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RE: Common-law Right to Travel - 1/18/2010 8:01:24 AM   
thornhappy


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Real0ne
Did you put driving codes in your constitution as an amendment?  NO

To the best of my knowledge no state has.

Why would you put something like that in a constitution? 

If you had to put all codes in your constitution, you'd get nothing done at all.

(in reply to Real0ne)
Profile   Post #: 41
RE: Common-law Right to Travel - 1/18/2010 8:07:24 AM   
Louve00


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Well, conduct an experiment, since you have such faith.  Throw your license away (as well as your license plate on your car).  Give us a synapse of what happens.  Produce to the authorities when they pull you over the paperwork involved in stating you are exercising your legal rights.  I have great interest in hearing the results.

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RE: Common-law Right to Travel - 1/18/2010 8:07:40 AM   
Real0ne


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Musicmystery

Ah.

Another claim with no evidence.



ok so you dont understand how it works.

I wont risk liquidation myself to prove a point for your education.   If you are fortunate enough to know someone then you will have your "proof".

Its not smart to take out judges by liquidating their bonds as some people have discovered when their families are threatened, if it can at all be helped.  Attorneys hell yeh.

You apparently have no idea the power one yields.

Thats why sovereigns are considered terrorists LOL

They force the government to obey the LAW.




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(in reply to Musicmystery)
Profile   Post #: 43
RE: Common-law Right to Travel - 1/18/2010 8:15:06 AM   
Musicmystery


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I understand that you have to make your case to establish your point.

In and out of law. Innuendo doesn't cut it.

Insisting otherwise is a child's game.

Incidentally, both instances are a matter of public record. Judges and attorneys don't just vanish, you know.

At least not here on Earth, where I'm from.




< Message edited by Musicmystery -- 1/18/2010 8:20:45 AM >

(in reply to Real0ne)
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RE: Common-law Right to Travel - 1/18/2010 8:25:38 AM   
mnottertail


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http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joseph_Force_Crater

LOL, Tim......and your neck of the woods.

But I love the dee doo dee doo conspiracy tinfoilers and posse comitatus shithouse lawyers. In any case, yeah, what Tim said is pretty much the case.

Ron

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RE: Common-law Right to Travel - 1/18/2010 8:39:06 AM   
pahunkboy


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...LOL.  try walking on many roads and the police will pull you over.

Nevermind that same roads were indian paths and when we expended westward we made these trails.

Try walking down a street in Orland Park IL- or route 15 in PA.   Or i80.   The police can not ID you so that pull you over.  In Orland you could be a burglar.  In 15 and 80 it might not be "safe".

However being a soveriegn is a process.  You have to go thru it.  You then are like your own country.

(in reply to mnottertail)
Profile   Post #: 46
RE: Common-law Right to Travel - 1/18/2010 8:58:16 AM   
ThatDamnedPanda


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quote:

ORIGINAL: pahunkboy

However being a soveriegn is a process.  You have to go thru it.  You then are like your own country.



No you're not. It has no legal force whatsoever.


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Profile   Post #: 47
RE: Common-law Right to Travel - 1/18/2010 10:11:44 AM   
Termyn8or


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"Well, conduct an experiment"

I know people who have. I told them it was futile and results were mixed. I've heard a tape of an exchange between the guy and a North Royalton police officer. His words boiled down to "I am going to let you go because technically you are right, but don't expect that every time you get stopped".

They had done exactly what you describe. They actually had license plates made that said something like UCC 1-207 or some shit, which refers to a section in the UCC which states something about if rights are not waivered in a contract they remain in full force or some such. I forget the exact wording.

Practicality got in the way. Even if allowed to go on their way, they are forever getting stopped, they might as well have walked ! Like paying income taxes, for most people it is just easier to ante up and grin and bear it.

There are ups and downs to everything. Since I am illegal, they can't make a moving violation stick. Surprise surprise. I know this personally, period. Every time I go to court it is a simple matter to have all other charges thrown out summarily, as I do not have a contract with the state. The main charge of driving under suspension sticks, but that in itself is proof that I don't have a contract, in fact that is the very basis of the charge. They have to throw everything else out. Speeding, illegal left turns, the beer between my legs, all of it. All gone. Been there done that.

Now don't try this bullshit for a DUI. You only make it worse and these defenses, if you can call them that, just don't cut it. If you are too intoxicated, and your use of a car, a gun, hell even a brick can be considered a danger to society. If they get you on that, STFU, do your jail time, pay up and don't do it again.

