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RE: USA's Global MilitaryDominance: Real Reason for San... - 2/19/2010 10:35:44 AM   
thompsonx


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Moonhead

The first world war? You only got involved about eighteen months before the end of that one, but I don't think it served America's interests with the League Of Nations proving a fiasco the next President couldn't be arsed with.



The U.S. ostensibly entered WW I because the Germans sank the Lusitania. They said it was a legitimate target because it was carrying munitions. We said it was not a legitimate target because it was not carrying munitions. Subsequently we have found that the Lusitania was in fact loaded to the gunnels with munitions.
If you would like a list of over a hundred little wars the U.S. has been in in the past couple of hundred years I would be glad to give it to you.

(in reply to Moonhead)
Profile   Post #: 101
RE: USA's Global MilitaryDominance: Real Reason for San... - 2/19/2010 10:42:26 AM   
Moonhead


Posts: 16520
Joined: 9/21/2009
Status: offline 		Whether or not it was carrying munitions, it was a passenger liner registered in a non combatant country. Hardly a military target.

_____________________________

I like to think he was eaten by rats, in the dark, during a fog. It's what he would have wanted...
(Simon R Green on the late James Herbert)

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Profile   Post #: 102
RE: USA's Global MilitaryDominance: Real Reason for San... - 2/19/2010 10:47:13 AM   
mnottertail


Posts: 60698
Joined: 11/3/2004
Status: offline 		so, painting the rotes kruez on a munitions factrory takes it out of the game?

Ach, mensch, meine nerven.

Nicht kammer raus, zum der Deutschman's haus.

_____________________________

Have they not divided the prey; to every man a damsel or two? Judges 5:30


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Profile   Post #: 103
RE: USA's Global MilitaryDominance: Real Reason for San... - 2/19/2010 10:48:40 AM   
xBullx


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quote:

ORIGINAL: thompsonx


ORIGINAL: slvemike4u

Pakistan has nukes....so unless you hhave developed a time machine....your point is moot.

My point was and is that we did nothing while Pakistan developed a nuclear capability...so if it is ok for one islamic republic to posses nukes then why not another?
 


No it's not ok, but it's like this damn deficit that is being created by the present and past administrations...it's wrong but WE must fix it going forward.

So yeah, you see it wasn't ok then and shouldn't be now, but to assume that you must pass on being resistant now because you turned a deaf ear before is ridiculous. So cease with the rhetorical nonsense... The objective should be the eventual elimination of all nukes. At this point I have no practical idea how we get there (which also isn't the point of business here), but by making more of the damn things(nukes) I doubt that will suit the purpose of complete world nuclear dissarmament.

quote:



Years of belicose statements trump one 60 minutes interveiw everytime....

We have a twenty minute face to face interview with the man and you would rather believe what his enemies say he said...interesting



Surely this man couldn't lie for a whole twenty minutes while furthering his agenda to the sympathetic partisan extremes of the American viewing audience... And he'd never have the balls to lie to the 60 minutes team, would he?

Dude, I trust "no one" and it is mine and my nation's right and, in fact, responsibility as a free men of this nation to be as proactive in the stopping this "regressive" and not progressive nuclear process as it is for the fellow in Iran to impart his agenda. It seems to be the pacifistic attitude of gentlemen like the "Brain" that we must sacrifice bits of our soveriegnty to further the rights of others that is down right unnatural and ridiculous. And yes we do have to straighten our own kitchen to serve as a practical leader and example, but we can't ignore our other global responsibilities while we do so.

quote:



but hey,if you are comfortable with the Mullahs in Iran having control of a couple of nukes all well and good...but realize this...most of Iran's neighbors will not be so comfortable....and will seek their own nuke's.

Which neighbors are those?
Israel (pretty sure they already got em)
India...yep they got em too.
Pakistan...same same
Iraq...we own em and we got em
Afghanistan...we own em and we got em
Syria...would most likely share Iran's technology



Again, what's your point? The fact that there should be more nukes? Are you serious? And yes, I don't want those that would be my enemy to have nukes. What's wrong with that?

Or perhaps we should take under consideration that Iran's people are subjugated under a rule of law they seemingly not too favor and yet you defend this assholes right to exist with nukes, do you really think his 20 minutes of propaganda offset the fact that he controls his people through every means possible. His recent examples that I have seen on all of our news mediums over the past year or so say enough about his credibility, political or otherwise.


