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ORIGINAL: NihilusZero

Strange. I would much prefer the auto-pilot mode, actually. Having an ever-present latent predisposition for compliance (using your definitions) strikes me as a comfort-fit into the role being expected of you and it would rest easier in my head being able to have a certain reliance that the engine will run smoothly naturally...and the less maintenance necessary on the vehicle, the more time to baby it.

I'm not seeing where you are not actively making the choice to obey, serve, and surrender, though. Are you used to feeling your submission reinforced by having to put forth effort and struggle to do what is asked of you...and now that things have gotten to a plateau of running on their own, it feels like there isn't a certain challenge of sorts?

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ORIGINAL: Surrenderwithin

As to your question: No, not at all. In fact, I am use to just being who I am and doing what I do. I think it is the exact opposite to be honest. I yearn to feel like I am self sacrificing for him. I am eager to surrender and just want to feel it. Honest submission is seen when one surrenders to that which is not easy. It is not a struggle for me and rarely has been. I suppose at some level, I am desire challenge.Make sense?
Maggi

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ORIGINAL: NihilusZero

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ORIGINAL: Surrenderwithin

As to your question: No, not at all. In fact, I am use to just being who I am and doing what I do. I think it is the exact opposite to be honest. I yearn to feel like I am self sacrificing for him. I am eager to surrender and just want to feel it. Honest submission is seen when one surrenders to that which is not easy. It is not a struggle for me and rarely has been. I suppose at some level, I am desire challenge.Make sense?
Maggi

So what you're trying to get at is affirmation. The trick is to contemplate whether you are looking for self affirmation or if you're looking for his affirmation.  Ideally, from an M/s dynamic, (while mutual discussion for enlightenment is the starting point) I would expect the slave to work on 'learning the language' of hir M-type's affirmation. What are the tell-tale signs in his body language or demeanor that indicate that things are okay? Learn to key in on them so they effectively become small versions of the affirmations you're looking for.

And, presuming he's perfectly pleased, you could always request some simple self affirmation act or token that he can give to you that will work in your 'language'.

If he wouldn't find it too tedious, I'd imagine something like having a daily or weekly 'report card' that he would fill out for you, grading your service in multiple categories, would be a nifty way to keep you focused on the things that have become menial (since you'd be focusing on trying to score straight A's every 'period').

Or maybe that's just an odd idea wrought from a geeky brain.

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ORIGINAL: Surrenderwithin

I have since come to realize that it isnt about me. It is about him being pleased and happy. He views having to reaffirm me as an inconvenience and expects me to just know. I have learned.

The flip side of that is I am a type A personality. I am an over achiever. I do compulsively cannot do things part way. Therefore I put everything I have into serving him. He accepts the service. I know I am doing well. However, because I am so type A I always want to do better, serve better yada yada yada... so yes, it is looking for affirmation from myself.

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ORIGINAL: Surrenderwithin

Perhaps, by not focusing on the fact that folding socks is a service and act of submission for my Master I am cheating myself out of the positive feeling I get through service and surrender. I am complying when I should be obeying and serving. Folding socks is rather meaningless and a mindless task unless I meditate upon the reason and the circumstances that I find myself in the middle of the livingroom floor folding socks.

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ORIGINAL: AnnaOfAramis

I don't think you should be worried about "compliance." Here's another way to look at it. This is an internal enslavement perspective. If you are "choosing to obey" then you are determining your own slavery, mastering yourself. When you don't choose, but find yourself complying because it is impossible for you not to, then He is mastering you.

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ORIGINAL: Surrenderwithin
So, my questions are:
What is the difference between obedience and compliance by your personal definition?
How do these concepts play a role in your life and with your surrender or how would you like them to play a part in the life of your submissive or slave?
Thoughts?

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ORIGINAL: SimplyIsaac

Before you are in a position to "not choose" and find yourself complying like an automaton, you first have to have the ability to put yourself in that place to begin with, and be receptive to authority from this person without letting ye old ego get in the way.

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ORIGINAL: Surrenderwithin
What is the difference between obedience and compliance by your personal definition?
How do these concepts play a role in your life and with your surrender or how would you like them to play a part in the life of your submissive or slave?
Thoughts?

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ORIGINAL: Amaros

Semantically, I would call that the difference between submission and servitude.

They are similar, and I don't know if the dictionary would agree with me or not, but to me, submission is more of actively psychological act that generates a psychological reward - servitude is merely drudgery; necessary at times, but not psychologically fulfilling - going through the motions, as you say, like being on autopilot.

