David Obey Calls for War Tax on Wealthy (Full Version)

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Brain -> David Obey Calls for War Tax on Wealthy (11/25/2009 1:46:41 AM)

And not another dime for war until we get a public option. After all, Joe the weasal is concerned about the deficit. The healthcare bill is paid for and he's pulling this shit to kill it? Joe the turd better co-operate or Obama better bust his balls If not, Obama is a sellout and needs to be replaced. IT IS NOT TOO LATE for Al or Hillary.

David Obey Calls for War Tax on Wealthy

Rep. David Obey, a Wisconsin Democrat and the chairman of the House Appropriations Committee, is the latest lawmaker to call for a new tax aimed at the rich to pay for a troop increase in Afghanistan.

http://www.michaelmoore.com/words/latest-news/david-obey-calls-war-tax-wealthy



LadyEllen -> RE: David Obey Calls for War Tax on Wealthy (11/25/2009 5:35:54 AM)

This is silly - there arent any wealthy people in the US, otherwise they would be employing people and the employment rate wouldnt be so high. If there's nothing to trickle down, how can it be taxed to pay for the military?

E



DomImus -> RE: David Obey Calls for War Tax on Wealthy (11/25/2009 6:33:31 AM)

Why tax the rich for something Obama is going to do?



servantforuse -> RE: David Obey Calls for War Tax on Wealthy (11/25/2009 6:50:29 AM)

When the wealthy are taxed to death and are no longer wealthy, who do you tax next ? You liberals need a new phrase. I'm really tired of hearing 'tax the rich'...



Lucylastic -> RE: David Obey Calls for War Tax on Wealthy (11/25/2009 7:16:27 AM)

This is not a new thing, the last bill for tax the wealthy for the war was proposed in 2007



pahunkboy -> RE: David Obey Calls for War Tax on Wealthy (11/25/2009 8:17:54 AM)

...at one time "soak the rich"  was something I agreed with.

But WHO is the rich?

taxes have been creeping up- and IMO we should start deleting most of them.  They are a relic of the past.



Mercnbeth -> RE: David Obey Calls for War Tax on Wealthy (11/25/2009 8:50:40 AM)

There are two main ways to tax someone, when you make money and when you spend money. The "Rich" can choose to do neither and it doesn't affect them. It will affect the businesses and, as the brilliant President Carter found out when he put a huge surcharge on 'luxury purchases' on boats, close entire industries.

Every time I see this I laugh. Any businessman, rich or not can still, relatively easily, make a purchase though the business and write it off REDUCING the government's tax revenue. Businesses pay taxes not on revenue but on profits. Expenses for cars, items needed for home offices like high def TV's & sound systems (have a few meetings there a year using them for power-point presentation), dinners, and my favorite business travel; are write offs reducing income. Many business owners take very little in salary for that very reason.

Sure - go ahead announce a 'TAX THE RICH!' initiative. The general public is defeated, doesn't have, and can't be motivated to work to become wealthy, so it gives a nice esoteric target to focus in lieu of the thinking about a more obvious solution, especially in this case. There are always two sides of any line item expense. This looks at one side of the ledger the needed revenue. But what about expense itself? Why not look at a quicker and easier solution - END the war. Bring home the occupying police force securing a people and a county with a big group of citizens who don't want us there and show it by trying to kill our troops.

But no - the product of the poor public education system probably believes this is the way to go, solving all their problems. It's a great idea, not only for the war, but will insure a redistribution of wealth. Tax the rich! As if that's not been advocated, tried, and tried again. Yet, as many often point out in these threads - there seems to be just as many 'rich' getting richer; while taxation and the mere promise by this Administration and Congress of more taxation and regulation puts more people out of work, closes businesses, and produces less tax revenue. I doubt many of the targeted rich are worrying about this threat. I'm sure that many more 'non-rich', not working in the public sector, are, or should be because without incentive - the rich just stay home, don't buy, don't invest, don't expand their businesses, and don't get as affected as the people who work for them.



servantforuse -> RE: David Obey Calls for War Tax on Wealthy (11/25/2009 9:11:14 AM)

It is 'class warfare', the democrats have been doing it forever. Tax the successful and give the money to those less motivated..



