RE: Thoughts on President Obama's Job Summit? (Full Version)

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LiveFreeAndSpank -> RE: Thoughts on President Obama's Job Summit? (12/4/2009 9:18:33 AM)

http://www.mayoclinic.com/health/narcissistic-personality-disorder/DS00652






mnottertail -> RE: Thoughts on President Obama's Job Summit? (12/4/2009 9:20:39 AM)

http://www.hondurasthisweek.com/previousissues/1011-former-irish-prime-minister-offers-insight-into-irelands-economic-growth

They've never heard of the laffer curve. Try to keep up.

Ron




Kirata -> RE: Thoughts on President Obama's Job Summit? (12/4/2009 9:53:09 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: cuckyman

If the Laffer curve didn't work, then explain Ireland's recent explosion of job and business growth after they cut capital gains taxes and lowered marginal tax rates

It is true that they did cut taxes. Significantly. This is from Ron's link:

Ireland taxed 65% of the income of the very wealthy, businesses 52%. As a result of reforms introduced by Ahern, the highest bracket for individual income is now 41% and the business tax is down to 12.5%. Capital gains taxes were cut from 40% to 20%. All of this attracted businesses such as Dell, Hewlett Packard, Bell Labs and Abbot Laboratories to move to Ireland.

But, they also...

increased the educational budget by 300%, hired 9,000 new teachers and reduced the number of children per classroom. Now, 60% of those in the 20 to 35 year old bracket have a university degree. An educated work force attracts foreign investment which creates jobs he added. From 1997 to 2008 jobs grew from 1.2 million to well over 2 million.

And...

Bureaucratic red tape was cut drastically, infrastructure was greatly improved and Ireland became known as a streamlined and user-friendly place to invest and do business.

The article is very much worth reading. You can't just cut taxes and go have lunch.

K.






DarkSteven -> RE: Thoughts on President Obama's Job Summit? (12/4/2009 9:59:37 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: cuckyman

Another know it all liberal spouting more garbage.... If the Laffer curve didn't work, then explain Ireland's recent explosion of job and business growth after they cut capital gains taxes and lowered marginal tax rates....hmmmmmm?  I'm waiting...


Well, gee whiz, I didn't get around to answering your post right away... my abject apologies.

What does the Irish cap gains tax have to do with their business growth?  The growth was due to multinationals building plants there... cap gains would affect the Irish investors, not the multinationals.  If you wanted to make a coherent argument, you would have tried to correlate the low business tax rate there (Note - I don't know what the Irish business tax rate is) with the business explosion.

When you mention marginal tax rates, again you need to specify if it's business or individual tax rates.  And why would anyone care about marginal tax rates as opposed to overall?






willbeurdaddy -> RE: Thoughts on President Obama's Job Summit? (12/4/2009 10:03:27 AM)

If he had to ask the question about jobs either

1. He already knew the answer and it was all for show
2. He really doesnt know the answer, and has no business being POTUS.




Mercnbeth -> RE: Thoughts on President Obama's Job Summit? (12/4/2009 10:30:53 AM)

quote:

highest bracket for individual income is now 41% and the business tax is down to 12.5%. Capital gains taxes were cut from 40% to 20%. Bureaucratic red tape was cut drastically


Kirata, points out how the home run was hit in Ireland. Unfortunately, it also documents the exact three things that will NOT happen under this administration and Congress.

However, I don't blame Congress or the Administration. The citizens don't want any of the that to take place. They are all anxiously awaiting their own entitlement promised in exchange of their votes. Where the money comes from, or how its expense on the books of the private sector companies and/or investors doesn't concern them. They want their 'free' health care, 'free' college education, 'free' housing (or at least an exception for paying the mortgage they signed). Another consideration at this point is the huge portion of the population works for the Federal, State, County, or local government in one manner or the other. They're safe secure, and entrenched; never mentioned when it comes to contributing to the problem. They have fantastic, and well funded by union dues, special interest PAC lobbyists making sure 'cuts' is a never spoken four letter word. Earlier this year, the bankrupt company known as California tried to get back just one paid Holiday as a cost saving measure back from the bureaucrats here in CA, they had to give two 'personal' days in exchange. The State Representatives, and Arnold saw it, and tried to sell it, as a 'victory'!

You can't cut taxes and/or the bureaucracy they fund when at the first hint of 'cuts' there are ads that night on TV with images of babies, children, teachers, old people, firemen, and police telling the masses of how their lives will end, and services curtailed, if one penny of funding cuts are implemented. It's a dead end issue.

When labor leader Andrew Stern of the Service Employees International Union; ranks #1 with 22 sleep over visits to the White House year to date, you can bet that the only safe jobs in the USA are in the public sector. Public sector jobs have two factors which contribute to a larger deficit and ongoing costs; they drain tax money from the economy, and they end up in perpetuity. Ever hear of any bureaucracy, or a person working for one, that was terminated after fulfilling whatever goal they were assigned? Meanwhile, as much as the cost and benefits for government workers is huge, it's nothing compared to the retirement benefits they get once they are gone; fully paid pension, and health care that lasts of lifetime.

