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relocate? - 3/17/2006 8:26:43 AM   
yourbaby


Posts: 4
Joined: 5/26/2005
Status: offline 		relocate? of course i would, for the right Master. But why does the burden of the first visit seemingly fall upon the slave? we haven't always the means or money to be able to travel... anyone with thoughts on this?
Profile   Post #: 1
RE: relocate? - 3/17/2006 8:50:40 AM   
LadyMorgynn


Posts: 800
Joined: 11/25/2005
From: N. Carolina
Status: offline 		Specifically for the first visit... if the slave is anywhere local, this can be negotiated, and we would meet in a public venue.

If, however, he is coming from far away, it gets a bit more trickly. You're not going to fly across 5 states to spend 2 hours at Starbucks. So if he's coming from afar, it's going to be for a Trial Run for a couple of days, probably a long weekend. Therefore, the slave needs to be IN the environment in which he will be living with Me, in My home, with a schedule fairly approximating how he would live on a day-to-day basis. This is an absolute necessity. Many inexperienced slaves believe that 24/7 means scening 24 hours a day, and need to actually taste what it's like in order to understand, and to know if that's what they really want. And even an experience slave is going to want to know how he's going to live with Me.

Would I pay for his ticket? NO! Would I help pay for the ticket? Possibly, but probably not. I've had too many VERY sincere sounding slaves, suddenly disappear without a word of explanation. Therefore, the "trial run" is in fact a test in more ways than one, the first test being if he is sincere enough to actually come to Me in the first place!

And frankly, if he can't afford a 14-day advance ticket, he probably can't afford to be My slave, who will be required to contribute his *half* of the household budget which provides us with a life of reasonable comfort.


_____________________________

---
Lady Morgynn
www.farhorizons.net/LadyMorgynn

(in reply to yourbaby)
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RE: relocate? - 3/17/2006 9:04:42 AM   
LuckyAlbatross


Posts: 19224
Joined: 10/25/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: yourbaby
relocate? of course i would, for the right Master. But why does the burden of the first visit seemingly fall upon the slave? we haven't always the means or money to be able to travel... anyone with thoughts on this?

Well the reason WHY it seems to fall on the slave is because usually it's the slave accommodating the master in all ways, so moving locations is just another part of that.

Plus, there is a reason of the stereotype that a slave is needy and goes towards the resources of the dominant.

However, there's certainly no rule or NEED for that to be how it happens. I'm much more pragmatic- schools, jobs, commutes, bills, family and other factors will be what decides things rather than simply "he's the dom, that's why." After all, a competent master takes those things into account already.

_____________________________

Find stable partners, not a stable of partners.

"Sometimes my whore logic gets all fuzzy"- Californication

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RE: relocate? - 3/17/2006 9:07:01 AM   
thetammyjo


Posts: 6322
Joined: 9/8/2005
Status: offline 		Each person has to decide what will work for him/her.

For me, with an established household and little income to throw around AND far more submissives and wouldbe slaves interested in me than I have desire or room for, it seems most logical in my world for him/her to come to me.


_____________________________

Love, Peace, Hugs, Kisses, Whips & Chains,

TammyJo

Check out my website at http://www.thetammyjo.com Or www.tammyjoeckhart.com

And my LJ where I post fiction in progress if you "friend" me at http://thetammyjo.livejournal.com/

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RE: relocate? - 3/17/2006 9:14:32 AM   
JohnWarren


Posts: 3807
Joined: 3/18/2005
From: Delray Beach, FL
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: yourbaby

relocate? of course i would, for the right Master. But why does the burden of the first visit seemingly fall upon the slave? we haven't always the means or money to be able to travel... anyone with thoughts on this?


When Libby and I decided to move in together, I had by far the higher paying job but she had a nice home and a community she was comfortable in whereas I was in Manhattan.

I moved.

It's a complex decision with many factors and probably whether someone is top, dom, bottom or sub may not be near the top of the list.

_____________________________

www.lovingdominant.org

(in reply to yourbaby)
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RE: relocate? - 3/17/2006 9:19:35 AM   
RavenMuse


Posts: 4030
Joined: 1/23/2006
Status: offline 		Personaly I'm looking relitivly localy so first meeting isn't much of a problem. Around here all rail links lead to central London. So thats where I arrange the first meeting. About an hours journey for me and probably for most of them too, but it is the logical choise.

