RE: Vanity & Good Mental Health (Full Version)

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FelinePersuasion -> RE: Vanity & Good Mental Health (3/22/2006 10:48:17 AM)

HERE HERE Shifted, my mom takes like 30 mins to do it all and she has to do it exactly with in 20 mins of time to go. And it's stupid. My X bf's mom took an hour to get ready.

I don't wear make up regularly I am pretty enough with out it. The most I *ever* put on is eyeshadow and lipstick. I don't need concealers and powder and then blush and then.......


quote:

ORIGINAL: ShiftedJewel

Personally, I have very little use for makeup and things like that. I have it should I ever desire to use it, but it's of little, if any importance to me. But I don't see a problem with those that use it... unless it comes to the point where I/We are having to wait long periods of time for them to "put their face on" or do their hair. I don't like being late if it is at all avoidable.. and I just don't see fixing makeup as a good excuse. I would tolerate it only for so long then the makeup would be gone until such a time when they could learn to anticipate how long the process is going to take and be ready when we are ready to walk out the door.



ownedgirlie -> RE: Vanity & Good Mental Health (3/22/2006 11:47:53 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: MHOO314

Nicely stated, the difference here is the "agreement" of the fact that he supports it---and it isn't vanity, its "pleasing"--<smiles>--and I do love your posts!


Sidebars the thread for just a sec to say Thank you (!!) and i love your's also - - Your genuineness always shines through. :)



maybemaybenot -> RE: Vanity & Good Mental Health (3/22/2006 2:35:12 PM)

I once posted a thread with the word " Vanity/Vain " in it. And the intent was misinterpreted by many. I think that most people use the absolute definition of the word when responding to posts like this. Vanity in the purest sense means an excessive pride in ones appearance or accomplishments. For myself, and I think many others who have replied I use the term to mean to take pride in ones appearance. Excessive is a very relative term and means many different things to each person. Nailpolish may be excessive to one, while washing your hair daily may be excessive to another.

To respond to Candy's OP :  I love having my feet done. I make sure I have it budgeted in each month. For me it is my treat to me. I love having my legs and feet massaged. I also have a weird aversion to toenails. I hate cutting them, it gives me the queevies. LOL. So It's nice not to have to do it. I do have my hair done every six weeks and get my eyebrows and upper lip waxed. I could give those up if it was that important to some one

In public I always want to look my best. This means being put together nicely, not like I just fell out of the back of a dumpster. Yes, having my hair neat and clean, having my scant amount of make up on, my clothes pressed and clean are very important to me.  If that is excessive vanity so be it.

For me, wearing my make up when in public is now a hard limit. Due to a former experience and some advice from CM folks. If I were to be interested in some one and they were opposed to this or wanted to alter it in any manor,  it would be a deal breaker. I could give up my monthly pedicures, if it was that important to a potential Dominant, but I  would also have a conversation as to what his motivation is for not wanting me to do this. It seems very *micromanagement* to me. To some one else it would be a very integral part of the relationship.

As for spending the cash to go have my feet, hair and waxing done. well.. I have always afforded it and with two incomes it would be very easily afforded.  I would never turn over complete financial control to my Dominant, so the money would be there.

I have yet to meet a Dominant/Master/Mistress who wants their sub/slave to look ike a piece of shit in public, or at home for many. The question is: what does the Master consider looking like a piece of shit and what do you?

And is it vanity or is it as MistressHathor said " pleasing". The key being both parties agree to what pleasing is.

                                        mbmbn




Valkyrieschains -> RE: Vanity & Good Mental Health (3/22/2006 3:29:05 PM)

This is a personal choice for me to indulge in.  If my tasks are done, and I am on my own time-and this "slaves have no time of their own, it all belongs to the Master" thing is just not realistic, unless you have negotiated micromanagement-if I want to wear makeup, or get a haircut, or braid it like Pippi Longstocking, it's my time.  If when it becomes his time once again, and he doesn't like it, if he even bothers to take notice of something so piddly like the presence of eyeliner, then I can take it off, unbraid it or put on a hat.  It's just not the big deal it feels to me like some folks are making of it.