< Message edited by xBullx -- 2/19/2010 10:50:25 AM >

_____________________________

Live well,

Bull



I'm not an asshole; I'm simply resolute...

"A Republic, If You Can Keep It."

Caution: My humor is a bit skewed.

(in reply to thompsonx)
Profile   Post #: 104
RE: USA's Global MilitaryDominance: Real Reason for San... - 2/19/2010 10:49:15 AM   
Moonhead


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Status: offline 		No, but attacking a ship full of noncombatants is much better justification for entering a war than most that your country's come out with since.

_____________________________

I like to think he was eaten by rats, in the dark, during a fog. It's what he would have wanted...
(Simon R Green on the late James Herbert)

(in reply to mnottertail)
Profile   Post #: 105
RE: USA's Global MilitaryDominance: Real Reason for San... - 2/19/2010 11:24:40 AM   
xBullx


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quote:

ORIGINAL: thompsonx


With the exception of Alaska every inch of the U.S. was acquired by force of arms or the threat there of.




You just aren't all that impressed with your human animal side are you?

I for one like kickin' a little ass, collecting tribute, nailin' my enemies bitches and demonstrating I am, a man of my word; maybe it's my Dragon Corp and SOCOM like mentality as opposed to your Marine upbringing. If I remember right it was one of them chicken shit CH53 pilots we were forced to take into Iran last time we had issues with them (back in the 70's) that flew into the 130 and casued us to scrap the rescue that would not have been neccesary if not for the present Iranian asshole and his friends.

So if you'd like me to help you with your como wire it's a can do.

I love commo wire, I like to call it the silent killer.

I'm just sayin'..................since you seem obsessed with the historical perspective and all.

_____________________________

Live well,

Bull



I'm not an asshole; I'm simply resolute...

"A Republic, If You Can Keep It."

Caution: My humor is a bit skewed.

(in reply to thompsonx)
Profile   Post #: 106
RE: USA's Global MilitaryDominance: Real Reason for San... - 2/19/2010 11:28:57 AM   
thompsonx


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Status: offline 		I am with you on the disarmament thing...dump them all.
That is not going to happen and we both know it.
If world domination is your goal then of course prevent everyone else from getting equal armament.
As for the interview with the president of Iran he pointed out the mistranslation that our government used when he said Israel had no right to exist.
If you have not seen the interview it would be difficult for you to comment on it with any validity.
You speak of our other global responsibilities...do you have any idea how presumptious that statement is? Our only responsibility is the constitution. No where in that document is it the responsibility of the government to poke its nose into the private business of soverign nations.
It is this very propensity of our government to do so that has caused so many nations to take up arms against us.

(in reply to xBullx)
Profile   Post #: 107
RE: USA's Global MilitaryDominance: Real Reason for San... - 2/19/2010 11:37:24 AM   
thompsonx


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quote:

ORIGINAL: xBullx

quote:

ORIGINAL: thompsonx


With the exception of Alaska every inch of the U.S. was acquired by force of arms or the threat there of.




You just aren't all that impressed with your human animal side are you?

I for one like kickin' a little ass, collecting tribute, nailin' my enemies bitches and demonstrating I am, a man of my word;


You mean a thug who has no respect for the rights and property of others.


maybe it's my Dragon Corp and SOCOM like mentality as opposed to your Marine upbringing. If I remember right it was one of them chicken shit CH53 pilots we were forced to take into Iran last time we had issues with them (back in the 70's) that flew into the 130 and casued us to scrap the rescue that would not have been neccesary if not for the present Iranian asshole and his friends.


Does beating your chest like that frighten your enemies?

So if you'd like me to help you with your como wire it's a can do.


I do not believe I have asked for any help from you or anyone else. Should the time come when I need help I will probably not seek it from someone who makes so much noise...Those who can do, those who cant just talk about it...

I love commo wire, I like to call it the silent killer.

I'm just sayin'..................since you seem obsessed with the historical perspective and all.


(in reply to xBullx)
Profile   Post #: 108
RE: USA's Global MilitaryDominance: Real Reason for San... - 2/19/2010 11:39:42 AM   
thompsonx


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Moonhead

No, but attacking a ship full of noncombatants is much better justification for entering a war than most that your country's come out with since.


