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RE: Airport Security - 1/9/2010 4:25:58 PM   
LafayetteLady


Posts: 7683
Joined: 5/2/2007
From: Northern New Jersey
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Jeffff

Ideally we live in a representational government, It is not a federal democracy, it is a republic. People do get the government they deserve.

Refusing to vote is not a vote against the system. It is abdicating your responsibility and since you mentioned it, a hard won right, especially for women


Jeff


And it is my right to choose to abdicate that responsibility. I never said I didn't vote as a means of "voting against the system." I specifically pointed out that since I didn't vote, I'm in no position to bitch over what the government is or is not doing. Specifically because, as you said I "abdicated that responsibility" and therefore my right to bitch. For the things that I want to have the "right" to bitch about, I will either vote or get involved in a way to try to affect change. If I don't, then yes I'm forced to accept what is given to me.

(in reply to Jeffff)
Profile   Post #: 81
RE: Airport Security - 1/9/2010 4:31:57 PM   
Jeffff


Posts: 12600
Joined: 7/7/2007
Status: offline 		Blah,, Blah Bla, you don't get to throw up women's sufferage as an example and then say you didn't vote.

I call bullshit.

Like it or not the system exhists. Writing letters and signing petitions might be moderatly effective, in an election year.

Nothing is more effective than voting.  You don't like something?, find a candidate, stuff some envelopes or send a check and then fucking vote.

Jeff

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(in reply to LafayetteLady)
Profile   Post #: 82
RE: Airport Security - 1/9/2010 4:36:26 PM   
barelynangel


Posts: 6233
Status: offline 		I guess i am strange i believe in actions when someone has such strong feelings, its opinions like yours Jeff and domiguys and others that make me not surprised the government pretty much tunes out everyone except when they the politicians singing about hope and promises in an election year to passify people enough to be voted into the government. That was why i asked my initial post to kittinsol. Her anger made me believe she was actually DOING something, and i thought because so many people don't have a clue how to start getting involved in such a thing, she could tell what she is doing and people may realize one person can make a difference.

Its sad that people feel that way. It reminds me of the "i'm just one person" mentality people have with regard to the same concept. To me, hope and promise doesn't lie in what others are trying to make me feel but instead hope and promise lies in actions people are willing to do to accomplish what they want to see of our government in everything which is a lot lol.

angel

< Message edited by barelynangel -- 1/9/2010 4:43:13 PM >

_____________________________


What lies behind us and what lies before us are tiny matters compared to what lies within us.
R.W. Emerson


(in reply to Jeffff)
Profile   Post #: 83
RE: Airport Security - 1/9/2010 4:39:29 PM   
KatyLied


Posts: 13029
Joined: 2/24/2005
From: Pennsylvania
Status: offline 		If I vote for a third party candidate or party that never wins; do I still get to bitch?  That is pretty much the same as not voting.  There are many voices that are never heard because we simply don't reside within the neat bounds of a 2 party system.  If you are a contributing member of society I have no problem listening to your voice, whether you vote or not.

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(in reply to Jeffff)
Profile   Post #: 84
RE: Airport Security - 1/9/2010 4:53:27 PM   
Kimveri


Posts: 783
Joined: 7/14/2007
From: Vegas
Status: offline 		~FR~

As long as people are expressing their views ("right", "wrong" OR "uninformed") then they are having an effect. When their expression(s) provoke others to do so as well, whether in support OR in opposition, then the issue gets more exposure.

As long as there's a place to speak freely about things & freely agree, disagree, question, & maybe learn....then there's hope for change...& maybe even improvement.

So...wanna know what I think? ;-P

I think ya'll need to keep debating this so that better info gets dragged onto the thread, more of us become interested in that info, & a few of us become inspired to take an action....even if that action is using the "hide" feature here on the forum...

~K

_____________________________

"You get what you accept."

"It is always wise to examine the facts from all angles before one renders a summary judgement."~_Marcus_

(in reply to KatyLied)
Profile   Post #: 85
RE: Airport Security - 1/9/2010 5:32:18 PM   
lusciouslips19


Posts: 9792
Joined: 9/8/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: barelynangel

Last i checked there is nothing mandatory in the TOS about my saying people should get out there and stand for their beliefs if they are going to be PASSIONATE ABOUT THEM on a fucking discussion board lol. OR my belief that inaction does in fact invalidate opinions down to nothing but white noise.

