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RE: Lets cut border patrol - 9/25/2009 11:53:50 PM   
ElaineSubmits


Posts: 49
Joined: 10/30/2005
Status: offline 		I'm reminded of this song by Tom Russell, "Who's Gonna Build Your Wall?" http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LZkAoosVLkA

"We've got fundamentalist Moslems
We've got fundamentalist Jews
We've got fundamentalist Christians
They'll blow the whole thing up for you

But as I travel around this big old world
There's one thing that I most fear
It's a white man in a golf shirt
With a cell phone in his ear"

(in reply to sappatoti)
Profile   Post #: 21
RE: Lets cut border patrol - 9/26/2009 2:21:56 AM   
Arrogance


Posts: 185
Joined: 7/29/2009
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: gift4mistress

quote:

ORIGINAL: mnottertail

well if you slosh around I am sure that there is a recession on and the government isnt taking in even the meager tax revenues that it used to, as well as the fence that was built has had 3,000 holes cut in it at 1000 bucks a pop to repair, so that should keep us safe.

Was that fence a democratic idea?


I would much rather them cut off welfare than to cut off the border patrol agents. There is a very real possible scenario that can be played out where people bring in biological/nuclear weapons to use on us through the southern border.


Seriously? No.

(in reply to gift4mistress)
Profile   Post #: 22
RE: Lets cut border patrol - 9/26/2009 7:10:24 AM   
popeye1250


Posts: 18104
Joined: 1/27/2006
From: New Hampshire
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: mnottertail


quote:

ORIGINAL: servantforuse

Instead of reducing agents on the border, we should hire and train more. Maybe then the illegals crossing the border couldn't cut holes in the fence.


So, bigger government is the conservatives answer to any imagined threat?


I dunno, is Obama "conserative?" He and the Dems are the ones in control now since,...Jan.
He sure seems to be if you look at what he's done so far, "Liberals" don't bail out big corporations do they?
They could always keep those Border Agents and lay off 116 desk jockeys in the State Dept or another "do nothing" gvt. dept for example for a "wash."
Coast Guard "code" for the State Dept is, "white collar welfare."

_____________________________

"But Your Honor, this is not a Jury of my Peers, these people are all decent, honest, law-abiding citizens!"

(in reply to mnottertail)
Profile   Post #: 23
RE: Lets cut border patrol - 9/26/2009 7:37:09 AM   
rikigrl


Posts: 203
Joined: 5/14/2009
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: GreedyTop

oh, god.. here we go...............


LMAO!!

(in reply to GreedyTop)
Profile   Post #: 24
RE: Lets cut border patrol - 9/26/2009 7:51:46 AM   
fluffypet61


Posts: 28879
Joined: 12/25/2006
From: New Jersey
Status: offline 		ALL the undocumented Mexicans i came across when i lived in Ok had come through REGULAR BORDER CROSSING POINTS, not through fences or rivers.  Many had come leagally on visas and simply stayed when the visa expired.  Others had used someone else's identity to cross. 
 

 
 

_____________________________

fluffy

"an exuberant example of libido continuing along regardless of age" - Kia

"Commandment Number One for any truly civilized society is this: Let people be different." -David Grayson


(in reply to rikigrl)
Profile   Post #: 25
RE: Lets cut border patrol - 9/26/2009 11:09:07 AM   
xBullx


Posts: 4206
Joined: 10/8/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: DavanKael

Border patrol is ineffective.  What I find puzzling is why they want to beef up the Canadian forces: to keep Canadians out or Americans in?!
  Davan


Them damn Canadians are coming after our health care.....

Hurry build a wall...

_____________________________

Live well,

Bull



I'm not an asshole; I'm simply resolute...

"A Republic, If You Can Keep It."

Caution: My humor is a bit skewed.

(in reply to DavanKael)
Profile   Post #: 26
RE: Lets cut border patrol - 9/26/2009 11:22:03 AM   
inevertell


Posts: 3
Joined: 9/23/2009
Status: offline 		Its the same principle they use in local government and schools systems. When they are approaching a budgetary crisis, the city immediately says, "We'll have to cut police and fire coverage to make up for it." The school district say, "We'll have to cut bus service and extracurricular activities to make up for it." They remove the things you want, or threaten to, and by this extortion ensure they will be able to pass tax increases. Its just more crooked politics.