The German government took out full page adds in the newspapers warning potential passengers that the Lusitania would be sunk and for passengers not to book passage on this ship

(in reply to Moonhead)
Profile   Post #: 109
RE: USA's Global MilitaryDominance: Real Reason for San... - 2/19/2010 11:42:20 AM   
xBullx


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quote:

ORIGINAL: slvemike4u

the U.S of America like all countries has its black marks in its history...and I have no trouble discussing them...



US Black Marks?

This concept is subjective at at best and frankly has no validity with all viewpoints thereby rendering at a useless point of basis.

I see Jimmy Carter as a black mark on US history, I also see income tax, the religious right, Career Politicians and not attacking Russia at the end of WWII as black marks. But the conquest of land that was there to be had in my opinion is natural expansion.

However I also see gun powder, the industrial age and lots of other shit as bigger black marks on humanity than the shit you folks are discussing here. 

But then again, these are just opinions and hell they could even change by weeks end.

_____________________________

Live well,

Bull



I'm not an asshole; I'm simply resolute...

"A Republic, If You Can Keep It."

Caution: My humor is a bit skewed.

(in reply to slvemike4u)
Profile   Post #: 110
RE: USA's Global MilitaryDominance: Real Reason for San... - 2/19/2010 11:46:30 AM   
thompsonx


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quote:

not attacking Russia at the end of WWII as black marks.


How many divisions do you think the U.S. could have fielded against the Russians at the end of WW II?

(in reply to xBullx)
Profile   Post #: 111
RE: USA's Global MilitaryDominance: Real Reason for San... - 2/19/2010 12:09:16 PM   
xBullx


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Joined: 10/8/2005
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quote:

ORIGINAL: thompsonx


You just aren't all that impressed with your human animal side are you?

I for one like kickin' a little ass, collecting tribute, nailin' my enemies bitches and demonstrating I am, a man of my word;


You mean a thug who has no respect for the rights and property of others.




Rights? Who determines those? You? If you're gonna say our Constitution I suggest you point out the areas you are referring too when it comes to foriegn issues and not that of US citizens.

quote:



maybe it's my Dragon Corp and SOCOM like mentality as opposed to your Marine upbringing. If I remember right it was one of them chicken shit CH53 pilots we were forced to take into Iran last time we had issues with them (back in the 70's) that flew into the 130 and casued us to scrap the rescue that would not have been neccesary if not for the present Iranian asshole and his friends.


Does beating your chest like that frighten your enemies?
 
 


Those still living, yes it would seem so.

I'm curious, are you implying that chest thumping is a bad thing? It seems an all to fair form of communication.

Hell you engaged it a form of it with the slave dude. Your comment about your pack and como wire was intended to serve you in a variety of ways, though I doubt you'd openly admit to it. My bet is that you were glad that Pirate Jonnie facilitated your agenda by stating what he did.

I'm ok with the fact you used your service to further your point and set your opponent off balance. Life is what it is, conflict, agendas and mayhem; oranized or not. Be prepared or ........................... die.

So don't play some super civilized example of manliness, I'm not buying your B.S.

quote:



So if you'd like me to help you with your como wire it's a can do.


I do not believe I have asked for any help from you or anyone else. Should the time come when I need help I will probably not seek it from someone who makes so much noise...Those who can do, those who cant just talk about it...



Sometimes its the "seemingly" unsolicited help that is most abundent. But it was your comments that begged my assist. I was just matching you up with a worthy advisory when you went to the swamp. But alas it appears you don't view me as worthy.

Noise? It's all your noise that brought me out of the shadows, and that being said I suppose I should therefore draw a conclusion about your can do attitude based upon all the talking you do (noise you make).


< Message edited by xBullx -- 2/19/2010 12:10:28 PM >

_____________________________

Live well,

Bull



I'm not an asshole; I'm simply resolute...

"A Republic, If You Can Keep It."

Caution: My humor is a bit skewed.

(in reply to thompsonx)
Profile   Post #: 112
RE: USA's Global MilitaryDominance: Real Reason for San... - 2/19/2010 12:32:49 PM   
xBullx


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Joined: 10/8/2005
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quote:

ORIGINAL: thompsonx

I am with you on the disarmament thing...dump them all.
That is not going to happen and we both know it.
 


See that's one place we differ. I believe the human spirit is capable of anything.

quote:



If world domination is your goal then of course prevent everyone else from getting equal armament.
 