One of the problems is that once people figure out how to fuck with the system, they take it to mean they are pretty much indemnified from any harm they may do. I saw a set of paperwork headed for the Michigan clerk of courts shooting for an abatement. For child support. I have no respect for that, you made the kid pay up. To use the law to defend against what is really rightfully your obligation does the cause no good at all, in fact is counterproductive.

Common law depends upon the support of the commoner, at least in this sense. If your kids are starving as you drive your hummer around, you do not have my support.

Now let's say you send your license back, get the UCC plate and drive. Let's say the locals know you and leave you alone. OK fine. But then you get into a car wreck. Prima facie evidence usually has the officer on scene writing a ticket. Let's say you get a ticket for failure to yield, this has happened to me. In such a case your actions caused a danger to society, so your Contitutional rights, while not out the window, will not be an adequate defense. And this is in the best case scenario.

Common law does not equal anarchy, and those who think it does only hurt the cause of returning this country to a country of laws, rather than the ogliarchy. Some people get so nuts that they think they can get away with anything. That is simply not true.

You walk into court nice and clean, you can do much with the Law. Taxes, zoning restrictions, even driving to some extent. But if you harm another, just shut the fuck up and pay up, twisting and turning the issues will only antagonize the court and make things worse.

If you are on my side, you don't try to hem and haw your way out of any real crimes you may have committed. To do so hurts us. If you hurt us, you ain't one of mine.

T

(in reply to Louve00)
Profile   Post #: 48
RE: Common-law Right to Travel - 1/18/2010 10:14:20 AM   
thishereboi


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Louve00

Well, conduct an experiment, since you have such faith.  Throw your license away (as well as your license plate on your car).  Give us a synapse of what happens.  Produce to the authorities when they pull you over the paperwork involved in stating you are exercising your legal rights.  I have great interest in hearing the results.


Don't forget the video camera and if the way the guy was whining about being cold is any indication, you might want to wait until the weather gets warmer.


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(in reply to Louve00)
Profile   Post #: 49
RE: Common-law Right to Travel - 1/18/2010 10:32:11 AM   
Arpig


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quote:

Fact is I have the right to travel by whatever means I chose whether that locomotion is my feet pistons or turbine or warp drive.
Really, and just where is the amendment that gives you such a right?

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Profile   Post #: 50
RE: Common-law Right to Travel - 1/18/2010 10:37:41 AM   
Lucylastic


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quote:

ORIGINAL: thishereboi

quote:

ORIGINAL: Louve00

Well, conduct an experiment, since you have such faith.  Throw your license away (as well as your license plate on your car).  Give us a synapse of what happens.  Produce to the authorities when they pull you over the paperwork involved in stating you are exercising your legal rights.  I have great interest in hearing the results.


Don't forget the video camera and if the way the guy was whining about being cold is any indication, you might want to wait until the weather gets warmer.


Ithought that part was really key to the whole vid...yeah wait til its minus 15 to make an point...
SMRT Really SMRT


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(in reply to thishereboi)
Profile   Post #: 51
RE: Common-law Right to Travel - 1/18/2010 10:42:40 AM   
pahunkboy


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From: Central Pennsylvania
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quote:

ORIGINAL: ThatDamnedPanda

quote:

ORIGINAL: pahunkboy

However being a soveriegn is a process.  You have to go thru it.  You then are like your own country.



No you're not. It has no legal force whatsoever.



I don't know how to tell you this-but my creator gave me un-alienable rights.    The state can not give me rights that the creator has not already given me.

Term is right  the Uniform Commercial Code/maritime law/ is not the same as common law.

Why do you think the state can give you better rights then what the creator has?  It cant.  The state will always be 2nd fiddle.

(in reply to ThatDamnedPanda)
Profile   Post #: 52
RE: Common-law Right to Travel - 1/18/2010 10:52:09 AM   
servantforuse


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I think that the OP would make a great 'Cops' episode. It would end with him getting tazed, cuffed and put into the back of a squad car.

(in reply to pahunkboy)
Profile   Post #: 53
RE: Common-law Right to Travel - 1/18/2010 11:07:44 AM   
Termyn8or


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servant, perhaps my sarcasm detector is a bit out of tune here. Are you saying that might makes right ?

T

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Profile   Post #: 54
RE: Common-law Right to Travel - 1/18/2010 11:19:26 AM   
mnottertail


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quote:

ORIGINAL: pahunkboy

quote:

ORIGINAL: ThatDamnedPanda

quote:

ORIGINAL: pahunkboy

However being a soveriegn is a process.  You have to go thru it.  You then are like your own country.



No you're not. It has no legal force whatsoever.



I don't know how to tell you this-but my creator gave me un-alienable rights.    The state can not give me rights that the creator has not already given me.

