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coming to terms with a false accusation - 11/8/2009 7:22:32 PM

lucylucy

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Let’s say you’re having a heated discussion or argument with your D type in which he says things he believes to be true about you but are not—for example, he believes you’ve manipulated a situation but you, in fact, have not. It becomes clear that no amount of explanation from you will dissuade him from his belief, even though the thing he thinks you have done is inconsistent with your general behavior. Let’s say you’ve tried to explain and he’s now just tired of your protests, and he says the discussion is over and you’re not to bring it up again.

How do you mentally adjust to giving up on setting the record straight?

I’m really struggling with this. Please don’t tell me to try honest discussion. Believe me, at this point, any more discussion of it will make things worse. He believes something about me, there is absolutely nothing I can do to change his mind, and now I have to deal with that.

Thank you for any advice or suggestions you can offer.

_____________________________

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Post #: 1

RE: coming to terms with a false accusation - 11/8/2009 7:27:04 PM

AquaticSub

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I'd ask if we can drop it for now and talk it up again in a few days or a week. I honestly don't think I'd be able to let that go very easily. It would gnaw at me and get under my skin.

Honest discussion is still, I think, the way to go. But the way to go about it may need to be improved on. Giving some time to cool off could be a great start and suggest other ways. Perhaps writing each other in a diary that you pass back and forth every few days could be a way to discuss the problem without it getting as heated.

In end, you may not be able to change his mind. I know that would upset me a lot but perhaps, in time, he'll understand your behavior or you'll see why he feels the way he does.

_____________________________

Without my dominance you cannot submit. Without your submission I cannot dominate. You are my equal in this, though our roles are different.-Val

It was ok for him to beat me but then he tried to cuddle me! - Me

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(in reply to lucylucy)

Post #: 2

RE: coming to terms with a false accusation - 11/8/2009 7:29:00 PM

DarkSteven

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Right now your emotions are still wound up, for both of you.

Hopefully, you'll both feel less aggravated about it tomorrow.

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The small-breasted ones want larger breasts. The large-breasted ones want smaller ones. The straight-haired ones curl their hair, and the curly-haired ones straighten theirs...

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Post #: 3

RE: coming to terms with a false accusation - 11/8/2009 7:32:31 PM

littlewonder

Posts: 15659
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I just drop it but if it continues to creep into our relationship then it's going to be time to have a heart to heart discussion on the continuation of the relationship.

(in reply to DarkSteven)

Post #: 4

RE: coming to terms with a false accusation - 11/8/2009 7:47:59 PM

lizi

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Letting it go for now would help you get a more neutral perspective on it. When you think you feel less upset try writing to him and explain it as succinctly as you can with an objective viewpoint and with as little emotions as you can manage. Make it short, to the point, and factual -there's a better chance he'll read it and think about it. Then in a day or two you can ask if he read it and if it seems ok to do so you can ask what he thought and maybe the discussion can open up again in a less heated way.

(in reply to littlewonder)

Post #: 5

RE: coming to terms with a false accusation - 11/8/2009 8:34:20 PM

LafayetteLady

Posts: 7683
Joined: 5/2/2007
From: Northern New Jersey
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quote:

ORIGINAL: lucylucy

Let’s say you’re having a heated discussion or argument with your D type in which he says things he believes to be true about you but are not—for example, he believes you’ve manipulated a situation but you, in fact, have not. It becomes clear that no amount of explanation from you will dissuade him from his belief, even though the thing he thinks you have done is inconsistent with your general behavior. Let’s say you’ve tried to explain and he’s now just tired of your protests, and he says the discussion is over and you’re not to bring it up again.

How do you mentally adjust to giving up on setting the record straight?

I’m really struggling with this. Please don’t tell me to try honest discussion. Believe me, at this point, any more discussion of it will make things worse. He believes something about me, there is absolutely nothing I can do to change his mind, and now I have to deal with that.

Thank you for any advice or suggestions you can offer.

While everyone is certainly right in saying that at the moment the two of you are upset and need to cool off a bit, the bottom line is that he thinks you have been manipulative and you think you haven't been. I don't know how long you have been in the relationship, nor do any of us know what he claims you were manipulative about. The real question is can you live with him forming what you believe to be false opinions of you? Because this isn't likely to be the one and only time that it happens. If you can live with him thinking poorly of you, then let it go and prepare yourself to be accused again in the future. If you can't live with it, tell him exactly that and prepare to move on.

(in reply to lucylucy)

Post #: 6

RE: coming to terms with a false accusation - 11/8/2009 8:40:50 PM

tazzygirl

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My response is probably going to be unpopular.. but here goes.

I dont try. Im in a relationship with a man who should have enough trust in me to tell him the truth. If, after i have told him the truth, he doesnt believe me, there is nothing more i can do, and i leave it alone. i have found this leads to one of two possible outcomes.

1) eventually the truth will be heard.

or

2) the relationship will suffer and end.

I cant be with someone i dont trust... or who doesnt trust me to be honest.