Valky
slave but not submissive, to anyone.



littleone35 -> RE: Vanity & Good Mental Health (3/22/2006 4:20:59 PM)

I am not big on make up i usually only wear blush mascara and lip gloss.  I have been blessed with good skin.  Master likes me to wear make up so i do but i put in on myself.

As for my hair i go to the Lemon Tree to get it done the same woman has been doing my hair for the past 12 years.  So when i get it cut and /or colored (no not to cover grey yet  lol) i like auburn hair i go to her.  No one else touches my hair.  I got nice hair so that is my big vanity indulgence.

Matt's littleone



KnightofMists -> RE: Vanity & Good Mental Health (3/22/2006 4:21:34 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Mercnbeth
YOU might be vain about your looks and desire coats of paint and dyes in order to give you the illusion that you look good, but not every woman does or even counts vanity among her necessities, especially for mental health--on the contrary, some folks have to let go and give up their "vanity" in order to achieve mental health(anorexics, et al).
 
Master has his slave's (head)hair trimmed every six weeks or so, because HE likes it to be neatly trimmed.
 
Master has decided Make-up(paint) is reserved for certain occasions:
costume parties(a Marie Antoinette costume NEEDS make-up as an accessory)
Gay pride(or any other pride for that matter) parades
a Prince concert where this slave had a purple heart symbol and the word SLAVE painted across her cheek, as a tribute to this slave's favorite performer's struggle with WB.
venues where this slave is doing artistic face and body painting
 


beth very well said!  Seems your Master's approach/expectations of your looks and care is similiar to mine.

simple... the appropriate care/looks for the given situations.... to be quite honest... I am not really concern that my girls are dressed and makeup'd to the nines when I am taking a load of junk to the dump!  of course... if I am going to a social function... well I like them and myself to look good! and appropriate for the given event!

again... very well said



maybemaybenot -> RE: Vanity & Good Mental Health (3/22/2006 5:28:34 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: KnightofMists
simple... the appropriate care/looks for the given situations.... to be quite honest... I am not really concern that my girls are dressed and makeup'd to the nines when I am taking a load of junk to the dump!  of course... if I am going to a social function... well I like them and myself to look good! and appropriate for the given event!

again... very well said


I do not dispute your statement or beths, KOM. But I would like to make an observation. You like the girls and yourself to look good when going out. I suspect your idea of " looking good" and the girls are similar in that,  if they look good to you, then they look good to themselves. I would call that pride in your own appearance and in your girls appearance.   The girls also most likely feel a sense of pride in how they look, because it is pleasing to you. Which some may call vanity. < not me>

Which one of us, using our own standards, has not commented  " i would never go out of the house looking like that" OR " I would never let my slave/sub out of the house looking like that".  Before answering that... think about being out in a public place/establishment and you see someone in dirty clothing, greasy hair, yesterdays broccoli stuck between their teeth or any other " unappealing look".  I believe anyone claiming not to have some degree of vanity is just not aware that their are degrees of it and it cannot be defined by one standard. As I wrote to some one in an e mail: Vanity in and of itself does not have to be self serving. One can have vanity or pride in looking good because another sees you that way.

                  mbmbn



candystripper -> RE: Vanity & Good Mental Health (3/22/2006 6:20:31 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: maybemaybenot

quote:

ORIGINAL: KnightofMists
simple... the appropriate care/looks for the given situations.... to be quite honest... I am not really concern that my girls are dressed and makeup'd to the nines when I am taking a load of junk to the dump!  of course... if I am going to a social function... well I like them and myself to look good! and appropriate for the given event!

again... very well said


I do not dispute your statement or beths, KOM. But I would like to make an observation. You like the girls and yourself to look good when going out. I suspect your idea of " looking good" and the girls are similar in that,  if they look good to you, then they look good to themselves. I would call that pride in your own appearance and in your girls appearance.   The girls also most likely feel a sense of pride in how they look, because it is pleasing to you. Which some may call vanity. < not me>