But, liberals have never been big on border protection, and conservatives haven't had the balls to stand together and force action on it. Right now our borders are so porous entire battalions of troops could enter our country without being noticed. And with all of the trouble at the southern border now due to the drug cartels, that is spilling into our souther U.S. cities as well, taking away border protection should be the last thing ANY politician should suggest.

Traitorous actually..... if you read your history, you'll agree with this: If Thomas Jefferson were alive today, probably a full half of the politicians in Washington would be hanged for treason.

(in reply to gift4mistress)
Profile   Post #: 27
RE: Lets cut border patrol - 9/29/2009 10:14:10 AM   
thebongripper


Posts: 31
Joined: 9/2/2009
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: servantforuse

Instead of reducing agents on the border, we should hire and train more. Maybe then the illegals crossing the border couldn't cut holes in the fence.


You cannot keep illegals from coming here with a fence, or with a bunch of rednecks carrying rifles. The only way that Mexicans as well as other illegals will stop coming to our country is when their country gets better. Which, of course, no one in this forum is going to agree with because all Americans care about is America.

(in reply to servantforuse)
Profile   Post #: 28
RE: Lets cut border patrol - 9/29/2009 10:22:29 AM   
AnimusRex


Posts: 2165
Joined: 5/13/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: gift4mistress

I would much rather them cut off welfare than to cut off the border patrol agents. There is a very real possible scenario that can be played out where people bring in biological/nuclear weapons to use on us through the southern border.


Interesting point- you do know, don't you, that the only real terrorist we ever caught crossing the border was that guy in 2000 who was crossing the....Canadian border into Washington.

The Canadian border as Arpig and rulemylife point out, is 4,000 miles long and is for the most part unguarded. So why the fixation on "terrorists" coming up from the smaller Mexican border?


< Message edited by AnimusRex -- 9/29/2009 10:25:38 AM >

(in reply to gift4mistress)
Profile   Post #: 29
RE: Lets cut border patrol - 9/29/2009 10:28:25 AM   
mick3y0


Posts: 10
Joined: 9/25/2009
Status: offline 		FYI, you cut welfare you'll just create extreme poverty which will just lead to more crime. Then we're feeding and caring for these individuals as they are in jail for years which cost far more than giving them a $100 bucks every month ever will amount to.

(in reply to AnimusRex)
Profile   Post #: 30
RE: Lets cut border patrol - 9/29/2009 10:34:39 AM   
AnimusRex


Posts: 2165
Joined: 5/13/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Arpig

quote:

FR...

The Mexican border could easily be sealed at far less a cost and without firing any border guards but the political will is not there to do it

I'm with thornhappy on this one FDD, just how would you seal the border at such low cost?


Ooh oohh! I know!
We just hire a bunch of low wage illegal Mexican immigrants, you see? I always see a bunch of them hanging around Home Depot.

This whole hysteria about illegals is nonsense. Immigrants are actually good for America, in that they bring competitiveness and new ideas and vitality to the country. The people who are terrified of immigrants are the ones, frankly, who are unable to work as hard or as fast or as efficiently.

(in reply to Arpig)
Profile   Post #: 31
RE: Lets cut border patrol - 9/29/2009 10:48:10 AM   
popeye1250


Posts: 18104
Joined: 1/27/2006
From: New Hampshire
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: thebongripper

quote:

ORIGINAL: servantforuse

Instead of reducing agents on the border, we should hire and train more. Maybe then the illegals crossing the border couldn't cut holes in the fence.


You cannot keep illegals from coming here with a fence, or with a bunch of rednecks carrying rifles. The only way that Mexicans as well as other illegals will stop coming to our country is when their country gets better. Which, of course, no one in this forum is going to agree with because all Americans care about is America.



Bongripper, not so, I'd like to see the Mexicans and other countries make their countries better too but *when* are they going to start?

_____________________________

"But Your Honor, this is not a Jury of my Peers, these people are all decent, honest, law-abiding citizens!"

(in reply to thebongripper)
Profile   Post #: 32
RE: Lets cut border patrol - 9/29/2009 11:10:57 AM   
Mercnbeth


Posts: 11766
Status: offline
quote:

Immigrants are actually good for America, in that they bring competitiveness and new ideas and vitality to the country.
Personally, I agree - without them, I couldn't afford my gardener, my pool boy, or my handy man. They are not 'illegal' but their prices are impacted because of the illegals currently here willing to work for less.