World domination? Damn it's all or nothing with you isn't it? How about we start out simple and evaluate human nature, the role we take in nature and try to find our way to working with it as opposed to redining it to suit our agenda.

quote:



As for the interview with the president of Iran he pointed out the mistranslation that our government used when he said Israel had no right to exist.
If you have not seen the interview it would be difficult for you to comment on it with any validity.
 


As for Mister Ahmadinejad, I have little use for what he states when he knows the camaras are rolling.

You speak of our other global responsibilities...do you have any idea how presumptious that statement is? Our only responsibility is the constitution. No where in that document is it the responsibility of the government to poke its nose into the private business of soverign nations.
It is this very propensity of our government to do so that has caused so many nations to take up arms against us.



Responsibilities are commitments we have made, Allies we have committed too and brew-haha's  we have inspired. We can pull back our wings and mind our own business but not at the expense of our integrity or our world standing.

We have to live up to our past to move into the future. And no that doesn't simply mean kicking ass and conquering the weaklings, though perserving weakness diminishes all of our (humanity) strengths. It also doesn't mean sacrificing our farm to appease the populace.

And don't just use the Constitution when it serves your purpose and dismiss it when it doesn't.

While I am certainly against poking my nose where it may not belong, I have yet to determine in all cases what defines where I don't belong if it effects my sovereign right.

Funny thing about sovereign rights is that you must be able to defend (and not just with might) them as your own. You see, when not motivated properly, I'm not in the gifting business.

_____________________________

Live well,

Bull



I'm not an asshole; I'm simply resolute...

"A Republic, If You Can Keep It."

Caution: My humor is a bit skewed.

(in reply to thompsonx)
Profile   Post #: 113
RE: USA's Global MilitaryDominance: Real Reason for San... - 2/19/2010 12:40:35 PM   
thompsonx


Posts: 23322
Joined: 10/1/2006
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quote:

ORIGINAL: xBullx

quote:

ORIGINAL: thompsonx


You just aren't all that impressed with your human animal side are you?

I for one like kickin' a little ass, collecting tribute, nailin' my enemies bitches and demonstrating I am, a man of my word;


You mean a thug who has no respect for the rights and property of others.




Rights? Who determines those? You?

I believe our founding doucments speak directly to that question

If you're gonna say our Constitution I suggest you point out the areas you are referring too when it comes to foriegn issues and not that of US citizens.


Perhaps you might want to read those documents a bit more closely.

quote:



maybe it's my Dragon Corp and SOCOM like mentality as opposed to your Marine upbringing. If I remember right it was one of them chicken shit CH53 pilots we were forced to take into Iran last time we had issues with them (back in the 70's) that flew into the 130 and casued us to scrap the rescue that would not have been neccesary if not for the present Iranian asshole and his friends.


Does beating your chest like that frighten your enemies?
 
 


Those still living, yes it would seem so.

If chest thumping is what frightens your enemies then your enemies are cowards

I'm curious, are you implying that chest thumping is a bad thing? It seems an all to fair form of communication.

Chest thumping works for the highland apes and children. Adults, I have noticed, can usually use verbal language skills.

Hell you engaged it a form of it with the slave dude. Your comment about your pack and como wire was intended to serve you in a variety of ways, though I doubt you'd openly admit to it. My bet is that you were glad that Pirate Jonnie facilitated your agenda by stating what he did.

It is clear that you missed the analogy

I'm ok with the fact you used your service to further your point and set your opponent off balance. Life is what it is, conflict, agendas and mayhem; oranized or not. Be prepared or ........................... die.


If you are going to do a "tony robbins" spiel please hold your thought while I go take a leak

So don't play some super civilized example of manliness, I'm not buying your B.S.
I have not asked you to purchase anything
quote:



So if you'd like me to help you with your como wire it's a can do.


I do not believe I have asked for any help from you or anyone else. Should the time come when I need help I will probably not seek it from someone who makes so much noise...Those who can do, those who cant just talk about it...



Sometimes its the "seemingly" unsolicited help that is most abundent. But it was your comments that begged my assist. I was just matching you up with a worthy advisory when you went to the swamp. But alas it appears you don't view me as worthy.

I think if you left your ego at home and quit thinking everyone is impressed with your chest thumping and flexing you have a lot of important and interesting points of view. As to your opinion that individuals or countries have some right to thug others out of their shit just because they think they can...well you and I will just have to disagree.

Noise? It's all your noise that brought me out of the shadows, and that being said I suppose I should therefore draw a conclusion about your can do attitude based upon all the talking you do (noise you make).


