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RE: Transparency - 3/8/2006 10:30:26 AM   
Slipstreme


Posts: 817
Joined: 1/1/2006
Status: offline 		Indeed. I am very open and honest to my partners, even to the point of wierding them out. I don't believe in keeping back secrets and wear who I am for them to see. Sure, it takes a level of vulnerability and nakedness that many people are unable to handle, however it avoids a lot of conflict in the long run. It just takes you getting over the fact you may not be accepted for who you are, and moving on from that: a lesson that has taken a lifetime to learn.

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Profile   Post #: 21
RE: Transparency - 3/8/2006 10:39:27 AM   
ExistentialSteel


Posts: 676
Joined: 1/18/2005
Status: offline 		Man, we have too many secret handshake things going on around here. Yeah, you should know all there is to know about someone. It takes time, but it comes eventually anyway. Telling the small and major things of your life to someone brings both of you closer. Nothing can be loved or hated, for that matter, unless it is known.

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Profile   Post #: 22
RE: Transparency - 3/8/2006 12:03:43 PM   
yourMissTress


Posts: 1665
Joined: 6/14/2005
From: Nashville, TN
Status: offline
quote:

I don't hold secrets, not of my own, I have nothing to hide. The only questions I won't answer are those involving things other people have told me in confidence, but anything about myself, I am an open book to any partner.


I like the way you said this Raven, and it's true for me as well. I am an open book to my partner/s. I have nothing to hide and believe in brutal honesty.

However, I am in a position of holding the confidences of others, both friends and lovers. I take that commitment as seriously as I do the commitment of honesty and truth with my partner/s.

I will share the most tender parts of my soul with the ones I love, but will not betray a confidence.

_____________________________

Tress


"If you have to tell people that you are a lady, you are not." My Grandmother


(in reply to RavenMuse)
Profile   Post #: 23
RE: Transparency - 3/8/2006 12:08:25 PM   
xxblushesxx


Posts: 9318
Joined: 11/3/2005
From: Kentucky
Status: offline 		Transparency isn't even as issue with me...as anyone who ever meets me can look in my eyes and see everything I think/feel (not exactly a characteristic I'm thrilled with, but, it prolly isn't gonna change now)

As far as doms...hmm...I've found they go for the 'tough lil boy' attitude...

If you look at them as someone who is hiding behind a tough exterieor, you can usually see the sweetness within....

(in reply to yourMissTress)
Profile   Post #: 24
RE: Transparency - 3/8/2006 12:31:32 PM   
IronBear


Posts: 9008
Joined: 6/19/2005
From: Beenleigh, Qld, Australia
Status: offline 		What I am finding interesting, is that only one person mentioned that transparency did not expend to confidences given to him. I said something similar regarding areas which I am sworn to secrecy including two at a Governmental level. Does this that those who want a completely open dialogue and have no secrets would share military secrets, confidential information from your place of employment or confidences from your family???? This is a tad like the “No Limits” v the “Hard Limits” debate …

If the answer is Yes..

1. Would a Dominant trust the sub/slave?

2. Would the sub/slave trust the Dominant?


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Iron Bear

Master of Bruin Cottage

http://www.bruincottage.org

Your attitude, words & actions are yours. Take responsibility for them and the consequences they incur.

D.I.L.L.I.G.A.F.

(in reply to xxblushesxx)
Profile   Post #: 25
RE: Transparency - 3/8/2006 12:53:27 PM   
Vancouver_cinful


Posts: 1911
Joined: 2/3/2004
Status: offline 		I feel as though I have nothing to add on this, because so many have summed it up already. Without transparency on my part, i just don't understand how I could trust my partner to make informed decisions for our lives...and I hope one day to find a partner who thrives from making those decisions. (With input and support)

The value of my being transparent has never been in doubt for me, but I've never really stopped to consider whether it is equally important for the dominant partner to be as transparent...

What are people's thoughts on this...Is there a difference between a sub being transparent and a dominant being transparent?

Cin

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Cin

quote:


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Profile   Post #: 26
RE: Transparency - 3/8/2006 12:58:45 PM   
ExistentialSteel


Posts: 676
Joined: 1/18/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: IronBear
I said something similar regarding areas which I am sworn to secrecy including two at a Governmental level. Does this that those who want a completely open dialogue and have no secrets would share military secrets


I know the combination to the lounge at work, but I won't give it away unless I'm tortured beyond anything any sub has ever endured....okay, it is 213, I can't take pain, I admit.

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For those who are like Roman Candles leaving bright trails in the night sky while the crowd watches until the dark blue center light bursts into magnificent colors and the crowd goes, ahhhhhhhhhh.

(in reply to IronBear)
Profile   Post #: 27
RE: Transparency - 3/8/2006 1:00:08 PM   
SimplyV


Posts: 351
Joined: 11/5/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: IronBear

What I am finding interesting, is that only one person mentioned that transparency did not expend to confidences given to him.