Philosophically, their cost to the economy and the labor force in the US is massive. Whether considering their direct impact on costs; one side welcoming their impact on low food costs, while the other side takes into account the high unemployment rate for US citizens; or the cost of government services they use; offset by their payment of sales tax and other fees; there is no denying the illegal workers impact the US economy. Attacking them or using them as pawns in the matter of border security is a distracting argument. The solution to address the issue is not at the border level or at the individual worker level. There's a simply solution to eliminating the problem - target the employers.

The necessary laws are already on the books as a result of the last 'amnesty', represented at the time just like this one. In 1986, a Republican President, signed the 'Immigration Reform and Control Act (IRCA)':

President Ronald Reagan signed that bill into law with great fanfare amid promises that it would grant legal status to illegal immigrants, crack down on employers who hired illegal workers and secure the border once and for all. Instead, fraudulent applications tainted the process, many employers continued their illicit hiring practices, and illegal immigration surged.

It was going to be the solution. Obviously it wasn't. However too much money is in play and too many special interest groups paying off Congress won't let that happen. Tyson needs cheap labor and they are willing to pay lobbyists to prevent any existing law enforcement, let alone increasing penalties against ownership and management.

(in reply to AnimusRex)
Profile   Post #: 33
RE: Lets cut border patrol - 9/29/2009 9:45:37 PM   
thebongripper


Posts: 31
Joined: 9/2/2009
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: popeye1250


quote:

ORIGINAL: thebongripper

quote:

ORIGINAL: servantforuse

Instead of reducing agents on the border, we should hire and train more. Maybe then the illegals crossing the border couldn't cut holes in the fence.


You cannot keep illegals from coming here with a fence, or with a bunch of rednecks carrying rifles. The only way that Mexicans as well as other illegals will stop coming to our country is when their country gets better. Which, of course, no one in this forum is going to agree with because all Americans care about is America.



Bongripper, not so, I'd like to see the Mexicans and other countries make their countries better too but *when* are they going to start?



That's my point.

They need a push in the right direction.

(in reply to popeye1250)
Profile   Post #: 34
RE: Lets cut border patrol - 9/29/2009 11:38:21 PM   
popeye1250


Posts: 18104
Joined: 1/27/2006
From: New Hampshire
Status: offline 		Well go down there and push them if you want. I couldn't care less what happens in those countries.
I don't know where that train of thought comes from that Americans should "care" about what happens in foreign countries, we can' even get the pols in D.C. to "care" about what happens in our country.
Look at many or most of the countries in Africa, the West has poured in hundreds of billions in foreign aid over the last 40 years and nothing's changed except the lobbyists in D.C. are a lot richer and U.S. Taxpayers have been ripped off for the last 40 years.
Fuck foreign countries, no more money!

_____________________________

"But Your Honor, this is not a Jury of my Peers, these people are all decent, honest, law-abiding citizens!"

(in reply to thebongripper)
Profile   Post #: 35
RE: Lets cut border patrol - 9/30/2009 11:53:19 AM   
thebongripper


Posts: 31
Joined: 9/2/2009
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: popeye1250

Well go down there and push them if you want. I couldn't care less what happens in those countries.
I don't know where that train of thought comes from that Americans should "care" about what happens in foreign countries, we can' even get the pols in D.C. to "care" about what happens in our country.
Look at many or most of the countries in Africa, the West has poured in hundreds of billions in foreign aid over the last 40 years and nothing's changed except the lobbyists in D.C. are a lot richer and U.S. Taxpayers have been ripped off for the last 40 years.
Fuck foreign countries, no more money!



Fuck nationalism and fuck capitalism.

I'm not talking about helping foreign countries, I'm talking about helping human beings. You can argue your political bullshit all you want, but in the end, if you were in their shoes, you'd be wanting the exact same thing.

Do you know why our relief efforts haven't done anything in Africa? Because we SEND THEM food and protection instead of teaching them how to grow crops and protect themselves. Maybe if we actually EDUCATED people, as opposed to just throwing them a bone, they would actually be able to help themselves.