I have a place that I am comfortable in, is well known, quite busy and fits with doing things SSC so thats where I arrange to meet them. If they are a no-show I can still enjoy a relaxed drink and wander off again. Not much loss on my part!

_____________________________

This above all: to thine own self be true,
And it must follow, as the night the day,
Thou canst not then be false to any man.

Owner of metalmiss

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RE: relocate? - 3/17/2006 9:23:47 AM   
TheTopHat


Posts: 39
Joined: 3/12/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: yourbaby

relocate? of course i would, for the right Master. But why does the burden of the first visit seemingly fall upon the slave? we haven't always the means or money to be able to travel... anyone with thoughts on this?


1. If it is a 'burden' to either party it shouldn't be happening at all.
2. It doesn't fall to the 'slave', indeed prior to meeting each other there is no question of subservience or accomadating a master in any or all ways.

I can't stress enough that until a slave has met a Master (and I include Mistresses when I use the term) and is comfortable with them they are not their slave and they have no duty, desire or even social contract to be subservient to them in any way. If anything I would say a 1st visit should ideally be from the Master to the submissive as theoretically they would be safer on 'home ground' should the Master not be what he claims or should they decide not to pursue the relationship.

As always this is dependent on logistics and the individual situation but I don't believe that such a rule or practice should exist as described. Were there to be a guideline I it should be that for the 1st meeting it should be at the place where the submissive party feels the safest and is the most comfortable. Not only does this make sense from a safety standpoint it potentially may make the submissive more relaxed and facilitate the 'courting' process between the 2 parties.

_____________________________

TheTopHat (and Cane)

Just my 2.31 cents (In Canada you see)

(in reply to yourbaby)
Profile   Post #: 7
RE: relocate? - 3/17/2006 9:44:47 AM   
MsSonnetMarwood


Posts: 1898
Joined: 2/10/2005
From: Eastern Shore, Maryland
Status: offline
quote:

relocate? of course i would, for the right Master. But why does the burden of the first visit seemingly fall upon the slave? we haven't always the means or money to be able to travel... anyone with thoughts on this?



If Person A initiates contact with Person B, interested in meeting Person B, then Person A needs to be willing and able to make the journey. IMHO, Person A has no business soliciting Person B if they don't have the means to travel to that person.

Person A also needs to take it graciously if Person B only is interested in locals. Person B probably has assessed their own needs to come up with that requirement.

Note: Nothing about doms, dommes, subs, slaves, switches.

_____________________________

~Ms. Sonnet Marwood~

Deja Moo: The feeling you've heard this bull somewhere before.

(in reply to yourbaby)
Profile   Post #: 8
RE: relocate? - 3/17/2006 10:06:53 AM   
Elegant


Posts: 1024
Joined: 3/15/2005
Status: offline 		I moved from Texas to Atlanta when my ex got a job transfer. We were divorced but it's part of our agreement 'cause we are still a family with 50/50 shared custody of the kids. He makes a mint at his job so he paid my moving expenses etc.

Master Archer followed a year later..it was suppose to be six months but his job in Texas kept bribing him to stay longer. It was a looong year. He gave up his job to move to Atlanta.

The kids are our priority!

_____________________________

Elegant
~Slave To Master Archer

http://www.FantasiesInLeather.com

(in reply to MsSonnetMarwood)
Profile   Post #: 9
RE: relocate? - 3/17/2006 11:21:44 AM   
BrianSenior


Posts: 88
Joined: 3/13/2006
Status: offline 		Most that I see on line are not local, infact 2 hours away is what would be considered or thought of as local for Me. With in the local setting I would go to them to meet, and to Me the first meet is just that a meet with no playing, no toy bag in the back seat no ideas of getting a room. Just to meet and to see what is going to be in our thoughts after we leave the table of the coffee shop. When we speak again, the topics we discussed will be brought up and from there the second meet or now a visit might come in to discussion. Since I own My place (Buying it no I am not rich) I will not relocate. It is a neccassity for the bottom to come to Me as it was said by LadyMorgynn "the slave needs to be IN the environment in which he will be living with Me, in My home, with a schedule fairly approximating how he would live on a day-to-day basis." I have paid for the ticket for the bottom to come to Me, most times I or My wife has went to pick them up our selves. It would depend on the finanacial situation at the time. If they are able to pay it on thier own then so it is done, if not then we wait till it is suitable for every one involved.