Normally I agree with you IB, but I'm counting a lot more than one.

quote:

ORIGINAL: IronBear
I said something similar regarding areas which I am sworn to secrecy including two at a Governmental level. Does this that those who want a completely open dialogue and have no secrets would share military secrets, confidential information from your place of employment or confidences from your family???? This is a tad like the “No Limits” v the “Hard Limits” debate …

If the answer is Yes..

1. Would a Dominant trust the sub/slave?

2. Would the sub/slave trust the Dominant?



As a Dominant, you have to trust your sub/slave to reveal to you what you need to know. Same goes for a sub/slave needing that trust in the Dominant.

No matter what a person ascribes to.. Dominant or submissive.. Keeping your word is part of that trust.

As for things as Govt secrets and what not.. Unless you know something that will directly harm your Dominant or sub (aka There is a nuclear bomb planted downtown about to go off).. Then those things should be kept secret, as you gave your word to the Govt that you would.

If a Dominant demands that their sub tell them everything.. then that sub should also let the person know who's confidence they're promising to keep .. that their Dominant will also be informed. Then the person has a choice of who gets to know the information.

A person has to be able to retain a certain amount of personal honor. I think subs need to see that honor in their Dominants.. and Dominants need to see that type of honor in their subs.

Maybe its just me, but I cannot trust or be with someone who cannot keep their word.

(though if every conversation a person had with another person was considered totally private.. I would probably get suspicious. At least at some point, one of them had to talk about something mundane.. even if it was "Nice shoes, where'd you get them?")

V

(in reply to IronBear)
Profile   Post #: 28
RE: Transparency - 3/8/2006 1:05:15 PM   
yourMissTress


Posts: 1665
Joined: 6/14/2005
From: Nashville, TN
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: IronBear

What I am finding interesting, is that only one person mentioned that transparency did not expend to confidences given to him. I said something similar regarding areas which I am sworn to secrecy including two at a Governmental level. Does this that those who want a completely open dialogue and have no secrets would share military secrets, confidential information from your place of employment or confidences from your family???? This is a tad like the “No Limits” v the “Hard Limits” debate …

If the answer is Yes..

1. Would a Dominant trust the sub/slave?

2. Would the sub/slave trust the Dominant?




IB, I would certainly consider military secrets, work related confidentiality and the like to be part of those confidences that I would hold and expect a partner to hold as well.

IMO honesty, trust, and confidentiality are all tightly woven and hardly separable. I would have a difficult time trusting someone if I knew that they had difficulty keeping other oaths. I distrust people that expose themselves to me as duplicitous, especially when they are doing so in an attempt to prove their own trustworthiness.

_____________________________

Tress


"If you have to tell people that you are a lady, you are not." My Grandmother


(in reply to IronBear)
Profile   Post #: 29
RE: Transparency - 3/8/2006 1:15:30 PM   
Dom4me2


Posts: 27
Joined: 2/27/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Level

By that I mean being totally open to not only yourself, but your partner? Even if it means the poop would hit the fan?


If you are not honest with yourself then who can you be honest with? That would be tragedy in and of itself. I am totally honest and if "poop" hits the fan in the process that is fine. If someone walks away that is fine. Apparently a lesson to be learned.

I will say that I have not read all the responses betweeen here and there (there being the last post to this thread), but I have found that things can become "distorted" if I do not pay attention to the original post. Somehow things seem to get out of balance and the original post has no bearing on the end response at times (just an observation).

Kathleen

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Profile   Post #: 30
RE: Transparency - 3/8/2006 1:22:43 PM   
brightspot


Posts: 3052
Status: offline
quote:

Does transparency matter to you? By that I mean being totally open to not only yourself, but your partner? Even if it means the poop would hit the fan?


Yes. Honesty and Clear Communication are Vital to me and my intimate relationships.

*Brightspot

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Profile   Post #: 31
RE: Transparency - 3/8/2006 1:23:09 PM   
ownedgirlie


Posts: 9184
Joined: 2/5/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: IronBear

What I am finding interesting, is that only one person mentioned that transparency did not expend to confidences given to him. I said something similar regarding areas which I am sworn to secrecy including two at a Governmental level. Does this that those who want a completely open dialogue and have no secrets would share military secrets, confidential information from your place of employment or confidences from your family???? This is a tad like the “No Limits” v the “Hard Limits” debate …

If the answer is Yes..

1. Would a Dominant trust the sub/slave?

2. Would the sub/slave trust the Dominant?



Anyone who confides in me will be told beforehand, that my Master is privvy to anything that is said to me, should he wish to know it. This doesn't mean i take up his time filling him in on every conversation i have. i actually only fill him in on such conversations that pertain to me or have an effect on me or us. But my friends know that i don't intentionally keep things from him. Period.

i don't work in a place of government secrets - interesting question, however. i can only believe my Master would not wish me to jeopardize my job in anyway and therefore would not insist i divulge information that would cost me my job, career, or worst yet, jail time.