Which one of us, using our own standards, has not commented  " i would never go out of the house looking like that" OR " I would never let my slave/sub out of the house looking like that".  Before answering that... think about being out in a public place/establishment and you see someone in dirty clothing, greasy hair, yesterdays broccoli stuck between their teeth or any other " unappealing look".  I believe anyone claiming not to have some degree of vanity is just not aware that their are degrees of it and it cannot be defined by one standard. As I wrote to some one in an e mail: Vanity in and of itself does not have to be self serving. One can have vanity or pride in looking good because another sees you that way.

                 mbmbn


mbmn is a wise woman.... (to me) to be VAIN is to ignore the needs of others or one's self to serve a distorted sense of pretty...to have VANITY means to have pride in one's appearance and is not negotiable with me; though the exact amount i spend in salons ebbs and flows. 
 
candystripper



sweetnessforsir -> RE: Vanity & Good Mental Health (3/22/2006 6:42:18 PM)

hmmmm . . . never really thought of this as vanity, just maintenance.  Well groomed hair and nails (hands and toes) seem to be a good idea whether one is a sub/slave/vanilla woman.  How that is achieved may be up for discussion.

It is very relaxing for me to get a manicure and pedicure every other week.  It makes me feel as if I am preparing for someone or something special.  There is a definite funk when that appointment is missed for whatever reason.

I also have a great appreciation for high end cosmetics.  However, I find that i spend less because I buy what I want and need and do not experiment as much.  There are only a few essentials in this area.  Most of the better lines last longer and give better results.  

Primping and preening is not for everyone, and there was a time in my life when all cosmetics were forbidden.  Nails were fine . . .  no make up.  Everyone lived through it.  It made me assess what it was that was so attractive about "making up."  And now I revel in being able to use it again.

s.



slavejali -> RE: Vanity & Good Mental Health (3/22/2006 7:44:54 PM)

I think the only thing Master has stated that He would never pay for is "acrylic nails" lucky I can grow my own *grin*

Master is lucky really in this area, Ive got a barter deal going with a beauty therapist and a hairdresser, massage for their services.[:)]



Sensualips -> RE: Vanity & Good Mental Health (3/22/2006 8:36:54 PM)

 
to have VANITY means to have pride in one's appearance and is not negotiable with me; though the exact amount i spend in salons ebbs and flows. 

For me, having pride in appearance is not the same as spending lots of money at a salon, or even on clothes or jewelry.  While I certainly indulge, I would not consider it a top priority or insist on a special line item in a budget. I would consider most of these things a superficial extra.  If I want to relax and feel good about myself, a hot bubble bath or foot massage or meaningful conversation can do the trick. 

If it is for someone, that is fine.  But I would not assume this is true for all women, all submissives, or all submissive women or any other demographic group. 



TemptingNviceSub -> RE: Vanity & Good Mental Health (3/22/2006 9:02:18 PM)

I have to agree with maybemaybnot...Everyone has differing definitions on what they consider simple usual grooming methods and vanity.I highly doubt that most any Dom would object to his submissive being well groomed, as it would be a reflection on his care of her and the good feeling she has of herself.As in any thing the extremes are what put most into a combative dynamic.But there you go again...what is extreme to one may not be to another..so it is a case of different strokes!...........be well....Tempting.



twicehappy -> RE: Vanity & Good Mental Health (3/23/2006 4:26:56 AM)

quote:

Submissives and slaves who are women need a bit --in my case alot -- of indulgence when it comes to vanity.  We are still women, and want to look good, feel good, smell good, etc.  In a budget, there should be some priority set for a sub's salon needs and for her make up, and whatever else she needs to feel pretty.  Opinions, A/anyone?. 

To begin with you appear to be speaking for all female subs/slaves, did i miss voting you in as spokes person?

Personally i can think of better ways to spend time and money.