So i guess we are both right lucious lips, so seriously, give up YOUR holier than thou mentality you tend to get when you don't agree with people. You tend to do what you accuse others of so you really aren't all that i am soo perfect you like to portray.


quote:

We are allowed to express our views, just as everyone else.


OHH but i am not allowed to express MY VIEWS. So what you are saying is youare a hypocrit, if your shaking your finger at me is accurate.

angel





Whenever you are called out you do this "na na, I know you are but what am I" crap
You are allowed to give your views of course. But you come off as telling people what they should do.

Did you here that everyone.
"inaction validates all opinions"

Thank you for that public service announcement.
You have any data to back up that OPINION which you state as fact????

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(in reply to barelynangel)
Profile   Post #: 86
RE: Airport Security - 1/9/2010 5:39:24 PM   
tazzygirl


Posts: 37833
Joined: 10/12/2007
Status: offline 		~FR

Since somany are upset about the scanners, which im still debating with myself... what about dogs? they can sniff out many bomb materials, including the last one used on the plane. But, would you rather have a wet nose (ok.. some of you remember this is NOT a kink thread lol) between your legs or a machine filming you?

_____________________________

Telling me to take Midol wont help your butthurt.
RIP, my demon-child 5-16-11
Duchess of Dissent 1
Dont judge me because I sin differently than you.
If you want it sugar coated, dont ask me what i think! It would violate TOS.

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Profile   Post #: 87
RE: Airport Security - 1/9/2010 5:43:10 PM   
lusciouslips19


Posts: 9792
Joined: 9/8/2007
Status: offline
quote:

That was why i asked my initial post to kittinsol. Her anger made me believe she was actually DOING something, and i thought because so many people don't have a clue how to start getting involved in such a thing, she could tell what she is doing and people may realize one person can make a difference.


I read that post and it in no way comes off as helpful and you thinking she was doing something you were seaking to shed positive light on. It was accusatory and judgemental. Fine to be that way. Just dont try to pretend you were getting ready to pat her on the back. The post still stands for us to read.

_____________________________

Original Pimpette,
Keeper of Original Home Flag and Fire of Mr. Lance Hughes
Charter member of Lance's Fag Hags,
Member of the Subbie Mafia
Princess of typos and it's my prerogative

(in reply to barelynangel)
Profile   Post #: 88
RE: Airport Security - 1/9/2010 6:05:41 PM   
barelynangel


Posts: 6233
Status: offline 		Yes, DO go back and READ my posts LusciousLips you will see all of them speak of the SAME THING - ACTIONS for strong opinions. I don't really care if you don't LIKE what i am saying i didn't realize you are one of the people i need approval from. Or do you think you are? ANd you say i feel i am superior lol. Seriously LusciousLips, i get it -- you don't like how i post, but well its not going to change so can you go be a school marm to someone else.

You know what's funny as hell, you speak TO ME about being judgmental and accusatory but i didn't see you saying ANYTHING TO ANYONE ELSE namely kittinsol's posts to many people on this very thread about not being nice. What's that called -- oh yes double standards. Nor do you see how you are doing the SAME thing you accuse me of lol. BUt its okay for you to do and others. BUt you don't LIKE me pointing THIS out to you because gee that would put you and me in the same boat yes? In we are both doing the same thing so how can yousay I am wrong and not admit to same yourself?

So i will chalk this up to being a PERSONAL issue and you really are a hypocrit as you don't hold everyone to posting a certain way. So i will chalk everytime you wanna shake your finger at me to be your simply not liking me and have to run in and have your say against me lol. Becuse you sure the hell aren't equally disapproving of people being judgmental and accusatory -- IF that was remotely what my motive was -- which it wasn't. I presume you aren't SO full of yourself you would dare try and tell me what my motive is for posting.

Again irony is funny. So why not just save us both some time and admit it, this is nothing about the correct way to post -- you don't LIKE me so you run in to get into it with me.

Yeah i post like i do, i never saw the written word as a gun to someone's head. If my posts make you think i am ORDERING you lol then honey, you really need to get offline.

If you are THAT insecure with my statements, then i can't help you. I am NOT going to change how i post. I post and write as i do. If you don't see posts as OPINIONS you need to get OFFLINE.

One thing people who have seen me post can say i do, i admit i am a bitch. I have no reason to lie about my motives in posting. If i was bitching at kittinsol for her posts, i would have been a whole lot less subtle than what you are saying, i don't do passive aggressive. So maybe its YOU who needs to take a step back and reevaluate.


