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RE: He Can't Order You Around Like That - 2/24/2010 4:28:29 PM

dreamerdreaming

Posts: 2839
Status: offline

Lovingpet, I PM'd you.

This person doesn't like your dom, and/or is jealous and uncomfortable with your dom's pervasive influence in your life. This person is feeling like you value the relationship with them less than the one you have with your dom. This may or may not be true, but either way, it wouldn't hurt to give this person some very meaningful (to this person) reassurances of their importance in your life, and your respect for their feelings, and for their right to their own opinion...

The important thing is to do it in a way that this person doesn't feel that they've successfully manipulated you into giving them their desired result. This person is feeling devalued and disrespected (didn't say it was right, just that its how they're feeling) and has not been able to ask for or receive reassurances in a way that allay these feelings.

With the limited information available and the short amount of time I have right now, that's the best I can do for you. Don't answer me right now, if you need some time to think about it. Am I close?

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(in reply to lovingpet)

Post #: 61

RE: He Can't Order You Around Like That - 2/24/2010 4:51:00 PM

lovingpet

Posts: 4270
Joined: 6/19/2005
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: CalifChick

Okay, so it's not that you're not wearing a bra, it's the REASON that you're not wearing a bra. Right?

quote:

This person and I owe it each other to both be honest with each other and to be accepting of each other. I really am not willing to accept anything less. He is one family member that would be privy to this information.

Okay, I didn't find what I was looking for using search, but if I remember correctly, this has something to do with your move and the people involved in your move. If I am correct on that, and this involves someone in your general age bracket, then I have to wonder what the heck is going on. I would think that this would have been CRUCIAL to work out before making serious plans (the premise, not the bra issue). Otherwise, aren't you just rearranging deck chairs on the Titanic?

Unless I'm mixing you up with someone else.

Cali

Yes, that's the issue. And that's just it. I THOUGHT we had worked all this out. I thought the person understood and I thought the person was agreed to it (albeit with some discomfort...newness and all). That's why I posted. I've gotten knocked all the way back to start. I feel like I'm playing freaking Candyland or something. I've gone to hoping the next cards I pulled would work out well in achieving my goal to pulling the lollipop card or whatever sends you from the top of the board to the bottom again. Now I'm the decorator on a sinking ship.

lovingpet

_____________________________

If you put your head into more, you'd have to put your back into less. ~Me

10 Fluffy pts.

(in reply to CalifChick)

Post #: 62

RE: He Can't Order You Around Like That - 2/24/2010 4:52:56 PM

lovingpet

Posts: 4270
Joined: 6/19/2005
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: camille65

quote:

ORIGINAL: lovingpet

quote:

ORIGINAL: camille65

Spouse?

Seriously I feel dense right now.

*hands camille a cookie and some gold stars*

lovingpet

*puts the cookie on her forehead and nibbles one of the stars*

Okies. It sounds to me like the whole concept of WIITWD escapes him, not just escapes him but is something he has active disinterest about.

Is he unhappy with your arrangement?

If I'm asking questions that are too personal please feel free to tell me to buzz off! But it comes across (at least to me) as if he dislikes the entire thing and isn't happy with the balance that has been struck.

I am beginning to think he finds it just flat out wrong. I think he's unhappy because he thinks no one in their right mind would allow another person this level of control.

lovingpet

_____________________________

If you put your head into more, you'd have to put your back into less. ~Me

10 Fluffy pts.

(in reply to camille65)

Post #: 63

RE: He Can't Order You Around Like That - 2/24/2010 5:35:44 PM

lovingpet

Posts: 4270
Joined: 6/19/2005
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: dreamerdreaming

This person doesn't like your dom, and/or is jealous and uncomfortable with your dom's pervasive influence in your life. This person is feeling like you value the relationship with them less than the one you have with your dom. This may or may not be true, but either way, it wouldn't hurt to give this person some very meaningful (to this person) reassurances of their importance in your life, and your respect for their feelings, and for their right to their own opinion...

More like is very intimidated by him and the nature of our relationship because it is not one he cannot provide that and we know because we tried... deathly hard.

I have had this conversation, trying very hard to reassure and explain how two totally different relationships could both have the same importance to me. I tried to show that the place in my life had not changed and that I value them and what we are to each other. I continue this process and probably always will so long as insecurities exist and I'm really okay with that.

quote:

The important thing is to do it in a way that this person doesn't feel that they've successfully manipulated you into giving them their desired result. This person is feeling devalued and disrespected (didn't say it was right, just that its how they're feeling) and has not been able to ask for or receive reassurances in a way that allay these feelings.

