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We, have a friend who likes to give his sub - 1/21/2010 11:26:49 PM

ForeverOwned

Posts: 269
Joined: 2/5/2008
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off to other men for the night or for an hour or so. We all thought that she liked it too, but come to find out recently that she has hated it all these years, yet she has never told him.

Would you keep quiet? i asked her why she did and she said because she was afraid he wouldn't love her anymore.

Do any of you feel that way, that if you don't do what your partner wants you to that he.she will not love you or want you anymore?

Post #: 1

RE: We, have a friend who likes to give his sub - 1/21/2010 11:47:58 PM

RCdc

Posts: 8674
Status: offline

That isn't submission, that is her being dependant.
If your scenario is real, then depending on the terms of your friendship with this man, she could be turning to you for help. Or she is simply a drama queen. If she is talking about her man behind his back and not able to tell him direct, relationships doomed.

No I would not keep quiet, but then I wouldn't be in a relationship like that anyway.

_____________________________

RC&dc

love isnt gazing into each others eyes - it's looking forward in the same direction

(in reply to ForeverOwned)

Post #: 2

RE: We, have a friend who likes to give his sub - 1/21/2010 11:50:30 PM

Mysticsgirl

Posts: 1
Joined: 1/21/2010
Status: offline

I don't usually any more, but I have had things in the past that I would do because I thought that he wouldn't love me anymore if I asked him to stop. The hardest lesson for me has been learning that my master loves me unconditionally. When something is an emotional problem for me, it is a problem for him too. Not because he no longer loves me because of it, but because it hurts his property.

Now her situation is a littler different because I don't know if he has unconditional love for her, though I would hope he does. It sounds like he also might not own her, but I'm not sure. Either way, my master has final say, but he is my master because I know I can trust him with those things that hurt me, or scare me, and that he will try to minimize those things in my life if they cause me damage. She is not alone and if she needs someone to talk to there are those of us out there who are willing to listen. I am one of them, so if she needs to message me, she can.

(in reply to ForeverOwned)

Post #: 3

RE: We, have a friend who likes to give his sub - 1/22/2010 12:06:07 AM

juliaoceania

Posts: 21383
Joined: 4/19/2006
From: Somewhere Over the Rainbow
Status: offline

I would not hide something like that...It would destroy me inside.

I think it is tremendously important that people talk about their true fantasies and feelings to prevent stuff like this...

There is a thread in gen discussion currently about a dominant that is dating someone who was a prostitute and still had prostitution fantasies... a lot of judgment about it... I think in both directions when the power imbalance discourages openness of likes and dislikes it means the lack of true intimacy.

I refuse to deny what I fantasize about anymore. I have done this in every relationship I ever had, and I suppose that self knowledge is making me speak out on both this thread and the one in gen discussions.. people start hiding who they are it means that the relationship is partially a lie...

just my opinion...

_____________________________

Once you label me, you negate me ~ Soren Kierkegaard

Reality has a well known Liberal Bias ~ Stephen Colbert

Great minds discuss ideas; Average minds discuss events; Small minds discuss people. Eleanor Roosevelt

(in reply to ForeverOwned)

Post #: 4

RE: We, have a friend who likes to give his sub - 1/22/2010 12:08:20 AM

ForeverOwned

Posts: 269
Joined: 2/5/2008
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You both have great insight, thank you! They have been married for about twenty years. He is aliitle selfish and and me oriented, but otherwise he treats her well as far as we know. This is the first time she has ever said anything negative to me about what they do. She istrying to get up the nerve to talk to him. i'll find out in a couple of days or so. it just made me think about how many other's are out there suffereing about things like that also. It must e awful.

(in reply to Mysticsgirl)

Post #: 5

RE: We, have a friend who likes to give his sub - 1/22/2010 7:56:43 AM

afkarr

Posts: 328
Joined: 1/13/2010
Status: offline

Sounds like a very unhealthy relationship,- she is being emotionally coerced into doing something that makes her uncomfortable for someone elses' benefit. The kink has noting to do with it; sounds like he is using "D/s" as an excuse to ignore her feelings and well being under the guise of being "in control". 20 years of being married to someone like that will do damage to anyones self esteem, he either straightens up or she needs to ditch him while she still can. She will end up seriously and perhaps permanently damaged if things continue status quo.

