RE: Health Care Bill passes the Senate!

RE: Health Care Bill passes the Senate! (Full Version)

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tazzygirl -> RE: Health Care Bill passes the Senate! (12/25/2009 8:31:32 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: zephyroftheNorth That's a relief, for a while there I feared for his health. Merry Christmas to you both. zeph Thank you sweety!! Merry Christmas to you as well!!

cuckoldmepls -> RE: Health Care Bill passes the Senate! (12/25/2009 8:32:39 AM)
First of all, according to the 10th amendment of the U.S. Constitution the federal government has almost no constitutional authority on healthcare since it is a local person walking into their local hospital which means it does not fall under the Interstate Commerce Clause. However, Insurance companies do fall under that clause since most of them cross state lines. Since they supposedly didn't pass a public option that would have been unconstitutional (you can't create something that is unconstitutional to begin with, then claim it falls under the ICC after you created it), another constitutional issue arises where they force people to buy insurance which is obviously completely unconstitutional. Technically, you can't make anyone buy anything, especially if they are barely making the mortgage payments as it is. The question then becomes, will this cause another mortgage meltdown, and put the finishing death nails on the big 3 automakers since even more people will not be able to buy new cars and new homes since their money will not be diverted to healthcare. Get ready folks, be prepared for a complete economic meltdown in 2 years. Which brings up an interesting possibilty. Will this cause another mortgage meltdown when people are forced to divert their money to healthcare. Now I agree that part of the problem in healthcare is that there are a lot of young people out there who are spending money on new cars instead of healthcare

tazzygirl -> RE: Health Care Bill passes the Senate! (12/25/2009 8:35:17 AM)
Then explain the passage of Social Security, Medicare and unemployment insurance... not to mention workmen's comp.

Raiikun -> RE: Health Care Bill passes the Senate! (12/25/2009 8:38:34 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: cuckoldmepls Now I agree that part of the problem in healthcare is that there are a lot of young people out there who are spending money on new cars instead of healthcare Something I'm partly guilty of (Except, I'm more of the home electronics geek type hehe...just installed a home theater with 120" screen). However, I do put money back for healthcare, enough so that (as mentioned in another thread), last year when I got seriously ill, I was able to pay for a neurologist visit, hemotologist visit, an MRI, CT scan, etc out of pocket. There are doctors out there btw who are quite happy to charge a lot less for medical visits too if you're willing/able to pay up front. But yep, I'll be quite miffed if now suddenly I'm required to pay for insurance that I really do have absolutely no need for.

cuckoldmepls -> RE: Health Care Bill passes the Senate! (12/25/2009 8:43:13 AM)
That's easy to explain. Democrats passed all those programs, and democrats don't have the foggiest clue what the U.S. Constitution says, including the 4 specific times it requires the federal government to protect us from invasion. They also don't understand what the 1st, and 2nd amendments say, since they are always attempting to silence free speech unless it is politically correct, and they are always attempting to disarm legal, law abiding citizens. In summary, all those programs you mentioned are unconstitutional, but they would not be unconstitutional if the states implemented similar programs of their own. By the way, have you not figured out yet why we are $10 trillion in debt??? It's because the feds have overstepped their constittional authority for the past 100 years. I almost forgot to mention this site which has 5 requirements for real healthcare reform among many other interesting articles, videos, and links. The proof that Obama is a muslim video is excellent as well. http://babelishere.webs.com/health.html

rulemylife -> RE: Health Care Bill passes the Senate! (12/25/2009 8:50:34 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Sanity But our actual health care is probably better than anyones, if for no other reason than because we don't have to wait for it and we don't need a permission slip from some government bureaucrat before we get whatever treatment we need. No, you just need a permission slip from your insurance company which has a profit motive to deny coverage.

tazzygirl -> RE: Health Care Bill passes the Senate! (12/25/2009 8:51:18 AM)
I dont buy into you fantasy world. I mentioned those programs because they all work, all for a specific purpose... the public good. The same as health care reform. The reason why republicans dont want this passed is two fold: 1 - Because it strips the powers of the health care industry, namely insurance companies, and when those powers are stripped, they wont be paying the politicians as much. 2 - Because it would give the Dems a win.. and heaven forbid that happen!

Sanity -> RE: Health Care Bill passes the Senate! (12/25/2009 8:53:16 AM)
Waiting list times for various procedures in the different Canadian provinces: http://www.hc-sc.gc.ca/hcs-sss/qual/acces/wait-attente/index-eng.php And again, the logistical challenges up there are nothing compared to what we're faced with here.