Mercnbeth -> RE: David Obey Calls for War Tax on Wealthy (11/25/2009 9:21:13 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: servantforuse
It is 'class warfare', the democrats have been doing it forever. Tax the successful and give the money to those less motivated..


Never gotten any of the more tax crowd to answer one question. If that works so well, why is it that here in CA we've just gone through the largest tax increase in the history of the country, but as a result instead of the problems being solved less than a year later, the State's revenue has decrease so dramatically that another 'crisis' is upon us and more taxes are necessary?

I don't put it as a Democrat/Republican issue. Here it took a Republican Governor and one republican senator's vote to put the last tax increase in place. This is a ruling class use of the naive voting constituency. Not one alleged 'representative' of the citizens would be considered poor; nationally not one in Congress wouldn't be considered 'rich' especially considering their fully paid health insurance coverage and life-time pension.

You don't have to fool all of the people all of the time, or even some of the people some of the time; just a simple majority every year on one day in November.



EbonyWood -> RE: David Obey Calls for War Tax on Wealthy (11/25/2009 9:21:22 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: servantforuse

It is 'class warfare', the democrats have been doing it forever. Tax the successful and give the money to those less motivated..


Comments like this are patent bullshit, and show you have no concept of reality.

Question the motivation level of some of the people I work with, and they will kick your ass.




mnottertail -> RE: David Obey Calls for War Tax on Wealthy (11/25/2009 9:22:13 AM)

LOL. You sound pretty motivated to me.

Ron



Lucylastic -> RE: David Obey Calls for War Tax on Wealthy (11/25/2009 9:22:38 AM)

[sm=anger.gif]yeah those lazy unmotivated useless scummy lowlife poor peeps are just rolling in money[sm=anger.gif]\
bloody hell may I suggest you go help out at a soup kitchen tomorrow, and tell them all how lucky they are to have you in their lives



Silence8 -> RE: David Obey Calls for War Tax on Wealthy (11/25/2009 9:34:09 AM)

You can also tax inheritance, tax assets (progressively, and not by brackets!)... there are many ways to tax.

But yeah, stop the fucking war. That's 50% of the government's tax revenue freed up.

Still, one has wonder... if instead of Keynesian economics, the government during the Great Depression had simply redistributed assets equally... where's the economist to work out that scenario? Economists represent their class, just as politicians represent their class -- business. The difference between Democrat and Republican, as far as I can gather, is which subset of business that is. If I'm remembering correctly, historically, Wall Street profits always seem to do better under democratic administration. I'm not sure which party better represents luxury yachts, though. The nature of conspicuous consumption goods is that additional taxes might actually increase demand; similarly, putting Gucci apparel on sale is bad for business...



mnottertail -> RE: David Obey Calls for War Tax on Wealthy (11/25/2009 9:49:27 AM)

Well, somewhat on the side of Merc and somewhat on the side of lazy downtrodden loafing poor.

From the 30s to the mid 60s or so, there was a 90% tax on the highest brackets........the rich found other ways of making money, to free up cash flows and addition to the taxed income, and they suffered in grand style as usual, creating more business to offset their privations........

So, somewhere in there lies an answer.

Ron



willbeurdaddy -> RE: David Obey Calls for War Tax on Wealthy (11/25/2009 9:50:38 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Brain

And not another dime for war until we get a public option. After all, Joe the weasal is concerned about the deficit. The healthcare bill is paid for and he's pulling this shit to kill it? Joe the turd better co-operate or Obama better bust his balls If not, Obama is a sellout and needs to be replaced. IT IS NOT TOO LATE for Al or Hillary.