As I have said before on the boards, feeling absolutely do matter, so even though these feelings are not reality, they are valid and I have done my best to continually put such feelings to rest. I think I am being expected to cave to unreasonable demands as proof that they are valued and respected and it simply is not going to happen. I will do what I can, but I'm not willing to go beyond certain reasonable boundaries. My boundaries are mine. This person will not dictate whether or not they are reasonable. That is my call.

quote:

With the limited information available and the short amount of time I have right now, that's the best I can do for you. Don't answer me right now, if you need some time to think about it. Am I close?

More like right on the money.

lovingpet

_____________________________

If you put your head into more, you'd have to put your back into less. ~Me

10 Fluffy pts.

(in reply to dreamerdreaming)

Post #: 64

RE: He Can't Order You Around Like That - 2/24/2010 6:34:06 PM

FetishRose

Posts: 212
Joined: 8/7/2008
Status: offline

We are always ourselves, no matter in public or private, my Sir and I. However, 99% of the time, no one notices that our relationship is "controlling," because often I am anticipating his wishes or needs and do them without being asked, or he tells me his wishes softly, for my ears alone. People do comment on how sweet we are to each other, always in physical contact, and how I obviously love him because I do things for him.
If, however, someone did notice something untoward and asked me about it, I'd simply tell them: "We do different things for each other, and its our pleasure to make the other happy. ____ makes him happy, so I do ____." Simple as that.

(in reply to lovingpet)

Post #: 65

RE: He Can't Order You Around Like That - 2/24/2010 6:46:08 PM

camille65

Posts: 5746
Joined: 7/11/2007
From: Austin Texas
Status: offline

lp I wish I had some wonderful words of wisdom to give you but I don't. If he thinks that WIITWD is wrong on a basic level then I don't think it likely that his view will change. As you know, this is one of those things in life that you just can't force someone to understand if they don't want to. If I didn't like you this next part would be so much easier to type!

I don't think it is fair to him. Now of course I don't have any idea of what you all worked out, but it is apparent that even if he verbally okay'ed all this there is a huge part of him where it just isn't okay at all. It sounds like he tried somewhat, he went to events to see what it was about.

It must feel like an impossible place to be in, and for that I am really sorry. And since I don't know the background I'm hesitant to say very much, but you do have my sympathy for being in a difficult place.

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(in reply to FetishRose)

Post #: 66

RE: He Can't Order You Around Like That - 2/24/2010 6:59:47 PM

Missokyst

Posts: 6041
Joined: 9/9/2006
Status: offline

A long time ago I knew a woman who was involved with a married man, with full knowlege of his wife. When they got involved it was supposed to be casual but it ended up being more for him. In the beginning he said he wanted to keep his marriage and life as it was. As time passed, his life.. his wife.. turned out to be something he kept for comforts sake, rather than for himself. The love he felt was not enough to keep him sustained and satisfied. And try as they might, his need for the other life pulled him harder than the hold from his marriage. It started out fine.. kind of like an open marriage, but the wife only settled for this because she wanted to keep him.
Everyone lost in the end because he could not make a choice.
I love kink. But, I would be just as happy in a nilla relationship where I could cater to my mate because that is what love is for me. Not everyone could do that. Sometimes though.. you have to weigh which life you want more because in the end it is not just you who might get hurt or confused.
There are times no amount of explaining can take away that pain or knowing that something was not good enough.
:( I don't envy you and wish you luck.

(in reply to lovingpet)

Post #: 67

RE: He Can't Order You Around Like That - 2/24/2010 7:04:08 PM

lovingpet

Posts: 4270
Joined: 6/19/2005
Status: offline

It's not fair to anybody. We didn't enter into our new life together with any inkling this thing called BDSM was at our door. My health was a whole lot better than it is now. He was motivated to create a good life for us. He really did seem to be that right person. Now things have been disturbed. I'm not who I was. He's not who he was. That's to be expected. People don't stay the same forever and ever, but it seems the directions we've grown have not been the same. Not completely opposite, but different enough to pull at and strain everything.