Seriously, i have always told people who don't like my posting that there is a hide button, PLEASE USE IT. I advocate it for my posts for people like you.

angel

< Message edited by barelynangel -- 1/9/2010 6:22:38 PM >

_____________________________


What lies behind us and what lies before us are tiny matters compared to what lies within us.
R.W. Emerson


(in reply to lusciouslips19)
Profile   Post #: 89
RE: Airport Security - 1/9/2010 6:08:26 PM   
servantforuse


Posts: 6363
Joined: 3/8/2006
Status: offline 		Not one person has blamed Bush for this. It was all done by the Messiah..

(in reply to barelynangel)
Profile   Post #: 90
RE: Airport Security - 1/9/2010 6:31:33 PM   
barelynangel


Posts: 6233
Status: offline 		I will say this, my posts never indicated people shouldn't HAVE an opinion or debate issues - as Kimveri indicated it does spark interest especially if its negative, however, it is my hope that the energy spurred by the PASSIONATE opinions some have shown to take that energy into actions outside of the forum where those actions can on many levels lead to more actions and maybe triumph fpr change to suit opinions people have in the positive.

I am a huge fan of actions to change laws and such, i have seen what lobbying and acting on topics have helped make change. I hope people get involved in areas they are passionate about especially with regard to the government and our countries outside of just complaining and being pissed off.

angel

< Message edited by barelynangel -- 1/9/2010 6:32:30 PM >

_____________________________


What lies behind us and what lies before us are tiny matters compared to what lies within us.
R.W. Emerson


(in reply to servantforuse)
Profile   Post #: 91
RE: Airport Security - 1/9/2010 7:02:25 PM   
tazzygirl


Posts: 37833
Joined: 10/12/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: servantforuse

Not one person has blamed Bush for this. It was all done by the Messiah..


did you find pahunk's meds and start taking them?

_____________________________

Telling me to take Midol wont help your butthurt.
RIP, my demon-child 5-16-11
Duchess of Dissent 1
Dont judge me because I sin differently than you.
If you want it sugar coated, dont ask me what i think! It would violate TOS.

(in reply to servantforuse)
Profile   Post #: 92
RE: Airport Security - 1/9/2010 7:16:37 PM   
lusciouslips19


Posts: 9792
Joined: 9/8/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: barelynangel

Yes, DO go back and READ my posts LusciousLips you will see all of them speak of the SAME THING - ACTIONS for strong opinions. I don't really care if you don't LIKE what i am saying i didn't realize you are one of the people i need approval from. Or do you think you are? ANd you say i feel i am superior lol. Seriously LusciousLips, i get it -- you don't like how i post, but well its not going to change so can you go be a school marm to someone else.

You know what's funny as hell, you speak TO ME about being judgmental and accusatory but i didn't see you saying ANYTHING TO ANYONE ELSE namely kittinsol's posts to many people on this very thread about not being nice. What's that called -- oh yes double standards. Nor do you see how you are doing the SAME thing you accuse me of lol. BUt its okay for you to do and others. BUt you don't LIKE me pointing THIS out to you because gee that would put you and me in the same boat yes? In we are both doing the same thing so how can yousay I am wrong and not admit to same yourself?

So i will chalk this up to being a PERSONAL issue and you really are a hypocrit as you don't hold everyone to posting a certain way. So i will chalk everytime you wanna shake your finger at me to be your simply not liking me and have to run in and have your say against me lol. Becuse you sure the hell aren't equally disapproving of people being judgmental and accusatory -- IF that was remotely what my motive was -- which it wasn't. I presume you aren't SO full of yourself you would dare try and tell me what my motive is for posting.

Again irony is funny. So why not just save us both some time and admit it, this is nothing about the correct way to post -- you don't LIKE me so you run in to get into it with me.

Yeah i post like i do, i never saw the written word as a gun to someone's head. If my posts make you think i am ORDERING you lol then honey, you really need to get offline.

If you are THAT insecure with my statements, then i can't help you. I am NOT going to change how i post. I post and write as i do. If you don't see posts as OPINIONS you need to get OFFLINE.

One thing people who have seen me post can say i do, i admit i am a bitch. I have no reason to lie about my motives in posting. If i was bitching at kittinsol for her posts, i would have been a whole lot less subtle than what you are saying, i don't do passive aggressive. So maybe its YOU who needs to take a step back and reevaluate.


Seriously, i have always told people who don't like my posting that there is a hide button, PLEASE USE IT. I advocate it for my posts for people like you.

angel


Well I could be wrong, I can admit that. Can people like you?