Whether or not money is set aside in the household budget for hair, makeup and trips to the salon are generally the Mistress/Master's decision. Or should have been prenegotiated for before accepting said collar. Even then the owner may make a different decision based on a variety of factors such as his/her desires as to your appearanceor simple economics. Remember, it is about doing what pleases your owner, not what you need to please yourself. Perhaps instead of worring about not being allowed to buy makeup or go to the salon you should reflect on the fact that your owner is pleased with you as is. What better compliment than he/she is pleased with you au'naturale? 

Do not get me wrong, Master and Mistress see to it that i have everything that i need, and a great deal of what i want by way of grooming supplies (to be honest Scooter spoils us both rotten by way of clothes, he loves dressing his women very well). But both have made it very plain they prefer me as is.

Plus this allows us to be ready to go at a moments notice, something we do often. I cannot imagine either of them having much patience with waiting while i put on my face. Lol, both of them would probably ask how my face fell off in the first place. 



Mercnbeth -> RE: Vanity & Good Mental Health (3/23/2006 10:08:35 AM)

[/quote] 
.... (to me) to be VAIN is to ignore the needs of others or one's self to serve a distorted sense of pretty...to have VANITY means to have pride in one's appearance and is not negotiable with me...candystripper
[/quote]

as someone who claims to have made a decent living and career out of using specific words in the English language to affect a pre-determined outcome (a lawyer), and also as a self-professed Catholic who must have at some point been made aware that "pride"( synonymous with "vanity") is one of Catholicism's "seven deadlies",  this slave finds it curious that you choose the words "Vain" and "Vanity" and apply your own personal meanings to them which have little to do with the generally accepted usage of the words.
 
"Vanity", as this slave was taught, is not just simple pride in one's appearance--the word, as you are using it, is intended to express EXCESSIVE pride, synonymous with CONCEIT, NARCISSISM, or EGO-TRIP, which this slave believes to be DETRIMENTAL to mental health, but, not being Catholic, doesn't believe folks are going to hell for it.
 
as an aside:  this slave was taught that "taking the Lord's name in VAIN" did NOT mean using expressions like "God damn it".  it meant going about thinking and acting VAIN and conceited about your relationship with God, the closest you got to His words were when they were tucked up high under your armpit as you paraded around the church on a Sunday morning, never a "Godly" action or thought coming from you during the rest of the week.



FelinePersuasion -> RE: Vanity & Good Mental Health (3/23/2006 11:14:37 PM)

lol using gods name in vain can be like using it to curse and stuff, however I pay no attention to religion and religious politics.


For me to have to classify someone as vain would always be like look at me I look good, ohg look at me I got designer shoes purses pants and cars, or they can't pass a mirror everytime with out muggen for the mirror.

Basically someone who's so stuck up on themself they can;t or won't shut up about how good they are. in anything and everything.



DragonNphoenix -> RE: Vanity & Good Mental Health (3/23/2006 11:17:29 PM)

My Dragon allows me to buy makeup and such from the store.  I do not get my nails and such done though.  But that is my choice, not his.  If I wanted it, I would be able to have it.

1st girl Phoenix



BitaTruble -> RE: Vanity & Good Mental Health (3/24/2006 12:54:22 AM)

Himself owns this body.. it is adorned as he requires in any given situation. There are times he has told me to remove adornment or to put on adornment and that's exactly what's done. If Himself told me that I was not allowed to shower, I would not shower.. if he told me to take two, three or four showers in a row, the water bill goes up. :) Just this evening, I was feeling a bit blue and gave myself a pedicure and manicure. I mentioned to Himself I was running out of my french manicure polish and he told me to make sure to stock up because he likes me having my nails polished. When I go out tomorrow, I'll stock up.

Celeste



SimplyV -> RE: Vanity & Good Mental Health (3/24/2006 4:43:51 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: MHOO314

Although I have not had nor do I seek a female submissive, I have rejected more than several male submissives for their vanity--one took great pains to mention all the designer things he wore, bought etc---I was like whoopiedo--


*laughs her ass off* That reminds me of HS.. and the girls saying "Oh look at my ZCav's" I was all "whoop de doo" back then.. and still am. If it fits well, looks nice, and is decent quality, then its perfect.