I don't know if there is positive resolution. This whole thing is just not settling into him in a way that is healthy and reasonably comfortable. I have no problem with it not being a part of him, but I don't think he can even have a detached, neutral relationship with it either. It isn't as though he sees it all as morally wrong or sin or some such thing. He actually enjoys it from a far distance. It is fine for those people on a screen. For someone in his living room and for it to play out there (even in perfect subtlety) it is another story. All I can do is my best. I have to be honest with myself and him. That means accepting that this IS that much a part of me and there is really no going back.

lovingpet

_____________________________

If you put your head into more, you'd have to put your back into less. ~Me

10 Fluffy pts.

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Post #: 68

RE: He Can't Order You Around Like That - 2/24/2010 7:08:04 PM

lovingpet

Posts: 4270
Joined: 6/19/2005
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Missokyst

A long time ago I knew a woman who was involved with a married man, with full knowlege of his wife. When they got involved it was supposed to be casual but it ended up being more for him. In the beginning he said he wanted to keep his marriage and life as it was. As time passed, his life.. his wife.. turned out to be something he kept for comforts sake, rather than for himself. The love he felt was not enough to keep him sustained and satisfied. And try as they might, his need for the other life pulled him harder than the hold from his marriage. It started out fine.. kind of like an open marriage, but the wife only settled for this because she wanted to keep him.
Everyone lost in the end because he could not make a choice.
I love kink. But, I would be just as happy in a nilla relationship where I could cater to my mate because that is what love is for me. Not everyone could do that. Sometimes though.. you have to weigh which life you want more because in the end it is not just you who might get hurt or confused.
There are times no amount of explaining can take away that pain or knowing that something was not good enough.
:( I don't envy you and wish you luck.

Thank you!

I really never wanted anyone to get hurt. I have worked my ass off to make everything work together. I haven't invested in one over the other. I have been EXTREMELY careful of that. In the end, however, all that work is for nothing it seems like and I am back to square one. It is disheartening and hurts.

lovingpet

_____________________________

If you put your head into more, you'd have to put your back into less. ~Me

10 Fluffy pts.

(in reply to Missokyst)

Post #: 69

RE: He Can't Order You Around Like That - 2/24/2010 7:41:35 PM

DesFIP

Posts: 25191
Joined: 11/25/2007
From: Apple County NY
Status: offline

It sounds like he agreed to you having this extra curricular relationship as the lesser alternative to you ending it but he doesn't like you having it. And yes, you do need to see his side of it. When you're with your master, that's one thing. But when with your husband it is an imposition into the husband/wife relationship. He wants to come first too.

And he should if you want the marriage to last. He's been with you for around what? 20 years maybe? He's the one standing by you when you had the saplings, when they've been throwing their guts up and when you have. He's the one who has come to your rescue when you got a flat etc.

Yet you're ignoring his desires in favor of a guy you've known for just a couple of years. Worse you're flaunting your relationship with this master in his face, saying outright that the new guy is more important to you. So even when in bed with your husband, he has to deal with another man there. I can't blame him for resenting it.

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(in reply to lovingpet)

Post #: 70

RE: He Can't Order You Around Like That - 2/24/2010 8:21:24 PM

lovingpet

Posts: 4270
Joined: 6/19/2005
Status: offline

Well, Des, I would agree if it weren't for the fact that it was laid out completely what this thing was long before I ever went looking for an outside partner. He and I tried for a very long time to do this thing. He knew more than a little when we hit the brick wall and agreed together for me to find someone else for this part of me. If I had found this thing called bdsm and asked him if I could find a bdsm partner from the get go without trying with him first and all the education and effort that went into that, then maybe there would be space for all this. That's not the case though.

I think I said somewhere on this thread that it is like there is a "tie" for first. The problem is one can't always come first or then only that one is first. Sometimes my partner and I have to allow for his needs, sometimes he and I have to allow for my partner. All the time we are supposed to be working together. That doesn't sound like putting one before the other. He has come first on countless occasions and will continue to do so. That isn't enough to suit him. You are also assuming that my husband has been there in any of the capacities you discussed and done so with a good spirit. I will not approach that except to say I am the most single married woman ever when it comes to stuff like you mentioned. I handle it just fine, but that is a big assumption.

No one is ignored. This conversation occurred by me stepping away specifically to address his concerns. I could have told him to go figure it out himself and talk to my partner instead. I didn't. I never do. We have as much couple time as his schedule allows. I haven't even seen my partner since December. That is due in part to being with him for special things and a few not so special but much needed times together. I bend over backwards to make sure he gets all the time possible and that it is of good quality too.