_____________________________

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Dont judge me because I sin differently than you.
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Post #: 7

RE: coming to terms with a false accusation - 11/8/2009 9:50:56 PM

winterlight

Posts: 1319
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If it were me i would be ok.. bye...

If he didn't believe me now what about later when something else pops up?

That is just me..

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Post #: 8

RE: coming to terms with a false accusation - 11/8/2009 10:18:04 PM

Malkinius

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Greetings lucylucy....

This is a question to consider. What if he is right and you are wrong? What if you did manipulate something but don't realize that you did?

There is one thing you can do depending on your situation. If you identify as a slave, the answer is to just say, "Yes Master," beg his forgiveness and promise not to do it again and let it drop. If you are the average sub you are too much in control to ever let something you think is wrong go.

Be well....

Malkinius

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Post #: 9

RE: coming to terms with a false accusation - 11/8/2009 10:35:01 PM

DrkJourney

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quote:

ORIGINAL: winterlight

If it were me i would be ok.. bye...

If he didn't believe me now what about later when something else pops up?

That is just me..

Probably an unpopular decision...but I totally agree. I've been in the situation before. The first time it happened I so wished I had just walked away, instead I went through a couple of years with him jumping to conclusions and accusing me of things.

Bottom line, it was something in "his" past that caused all this.

From then on, if I ran into someone like that, as I did at least one other time, I tried to explain, he still wanted to stick to his beliefs and rant, so I simply walked away...in the long run I was much happier for it, even though it was a bit of a sting at first.

I wish you good luck and hope whatever you decide works out for you

_____________________________

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Post #: 10

RE: coming to terms with a false accusation - 11/8/2009 10:36:13 PM

CalifChick

Posts: 10717
Joined: 10/28/2007
From: California
Status: offline

I'm one of those that can't come to terms with it. Not believing me is calling my integrity into question. It's something very important to me.

Cali

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(in reply to Malkinius)

Post #: 11

RE: coming to terms with a false accusation - 11/9/2009 12:07:23 AM

NihilusZero

Posts: 4036
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From: Nashville, TN
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"Manipulation", among plenty of other malleable things, is a topic of interpretation. Unless otherwise specified, the point in a D/s relationship is that the D's interpretation wins tiebreakers. Unless you want to call into question the entire relationship (and/or his entire character), this isn't about you being right or wrong. This is about you having done something which displeased him.

What I would look for in a response?

"I sincerely apologize that I have acted in a way that would suggest to you that I was being manipulative. I'd like to respectfully take one last moment to honestly express to you that I had no genuine intention of manipulation in my actions....but the fact that I have displeased you is what is more important and I'd very much like to request of you to, when you decide it's appropriate, offer me a means by which I can demonstrate to you my honest intentions when it comes to you, me, and our relationship."

_____________________________

"I know it's all a game
I know they're all insane
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I know that I'm to blame."
~Siouxsie & the Banshees

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Post #: 12

RE: coming to terms with a false accusation - 11/9/2009 12:12:51 AM

wandersalone

Posts: 4666
Joined: 11/21/2005
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quote:

ORIGINAL: NihilusZero

"Manipulation", among plenty of other malleable things, is a topic of interpretation. Unless otherwise specified, the point in a D/s relationship is that the D's interpretation wins tiebreakers. Unless you want to call into question the entire relationship (and/or his entire character), this isn't about you being right or wrong. This is about you having done something which displeased him.

What I would look for in a response?

"I sincerely apologize that I have acted in a way that would suggest to you that I was being manipulative. I'd like to respectfully take one last moment to honestly express to you that I had no genuine intention of manipulation in my actions....but the fact that I have displeased you is what is more important and I'd very much like to request of you to, when you decide it's appropriate, offer me a means by which I can demonstrate to you my honest intentions when it comes to you, me, and our relationship."

NZ in your suggestion of a response wouldn't she then be disobeying the dominant's order that the topic be dropped and isn't the apology in fact a form of manipulation in that she would be again stating her belief that she wasn't manipulating?

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Post #: 13

RE: coming to terms with a false accusation - 11/9/2009 12:22:56 AM

NihilusZero

Posts: 4036
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From: Nashville, TN
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quote:

ORIGINAL: wandersalone

NZ in your suggestion of a response wouldn't she then be disobeying the dominant's order that the topic be dropped

Upon rereading, yes, you're right. Being told not to bring it up again does kind of make the situation difficult. I suppose my suggestion would have to wait until she is able to discuss the issue again.

quote:

ORIGINAL: wandersalone

and isn't the apology in fact a form of manipulation in that she would be again stating her belief that she wasn't manipulating?

I would just see that as honesty. What I suspect became the problem is that her desire to adhere to being not-guilty completely washed away the point that she is in a relationship where she (presumably) has chosen him to be the arbiter of what is and isn't guilty. Obviously, there was a miscue in the 'compatibility of interpretation' department. "Manipulation" is one of those non-verifiable things. If she was manipulative but in denial or ignorant of it, does it change things?