I for one have never gotten into going to the salon for anything. I think that could be how I grew up though. My mother wasn't a girlie girl, nor were my sisters really. Everything I know about makeup and nails and grooming.. I had to learn on my own pretty much. Up until I left home at 18, I'd been to a Salon maybe 5 times in my life. 4 were for haircuts, and one permanent. Otherwise my mom cut my hair my entire life.

I'm not big on having my nails done. I have had it done professionally twice, both for very special occasions to which my best friend insisted I needed to have it done. I don't like my fingernails done because I always chip them and then they look ugly. I like au natural better. My toenails though are usually done in red.

I get my hair cut about every 6 months (more often if I decided to try a wacky cut and it doesn't grow out very well). I like to get a shortish bob about once a year and let it grow out.

All my grooming I do myself. I do my own makeup. I dye my own hair (have since age 15). Do my own waxing/shaving/plucking. I've even been known to cut my own hair from time to time.

I suppose if I had millions of dollars, and had nothing better to do.. a few hours feeling spoiled at a salon would be nice every week. Until then, I'm good with being cheap-er.

Though I'm not all that cheap I guess.. as I require special soaps (allergies), certain brands of perfumes and whatnot, which aren't cheap..

Actually, I've thought for a long time.. You know back when it was more notorious that men recieved much more pay than women for the same job.. I thought that women should get paid more then men, as most women have to spend much more time and money making themselves look "beautiful" by society's standards. Or maybe we should be able to write off the salon as a business expense? [:D]



Wildfleurs -> RE: Vanity & Good Mental Health (3/24/2006 5:29:34 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: candystripper

Submissives and slaves who are women need a bit --in my case alot -- of indulgence when it comes to vanity.  We are still women, and want to look good, feel good, smell good, etc.  In a budget, there should be some priority set for a sub's salon needs and for her make up, and whatever else she needs to feel pretty.  Opinions, A/anyone?. 
 

Personally I think its important to take care of yourself.  I think what that means to people will vary hugely.   For me, being a black woman that means I need a perm every 6-8 weeks (although I tend to get my hair done more once every 3 weeks).  There really aren’t a lot of low-maintenance ways to style your hair and still have it look good for a professional atmosphere.  It means that you get your hair trimmed every few months to avoid dead ends.  And I like having color in my hair, it really adds something nice since my hair is normally jet black.  I certainly wouldn’t die if that didn’t happen, but my hair would look horrible (for every decision there are repercussions).  

For me taking care of myself also means that I get massages every so often (the frequency depending on my budget and schedule), go to the spa when I can, try to go to the gym (even though I'm fat), and pay attention to myself.  To me it has more to do with my life philosophy that the only person at the end of the day that’s going to love you, is you.  

I have an owner that doesn’t have problems with this.  Our philosophies on things like that mesh pretty well.  He’s not big into a lot of makeup, and neither am I (I wear lipstick and blush sometimes but very very very rarely foundation or anything more significant).  He’s allergic to heavy scents so I am very cautious around that (no heavy perfumes that’ll make people wheeze).  But in general I do tend to believe that how we look reflects on how we feel.

Just my two cents on the topic, 

C~



Sirandlittle1 -> RE: Vanity & Good Mental Health (3/24/2006 11:32:45 PM)

Im Miss Vain. Its one of my character flaws if you like. Ill spend hours in front of a mirror. I like to change my image. I can do that. I apply makeup, and voila! Im such and such. I wont go out of the house, or rarely, without make up on. I not only take pride in my appearance, i am vain. I have my nails done, im waxed, my pubic hair is ok for being run over in, as is my underwear. I like clothes. Ive noticed, that these things have become more important, the more weight ive gained over the years. But then there have been times, when ive picked my kids up from school gates with tracky bottoms on, and slippers! And couldnt give a rats. Im vain, but the mother in me is not, the sub in me is not either. And i enjoy the freedom i get in those spaces from it.
Ive allways been one to dress up in costumes. I collect costumes for me, or make them up. I think this grew my vanity.
littleone



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