This thing of flaunting. I don't understand. He and I agreed together that the move was a good idea and that there was no issue with my partner and I taking things to full 24/7 additionally. He is only now realizing that that means some level of imposition on him when we are alone together. Even if my partner and I agreed to let the reigns drop completely for my times with my husband, it is already a fact that things can be that way with my husband because that decision was made. It's just all pervasive. It isn't anyone trying to flaunt anything. No one is trying to place one over the other. I couldn't even begin to think that way. If I sound upset, I am a little. I have tried so hard to NOT do these things. Not only does he perceive it like you described, but apparently it looks that way to others too. I did my best on this. I guess I failed.

lovingpet

_____________________________

If you put your head into more, you'd have to put your back into less. ~Me

10 Fluffy pts.

(in reply to DesFIP)

Post #: 71

RE: He Can't Order You Around Like That - 2/25/2010 2:13:01 AM

ranja

Posts: 2111
Joined: 11/1/2007
Status: offline

Ah things get less muddy... or more depending on how you look upon it...

The 'other person' you keep referring to is actually your husband ... who should be nr One really ... imagine for a husband to be degraded to a title like 'the other person' ... unless he is into cuckolding you surely can see a problem there can't you?

i am with Dreamer and also Des

i think you want your cake and eat it and now crumbs are getting stuck in your throat...

I do not understand how a submissive woman who is married can ever be 24-7 with a Master who is not her husband unless her husband is a willing slave in all senses to the Master too.
It seems you and your Master have some more manipulation of the unreasonable difficult sod to do.

I do understand how a woman who is unfulfilled in a marriage can take a lover and in most cases i would advise her to keep it a secret unless she does not care about the marriage anymore.

Good luck with it all...

(in reply to lovingpet)

Post #: 72

RE: He Can't Order You Around Like That - 2/25/2010 4:27:41 AM

ownedbyPF

Posts: 126
Joined: 2/18/2010
Status: offline

Wow.. okay I admit, I did not see the word spouse coming! :) After reading some of the replies I can see why you hedged on saying who it was in the first place.

I think you have done everything you possibly could to fulfill everyones needs. I recall being married to a vanilla man. He couldn't get into this, oh he would try, but no, it didn't work. There were alot of things I needed him to do, mainly grow the fuck up, but he couldn't do that either :) I remember being at a point where I was trying really hard to accept what he was and what he wasn't. I told myself to look at the positives and forget the rest! Sounded good, but it didn't work because for as much as he couldn't change what he was, and wasn't, I could change what I desperately needed!

I'm guessing you were in a similar place and tried to come up with a way for everyone's needs to be met. He went along with it, agreed to it and all the rest and now is esentially backing out. I imagine he didn't outright lie in telling you he could live with this, maybe he really thought he could and is realizing it's way too hard to actually do. Most of us, not all, but many, are wired/taught monogamy. I'm sure in his mind it isn't just the activity of bdsm he can't get around, it's the being with someone that isn't him.

I saw what missokyst said about being married to someone that was vanilla that she could serve (paraphrasing) maybe that could work for you, but it doesn't seem likely. I tried that and that's when I realized that the key ingredient in a relationship is respect... and I had to have a tremendous amount of respect towards somone to want to serve etc. I didn't have that for my husband, so it didn't work. Besides I really needed boundaries and discipline.. and I do mean need, a force so strong and compelling in me that I couldn't rest until I had that. (And it's been that way as far as I can remember for me). So, just sayin it doesn't seem likely for you to be able to make that whole thing work, but maybe it could. Maybe you respect your husband still and your needs are probably different than mine... so maybe.

So, what do you do? You are discovering it's impossible to make everyone happy. Husband isn't going to just get on over this. I know you're ticked because he agreed, but you can't change what he can live with and what he can't, or what he's willing to live with and what he isn't. And you can't change what you need. It seems to me that's your bottom line, and hard decisions are going to have to be made... and just so you know I don't think the "right" thing for you to do is to say okay fine and be miserable yourself. People grow and people change and shit happens and relationships end and it sucks and it's ugly.... sometimes they don't end and people suck it up, make the best of it and sneak around on the side because they can't take being so stifled.... you are the only one who knows what you can live with.

