RE: Extreme BDSM & Ethics

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OrionTheWolf -> RE: Extreme BDSM & Ethics (10/7/2009 4:09:40 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: MartinP quote: ORIGINAL: OrionTheWolf I have not as yet had to backhand my girl, but she knows it is not out of the realm of possibilities if needed. Orion, so you did not split her lips after all? Nice back-pedaling! Not a back pedal. Research some of my posts, and you will see I do not back pedal, even if I have an unpopular opinion on a subject. quote: If it is so easy to understand why slapping a defenseless woman is right (and yes, this woman is defenseless to you if not to others) , it must also be easy to explain it. Why don't you give it a try? Will give it a try, but with your western bred morality leading the way, you will likely not understand. My girl begged my collar knowing that she would be treated as if she had no rights. She did so knowing that I will not put up with any of the bullshit she has tried with me before, and done to many males repeatedly. She knows that short of breaking a bone purposefully (or something equally damaging) I will use physical force when she gets one of her emotional episodes. You see, she realizes that it is her emotional episodes, that happen rarely, that has caused her relationship and life issues in the past. I will do what is necessary to stop those. quote: It would surely establish you as the Man and me as a poor jerk. Something that your authority arguments will never achieve. Now this is a chivalreque gantlett thrown. But I am afraid it will remain on the soil. Actually your own words have established you as a jerk. I am just me, and often an asshole. You see I own my actions. quote: As for you lady, I am sorry to say, but her pictures do not show her with an good BMI, I may be mistaken, but it looks to me like anorexy which is not an insult but a treatable disease, like walking with a white cane and black glasses lead me to think of a person as blind. Is calling the later "blind" an insult? OK, for the sake of political correctness, I will correct it to visually-challenged, and she is gravitationnaly-challenged. Happy now? So do you have a medical degree? If so, you would offer a diagnosis via just pictures? Are you aware of her caloric intake, activity, and muscle density? Actually now who seems to be back pedaling? You offer more insult and denying your own mistake of a misdiagnosis, by offering a red herring of not being PC. Pretty deceptive in my opinion. You see my property is with me 24/7 and I have known her very well for a few years, so I am pretty sure I am in a better position to judge her health. quote: Speaking of her, I checked all posts under her profile, and all six are signed "Orion", not "Orion's property". I may not like your ways, but at least you are honest. Thus I suppose that a direct rebuttal of her is out of question. Let us assume that it would be beneath her dignity. Yeah those are mistaken posts where she reads the boards, but does not like to post, and then I pulled the site up after her and not realizing she had not logged out (which removes the cookie). A direct rebuttal of what? I offered her comments, but you likely just disbelieve them. If you are ever in Atlanta, we can have a beer and she can tell you to your face that you act like every pussy whipped male she has ever wrapped around her finger. People like you rarely ever try and understand anything, though there is some information for ya.

OrionTheWolf -> RE: Extreme BDSM & Ethics (10/7/2009 4:12:58 PM)
But LP you are the weaker sex and must be protected [:-]. Gawd I would love to see you in the room with MartinP. I truly believe that he does not realize what he is actually saying. quote: ORIGINAL: LadyPact quote: ORIGINAL: MartinP Lovingpet, as much as would like to discuss with you the submissive aspect of the matter, I am currently focused on the dominant side. It is one thing to like being "beat bloody", it is quite another to beat somebody else bloody, especially when this person is not able of responding in kind. I am sure you understand me. Now I understand. So you're all good with Me unleashing My sadistic desires on My boy because it's something we both want. However, if I were a male, I would suddenly be wrong for doing the same thing in a hetro dynamic.