David Obey Calls for War Tax on Wealthy

Rep. David Obey, a Wisconsin Democrat and the chairman of the House Appropriations Committee, is the latest lawmaker to call for a new tax aimed at the rich to pay for a troop increase in Afghanistan.

http://www.michaelmoore.com/words/latest-news/david-obey-calls-war-tax-wealthy


In what bizarro world is the health care bill paid for?



willbeurdaddy -> RE: David Obey Calls for War Tax on Wealthy (11/25/2009 9:52:49 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Mercnbeth

quote:

ORIGINAL: servantforuse
It is 'class warfare', the democrats have been doing it forever. Tax the successful and give the money to those less motivated..


Never gotten any of the more tax crowd to answer one question. If that works so well, why is it that here in CA we've just gone through the largest tax increase in the history of the country, but as a result instead of the problems being solved less than a year later, the State's revenue has decrease so dramatically that another 'crisis' is upon us and more taxes are necessary?

I don't put it as a Democrat/Republican issue. Here it took a Republican Governor and one republican senator's vote to put the last tax increase in place. This is a ruling class use of the naive voting constituency. Not one alleged 'representative' of the citizens would be considered poor; nationally not one in Congress wouldn't be considered 'rich' especially considering their fully paid health insurance coverage and life-time pension.

You don't have to fool all of the people all of the time, or even some of the people some of the time; just a simple majority every year on one day in November.


I assume you use "Republican" loosely wrt to Ahnuld.



AnimusRex -> RE: David Obey Calls for War Tax on Wealthy (11/25/2009 10:40:10 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: mnottertail
From the 30s to the mid 60s or so, there was a 90% tax on the highest brackets........the rich found other ways of making money, to free up cash flows and addition to the taxed income, and they suffered in grand style as usual, creating more business to offset their privations........


well...not exactly.

The gap between the rich and poor has not remained static. It has increased and shrunk over time.
Here is a CNN article about it:
http://money.cnn.com/2007/10/12/news/economy/income/index.htm?postversion=2007101209
Money quote:
While the IRS data only dates back as far as 1986, academic experts told the paper that the last time the rich had this large of a share of income was during the 1920s.

What has happened, is that during the New Deal- 1933 through the late 70's; the gap between rich and poor narrowed; after the tax cuts of the 1980's, the gap started to widen, and had grown ever larger; while the middle class has stagnated in terms of real income, the rich have grown enormously wealthy- it is described as like the upper end of the spectrum being pulled like taffy- the richer you are, the faster your income grew during 2001-2008.

I am not actually a fan of 'soak the rich" schemes, but progrssive tax rates do have a beneficial effect of holding the gap between rich and poor to tolerable levels.
A natural gap is acceptable, but too large a gap, and we end up burning the sense of community, the sense that we have a common society; we end up llike 3rd World nations, where some ride around n limos while others are starving in the streets.




Moonhead -> RE: David Obey Calls for War Tax on Wealthy (11/25/2009 11:00:00 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: mnottertail

Well, somewhat on the side of Merc and somewhat on the side of lazy downtrodden loafing poor.

From the 30s to the mid 60s or so, there was a 90% tax on the highest brackets........the rich found other ways of making money, to free up cash flows and addition to the taxed income, and they suffered in grand style as usual, creating more business to offset their privations........

So, somewhere in there lies an answer.

Ron

You mean the rich were paying a huge tax bite when Rush "let's roll the clock back" Limbaugh was a kid and everything in the world was better? Who'd have thunk it?



mnottertail -> RE: David Obey Calls for War Tax on Wealthy (11/25/2009 11:02:37 AM)

unless he is no more advanced in years than his intelligence indicates and he just has alot of hard miles on him, it is exactly what I am saying, Moonhead:

http://www.truthandpolitics.org/top-rates.php

Ron



Moonhead -> RE: David Obey Calls for War Tax on Wealthy (11/25/2009 11:05:13 AM)

I'm not surprised he's never mentioned that when he's ranting to people who have to take their shoes off to count to twenty, then.



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