(in reply to ForeverOwned)

Post #: 6

RE: We, have a friend who likes to give his sub - 1/22/2010 8:04:03 AM

Mercnbeth

Posts: 11766
Status: offline

quote:

Do any of you feel that way, that if you don't do what your partner wants you to that he.she will not love you or want you anymore?

this slave wouldn't expect our relationship to exist if she didn't do what He wants...and doing what He wants is what she signed up for.

(in reply to ForeverOwned)

Post #: 7

RE: We, have a friend who likes to give his sub - 1/22/2010 8:27:15 AM

chamberqueen

Posts: 1597
Joined: 10/25/2007
From: Kalamazoo, MI
Status: offline

I have served in ways that I have hated and have kept quiet about it because I am not allowed to complain. Some of these things went on for a very long time. I was not afraid of losing love because my relationship was not a romantic one. I was simply doing what I thought was best.

I was fortunate. My Master asked me once if he'd ever had me do anything that I truly hated and I said yes. He asked me what, and I was finally able to tell him about that particular ongoing task and why I hated it so much. He was shocked - he had no clue. He knew it wasn't one of my favorites but had no idea how I truly felt and why.

It can be easy for a Dom with a certain kink to assume that his partner will get as much enjoyment out of it as he does. He projects his pleasure onto her. If the lines of communication fail for any reason - her being afraid of losing his love, her being driven to always do her best for him and never complain, or him simply not listening and watching carefully enough - then she can end up being stuck with a task that she can't stand and that he believes she enjoys as much as he enjoys having her do it.

Face it - subs/slaves are given tasks that they don't care for. It is part of what proves their trust in and devotion to their Dom/Master. If it is something that could eventually cause emotional harm to the submissive then it is her job to take it to her Dominant and try to explain it. I don't suggest whining or pleading to get out of it, but explaining calmly and factually why it is difficult and asking for his help to make it less so. That help might end up being in the form of the task being completely taken away.

_____________________________

(in reply to Mercnbeth)

Post #: 8

RE: We, have a friend who likes to give his sub - 1/22/2010 8:27:30 AM

osf

Posts: 3288
Joined: 10/19/2009
Status: offline

quote:

this slave wouldn't expect our relationship to exist if she didn't do what He wants...and doing what He wants is what she signed up for.

i think that expresses it well

_____________________________

all around nice guy and creative misogynist

i'm not very skilled so i just hit harder

i want a woman to make into the woman she never wanted to become

(in reply to Mercnbeth)

Post #: 9

RE: We, have a friend who likes to give his sub - 1/22/2010 10:23:18 AM

pyroaquatic

Posts: 1535
Joined: 12/4/2006
From: Pyroaquatica
Status: offline

In that situation I would be clear, concise, upfront, honest, transparent, and any other word that would describe how miserable I would feel to be in that situation.

Yep.

Since I am not in that situation and not sure what the exact details of the relationship are...

... all I can say is SPEAK YOUR MIND!!!

_____________________________

You are what your deep, driving desire is.
As your desire is, so is your will.
As your will is, so is your deed.
As your deed is, so is your destiny.
-Brihadaranyaka Upanishad IV.4.5

(in reply to ForeverOwned)

Post #: 10

RE: We, have a friend who likes to give his sub - 1/22/2010 10:30:52 AM

littleone35

Posts: 2828
Joined: 2/17/2005
Status: offline

She is afraid of losing his love? She has to talk to him maybe he thinks she likes it. She should not have to contunue doing something that is emotionally harming her. If he loves her then he should not fall out of love with her or not love her anymore, becuse she does not want to do this anymore. If he does not love you for not wanting to do this there is a serious problem there This is a big deal its not like hating to scrub floors or something.

I am never afraid i losing my Master's love i know i can talk to him about anything and not worry about him not loving me anymore. Communation is key if you don't communitate how will he know how you feel? They are not mind readers.