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ORIGINAL: porcelaine

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ORIGINAL: SimplyIsaac

Before you are in a position to "not choose" and find yourself complying like an automaton, you first have to have the ability to put yourself in that place to begin with, and be receptive to authority from this person without letting ye old ego get in the way.

you're correct. the external enslavement of the property generally happens before the internal process begins. the automation that is mentioned is not from the first, but truly stems from an internal mechanism taking place. i believe the difficulty arises when people attempt to put the horse before the cart and attach negative associations to feelings that are on par with the process. without a sacrifice of self internal enslavement will never occur. yet you cannot reach that point without other things happening first. there's a method to the madness that truly works.

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ORIGINAL: SimplyIsaac

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ORIGINAL: Amaros

Semantically, I would call that the difference between submission and servitude.

They are similar, and I don't know if the dictionary would agree with me or not, but to me, submission is more of actively psychological act that generates a psychological reward - servitude is merely drudgery; necessary at times, but not psychologically fulfilling - going through the motions, as you say, like being on autopilot.

That got me thinking. Yeah, I can see where you're coming from, but it's the "consensual" part of slavery that makes me say it's both. i do realize i'm speakikng about extreme servitude, though... not just submitting on a comfortable level.

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I do not want to be a slave who complies and allows my service and surrender to be a passive act or lie dormant within me as I go through my day. I want my surrender, sacrifice, and slavery to be an active choice to obey, serve, and surrender.I want my service, even in the mundane tasks, to be from a place of love, honor, and devotion. I desire my surrender to come from my mind, my heart, and my soul. I wish to present in all acts of obedience. I want to be an obedient slave....obedient to his whim, his rules, his decisions, and his guidance.

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ORIGINAL: Amaros

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ORIGINAL: SimplyIsaac

quote:

ORIGINAL: Amaros

Semantically, I would call that the difference between submission and servitude.

They are similar, and I don't know if the dictionary would agree with me or not, but to me, submission is more of actively psychological act that generates a psychological reward - servitude is merely drudgery; necessary at times, but not psychologically fulfilling - going through the motions, as you say, like being on autopilot.

That got me thinking. Yeah, I can see where you're coming from, but it's the "consensual" part of slavery that makes me say it's both. i do realize i'm speakikng about extreme servitude, though... not just submitting on a comfortable level.

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I do not want to be a slave who complies and allows my service and surrender to be a passive act or lie dormant within me as I go through my day. I want my surrender, sacrifice, and slavery to be an active choice to obey, serve, and surrender.I want my service, even in the mundane tasks, to be from a place of love, honor, and devotion. I desire my surrender to come from my mind, my heart, and my soul. I wish to present in all acts of obedience. I want to be an obedient slave....obedient to his whim, his rules, his decisions, and his guidance.

In short nobody likes to be taken for granted, slave or no.

There are ways of incorporating play into the most mundane acts, hand scrubbing a floor is inefficient, but I love to watch her ass sway back and forth while...

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ORIGINAL: porcelaine

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ORIGINAL: Surrenderwithin

I have since come to realize that it isnt about me. It is about him being pleased and happy. He views having to reaffirm me as an inconvenience and expects me to just know. I have learned.

The flip side of that is I am a type A personality. I am an over achiever. I do compulsively cannot do things part way. Therefore I put everything I have into serving him. He accepts the service. I know I am doing well. However, because I am so type A I always want to do better, serve better yada yada yada... so yes, it is looking for affirmation from myself.

i disagree. it is always about you. this is your journey. slavery is a tool for change. it is not the only avenue you can take for this to occur. you've already contradicted yourself in the first paragraph. how can it possibly be about him being pleased and happy until you've learned what it means to be selfless? that won't happen unless you've devoted some time to y.o.u. also, your problem is an inability to affirm yourself. you're seeking that from another person instead. something that you'll discover along the way is not as necessary as you may believe. but that's another discussion.

your personality type is an asset. don't allow anyone to tell you differently. some of the best slaves are type a. the only time this is a problem is when the dominant's differs or your quest for perfection drives him insane. you must learn how to redirect the energy. if you can view slavery holistically and recognize that there are many ways to learn and serve, you'll start thinking outside the box.

rather than obsess over one thing try something new instead. which feeds into your need for achievement and to provide exemplary service. discover the things he's eager to learn but lacks the time at present and become his walking resource. there are a host of ways you can utilize this to your benefit. but it won't be that as long as you view it as a liability.

by the way, i'm a type a as well. i have feverishly exploited it and continue to do so. i see no purpose in resting on my laurels. i can do so when i'm dead. until then, there's work to be done. best of luck.

porcelaine