I think the whole issue entirely missed the point that she had acted in a way that displeased him and should have been seeking ways in which to fix it so the same interpretations wouldn't be made again.

< Message edited by NihilusZero -- 11/9/2009 12:24:17 AM >

_____________________________

"I know it's all a game
I know they're all insane
I know it's all in vain
I know that I'm to blame."
~Siouxsie & the Banshees

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RE: coming to terms with a false accusation - 11/9/2009 12:30:07 AM

wandersalone

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quote:

ORIGINAL: NihilusZero

I think the whole issue entirely missed the point that she had acted in a way that displeased him and should have been seeking ways in which to fix it so the same interpretations wouldn't be made again.

Agreed and it appears he has made it clear that there is to be no further discussion so I would make an apology without justifying or rationalising and maybe meditate on the discomfort about not being believed and think about what is more important.....being right or obeying.

_____________________________

Our lives begin to end the day we become silent about things that matter. Martin Luther King
Godmother of the subbie mafia
My all time favourite threads
http://www.collarchat.com/fb.asp?m=2002501
http://www.collarchat.com/fb.asp?m=790885

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Post #: 15

RE: coming to terms with a false accusation - 11/9/2009 1:12:02 AM

RCdc

Posts: 8674
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quote:

Let’s say you’ve tried to explain and he’s now just tired of your protests, and he says the discussion is over and you’re not to bring it up again.

You cease bringing it up. Just because you don't believe you used manipulation, doesn't mean you did not in his eyes.
If you cannot or feel wronged, then you leave the relationship.

the.dark.

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RC&dc

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RE: coming to terms with a false accusation - 11/9/2009 3:14:13 AM

DesFIP

Posts: 25191
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From: Apple County NY
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I'd have to ask him how I was to continue a relationship with someone who doesn't believe what I say, and who assumes I'm a liar? And that personally, I don't see a way to. Because if he's withdrawn all trust in me, then I am going to do the same.

For me, this would be a deal breaker.

Now saying we're too wound up to think straight is one thing and you need to postpone the discussion a day. But somebody who deliberately assumes the worst of me is not someone I want to be with. And I sure as hell wouldn't let them tie me up or take advantage of me because I do believe he would use that situation to take his anger out on me inappropriately.

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RE: coming to terms with a false accusation - 11/9/2009 3:35:06 AM

NihilusZero

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quote:

ORIGINAL: DesFIP

But somebody who deliberately assumes the worst of me is not someone I want to be with.

From the position of a submissive, I view that as a bit too paranoid for my tastes.

The base denominator here is that he found what she did manipulative. Ergo, it is. The same way that if he calls something she did "cheating", it is...because those things only come into reality based on the interpretation of your partner. At best, she simply had a misunderstanding of what he would consider manipulative, and acted without intent to harm.

She did something that caused him to view things in that manner. She either owns up to the error, gently tries to restate that her active intentions were not that, and works towards keeping such an event from happening again or she throws her ability to trust his interpretations to the wind and re-decides if she should even be submitting to him in any realistic fashion at all (that last part ideally happening with his inclusion in the process).

_____________________________

"I know it's all a game
I know they're all insane
I know it's all in vain
I know that I'm to blame."
~Siouxsie & the Banshees

NihilusZero.com

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Post #: 18

RE: coming to terms with a false accusation - 11/9/2009 3:45:47 AM

DesFIP

Posts: 25191
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From: Apple County NY
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Sorry NZ. If it's paranoia, then he's induced it.

If she knows that she did not intend any manipulation and he's saying that she did, that she's lying about it, and that he's ending all communication - what further trust can there be between them? This is not a minor thing, she cannot say yes she was a deliberately manipulative bitch who lied about not doing so, and accepts deserved punishment. Because it isn't true.

But she also isn't allowed to say that she didn't do this and that she needs this resolved to go forward. It's his closing off any communication and insisting on believing the worst of her that is damaging the relationship, which he apparently doesn't care about at the moment or he wouldn't be doing this.

If he lied and cheated me, that would probably be a deal breaker. So why isn't it when he believes her to be a lying deceitful person? Without honesty and openness and trust, there isn't much left to base a relationship on.

_____________________________

Slave to laundry

Cynical and proud of it!

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Post #: 19

RE: coming to terms with a false accusation - 11/9/2009 4:05:47 AM

LaTigresse

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For me, it comes down to, do I want to be with someone that does not trust me. Do I feel like this is something that can be fixed (not this particular instance but the bigger problem) or will it continue to polute the relationship?

And yes, wait until emotions are less a part of any decision on the matter. Wait until you can take a more watchful approach. Only the people in the relationship know what they can tollerate. You know yourself. Can you let it go if it never changes, or will it forever be there like a splinter, hindering the sucess of the relationship?

Then you can think about things like, "why is this so important to me?" "what will it mean to me if it is never resolved?" and calmly sort through it that way.

< Message edited by LaTigresse -- 11/9/2009 4:15:26 AM >

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Just because you are well educated, articulate, and can use big, fancy words, properly........does not mean you are right!

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