Term is right  the Uniform Commercial Code/maritime law/ is not the same as common law.

Why do you think the state can give you better rights then what the creator has?  It cant.  The state will always be 2nd fiddle.




Since the creator cannot be traced back beyond your earthly parents and antecedents, the common law will suffice as the whole of your your rights.

Just saying.

Thats how we play the game when everbody playing aint wearing their tinfoil nutcups.

Ron

_____________________________

Have they not divided the prey; to every man a damsel or two? Judges 5:30


(in reply to pahunkboy)
Profile   Post #: 55
RE: Common-law Right to Travel - 1/18/2010 11:29:49 AM   
pahunkboy


Posts: 33061
Joined: 2/26/2006
From: Central Pennsylvania
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quote:

ORIGINAL: mnottertail


quote:

ORIGINAL: pahunkboy

quote:

ORIGINAL: ThatDamnedPanda

quote:

ORIGINAL: pahunkboy

However being a soveriegn is a process.  You have to go thru it.  You then are like your own country.



No you're not. It has no legal force whatsoever.



I don't know how to tell you this-but my creator gave me un-alienable rights.    The state can not give me rights that the creator has not already given me.

Term is right  the Uniform Commercial Code/maritime law/ is not the same as common law.

Why do you think the state can give you better rights then what the creator has?  It cant.  The state will always be 2nd fiddle.




Since the creator cannot be traced back beyond your earthly parents and antecedents, the common law will suffice as the whole of your your rights.

Just saying.

Thats how we play the game when everbody playing aint wearing their tinfoil nutcups.

Ron


Big brother loves you.

He loved every cell of your body and he wants you to be safe and secure in every way,

He loves you.

he loves you even more then Jesus does.

(in reply to mnottertail)
Profile   Post #: 56
RE: Common-law Right to Travel - 1/18/2010 11:50:11 AM   
mnottertail


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well thank fuckin god for that.

_____________________________

Have they not divided the prey; to every man a damsel or two? Judges 5:30


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Profile   Post #: 57
RE: Common-law Right to Travel - 1/18/2010 12:06:46 PM   
servantforuse


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I think that the OP is is a smart ass punk. His bs wouldn't fly in this country.

(in reply to mnottertail)
Profile   Post #: 58
RE: Common-law Right to Travel - 1/18/2010 12:31:18 PM   
UncleNasty


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quote:

ORIGINAL: thornhappy

quote:

ORIGINAL: Real0ne


No state shall convert a liberty into a privilege, license it, and attach a fee to it. Murdock v. Penn., 319 US 105

A State [or the US] may not impose a charge for the enjoyment of a right granted by the federal Constitution. Murdock v Pennsylvania, 319 U.S (1943)


The government doesnt have to follow the rules just those who consented to be governed :)


Are either of the cases you quoted currently in effect?  Not seen as obsolete, overturned, not applicable anymore?  Sometimes stuff will be on the books, but a judge would laugh you out of the courtroom for using it.



Among the problems we have is that judges DO laugh people out of courtrooms, and they often do this in conflict with statutes, rules of procedure and the ethical cannons by which they are bound. Few know their rights thoroughly enough to recognize or know when those rights are being abused or denied. Many in authority are not only aware of this ignorance they are also trained to exploit it.

In times past things considered crimes, for which a violator or guilty party could be held accountable, were limited to only 2 circumstances:

1) When one harmed anothers person
2) When one harmed anothers property

Were I to travel, or operate a motor vehicle, or drive, on the public roads (which are paid for by the people, and belong to the people NOT the government) without having a license or vehicle registration sanctioned by the state, doing such in accordance with safe practices, arriving at my destination having harmed no one, and having harmed no one's property, where is the logic or reason in deeming such activity a crime, and me a criminal?

A sorta reversal of the argument saying that driving is not a right, but rather a privilege, goes something like this:

If a driver of a motor vehicle, who has been granted the privilege to do so by the state, and sanctioned as a safe driver by the state, is the cause of an accident that DOES harm another person, why cannot the harmed person sue also the state in order to be made whole?

The states issuance of licenses clearly does not protect any of us, as evidenced by the numbers of accidents, injuries and deaths that occur annually. Given that is true what then is the purpose of a license?

If you hurt somebody, or somebodies stuff, you oughta pay. If not then carry on.

Uncle Nasty

(in reply to thornhappy)
Profile   Post #: 59
RE: Common-law Right to Travel - 1/18/2010 12:37:59 PM   
servantforuse


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If the roads are owned by the people, then you couldn't sue the government. Elected people, not the government make the laws.

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Profile   Post #: 60
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