Matt's littleone

(in reply to osf)

Post #: 11

RE: We, have a friend who likes to give his sub - 1/22/2010 11:07:26 AM

Drifa

Posts: 547
Joined: 7/27/2007
From: Rural Texas
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Mercnbeth

quote:

Do any of you feel that way, that if you don't do what your partner wants you to that he.she will not love you or want you anymore?

this slave wouldn't expect our relationship to exist if she didn't do what He wants...and doing what He wants is what she signed up for.

But beth, in the spirit of keeping the toys from breaking, if you were experiencing distress and really upset about something Merc wanted you to do, would you not share that with him and let him use that info to make decisions?

I think it's sad that the woman has let this go on all this time without explaining to her dominant that it is not something she's at all happy with. She's assuming what his reaction will be, ie. that he won't love her anymore, instead of allowing him to be dominant and make an informed decision based on reality.

(in reply to Mercnbeth)

Post #: 12

RE: We, have a friend who likes to give his sub - 1/22/2010 11:43:42 AM

Mercnbeth

Posts: 11766
Status: offline

quote:

...But beth, in the spirit of keeping the toys from breaking, if you were experiencing distress and really upset about something Merc wanted you to do, would you not share that with him and let him use that info to make decisions?...

of course this slave shares her distress and discomfort with some of the things Master requires...especially when distress and discomfort is His point/goal!!! why would she deny Him that pleasure?

He is a sadist, after all.

(in reply to Drifa)

Post #: 13

RE: We, have a friend who likes to give his sub - 1/22/2010 11:53:01 AM

AquaticSub

Posts: 14867
Joined: 12/27/2005
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: ForeverOwned

Would you keep quiet? i asked her why she did and she said because she was afraid he wouldn't love her anymore.

Do any of you feel that way, that if you don't do what your partner wants you to that he.she will not love you or want you anymore?

No. And at the risk of pulling the roof down over my head, that doesn't sound like a healthy relationship. Of course, it's entirely possible that he doesn't have a friggin' clue that anything is wrong because she hasn't told him.

Valyraen gives commands. If completing the command would damage me, others, or property, I'm not to withhold that information from him. Once he has the information, then he can decide if he wants to continue anyway.

quote:

this slave wouldn't expect our relationship to exist if she didn't do what He wants...and doing what He wants is what she signed up for.

I think the question here isn't a matter of obeying the command or not. It's "do you think your owner will stop loving/wanting you if he is aware that you aren't happy about X". It's not about refusing in any way. Only providing the further information of "I would rather not" - or being afraid to out of worry that you will be abandoned.

There are plenty of things that I do that I don't enjoy doing. Valyraen is aware I don't enjoy doing them. He really doesn't care at all. But I'm never afraid to respectfully tell him that I don't like them.

_____________________________

Without my dominance you cannot submit. Without your submission I cannot dominate. You are my equal in this, though our roles are different.-Val

It was ok for him to beat me but then he tried to cuddle me! - Me

Member:Clan of the Scarlet O'Hair

(in reply to ForeverOwned)

Post #: 14

RE: We, have a friend who likes to give his sub - 1/22/2010 12:59:11 PM

lizi

Posts: 4673
Joined: 2/1/2009
Status: offline

No, I would not keep quiet if I truly did not want to do something. This doesn't mean I'm refusing him by letting him know I don't want to do it but it would open the subject up to a discussion. Whatever position we came to have after he knew of my discomfort would be arrived at by both of us and therefore it would reflect what both of us wanted in the end. Maybe I'd switch over to his 'side' and maybe he'd decide not to push for what he originally wanted but I would indeed tell him.

He depends on me for my input and to refuse him my opinion would be selling our relationship short. He's made it clear from the beginning that he wants to hear from me if I have something to offer. I've made it clear that he is in charge and if there is something I think is important than I inform him. It works well for us. Any breakdowns we've had in the relationship so far have been from lack of communication and there were a couple of doozies from that. I learned my lesson. He and I will be talking if there is something that comes up...I don't keep things to myself anymore. I almost lost us over it and I don't need to be shown again how stupid it was that I decided to not tell him some things and it led to a complete disaster. I am very grateful we've been able to put it behind us and are connected now more strongly than before. No....I'd never take the path again of NOT telling my Dom about something that was causing problems for me.