Its funny, if i question you or anyone questions you, we need to reevaluate? M'kay. Sounds a bit narcissistic to me. I'm passive -aggressive, not aggressive-aggresive and tromping other people down? All of us opposed to your opinions and statements need to block and hide you? i think not. I think I'll just be interjecting my 2 cents for as long as I please.

< Message edited by lusciouslips19 -- 1/9/2010 7:35:31 PM >

_____________________________

Original Pimpette,
Keeper of Original Home Flag and Fire of Mr. Lance Hughes
Charter member of Lance's Fag Hags,
Member of the Subbie Mafia
Princess of typos and it's my prerogative

(in reply to barelynangel)
Profile   Post #: 93
RE: Airport Security - 1/9/2010 7:20:29 PM   
lusciouslips19


Posts: 9792
Joined: 9/8/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Kimveri

~FR~

As long as people are expressing their views ("right", "wrong" OR "uninformed") then they are having an effect. When their expression(s) provoke others to do so as well, whether in support OR in opposition, then the issue gets more exposure.

As long as there's a place to speak freely about things & freely agree, disagree, question, & maybe learn....then there's hope for change...& maybe even improvement.

So...wanna know what I think? ;-P

I think ya'll need to keep debating this so that better info gets dragged onto the thread, more of us become interested in that info, & a few of us become inspired to take an action....even if that action is using the "hide" feature here on the forum...

~K

People should be able to speak here and interject there thoughts rant or not. Perhaps not a derailing of their thoughts with a questioning of their ethics. Maybe a seperate thread that is a "call to action" if they are trying to incite action.

_____________________________

Original Pimpette,
Keeper of Original Home Flag and Fire of Mr. Lance Hughes
Charter member of Lance's Fag Hags,
Member of the Subbie Mafia
Princess of typos and it's my prerogative

(in reply to Kimveri)
Profile   Post #: 94
RE: Airport Security - 1/9/2010 8:02:30 PM   
LafayetteLady


Posts: 7683
Joined: 5/2/2007
From: Northern New Jersey
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Jeffff

Blah,, Blah Bla, you don't get to throw up women's sufferage as an example and then say you didn't vote.

I call bullshit.

Like it or not the system exhists. Writing letters and signing petitions might be moderatly effective, in an election year.

Nothing is more effective than voting.  You don't like something?, find a candidate, stuff some envelopes or send a check and then fucking vote.

Jeff


Everything I brought up were things that occurred WAY before I could have voten on them, most in fact before I was even born.

If you will re-read my posts, I have said that if someone doesn't like something, they need to take action against it. That does not always involve voting, but I agree that is a good place to start.

But I never said that people shouldn't vote. Your implication is that because I openly admit that I didn't vote, that any other action I may choose to take is null and void. That's plain stupidity.

I specifically said that because I DID NOT take part in the election of our latest president, that I am in no position to complain about him. Why? Because I did not take a position either way, for Obama or McCain. So those who did vote for one of the two can complain or compliment how they think the guy is doing.

But make no mistake, the president is in no way responsible for the issue discussed in this thread.

quote:

ORIGINAL: KatyLied

If I vote for a third party candidate or party that never wins; do I still get to bitch? That is pretty much the same as not voting. There are many voices that are never heard because we simply don't reside within the neat bounds of a 2 party system. If you are a contributing member of society I have no problem listening to your voice, whether you vote or not.


Yep, feel free to bitch all you want. It isn't the same as not voting. If you play a game and lose, is that like not playing at all? Perhaps your voting for the third party guy (whether or not that is what you actually did, so fill in "general" you if you prefer), kept McCain from winning the election. We recently had a situation in our election for Governor here in NJ. One guy ran SPECIFICALLY to take votes away from one of the other candidates.

Those voices outside of the "2 party" system can get heard. Surely you have heard of Ralph Nader? He's outside the two party system for sure. Harvey Milk, who I don't know if he was Democrat or Republican was still in his own way outside the two party system by being openly gay.

My example was not to say "if you don't vote, shut the fuck up." Although if you did not take part in the presidential election, yea, shut the fuck up if you don't like the president. I didn't vote, nor do I complain about the president.

Other issues don't require a "vote." If someone is unhappy about the homeless and the poor in this country, they can do plenty to help without "voting." "Avon's Walk for a Cure" raises money and really doesn't have to do with voting for the president.