lovingpet -> RE: Extreme BDSM & Ethics (10/7/2009 4:18:26 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: LadyPact quote: ORIGINAL: MartinP Lovingpet, as much as would like to discuss with you the submissive aspect of the matter, I am currently focused on the dominant side. It is one thing to like being "beat bloody", it is quite another to beat somebody else bloody, especially when this person is not able of responding in kind. I am sure you understand me. Now I understand. So you're all good with Me unleashing My sadistic desires on My boy because it's something we both want. However, if I were a male, I would suddenly be wrong for doing the same thing in a hetro dynamic. Thank you LP! No, Martin, I'm sorry, but I really don't understand at all. I happen to be switch, so I am perfectly capable and willing to dispatch the same to any submissive partner that would be trusting enough and understand me well enough to want to go there with me. I don't see how I am not able to respond in kind. What you are still missing is that choosing to not beat me bloody when that is what I want, need, and desire is actually a deep rejection of me and would kill any further dynamic between us. Denying me for other reasons may or may not have similar effect, but based on the reason you are implying, you are basically saying that what I desire is deplorable and I must have a nut loose for wanting it. You are restraining yourself, in this kind of case, out of loathing for something within me, not for fear of what is in YOU. If you are concerned what might lie beneath the surface if you ever let go to that extent and so refrain, that is completely another thing. I would admire your restraint and consideration for my welfare, though I may very well go on to serve you by helping you come to terms with whatever it is so that you can be free as well and I can absorb the fullest measure of those things you demonstrate to me by those means: the love, lust, acceptance, and more. I am there with my partner just as much when he is fighting his own demons as I am when he is so self assured. He takes me by the hand and helps me defeat mine. My greatest honor is to get to do the same in kind. Yes, I'm sorry, but I just don't get it. I don't see why I need protecting from MY OWN desires. I don't see a partner who would determine this as truly understanding me and accepting me in my entirety. I would find myself forever having to hedge and hide. In other words, I would find myself unable to trust that person and I guess at that point your dilemma would be solved because I would be out the door. lovingpet

MartinP -> RE: Extreme BDSM & Ethics (10/7/2009 4:18:59 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: RedMagic1 So you sabotage your own relationships, in addition to denigrating the relationships of others. That behavior belongs in the "red flag" thread. What you seem to be missing in this discussion of "Ethics" is the fundamental ethic of "commitment to, and mutual responsibility for, each other." Nope, I take my responsibilities, and when I see that my SO has what looks pretty well like a once-in-the-life chance professionaly, I bite the bullet and do what I think is the right thing. Maybe I am wrong, maybe she will be fired next month. Pardon me if I do not want to stand between her and her dreams just for the sake of an "orthodox" BDSM relationship. We all follow our onw pathes, but they always cross twice... As for denigrating men who slap women in the face. I do not, I just find them disgusting, literraly, like spinatch.

OrionTheWolf -> RE: Extreme BDSM & Ethics (10/7/2009 4:26:02 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: MartinP We all follow our onw pathes, The above does not reconcile with the below. quote: As for denigrating men who slap women in the face. I do not, I just find them disgusting, literraly, like spinatch. Might I suggest some introspection and examination of your own ethics, particularly looking for inconsistancies between them, or that are flat out contradictory to each other.

DemonKia -> RE: Extreme BDSM & Ethics (10/7/2009 4:28:04 PM)
lol . . . . I'm feeling like such a pissy bitch today that this stuff is most excellent entertainment . . . . . & I'm only marginally feeling apologetic about it, too . . . .. Anyways, I suddenly flashed on how surreal it is to essentially hear a 'when did you quit beating your wife' style argument bein' hustled in a BDSM forum . . . . . In a thread about extreme kink . . . . . . shakes head, looks disoriented . . . . okay, who put somethin' in my kool-aid? huh?

Politesub53 -> RE: Extreme BDSM & Ethics (10/7/2009 4:29:29 PM)
I suspect most people who want to get in a BDSM relationship know exactly what they are getting into. Sure some dont realise what it entails but they still have the right to leave that relationship. Anyone submissive who stays and enjoys receiving pain has the right to do so, without being judged, and trust me submissive men are often judged by their peers. A dominant who hits a submissive who has a need to be hit may well be someone who needs to abuse, but it is ( Mostly ) a consensual arrangement. If we were to all think along PC lines or what is consdered the norm, we wouldnt be talking on a Forum such as this.

Politesub53 -> RE: Extreme BDSM & Ethics (10/7/2009 4:33:08 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: MartinP As for denigrating men who slap women in the face. I do not, I just find them disgusting, literraly, like spinatch. And so will the majority of the users, male and female, on this board. This is a world away from being physical with a male or female who has masochistic tendencies.

lovingpet -> RE: Extreme BDSM & Ethics (10/7/2009 5:11:59 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Politesub53 quote: ORIGINAL: MartinP As for denigrating men who slap women in the face. I do not, I just find them disgusting, literraly, like spinatch. And so will the majority of the users, male and female, on this board. This is a world away from being physical with a male or female who has masochistic tendencies. Shoot, this is merely the attention grabber at the beginning of the play. lovingpet