As for "two-way" transparency, i do not know every detail about his life as he does mine. But i know enough, and i know him, and that works for us.

(in reply to IronBear)
Profile   Post #: 32
RE: Transparency - 3/8/2006 1:32:44 PM   
BitaTruble


Posts: 9779
Joined: 1/12/2006
From: Texas
Status: offline
quote:

Anyone who confides in me will be told beforehand, that my Master is privvy to anything that is said to me, should he wish to know it. This doesn't mean i take up his time filling him in on every conversation i have. i actually only fill him in on such conversations that pertain to me or have an effect on me or us. But my friends know that i don't intentionally keep things from him. Period.


I'm with owned on this one. If I can't tell Master, then don't tell me. Things which I knew or held in coinfidence prior to our relationship remain inviolate to this day and until the day I die because those are not 'mine' to give to him. They belong to someone else.

Celeste

_____________________________

"Oh, so it's just like
Rock, paper, scissors."

He laughed. "You are the wisest woman I know."


(in reply to ownedgirlie)
Profile   Post #: 33
RE: Transparency - 3/8/2006 3:45:09 PM   
IronBear


Posts: 9008
Joined: 6/19/2005
From: Beenleigh, Qld, Australia
Status: offline 		Honour, Respect, Integrity, Trustworthness, Duty, Loyalty, Courage ~~~~ All things which Goreans hold true yet are not exclusive to Gorean Lifestylers. They are what make you Human instead of humus. I see a lot of Humans here and no humus……

_____________________________

Iron Bear

Master of Bruin Cottage

http://www.bruincottage.org

Your attitude, words & actions are yours. Take responsibility for them and the consequences they incur.

D.I.L.L.I.G.A.F.

(in reply to BitaTruble)
Profile   Post #: 34
RE: Transparency - 3/8/2006 3:46:19 PM   
KnightofMists


Posts: 7149
Joined: 7/29/2005
Status: offline 		most definitely!!! It speaks of Intergity of ones Motivations and achieving my goal of having Vulnerability within the emotional context!

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Knight of Mists

An Optimal relationship is achieved when the individuals do what is best for themselves and their relationship.

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Profile   Post #: 35
RE: Transparency - 3/8/2006 3:47:53 PM   
Level


Posts: 25145
Joined: 3/3/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: BeeQueen

transparency or honesty...what is it u refer too?

transparency would bee laying out all motivations of my actions
honesty regards answering questions as open as u can/know.

for transparency u would first need to know about ur own motivations
eg why u do certain things as u do them.
selfreflexion is something not many ppl have, and even less are able to talk about selfreflected awarness

but honesty and open talks about why or how i do things or expect things is absolutly needed for the lifestyle i live.
Bee


I see how you're trying to make a distinction between honesty and transparency, but to me they're of the same tree. When you "lay out all motivations of your actions", that is an act of honesty. I do like the other points you made, especially about self-reflection. I think many are horrified at the very thought of knowing themselves.

Level

~~~~~~~~

"We don't see things as they are, we see them as we are."

Anais Nin

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Profile   Post #: 36
RE: Transparency - 3/8/2006 3:51:36 PM   
Level


Posts: 25145
Joined: 3/3/2006
Status: offline 		A lot of excellent posts, hope more are to come.........and I thank all who have weighed in so far.

Level

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Profile   Post #: 37
RE: Transparency - 3/8/2006 3:53:47 PM   
Level


Posts: 25145
Joined: 3/3/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: xxblushesxx

As far as doms...hmm...I've found they go for the 'tough lil boy' attitude...

If you look at them as someone who is hiding behind a tough exterieor, you can usually see the sweetness within....


Hi blushes *smiles*.........why do you think this is so?

Level

(in reply to xxblushesxx)
Profile   Post #: 38
RE: Transparency - 3/8/2006 3:58:16 PM   
Level


Posts: 25145
Joined: 3/3/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Vancouver_cinful

What are people's thoughts on this...Is there a difference between a sub being transparent and a dominant being transparent?

Cin


Not to me there isn't. Either the window is open or it isn't.

Level

(in reply to Vancouver_cinful)
Profile   Post #: 39
RE: Transparency - 3/8/2006 4:01:01 PM   
xxblushesxx


Posts: 9318
Joined: 11/3/2005
From: Kentucky
Status: offline 		hmm...well, Level, partly because I am psychic...(yes, some say psycho, as well, but...this is another story)

And also, because whenever I call one on it...they get that sheepish look, look away, and change the subject...

I love doms...they are so secretly sweet and cuddleable...

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Profile   Post #: 40
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