(in reply to popeye1250)
Profile   Post #: 36
RE: Lets cut border patrol - 9/30/2009 12:05:14 PM   
sappatoti


Posts: 14844
Joined: 10/30/2006
From: the edge of darkness...
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: thebongripper
quote:

ORIGINAL: popeye1250
... Fuck foreign countries, no more money!

Fuck nationalism and fuck capitalism.

I'm not talking about helping foreign countries, I'm talking about helping human beings. You can argue your political bullshit all you want, but in the end, if you were in their shoes, you'd be wanting the exact same thing.

Do you know why our relief efforts haven't done anything in Africa? Because we SEND THEM food and protection instead of teaching them how to grow crops and protect themselves. Maybe if we actually EDUCATED people, as opposed to just throwing them a bone, they would actually be able to help themselves.

Actually, the reason why humanitarian efforts have failed is because the governments of those people have interfered with those attempting to help their people, or have you not yet taken the initiative to read the blogs of relief workers in those regions you mentioned to understand this?

The point is, we do not get to deal with the internal affairs of another country without some sort of acknowledgment of their government; meaning, we either work with them to better the lives of their citizens or we make war and move those "uncooperative" governments out of the way. There isn't any other way.

Unless you hold the secret and if so, please tell us. Taking the simplistic "fuck nationalism" approach is not a solution unless you have specific actions in mind on how to back that up.

_____________________________

Never mind the man on the edge of the darkness... he means no harm...

"Community, Identity, Stability." ~ A Brave New World, Aldous Huxley, 1932

If you don't like my attitude, QUIT TALKING TO ME!

(in reply to thebongripper)
Profile   Post #: 37
RE: Lets cut border patrol - 9/30/2009 2:13:31 PM   
DomImus


Posts: 2004
Joined: 3/17/2009
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Arpig
I'm with thornhappy on this one FDD, just how would you seal the border at such low cost?


Go to every spot on the border that is easily breached and popular for crossing. Paint a crosswalk. Problem solved.




_____________________________

"Regret for the things we did can be tempered by time; it is regret for the things we did not do that is inconsolable." Sidney J. harris

(in reply to Arpig)
Profile   Post #: 38
RE: Lets cut border patrol - 9/30/2009 4:27:52 PM   
popeye1250


Posts: 18104
Joined: 1/27/2006
From: New Hampshire
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: thebongripper

quote:

ORIGINAL: popeye1250

Well go down there and push them if you want. I couldn't care less what happens in those countries.
I don't know where that train of thought comes from that Americans should "care" about what happens in foreign countries, we can' even get the pols in D.C. to "care" about what happens in our country.
Look at many or most of the countries in Africa, the West has poured in hundreds of billions in foreign aid over the last 40 years and nothing's changed except the lobbyists in D.C. are a lot richer and U.S. Taxpayers have been ripped off for the last 40 years.
Fuck foreign countries, no more money!



Fuck nationalism and fuck capitalism.

I'm not talking about helping foreign countries, I'm talking about helping human beings. You can argue your political bullshit all you want, but in the end, if you were in their shoes, you'd be wanting the exact same thing.

Do you know why our relief efforts haven't done anything in Africa? Because we SEND THEM food and protection instead of teaching them how to grow crops and protect themselves. Maybe if we actually EDUCATED people, as opposed to just throwing them a bone, they would actually be able to help themselves.




Bong, if you feel so strongly about it go find your checkbook!
Why should foreign countries get up off of their asses if they think that "America will keep doing it for us?"
It hasn't worked very well in the last 40 years has it? "Educated people?" Do they not know how to grow crops?
That's the job of *their governments* not ours.
If individuals want to use their own funds for such purposes fine, but Taxpayer Dollars should't be used for such things.
We have 50 million people in the U.S. with no healthcare yet *their* Taxdollars go to build hospitals in ratbag foreign countries!
The people in Washington are supposed to be running our government, not a charity for foregn countries! That's not the Job Decription.

_____________________________

"But Your Honor, this is not a Jury of my Peers, these people are all decent, honest, law-abiding citizens!"

(in reply to thebongripper)
Profile   Post #: 39
RE: Lets cut border patrol - 9/30/2009 4:48:29 PM   
thornhappy


Posts: 8596
Joined: 12/16/2006
Status: offline 		Yup.  They just need a California Water Project.  Or an Oglalla Aquifer.  Stuff like that.

(in reply to popeye1250)
Profile   Post #: 40
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