CaringandReal -> RE: Extreme BDSM & Ethics (10/7/2009 7:17:35 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: zephyroftheNorth No Martin you are focused on saving women who DO...NOT...NEED....SAVING Really.....honestly....scouts honor. We are fine and capable of defending ourselves. If we need your help we will ask.... ETA unless the helpless thing will get me lots and lots of sex in which case never mind the above post ROFL! Or as we say down south, in a slightly different context, "Oh please Brer' Fox, don't throw me into that Briar Patch! Anything but that! ANYTHING!" :D

IronBear -> RE: Extreme BDSM & Ethics (10/7/2009 7:47:11 PM)
I'm going to jump back a few pages here to my comments about the "King Hit". It has relevance in the discussion too. Laws have been passed in I think all States here giving a mandatory jail sentence for anyone using a kink hit. Such people are charged with attempted murder. We lost a much lived cricketer here who was dropped by a king hit outside a pub/restaurant. There was nothing to break his fall because he had already lost conciousness (according to the autopsy) and when his head came in violent contact with the pavement he died. Follow this much publicised case a number of other cases came up in several States when people king hit died. Rather than hit someone like that (a well timed upper cut will do an excellent job in KOing someone if landed correctly and with force). I prefer a back hander with a relatively loose hand to the carotid artery (known as a carotid punch) which usually buckles the knees giving time to either get the hell out of there or restrain the person. If I am play fighting or when confronted on a one on one I prefer top use pressure points when feasibly leaving the escalation to actual violence as a last resort. Sometimes, just sometimes it is necessary to strike the most vulnerable point/s offered especially when that person is trying to glass you (Slash you face with a broken glass or bottle and often go for your eyes with the object of blinding you). Again such situations do not offer the safe opportunity to use lethal force I.E., a firearm. My contention is that there are ways that one can "beat up" on someone who enjoys it with out incapacitation or leaving marks obvious next day at work. It takes time and practice which is better taught by someone who does have formal training and accreditation in such things, or at least someone with years of experience and a demonstratable track record. Personally I wouldn't want to try such things or advise anyone else to do so unless that person is well trained in first aid too or have a well trained person handy to sort the cuts and/or bruises after...

WyldHrt -> RE: Extreme BDSM & Ethics (10/7/2009 10:06:28 PM)
quote: But...but...but you're a GIRLIE LadyP you couldn't POSSIBLY hit as hard runs for the hills Care for a second opinion on that one, Zephyr? I even have pics taken the next day that show what a "girlie" swing LadyP has [:D] running was a GOOD idea! [;)]

Justme696 -> RE: Extreme BDSM & Ethics (10/8/2009 1:52:40 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: MartinP Justme, I hope you will not mind if I do not follow your reasonnable advice. Best regard, No problem..I hardly follow it myself [:D] ..and accept the consequences they have

bravemax -> RE: Extreme BDSM & Ethics (10/8/2009 2:12:08 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: DemonKia lol . . . . I'm feeling like such a pissy bitch today that this stuff is most excellent entertainment . . . . . & I'm only marginally feeling apologetic about it, too . . . .. Anyways, I suddenly flashed on how surreal it is to essentially hear a 'when did you quit beating your wife' style argument bein' hustled in a BDSM forum . . . . . In a thread about extreme kink . . . . . . shakes head, looks disoriented . . . . okay, who put somethin' in my kool-aid? huh? My thoughts exactly. There are some kinks I personally struggle with comprehending. But I would have assumed a consensus in this forum around the idea that a hit may mean something special in a nice way to the reciever (and the deliverer). It's not a radical concept on a bdsm website. Shame we got derailed in this fashion as the original topic raises two interesting questions... What are the doms in the rooms personal limits? Would they go anywhere for their subs "development" or draw the line before then for reasons of their own ethics/tastes? And more controversialy are there any universally "too far" areas between consenting adults? Anti-euthanasia arguments suggest their are - basically saying that no-one can ethically ask another to kill them. (I dont agree).

zephyroftheNorth -> RE: Extreme BDSM & Ethics (10/8/2009 3:01:48 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: WyldHrt quote: But...but...but you're a GIRLIE LadyP you couldn't POSSIBLY hit as hard runs for the hills Care for a second opinion on that one, Zephyr? I even have pics taken the next day that show what a "girlie" swing LadyP has [:D] running was a GOOD idea! [;)] No thanks Wyld, somehow I believe LadyP is capable of more than a "girlie" swing. And yes running was a good thing self preservation lives strong in me [:D]

blmtrsne -> RE: Extreme BDSM & Ethics (10/8/2009 3:38:34 AM)
My slave trusts my judgement, so I can do whatever I want. Since he gave me his trust (and anything else), he trusts me to take care of him. He knows my limits could be challinging to him, but he's my property and knows I make good use of him. Why should I damage my servant or cleaner ? So, any slave should choose his Mistress wisely before starting any relation.

