397
Joined: 2/15/2008
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quote:

ORIGINAL: billyInAustin

I did a really bad job on what I was trying to say. I meant play torture to make someone do something vs. submission. That is all i meant, was looking for thoughts

Some people play that way. It's edgy. You'll find ideas about it by reading up on "interrogation scenes" within a bdsm context. They occur and some people are expert in designing them. The pain and fear involved in these scenes can go very far, but stop short of the maiming or doing other harm that occurs in real torture. The version in which you say something (like give up a piece of information) when the pain becomes too much is an easier version to bear than the one in which you must give up a hard limit in order to stop the pain and the one in which nothing you say or do stops it. Giving up the information during an interrogation is sort of like having a safe word. The spin is a little different because the whole point of this sort of game is to hold out as long as you possibly can. Anyway, in my opinion, it's the version to start out with, as you get your feet wet and see if you like it. If you find you like it, then try one of the more extreme versions.

_____________________________

"A friend who bleeds is better" --placebo

"How seldom we recognize the sound when the bolt of our fate slides home." --thomas harris

(in reply to billyInAustin)

Post #: 12

RE: Torture - 9/10/2009 2:15:30 PM

daintydimples

Posts: 967
Joined: 7/6/2009
Status: offline

You are wanting to be induced into giving up your hard limits? I don't think it really takes a torture scene to do that, just chemistry with the right person whom you trust. I have gone well beyond anything I thought I could even consider only because I found a partner who is able to take me there and who I know will help me through any consequences. I would think that torture would erode your ability to let go and cross those lines. It may well become a mental block to the very process of giving up those limits that you seek.

Reasons why I really like lovingpet, she gives good post !!

Not only will the right dominant find your limits and push them, the right dominant is looking to do just exactly that. To find and push limits the submissive *wants/needs* to have found and pushed. It's what makes for a good dynamic.

_____________________________

Some soften by the forced reflection that comes from loss; others harden. Which are you?

(in reply to CaringandReal)

Post #: 13

RE: Torture - 9/10/2009 4:04:39 PM

SweetNika

Posts: 955
Joined: 4/19/2008
From: Forest Hills, Maryland
Status: offline

I know that for me, if my hard limits were pushed or broken that that act in itself would be a form of torture for me and not in a fun playful sense. It would do definate damage to me on many levels and would destroy the relationship. My hard limits are there for various reasons. If something is a hard limit, why would you want to push that? Don't hard limits exist for reasons? I know mine do. Do you truly know what it means to live with the aftermath of a tramatic or harmful scene (physically or mentally)? Do you know how you would react if those hard limits are pushed? To me personally it's not worth the risk and I love pushing myself, that rush. But somethings, simply are not worth the consequences - somethings are best left to the fantasy world.

< Message edited by SweetNika -- 9/10/2009 4:05:40 PM >

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Blessed be,
Nika

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Post #: 14

RE: Torture - 9/10/2009 4:23:49 PM

lovingpet

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Joined: 6/19/2005
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What I have found along the way, though, is that hard limits are not always there for the reason the person THINKS they are serving. This is especially true for those who are coming in new or who have gone through a nasty situation within a D/s relationship. I was absolutely certain I didn't want anything to do with canes. Now they are a favorite. I would have considered them a hard limit in the early going. My partner showed me otherwise. I have had this occur with far more serious "limits" too. We place these limits because of past pain, fear, and lack of knowledge. When trust deepens, some of these areas become more open to some experimentation. It is not at all that they weren't a hard limit to begin with, but that it was functioning as a limit in a different way than one thought. I definitely wouldn't push anyone to explore hard or even soft limits if there wasn't trust and a lot of it.

The belief that a thing carries a certain level of inherent harm or negative consequences is fear. Fear is good. It keeps us safe, but it can also stifle growth and progress. It is a delicate balance knowing how much fear is healthy and how much is just holding us back. Just some thoughts based on my experience only. Others' paths will differ I know.

lovingpet

(in reply to SweetNika)

Post #: 15

RE: Torture - 9/10/2009 4:33:23 PM

efwb2

Posts: 2
Joined: 2/19/2009
Status: offline

1. the act of inflicting excruciating pain, as punishment or revenge, as a means of getting a confession or information, or for sheer cruelty. 2. a method of inflicting such pain. 3. Often, tortures. the pain or suffering caused or undergone. 4. extreme anguish of body or mind; agony. 5. a cause of severe pain or anguish.