(in reply to yourbaby)
Profile   Post #: 10
RE: relocate? - 3/17/2006 11:46:42 AM   
knight4king


Posts: 13
Joined: 2/23/2006
Status: offline 		i can sympathize with the dilemma. i'm on a very tight budget myself. i went on one visit to find that he wasn't at all what he claimed to be online. wondered what he thought the reaction was going to be. The second trip to another went very well, He said he was pleased. i got home to a message that he liked me but he still had "a few" to check out first. sigh. The third gentleman got upset when i told him i needed a few months to save up the airfare. Looking locally too, but so far still looking.

(in reply to BrianSenior)
Profile   Post #: 11
RE: relocate? - 3/17/2006 12:30:59 PM   
slavejali


Posts: 2918
Status: offline 		There was a thread here recently along the theme of "why set yourself up for failure re long distance relationships". Everyone has to live and make choices within their means. If you cant afford to travel to meet someone, why look in that direction? You cant expect people to pay your way, Dom or submissive or not.

Saying that, if someone was interested enough in another and were willing to invest capital into a first meeting knowing the other party was struggling financially, thats cool. Perhaps they could share the costs.

I guess my point is

1. People should live within their means
2. People shouldnt expect strangers to pay their way.
3. If an offer is made to help out financially, cool, but their is no burden of responsibility on either party to pay for the other.

(in reply to knight4king)
Profile   Post #: 12
RE: relocate? - 3/17/2006 1:36:46 PM   
yourbaby


Posts: 4
Joined: 5/26/2005
Status: offline 		Thanks for all of your thoughts... and so quickly!

i wasn't trying to indicate that slaves shouldn't travel to their Masters... merely, that if Someone who lived far away from the slave was (initiated) interested in him/her, that that master/Mistress would travel for the first meeting...

Later, after all is established (chemistry, and the beginnings of the relationship), and it was time to be officially collared (i agree with the Top Hat that a slave is not bound until after they meet their Master IN PERSON and physically submit), i would think it was the role of the slave to travel to it's owner...

i think too many people think submission is an instant thing: it isn't, even though that is possible as love at first sight. Of course, after the first meet, the slave should travel to visit it's potential Master/Mistress in the environment in which the slave was to be living, so it could know what it was to be...

but i have run into too many instances of Master's writing me from different states across the US and answering every question with "when you travel to me for your first visit to submit..." etc etc.

i think that is not exactly polite: and takes the whole Master/slave relationship in a direction that is unhealthy: dooming the long distance relationship in totem rather than by the indivdual, as it should be.

i beleive in love at first siught! but i also think that a "relationship" cannot ever be instant...

(in reply to slavejali)
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RE: relocate? - 3/17/2006 1:44:05 PM   
LuckyAlbatross


Posts: 19224
Joined: 10/25/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: yourbaby
merely, that if Someone who lived far away from the slave was (initiated) interested in him/her, that that master/Mistress would travel for the first meeting...

If that's what everyone agrees on, sure. There's nothing inherent about the situation that would suggest one person of an orientation should travel over the others. (What do you feel in the case of switches? Or of couples? Or families?)

quote:

i would think it was the role of the slave to travel to it's owner...

Why? Refer to above.

quote:

i think that is not exactly polite: and takes the whole Master/slave relationship in a direction that is unhealthy: dooming the long distance relationship in totem rather than by the indivdual, as it should be.

i beleive in love at first siught! but i also think that a "relationship" cannot ever be instant...


There is no time frame for relationships. When can we say at 11:56:06 there is no relationship and then at 11:56:07 there is one?

Relationships can form instantly. However, they take time and work to become solid and long term.

As far as the not polite thing, it can certainly be presumptuous if those issues have not previously been discussed or if there is not an authority dynamic established. However, likely the doms saying those things don't know they are committing such social faux pas and are just trying to come across as strong and in charge.


_____________________________

Find stable partners, not a stable of partners.