LaTigresse -> RE: Extreme BDSM & Ethics (10/8/2009 3:53:57 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: zephyroftheNorth quote: ORIGINAL: LadyPact quote: ORIGINAL: MartinP Lovingpet, as much as would like to discuss with you the submissive aspect of the matter, I am currently focused on the dominant side. It is one thing to like being "beat bloody", it is quite another to beat somebody else bloody, especially when this person is not able of responding in kind. I am sure you understand me. Now I understand. So you're all good with Me unleashing My sadistic desires on My boy because it's something we both want. However, if I were a male, I would suddenly be wrong for doing the same thing in a hetro dynamic. But...but...but you're a GIRLIE LadyP you couldn't POSSIBLY hit as hard runs for the hills Perhaps Martin needs a dose of the activity portrayed in the add, on the front page, that has all the boys in such a tizzy?[:D]

zephyroftheNorth -> RE: Extreme BDSM & Ethics (10/8/2009 4:04:34 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: LaTigresse quote: ORIGINAL: zephyroftheNorth quote: ORIGINAL: LadyPact quote: ORIGINAL: MartinP Lovingpet, as much as would like to discuss with you the submissive aspect of the matter, I am currently focused on the dominant side. It is one thing to like being "beat bloody", it is quite another to beat somebody else bloody, especially when this person is not able of responding in kind. I am sure you understand me. Now I understand. So you're all good with Me unleashing My sadistic desires on My boy because it's something we both want. However, if I were a male, I would suddenly be wrong for doing the same thing in a hetro dynamic. But...but...but you're a GIRLIE LadyP you couldn't POSSIBLY hit as hard runs for the hills Perhaps Martin needs a dose of the activity portrayed in the add, on the front page, that has all the boys in such a tizzy?[:D] Ooooooooo evil, pure evil.....I like the way your mind works LaT [:D]

SirJohnD -> RE: Extreme BDSM & Ethics (10/8/2009 6:17:54 AM)
quote: I don't really go in for the whole negotiation and contract thing That's the beauty of BDSM. It is such a broad 'church'. A lot of people think the acronym stands just for Bondage Discipline Sadism Masocism but, of course, it's much more 'poly' than that incorporating Master slave Dominant submissive and so on. Personally, I get a lot of pleasure from the Negotiation phase. A TPE relationship is also a tpe RELATIONSHIP and while I want my slaves to be very feminine and very submissive, I also want them to make me laugh, have a brain and be interesting people in their own right. A TPE relationship is meant to last and that will only happen if you get more out of each other than just 'scenes'. I also enjoy the formality of BDSM. I get a lot of pleasure designing Contracts, drawing up sets of Rules and Protocols and going through Contract Signing and Collaring Ceremonies. Respecting Protocols also floats my boat. We went to a new club recently and my slave was the only one not sitting on furniture. Indeed, she was the only one on a leash! What's that about? [8\|] Each to their own. [:)]

justagirlinzh -> RE: Extreme BDSM & Ethics (10/8/2009 6:39:17 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: MartinP quote: ORIGINAL: RedMagic1 So you sabotage your own relationships, in addition to denigrating the relationships of others. That behavior belongs in the "red flag" thread. What you seem to be missing in this discussion of "Ethics" is the fundamental ethic of "commitment to, and mutual responsibility for, each other." Nope, I take my responsibilities, and when I see that my SO has what looks pretty well like a once-in-the-life chance professionaly, I bite the bullet and do what I think is the right thing. Maybe I am wrong, maybe she will be fired next month. Pardon me if I do not want to stand between her and her dreams just for the sake of an "orthodox" BDSM relationship. We all follow our onw pathes, but they always cross twice... As for denigrating men who slap women in the face. I do not, I just find them disgusting, literraly, like spinatch. Really? I think it's sexy as long as the woman has consented. And if the guy I like ever slaps me in the face, I'll turn into a puddle of whimpering, submissive goo and hit my knees.

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