From my point of view your friend has been selling herself and her relationship with her husband short. I feel for her but she put herself into this position. You really can't blame the guy if he's doing something and doesn't have a clue how she feels on the subject. If I were him I might almost be angry that she witheld that information from me that she was very unhappy doing something I asked her to do. He needs to know...

(in reply to ForeverOwned)

Post #: 15

RE: We, have a friend who likes to give his sub - 1/22/2010 2:34:23 PM

HisEvelyn

Posts: 252
Joined: 1/21/2010
Status: offline

Communication is an exceedingly important part of my relationship with my Master. He praises me when I share with him how I truly feel about things, as I have a history of holding back my true feelings out of a desire to please. There are times I do things I am not particularly happy about, but I will respectfully tell him why I am not happy. I will not disobey him on these things, because he is Master, but he always likes to know how I feel.

If I were to ever follow an order that my Master gave me that would severely damage me emotionally, without telling him that this would be the result? I would be SEVERELY punished for withholding that information. In fact, it is a standing order that if something like this happens, I am to tell him. He is in control, but he has no desire to break me. He doesn't always care if I want to do something or not, but on something large enough that it would truly, honestly hurt me? He would be very angry if I did not tell him about this consequence, and grant him the power to change his mind based on that new information.

< Message edited by HisEvelyn -- 1/22/2010 2:36:18 PM >

(in reply to lizi)

Post #: 16

RE: We, have a friend who likes to give his sub - 1/22/2010 3:24:07 PM

AnimusRex

Posts: 2165
Joined: 5/13/2006
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At the risk of sounding merciless, I am not buying her story. Or rather, I believe it is true, I am just not prepared to see her as a victim.

Its the old "fool me once" thing. If he did this once or even twice, and she hated it, I might feel sorry for her. But accepting this for decades sounds like she must have either accepting it, or else enjoying playing the pitiful victim.

(in reply to ForeverOwned)

Post #: 17

RE: We, have a friend who likes to give his sub - 1/22/2010 3:30:14 PM

Firebirdseeking

Posts: 477
Joined: 9/3/2006
Status: offline

It is difficult for me to fathom how a relationship could have happened where he "gives" her to other men; I dont think too highly this kind of thing but that is me.However, that aside for the moment, it is even more difficult for me to fathom that he gives her to other men, and she hates it and he doesnt know it. A D/s relationship is still a RELATIONSHIP, is it not? Its not all about the Dominant or Master. Somewhere early in their connection, shouldnt this behavior have been discussed?

I hope you can assist your friend to speak directly with her Master, because as it stands, this is a very unhealthy dynamic.

(in reply to ForeverOwned)

Post #: 18

RE: We, have a friend who likes to give his sub - 1/22/2010 4:39:25 PM

Huntertn

Posts: 715
Joined: 10/7/2006
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I agree with AnimusRex...Come on..you can't say after years of this she could not stop it if she really had too..and by the same token..How could he not know how she feels? After that amount of time a Dom would have to be really dense Not to see it.

(in reply to Firebirdseeking)

Post #: 19

RE: We, have a friend who likes to give his sub - 1/22/2010 5:35:09 PM

afkarr

Posts: 328
Joined: 1/13/2010
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: AnimusRex

At the risk of sounding merciless, I am not buying her story. Or rather, I believe it is true, I am just not prepared to see her as a victim.

Its the old "fool me once" thing. If he did this once or even twice, and she hated it, I might feel sorry for her. But accepting this for decades sounds like she must have either accepting it, or else enjoying playing the pitiful victim.

20 years is a long time to chip slowly away at her self esteem, possibly putting her in a place where she doesn't have the strength to change it. Also, as they are married, there may be other factors involved- are there children? Is she financially depedndent upon him to support the kids? Has he done the old "Leave me and I'll make sure you never see them again" routine? Or the "everyting is my way because I'm in charge"? Or a universal favorite among prepretrators of all persuasions "No one else would want you". Those who prey upon the weak tend to have multiple areas of subtle attack which can really tend to screw with someones head.

(in reply to AnimusRex)

Post #: 20

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