"Sometimes my whore logic gets all fuzzy"- Californication

(in reply to yourbaby)
Profile   Post #: 14
RE: relocate? - 3/17/2006 1:51:44 PM   
TemptingNviceSub


Posts: 3054
Joined: 10/1/2005
Status: offline 		I too agree with TopHat...when he stated that for a submissive to feel safe or comfortable it should be on a submissives "home ground" for that first visit.However if after that all is well then it should be to whom ever has the werewithal to do so.And if it comes to a decision to who moves...well then it should be to the person that has less need or commitment within their community..ie: children,homes,family,non-transferrable jobs,schooling etc...........be well Tempting

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RE: relocate? - 3/17/2006 8:27:36 PM   
swtnsparkling


Posts: 1738
Joined: 1/1/2004
Status: offline
quote:

If anything I would say a 1st visit should ideally be from the Master to the submissive as theoretically they would be safer on 'home ground' should the Master not be what he claims or should they decide not to pursue the relationship.



If it is a first ever meeting This has always been the way for me. Never had any complaints about it.

_____________________________

Never make anyone a priority who treats you as an option 2003

Walk in Peace
A "No" uttered from deepest conviction is better than a "Yes" uttered merely to please



(in reply to TheTopHat)
Profile   Post #: 16
RE: relocate? - 3/17/2006 9:05:55 PM   
OscarHargraves


Posts: 693
Joined: 8/9/2005
Status: offline 		Consider........

Negogiation, Communication, or Sharing Costs or travel

_____________________________

Never drive faster than your guardian angel can fly ! !

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Profile   Post #: 17
RE: relocate? - 3/17/2006 9:23:06 PM   
IronBear


Posts: 9008
Joined: 6/19/2005
From: Beenleigh, Qld, Australia
Status: offline 		Relocation is a complete pain in the ass at anytime….

First Visit/s:

Would you expect a breeding kennel pr a farmer to bring potential stock for your viewing to your home address?? Of course not! A Gorean slave is property. You the potential owner should make the trip to check her out in her natural setting. (Gives you a chance to have a small holiday too). Allow her to play hostess and even show you the sites.. Think about it you have the chance to explore her in circumstances away from your home…. If she seems to work out that do what I would with another malamute, have her come to me to meet the household and get used to my environment…. Now you have both seen each other in two different scenarios you have a better and more balanced basis to make further plans… This is where I differ from you LA. The pleasing of a Master is only relevent if the slave is in a Master's Collar IMV. I agree with your view that the slave's outside responsibilities with jobs, family etc are important and needs to be considered too. A wise Master will know this as well.

Moving:

This is going to be dependent of whose is financially to carry the burden and who pays for what etc.. Were my finances on a par with the old days, I would foot the bill entirely and go to help supervise as well as transporting the slave myself (under armed escort so there could be no slave rustling unless she was the Brown Paper Slave..)


_____________________________

Iron Bear

Master of Bruin Cottage

http://www.bruincottage.org

Your attitude, words & actions are yours. Take responsibility for them and the consequences they incur.

D.I.L.L.I.G.A.F.

(in reply to OscarHargraves)
Profile   Post #: 18
RE: relocate? - 3/17/2006 10:00:00 PM   
Vancouver_cinful


Posts: 1911
Joined: 2/3/2004
Status: offline 		When it's been long-distance, I've had dominants travel to meet me, and I've done the same. None of these situations were more than a few hours by car (or ferry). Who did the travelling depended on many factors, never had to do with who was sub or who was dom.

Local first meetings are usually done at a little coffee shop near me. Every dom I have agreed to meet locally has been guite happy to be the ones to come to my neighbourhood, because they were gentlemen. I think it's a lovely chivalrous, gesture on their part.

Cin

_____________________________

Cin

quote:


My Karma Account is huge, but I just can't seem to make a withdrawal!!

http://cinful.wordpress.com

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Profile   Post #: 19
RE: relocate? - 3/17/2006 10:06:37 PM   
IronBear


Posts: 9008
Joined: 6/19/2005
From: Beenleigh, Qld, Australia
Status: offline 		I guess it depends on distance cin, I'm more used to say a 10 to 20 hour drive to visit especially when I lived in Perth West Aussie, I'd have a vehicle packed by dinner time and drive all night to go fishing at first light on some remote beach and drive home the next night.... If the interest were there, I'd happily drive the 12 to 14 hours down to Sydney to have a coffee meet and then drive home....

_____________________________

Iron Bear

Master of Bruin Cottage

http://www.bruincottage.org

Your attitude, words & actions are yours. Take responsibility for them and the consequences they incur.

D.I.L.L.I.G.A.F.

(in reply to Vancouver_cinful)
Profile   Post #: 20
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