In other words, I don't have any good solutions to offer you, but I don't think you are terrible, I don't think you set out for everything to get all fucked to hell, I think you were trying to make everything okay for everyone and I totally get how this all wound up happening :)
Good good good luck!
~s

< Message edited by ownedbyPF -- 2/25/2010 4:30:26 AM >

(in reply to lovingpet)

Post #: 73

RE: He Can't Order You Around Like That - 2/25/2010 5:12:12 AM

lovingpet

Posts: 4270
Joined: 6/19/2005
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: ranja

Ah things get less muddy... or more depending on how you look upon it...

The 'other person' you keep referring to is actually your husband ... who should be nr One really ... imagine for a husband to be degraded to a title like 'the other person' ... unless he is into cuckolding you surely can see a problem there can't you?

i am with Dreamer and also Des

i think you want your cake and eat it and now crumbs are getting stuck in your throat...

I do not understand how a submissive woman who is married can ever be 24-7 with a Master who is not her husband unless her husband is a willing slave in all senses to the Master too.
It seems you and your Master have some more manipulation of the unreasonable difficult sod to do.

I do understand how a woman who is unfulfilled in a marriage can take a lover and in most cases i would advise her to keep it a secret unless she does not care about the marriage anymore.

Good luck with it all...

Wow! Okay. He wasn't relegated to any kind of nominal position by this post. I did not bring up the nature of that relationship because of just these sorts of responses. I knew good and well that people were going to choke on the word spouse. This isn't some wandering heart situation. This isn't something he was cast into. He walked through all these gates of his own accord. He's not remotely dominant nor is he slave. He is simply vanilla him and that's fine. He doesn't have to be anything else. I think the sooner we get back to just being as much the us we were before this journey started, the better off potentially. There are some recalibrations that must occur based upon the fact that I have had so many changes, but they really don't have to be so dramatic and over the top as he is trying to make them out to be.

I'm not choking on anything. If a grown person cannot thoroughly explore something, agree to that same thing, and carry it out in the way it was agreed upon, then I can't help him. I don't coddle people when it comes to making informed choices and sticking with them. He doesn't read the boards. This thread was for my benefit only. It is quickly becoming less than beneficial the more people want to pretend to know my relationships better than I do. I know the history of all this and how carefully everything has proceeded and how much extreme effort was put into making sure my husband was always my first consideration and his feelings and thoughts always taken into account. It's offensive to have it viewed otherwise. I have a better reputation here (for whatever a reputation is worth online). I deserve better than these kinds of baseless extrapolations.

lovingpet

_____________________________

If you put your head into more, you'd have to put your back into less. ~Me

10 Fluffy pts.

(in reply to ranja)

Post #: 74

RE: He Can't Order You Around Like That - 2/25/2010 5:32:28 AM

Icarys

Posts: 5757
Status: offline

People never learn..Your starting to see why it's not a good idea to post personal info on the web huh pet? You really expect good advice from a person who says it would be better to be dishonest and have an affair than do what you've done?

_____________________________

submission - the feeling of patient, submissive humbleness - the state of being submissive or compliant; meekness.

Alaska Bound-The Official Countdown Has Started!
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http://alturl.com/mog7m

(in reply to lovingpet)

Post #: 75

RE: He Can't Order You Around Like That - 2/25/2010 5:36:19 AM

lovingpet

Posts: 4270
Joined: 6/19/2005
Status: offline

It kind of got thrown for a loop by that point, I know. And it is very clear why I kept that part out of it for as long as possible. I also am absolutely refusing to get into some relationship specifics about my husband here. This is out of basic common courtesy for him. I have discussed these as part of this same issues with a couple of friends I trusted, but certainly won't put them out as dirty laundry on the boards.

My overall response is one of agreement over the general gist. I have tried and tried even to my own detriment, exhaughstion, and at risk of my own sanity to try to help him. I offered to step away from the whole thing more than once. We both knew that wasn't actually going to work, but I was willing to do it and try to make it work. I have done everything in my power. Now it is down to him. Only he knows for sure what he can or cannot handle.

There is certainly no shame in admitting that this is hard or even something he can't do. I can respect that. What doesn't work for me is going one way with his blessing and everything and suddenly have the whole things switched up on me. Okay, things turned out to be a little different from what he was expecting. Let's stop where we are and talk about it, work it through, and move on in whatever fashion will work. At this point backwards isn't really an option. That was the whole point of the thread. How can we go forward once again with him comfortable? Can we?