Sanity -> RE: Health Care Bill passes the Senate! (12/25/2009 8:56:41 AM)
An insurance company's motivation is selling policies, something that a good reputation helps with tremendously. They perform, or they lose business. A fat lazy bureaucrat sitting in a cozy office chair somewhere has no motivation. His or her fat bureaucratic ass gets funded whether he or she answers the phone or not, whether he or she is pleasant to you or not, and whether he or she helps you or not. quote: ORIGINAL: rulemylife quote: ORIGINAL: Sanity But our actual health care is probably better than anyones, if for no other reason than because we don't have to wait for it and we don't need a permission slip from some government bureaucrat before we get whatever treatment we need. No, you just need a permission slip from your insurance company which has a profit motive to deny coverage.

tazzygirl -> RE: Health Care Bill passes the Senate! (12/25/2009 9:04:32 AM)
HEATH CARE ACHIEVEMENTS Wait times for various key procedures are down since 2005: •Cataract surgeries: wait time down 191 days or 61 per cent •Angiography: wait time down 26 days or 47 per cent •Knee replacements: wait time down 196 days or 45 per cent •CT scans: wait time down 32 days or 40 per cent •Hip replacements: wait time down 129 days or 37 per cent •Angioplasty: wait time down nine days or 32 per cent •Cancer surgeries: wait time down 12 days or 15 per cent •MRI scans: wait time down seven days or six per cent •Pediatric surgeries (since 2006): wait time down 14 days or five per cent Access to health care professionals has improved: •More than 500,000 people who did not have a family doctor in 2003 now have one •More than 8,000 nurses were hired between 2003 and 2008 •More than doubled the number of training and assessment positions for international medical graduates to 200 positions in 2004. http://www.investinontario.com/siteselector/ooql_404_us.asp

cuckoldmepls -> RE: Health Care Bill passes the Senate! (12/25/2009 9:04:36 AM)
Here's the 10th amendment which proves my point." It's as plain as day. There's no ambiguity. "The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the States, are reserved to the States respectively, or to the people." If it is does not specifically give the feds the authority, then it is reserved to the states. It's absolutely amazing that some people haven't figured out why we are $10 trillion in debt. it's very simple, the feds have created all these programs that are unconstitutional, and they don't even have enough revenue to fund them so they end up borrowing money. This means that it won't be long before we will paying half a trillion in interest each year to wealthy people, here and abroad, and to other countries. A half a trillion could go a long way into improving the quality of life in each state if you divided it up according to population. That's 500 bllion dollars which means 50 billion for each state annually. "When the government creates jobs with more spending, they have to take more and more of your paycheck in taxes or pass the debt on to our children which means they are giving billions in interest payments to wealthy people here and abroad and to other countries, not to mention still owing the debt. When private industry creates jobs, you actually receive a product or a service when they take your money. Now which would you rather have?" Now, you tell me you're going to vote for Obama again, and I'll show you a fool who believes in mass murder of unborn children, and fatalistic economic policies. By the way, it sometimes takes 5 to 10 years for the results of economic policies to reveal themselves, and Bill Clinton was the benefactor of reaganomics. Then Clinton signed NAFTA, and China, and Bush ignores Illegal Immigration for 8 years, and now look what you have. 10% official unemployment. 12% to 15% real unemployment. Obama doesn't plan on doing anything about NAFTA, China or Illegal Immigration, so how long do you think we have???

tazzygirl -> RE: Health Care Bill passes the Senate! (12/25/2009 9:08:04 AM)
quote: Now, you tell me you're going to vote for Obama again, and I'll show you a fool who believes in mass murder of unborn children, and fatalistic economic policies. Care to back this up with more fantasy web sites? quote: A half a trillion could go a long way into improving the quality of life in each state if you divided it up according to population. That's 500 bllion dollars which means 50 billion for each state annually. If you believe the people of these states would see much of this money, i got a bridge to sell you. The more something trickles down through the hands of politicians, the less we the people see.

cuckoldmepls -> RE: Health Care Bill passes the Senate! (12/25/2009 9:08:59 AM)
Oops, I did my math wrong, it's only $10 billion for each state, and that's not by dividing it up by population. Thats still a lot of money though, that could go a long way into MAPS projects that build new inner city schools, and rehabilitate slum neighborhoods, which eventually improves the quality of life for everyone living in those previous hell holes.

Sanity -> RE: Health Care Bill passes the Senate! (12/25/2009 9:10:58 AM)
The figures go both up and down over time. Politicians will pay the various problems lip service in election season, promise the sun and the moon, then depending on public outrage and on funding deliver whatever they can get around to providing. I would really hate to have to rely on various politicians' campaign promises for my health care solutions as they do in Canada.

Raiikun -> RE: Health Care Bill passes the Senate! (12/25/2009 9:12:21 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: tazzygirl HEATH CARE ACHIEVEMENTS Wait times for various key procedures are down since 2005: •Cataract surgeries: wait time down 191 days or 61 per cent •Angiography: wait time down 26 days or 47 per cent •Knee replacements: wait time down 196 days or 45 per cent •CT scans: wait time down 32 days or 40 per cent •Hip replacements: wait time down 129 days or 37 per cent •Angioplasty: wait time down nine days or 32 per cent •Cancer surgeries: wait time down 12 days or 15 per cent •MRI scans: wait time down seven days or six per cent •Pediatric surgeries (since 2006): wait time down 14 days or five per cent Access to health care professionals has improved: •More than 500,000 people who did not have a family doctor in 2003 now have one •More than 8,000 nurses were hired between 2003 and 2008 •More than doubled the number of training and assessment positions for international medical graduates to 200 positions in 2004. http://www.investinontario.com/siteselector/ooql_404_us.asp Kinda scary actually reading those stats. For instance - "Pediatric surgeries (since 2006): wait time down 14 days or five per cent" Five percent...that means wait time has dropped from 280 days to 264 days. •CT scans: wait time down 32 days or 40 per cent That's 80 down to 48 days. (For a scan that I was able to get on the same trip as my initial doctor's visit here).