If you want to have a discussion I think that is a good idea but save the flexing and posturing for someone who is impressed by such things.



(in reply to xBullx)
Profile   Post #: 114
RE: USA's Global MilitaryDominance: Real Reason for San... - 2/19/2010 12:44:09 PM   
thompsonx


Posts: 23322
Joined: 10/1/2006
Status: offline 		As for Mister Ahmadinejad, I have little use for what he states when he knows the camaras are rolling.

So you are content to listen to only one side of a discussion?

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Profile   Post #: 115
RE: USA's Global MilitaryDominance: Real Reason for San... - 2/19/2010 12:46:04 PM   
thompsonx


Posts: 23322
Joined: 10/1/2006
Status: offline 		Responsibilities are commitments we have made, Allies we have committed too and brew-haha's we have inspired. We can pull back our wings and mind our own business but not at the expense of our integrity or our world standing.


We have a long history of being an international thug...the word integrity seems so out of place when you put our "commitments" in light of history

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Profile   Post #: 116
RE: USA's Global MilitaryDominance: Real Reason for San... - 2/19/2010 12:47:43 PM   
xBullx


Posts: 4206
Joined: 10/8/2005
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quote:

ORIGINAL: thompsonx

quote:

not attacking Russia at the end of WWII as black marks.


How many divisions do you think the U.S. could have fielded against the Russians at the end of WW II?


None would have been required. At that point we had this fuckin' bomb and they did not. I suspect we coiuld have halted the arms race at that point right there. Formed the UN, declared nuclear weapons illegal and found a way to use the bombs that were presently constructed as transparent deterrant and moved on.

Yeah I know, hind sight, a perfect world and all....

Listen I have no use for world domination, I love my little farm here and the food that we grow ourselves within my delusional little world of bliss I have constructed for myself, but consider a world where the US and the USSR had never battled one another in the cold war. We might have been able to make good use of alot of wasted money. Though sadly many of our greatest acheivements or advancements were spawned by military developement.

_____________________________

Live well,

Bull



I'm not an asshole; I'm simply resolute...

"A Republic, If You Can Keep It."

Caution: My humor is a bit skewed.

(in reply to thompsonx)
Profile   Post #: 117
RE: USA's Global MilitaryDominance: Real Reason for San... - 2/19/2010 12:48:18 PM   
Arpig


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From: Increasingly further from reality
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quote:

The first world war? You only got involved about eighteen months before the end of that one, but I don't think it served America's interests with the League Of Nations proving a fiasco the next President couldn't be arsed with.
The league of Nations was, like the UN, an American invention.

_____________________________

Big man! Pig Man!
Ha Ha...Charade you are!

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CM's #1 All-Time Also-Ran


(in reply to Moonhead)
Profile   Post #: 118
RE: USA's Global MilitaryDominance: Real Reason for San... - 2/19/2010 12:48:39 PM   
thompsonx


Posts: 23322
Joined: 10/1/2006
Status: offline 		We have to live up to our past to move into the future. And no that doesn't simply mean kicking ass and conquering the weaklings, though perserving weakness diminishes all of our (humanity) strengths. It also doesn't mean sacrificing our farm to appease the populace.


I guess you will have to define weaklings for me. Is a weakling an old woman whom you can beat up and take her purse?

(in reply to thompsonx)
Profile   Post #: 119
RE: USA's Global MilitaryDominance: Real Reason for San... - 2/19/2010 12:59:54 PM   
thompsonx


Posts: 23322
Joined: 10/1/2006
Status: offline 		None would have been required. At that point we had this fuckin' bomb and they did not. I suspect we coiuld have halted the arms race at that point right there. Formed the UN, declared nuclear weapons illegal and found a way to use the bombs that were presently constructed as transparent deterrant and moved on.


Actually we did not have the atomic bomb when Germany surrendered.
When we did get the bomb we used the only two we had on Japan.
We had no more fissionable material to make another bomb.
So my question stands how would you have made a successful assault on Russia?
The Britts had already sacked Churchill and were not the least interested in getting into a pissing contest with Russia.
France and Russia were Allies.
The Russians outnumbered the allies in Europe by almost three to one.
Just what is it that makes you think we could have been successful against the Russians when over six million "supermen" got their collective asses spanked by the bear.

(in reply to thompsonx)
Profile   Post #: 120
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