When I say there's no going backwards it is partly that those things in me are being addressed and I don't do well anymore when they aren't. Also, we have already moved banking, signed a lease, begun the transition process for the saplings' school, and much more. Aside from physically moving our crap, it's done. At the very least, we're stuck with it for a year. We will all have to just suck it up. To say his timing sucks would be a gross understatement.

I thank you for at least saying it seems that I have done my best and wasn't out to harm anyone. It's a small grace right now. I continue to talk through all this with him. Some things seems better resolved and others not so much. No one is going to ever be able to say I didn't give it my all to help this thing work. I know it deep down and I guess that's all that really matters.

lovingpet

_____________________________

If you put your head into more, you'd have to put your back into less. ~Me

10 Fluffy pts.

(in reply to ownedbyPF)

Post #: 76

RE: He Can't Order You Around Like That - 2/25/2010 5:38:11 AM

lovingpet

Posts: 4270
Joined: 6/19/2005
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Icarys

People never learn..Your starting to see why it's not a good idea to post personal info on the web huh pet? You really expect good advice from a person who says it would be better to be dishonest and have an affair than do what you've done?

That's why I tried to keep the topic neutral as long as possible. I knew what was coming if I didn't. Too bad things are so predictable that I had to be right.

lovingpet

_____________________________

If you put your head into more, you'd have to put your back into less. ~Me

10 Fluffy pts.

(in reply to Icarys)

Post #: 77

RE: He Can't Order You Around Like That - 2/25/2010 5:42:48 AM

Icarys

Posts: 5757
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: lovingpet

quote:

ORIGINAL: Icarys

People never learn..Your starting to see why it's not a good idea to post personal info on the web huh pet? You really expect good advice from a person who says it would be better to be dishonest and have an affair than do what you've done?

That's why I tried to keep the topic neutral as long as possible. I knew what was coming if I didn't. Too bad things are so predictable that I had to be right.

lovingpet

The beauty of things being predictable and you being right is what class?
You are in a position to change the future

Anyway, I'm sorry to hear that your going through this..I hope it works out for ya.

_____________________________

submission - the feeling of patient, submissive humbleness - the state of being submissive or compliant; meekness.

Alaska Bound-The Official Countdown Has Started!
http://tinyurl.com/872mcu3
http://alturl.com/mog7m

(in reply to lovingpet)

Post #: 78

RE: He Can't Order You Around Like That - 2/25/2010 5:46:36 AM

starshineowned

Posts: 1551
Joined: 4/19/2005
From: Texas
Status: offline

Greetings..

This is most assuredly Not going to be a popular view of things here but going this path was "for me" meant to be life altering/changing. It was not one decided lightly nor negligent of time in the decision. Once it was made...The only one I "need" in my life is the Master I serve. Everyone else is now met with "I love you, like you, enjoy you..But this is my life now, and I am truly happy for the first time, and will not sacrifice it for anyone else for any reason even if it means no longer having you as part of my life.

That is my thought process... though explaining it to loved ones or friends that get noisy I will make it shorter. It's my life..period.

starshine

< Message edited by starshineowned -- 2/25/2010 5:48:13 AM >

_____________________________

"And in the end, it's not the years in your life that count. It's the life in your years." --Abraham Lincoln

(in reply to lovingpet)

Post #: 79

RE: He Can't Order You Around Like That - 2/25/2010 5:50:05 AM

lovingpet

Posts: 4270
Joined: 6/19/2005
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Icarys

quote:

ORIGINAL: lovingpet

quote:

ORIGINAL: Icarys

People never learn..Your starting to see why it's not a good idea to post personal info on the web huh pet? You really expect good advice from a person who says it would be better to be dishonest and have an affair than do what you've done?

That's why I tried to keep the topic neutral as long as possible. I knew what was coming if I didn't. Too bad things are so predictable that I had to be right.

lovingpet

The beauty of things being predictable and you being right is what class?
You are in a position to change the future

Anyway, I'm sorry to hear that your going through this..I hope it works out for ya.

Thank you Icarys. It's definitely going to be one of the harder things I've done in my life.

As for changing the way of things on the boards, hopefully I do that a little by trying my best NOT to fall into this standard practice. I'm not perfect, but I do try to assume little and respond according to the information I do have. Again, I'm not perfect, but I try.

lovingpet

_____________________________

If you put your head into more, you'd have to put your back into less. ~Me

10 Fluffy pts.

(in reply to Icarys)

Post #: 80

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