However, let's try a new example and see if that clears up any confusion. If someone is thoroughly pissed off that we don't have a cure for cancer, which is more productive? "Walk for the Cure" or any of the other thousands of fund raising activities for each type of cancer or coming to a message board and spouting off that there really IS a cure for cancer, but the pharmaceutical companies are simply hiding it to make more money.

Speaking up about something is about being proactive. Speaking up about something in a way that makes you sound uninformed, or like a conspiracy theorist or raging like a crazed lunatic is not about to get the issue noticed. Speak up in an intelligent, reasonable manner with realistic concerns and maybe someone will listen.

Comparing it to the way Israel's airport security works with armed guards and interrogations as being better? Sure, they haven't had security breaches that we have, but I think people would be equally offended by some of the questions that are asked and the searches of luggage that occur. Not x-raying luggage, but out right searches. If the USA were to change to that method, the same people who are bitching about the scanners would now be bitching about the armed guards and the interrogations they must submit to in order to get on a plane. Why? Because most of these people, while demanding something be done to protect them, also don't want to have their "personal freedoms" violated. In other words, since they aren't a terrorist, they should be left alone.

(in reply to Jeffff)
Profile   Post #: 95
RE: Airport Security - 1/9/2010 8:03:56 PM   
tazzygirl


Posts: 37833
Joined: 10/12/2007
Status: offline 		Again, what about the solution of using dogs?

_____________________________

Telling me to take Midol wont help your butthurt.
RIP, my demon-child 5-16-11
Duchess of Dissent 1
Dont judge me because I sin differently than you.
If you want it sugar coated, dont ask me what i think! It would violate TOS.

(in reply to LafayetteLady)
Profile   Post #: 96
RE: Airport Security - 1/9/2010 8:06:52 PM   
barelynangel


Posts: 6233
Status: offline 		i don't do subtle or passive agreesive so my posts can usually be taken at face value as to what they say. I know this is hard for people to understand because many people do employ passive-aggressiveness. I don't. My posts are what they are. To me passive-aggressive is something i have never respected and it is synonmous to me as someone attacking someone from the back or major manipulation. There is no integrity to me in passive-aggressiveness and subtlety is a close second.

You've lost me what am i supposed to being MAYBE wrong about? My opinions? Umm nope, sorry, my opinions haven't changed. So i am not sure what you want from this exchange lol. We both know your only reasons for shaking your finger was not due to your belief in posting non-judgmental or non-accusing posts standard for everyone, but because OF ME, personally. I get it. As i said, you can hide me cause my posting style won't change. AND i am rarely when i do post judgmentally and accusatory the ONLY people to do so in threads. To indicate i am is beyond ridiculous.

angel


angel

_____________________________


What lies behind us and what lies before us are tiny matters compared to what lies within us.
R.W. Emerson


(in reply to lusciouslips19)
Profile   Post #: 97
RE: Airport Security - 1/9/2010 8:07:25 PM   
LafayetteLady


Posts: 7683
Joined: 5/2/2007
From: Northern New Jersey
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl

Again, what about the solution of using dogs?


Good question. If they sniff something then maybe the scanner can be the next step. If the dog likes you, you can pass, if they don't, it's the scanner for you.

I would think though that the fact that many people have some pretty big fears of dogs, that could be a problem.

(in reply to tazzygirl)
Profile   Post #: 98
RE: Airport Security - 1/9/2010 8:14:37 PM   
sirsholly


Posts: 42360
Joined: 9/7/2007
From: Quietville
Status: offline
quote:

I detest the way we are all collectively accepting yet another invasion of privacy for bullshit reasons.
Kittin...i just can't shake the thought that if it were my husband or my kids getting on a plane I would want the airline to do everything possible to ensure their safety. If this means invading the privacy of the other travelers, the airlines have my blessing. The kids privacy and hubby's would of course be invaded too, but there is some other wife/mom who wants my family screened so hers will be safe.




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Profile   Post #: 99
RE: Airport Security - 1/9/2010 8:15:23 PM   
tazzygirl


Posts: 37833
Joined: 10/12/2007
Status: offline 		Actually, while reading up on the use of dogs, they are starting to train dogs to sniff the air as people pass in airports. But, seriously, would the use of dogs not be an answer to those who dont wish to use the scanner? why not have two options?

_____________________________

Telling me to take Midol wont help your butthurt.
RIP, my demon-child 5-16-11
Duchess of Dissent 1
Dont judge me because I sin differently than you.
If you want it sugar coated, dont ask me what i think! It would violate TOS.

(in reply to LafayetteLady)
Profile   Post #: 100
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