Really torture is differant for everybody for some people it is pushing or breaking there hard limits, for others its punishing the person to try and break them. the Romans used the whip the chinises water torture. The Church Thumb screews and everything else, so really if you say you want to play with torture you have to be more precise with what you mean.

For me torture is working with in someones limits to make those that want to submit, submit further or as part of there training.

EL

(in reply to SweetNika)

Post #: 16

RE: Torture - 9/10/2009 6:15:31 PM

IronBear

Posts: 9008
Joined: 6/19/2005
From: Beenleigh, Qld, Australia
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: billyInAustin

This is a different sort of topic. I have lately been wondering about real torture in the original sense. Not in the submissive sense. What I mean is this. I have been thinking it would be a great experiment to be bound and helpless and be forced to do or say things I would never so without the torture. I have some very hard limits and would have to be in very severe pain to do them.
Thoughts?

I seriously doubt if you or many contributors here have any first hand knowledge of what "Real" torture is, to be tortured/hard interrogated, or to hard interrogate/torture someone. I have practical/physical experience in both counts and it is far worse than your worse nightmare. I suggest you keep these wonderings in the realm of fantasy and stay well away from reality unless you want nightmares lasting years.

_____________________________

Iron Bear

Master of Bruin Cottage

http://www.bruincottage.org

Your attitude, words & actions are yours. Take responsibility for them and the consequences they incur.

D.I.L.L.I.G.A.F.

(in reply to billyInAustin)

Post #: 17

RE: Torture - 9/10/2009 6:23:41 PM

lovingpet

Posts: 4270
Joined: 6/19/2005
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quote:

ORIGINAL: IronBear

quote:

ORIGINAL: billyInAustin

This is a different sort of topic. I have lately been wondering about real torture in the original sense. Not in the submissive sense. What I mean is this. I have been thinking it would be a great experiment to be bound and helpless and be forced to do or say things I would never so without the torture. I have some very hard limits and would have to be in very severe pain to do them.
Thoughts?

I seriously doubt if you or many contributors here have any first hand knowledge of what "Real" torture is, to be tortured/hard interrogated, or to hard interrogate/torture someone. I have practical/physical experience in both counts and it is far worse than your worse nightmare. I suggest you keep these wonderings in the realm of fantasy and stay well away from reality unless you want nightmares lasting years.

I can attest this is quite true! Real torture is nothing to be toyed around with. Very few, and I mean that, have any business messing around with this.

lovingpet

(in reply to IronBear)

Post #: 18

RE: Torture - 9/10/2009 8:25:25 PM

Acer49

Posts: 1434
Joined: 8/7/2009
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: billyInAustin

This is a different sort of topic. I have lately been wondering about real torture in the original sense. Not in the submissive sense. What I mean is this. I have been thinking it would be a great experiment to be bound and helpless and be forced to do or say things I would never so without the torture. I have some very hard limits and would have to be in very severe pain to do them.
Thoughts?

I think you should post this on your journal and not here as I do not think you are truly looking fore an answer

_____________________________

Never be bullied into silence. Never allow yourself to be made a victim. Accept no one's definition of your life; define yourself.
Harvey Fierstein

(in reply to billyInAustin)

Post #: 19

RE: Torture - 9/10/2009 9:15:30 PM

HeavansKeeper

Posts: 1254
Joined: 5/14/2007
Status: offline

I think I understand what Billy is heading toward.

There are multiple engines to drive people's motives. Devotion, anger, avoidance of pain... Most willing participants of D/s either will do an act or consider it a hard limit, and view requiring it to be abusive. At this point it gets ugly: safe-word or lawsuit.

I can see the allure of pushing someone into certain acts with the "your devotion is irrelevant, so long as you're obedient" mentality. It's kind of sexy, maybe... "It doesn't matter what you think, feel, or say - so long as you do as told." The sick perverted side of me grins wickedly thinking of a crying bottom continuing anyway.

But it's still a farce. At this point, the bottom is either continuing to consent or is being assaulted/battered/raped. It's that simple.

I'll be the first to say assault, battery, and rape are all bad. BAD BAD BAD. That means it's a catch-22. If they submit from the torture, then they actually consent all along, they just wanted to play out the emotions of the role play. If they honestly do not wish to continue, the top is a violent criminal.

I'll point out that role playing "torture", rape, forced bisexuality can all feel very real. And there can be very real internal struggle as well. But in the end, it's all a game.

_____________________________

The Loving Owner of HisHeavan

... You've waited your whole life for this moment...

(in reply to Acer49)

Post #: 20

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