Any business person looking at the fixed employee expenses would take drastic actions, perhaps including bankruptcy, to change that situation before considering anything else, were we talking about a company similarly encumbered with bad labor deals. At the very least, the cards would be dealt up and an attempt at some mutually agreed plan would be implemented. Something relatively simple and harmless like establishing a new pay-scale and pension program for any new hire. Or more effective - a freeze on all public employee hiring for say 25 years so attrition will bring the numbers down to a reasonable amount.

However when the ultimate employee union 'boss' is sleeping over - that chat just isn't taking place.




servantforuse -> RE: Thoughts on President Obama's Job Summit? (12/4/2009 10:53:15 AM)

The very same day that Obama had is jobs summitt, Nancy Polosi and the other hacks in the House voted to raise the estate tax ( death tax ) to 45% on any estate over 3.5 million. Work your whole life and the federal govt. will take half of it when you die..




Brain -> RE: Thoughts on President Obama's Job Summit? (12/4/2009 12:17:59 PM)

This is good news, maybe the worst is over: Unemployment Rate Drops To 10.0%, Economy Sheds 11,000 Jobs - Fewest Since 2007

Obama: Jobs report is ‘modestly encouraging’ - Stocks & economy- msnbc.com

WASHINGTON - The unemployment rate fell to 10 percent in November as employers cut the smallest number of jobs since the recession began.

The Labor Department said Friday the economy shed 11,000 jobs last month, an improvement from October's revised total of 111,000. That's also much better than the 130,000 Wall Street economists expected.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/34272155/ns/business-stocks_and_economy/




servantforuse -> RE: Thoughts on President Obama's Job Summit? (12/4/2009 12:30:51 PM)

If the economy adds 300,000 jobs per month for the next 10 months, the unemployment rate will be at 8.5% next October. Good news ?




rulemylife -> RE: Thoughts on President Obama's Job Summit? (12/4/2009 12:56:29 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: willbeurdaddy


quote:

ORIGINAL: rulemylife
I really have no h

Yes. I love it.

The Bush recession was inherited from Clinton but the Obama recession belongs to him and had absolutely nothing to do with Bush.



putting words in my mouth again, eh? That is the only thing you are actually competent at doing. Congrats.


Someone has to Willbeur, you seem to have some problems expressing yourself.

Just trying to help.  [sm=dunno.gif]




rulemylife -> RE: Thoughts on President Obama's Job Summit? (12/4/2009 1:04:35 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: servantforuse

As I mentioned earlier, unions do not create jobs. They have no place at a job summit. CWA never paid me a dime. Lets get business owners at the summit. They are the ones who employ people.


They never paid you a dime but negotiated your pay and benefits.

It never ceases to amaze me how many people who benefit from unions are anti-union. 

Do you really think you would have achieved your pay-scale and retirement benefits from the generosity of AT&T without a union presence? 




servantforuse -> RE: Thoughts on President Obama's Job Summit? (12/4/2009 1:08:41 PM)

I have benefited from being a union member and am certainly not anti-union. I still believe that unions do not create new jobs. Profitable companies create new jobs.




Mercnbeth -> RE: Thoughts on President Obama's Job Summit? (12/4/2009 1:09:37 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: servantforuse
If the economy adds 300,000 jobs per month for the next 10 months, the unemployment rate will be at 8.5% next October. Good news ?


You don't need to go that far - lets just quote the "good news" being reported - The economy sheds 11,000 jobs - yet the unemployment percentage went down. The solution is obvious! Increase the population by 100,000,000 and we can keep 'shedding jobs' and Obama can still give a speech about how great and "encouraging" the lowering percentage numbers reported.

There were 11,000 FEWER Jobs - That means businesses are closing. $787 Billion in 'Stimulus' and many of the temporary and fictitiously reported (I think they used the global warming scientists) jobs are ending.

Meanwhile, the reality of the numbers YTD:
Another month under President Obama, another 11,000 jobs lost, pushing the total Obama jobs deficit to 7.6 million. One day after the White House jobs summit admitted that the President's policies - including the massive $787 billion stimulus enacted last spring - are not working to create jobs, the Department of Labor's monthly jobs report added the exclamation point.

Barack Obama promised that if elected he would create 3.5 million jobs by the end of 2010 through new economic policies, beginning with the enactment of a massive economic stimulus package. So far in his term in office, employment has dropped by about 3.3 million jobs, while the unemployment rate remains at 10 percent. Accompanying his jobs promise, the President also emphasized accountability and measuring his presidency by results. The President's jobs promise means total employment should be at least 138.6 million by 2010.




willbeurdaddy -> RE: Thoughts on President Obama's Job Summit? (12/4/2009 1:47:47 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: rulemylife

quote:

ORIGINAL: willbeurdaddy


quote:

ORIGINAL: rulemylife
I really have no h

Yes. I love it.

The Bush recession was inherited from Clinton but the Obama recession belongs to him and had absolutely nothing to do with Bush.



putting words in my mouth again, eh? That is the only thing you are actually competent at doing. Congrats.


Someone has to Willbeur, you seem to have some problems expressing yourself.

Just trying to help.  [sm=dunno.gif]


Yes, I will admit to having trouble writing for a 3rd grade comprehension level. Writing for GED or above is so much easier.




mnottertail -> RE: Thoughts on President Obama's Job Summit? (12/4/2009 1:49:01 PM)

no it isn't.

Wilbur, Jr.




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