cuckoldmepls -> RE: Health Care Bill passes the Senate! (12/25/2009 9:13:20 AM)
I don't have to back anything up proving that Democratic spending programs are turning us into a 3rd world socialist country who believes that lazy people shouldn't have to work and live within their means. The final proof is that we are $10 trillion in debt. There's no possible way you can dispute that. Anyone with common sense knows that you shouldn't be able to buy a new car, while taxpayers pay for your healthcare.

Sanity -> RE: Health Care Bill passes the Senate! (12/25/2009 9:13:50 AM)
Give tazzy her due credit though, she proved that you really can put a shine on a turd. [;)] quote: ORIGINAL: Raiikun quote: ORIGINAL: tazzygirl HEATH CARE ACHIEVEMENTS Wait times for various key procedures are down since 2005: •Cataract surgeries: wait time down 191 days or 61 per cent •Angiography: wait time down 26 days or 47 per cent •Knee replacements: wait time down 196 days or 45 per cent •CT scans: wait time down 32 days or 40 per cent •Hip replacements: wait time down 129 days or 37 per cent •Angioplasty: wait time down nine days or 32 per cent •Cancer surgeries: wait time down 12 days or 15 per cent •MRI scans: wait time down seven days or six per cent •Pediatric surgeries (since 2006): wait time down 14 days or five per cent Access to health care professionals has improved: •More than 500,000 people who did not have a family doctor in 2003 now have one •More than 8,000 nurses were hired between 2003 and 2008 •More than doubled the number of training and assessment positions for international medical graduates to 200 positions in 2004. http://www.investinontario.com/siteselector/ooql_404_us.asp Kinda scary actually reading those stats. For instance - "Pediatric surgeries (since 2006): wait time down 14 days or five per cent" Five percent...that means wait time has dropped from 280 days to 264 days. •CT scans: wait time down 32 days or 40 per cent That's 80 down to 48 days. (For a scan that I was able to get on the same trip as my initial doctor's visit here).

tazzygirl -> RE: Health Care Bill passes the Senate! (12/25/2009 9:14:07 AM)
And many of us are sick (literally) of having to wait for some CFO in an insurance office to determine if i am eligible for a procedure or if i can see the specialist my primary care physician has determined i need to see... or if im suddenly denied coverage because i forgot to mention the toenail fungus infection i had 5 years ago.

Sanity -> RE: Health Care Bill passes the Senate! (12/25/2009 9:15:51 AM)
You want out of the miserably hot frying pan so you can enjoy the nice cool relaxing fire down below. quote: ORIGINAL: tazzygirl And many of us are sick (literally) of having to wait for some CFO in an insurance office to determine if i am eligible for a procedure or if i can see the specialist my primary care physician has determined i need to see... or if im suddenly denied coverage because i forgot to mention the toenail fungus infection i had 5 years ago.

tazzygirl -> RE: Health Care Bill passes the Senate! (12/25/2009 9:17:23 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Sanity Give tazzy her due credit though, she proved that you really can put a shine on a turd. [;)] quote: ORIGINAL: Raiikun quote: ORIGINAL: tazzygirl HEATH CARE ACHIEVEMENTS Wait times for various key procedures are down since 2005: •Cataract surgeries: wait time down 191 days or 61 per cent •Angiography: wait time down 26 days or 47 per cent •Knee replacements: wait time down 196 days or 45 per cent •CT scans: wait time down 32 days or 40 per cent •Hip replacements: wait time down 129 days or 37 per cent •Angioplasty: wait time down nine days or 32 per cent •Cancer surgeries: wait time down 12 days or 15 per cent •MRI scans: wait time down seven days or six per cent •Pediatric surgeries (since 2006): wait time down 14 days or five per cent Access to health care professionals has improved: •More than 500,000 people who did not have a family doctor in 2003 now have one •More than 8,000 nurses were hired between 2003 and 2008 •More than doubled the number of training and assessment positions for international medical graduates to 200 positions in 2004. http://www.investinontario.com/siteselector/ooql_404_us.asp Kinda scary actually reading those stats. For instance - "Pediatric surgeries (since 2006): wait time down 14 days or five per cent" Five percent...that means wait time has dropped from 280 days to 264 days. •CT scans: wait time down 32 days or 40 per cent That's 80 down to 48 days. (For a scan that I was able to get on the same trip as my initial doctor's visit here). Keep it in perspective, sanity. Emergency cases do not wait. And here in the good ole usa, i had to wait 6 weeks for my knee surgery. And two weeks for the MRI. No matter what system your using... you WILL have wait times.

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