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Freedom (2) - 3/17/2010 5:11:27 PM

LadyEllen

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I contend that freedom is impossible for anyone that is attached in any way to this world, including even their very life, and that those with the most are the least free of all in that they fear its loss greatly and that consequently the most free are those that have and seek nothing.

I contend further that it is fear of loss of that to which we are attached that makes slaves of all, the mighty and the lowly, and that it is this fear that drives anger and thence hate for any thing or person that is perceived to bring the prospect of loss or which is perceived to have occasioned loss.

The greater the fear of loss, the less freedom we have, the more angry we become, the more hate we feel. And hate will often, upon opportunity or provocation, boil over into violent thoughts, words and deeds. And in its revelation, such hatefilled violence reveals those who live with the greatest fear and attachment, and the least freedom.

It is therefore inevitable that such persons should displace their fear and attachment into expressions characterised by ideas of freedom and perceived threats to it, and identify targets for their resultant hatred and violence as being one with those perceived threats.

The perhaps paradoxical remedy to such a dire diagnosis and its unhappy prognosis is to be found in abandoning all attachment such that there is nothing left to lose and thereby realising freedom, which is the very anathema to the source of the condition.

E

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RE: Freedom (2) - 3/17/2010 5:14:05 PM

Moonhead

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I'm sorry, Lady E, but this thread seems a lot less amusing than the first Freedom thread.

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(in reply to LadyEllen)

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RE: Freedom (2) - 3/17/2010 5:16:48 PM

LadyEllen

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Youre clearly far too attached to the other thread MH, and fear its loss down the rankings.

Remember what Yoda said.

E

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In a test against the leading brand, 9 out of 10 participants couldnt tell the difference. Dumbasses.

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Post #: 3

RE: Freedom (2) - 3/17/2010 5:23:07 PM

thornhappy

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Good words, LadyE.

Though we won't be able to sell tickets for a train wreck!

< Message edited by thornhappy -- 3/17/2010 5:24:00 PM >

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Post #: 4

RE: Freedom (2) - 3/17/2010 5:25:19 PM

Jeffff

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Does freedom automatically equate with happiness?

Last May, I had a brush with death...... actually more of a knock.... perhaps a nice fore check. I found I was not at all afraid to die.

That made me rather happy, for a while. Then it occurred to Me that my life might be lacking. I am as "Free" as any man I know. I have no onerous debt. I have all of the possessions I need and most that I want. I have a job that I am very good at and it doesn't suck.

While I am not lacking for female companionship, I do not believe I am currently seeing My own true love...:)

It has occurred to me that I am pretty fucking free, My life might be better if I were a bit less free

Jeff

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RE: Freedom (2) - 3/17/2010 5:30:57 PM

LadyEllen

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It isnt wealth itself that means more or less freedom Jefff. Its the degree of your attachment to that wealth.

E

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In a test against the leading brand, 9 out of 10 participants couldnt tell the difference. Dumbasses.

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Post #: 6

RE: Freedom (2) - 3/17/2010 5:32:16 PM

SL4V3M4YB3

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From: S.E. London U.K.
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I have no attachment at all to wealth.

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Memory Lane...been there done that.

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RE: Freedom (2) - 3/17/2010 5:33:25 PM

Jeffff

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Money can't buy happiness. It can buy a boat big enough to sail right to next to it though...:)

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RE: Freedom (2) - 3/17/2010 5:33:26 PM

subfever

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Using FR

Take a quick look on this forum, and see where the big numbers are. The 1000+ hits and 100+ replies are all on emotionally laden threads. The logical/philosophical threads don't compare. And when they do come close, you can almost rest assured that there's been an emotional hijack away from the OP.

This clearly shows where we're at as a society.

Kiss the hand that enslaves you.

< Message edited by subfever -- 3/17/2010 5:34:13 PM >

(in reply to Jeffff)

Post #: 9

RE: Freedom (2) - 3/17/2010 5:35:24 PM

LadyEllen

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So, if I asked, you would give me all that you have, especially if it were obvious I didnt need it?

This isnt a perfection competition by the way - I doubt there is anyone here so free that they could live up to the standards implied by the OP. Even me. Though having been in that position - having lost everything - I do know that freedom.

E

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In a test against the leading brand, 9 out of 10 participants couldnt tell the difference. Dumbasses.

(in reply to SL4V3M4YB3)

Post #: 10

RE: Freedom (2) - 3/17/2010 5:40:25 PM

LadyEllen

Posts: 10931
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From: Stourport-England
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quote:

ORIGINAL: subfever

Using FR

Take a quick look on this forum, and see where the big numbers are. The 1000+ hits and 100+ replies are all on emotionally laden threads. The logical/philosophical threads don't compare. And when they do come close, you can almost rest assured that there's been an emotional hijack away from the OP.

This clearly shows where we're at as a society.

Kiss the hand that enslaves you.

give it a chance - despite all evidence to the contrary, I should expect the OP to "Freedom" will get what I'm saying about his position and arguments and then we can expect this to get much more active.

E

_____________________________

In a test against the leading brand, 9 out of 10 participants couldnt tell the difference. Dumbasses.

(in reply to subfever)

Post #: 11

RE: Freedom (2) - 3/17/2010 5:50:27 PM

SL4V3M4YB3

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That op knows nothing about freedom, he has been chained to his PC for days answering the 400+ responses.

Compulsion is the opposite of freedom, even a simpleton like me knows that.

What is the point in having freedom if you don't use it?

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Memory Lane...been there done that.

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Post #: 12

RE: Freedom (2) - 3/17/2010 5:51:16 PM

subfever

Posts: 2895
Joined: 5/22/2004
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quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyEllen

quote:

ORIGINAL: subfever

Using FR

Take a quick look on this forum, and see where the big numbers are. The 1000+ hits and 100+ replies are all on emotionally laden threads. The logical/philosophical threads don't compare. And when they do come close, you can almost rest assured that there's been an emotional hijack away from the OP.

This clearly shows where we're at as a society.

Kiss the hand that enslaves you.

give it a chance - despite all evidence to the contrary, I should expect the OP to "Freedom" will get what I'm saying about his position and arguments and then we can expect this to get much more active.

E

I hope you're right. But if it exceeds the 1000/100, my guess is that it will include a hijiack by those playing in the emotional sandbox.

(in reply to LadyEllen)

Post #: 13

RE: Freedom (2) - 3/17/2010 5:51:57 PM

juliaoceania

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From: Somewhere Over the Rainbow
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Freedom's just another word for nothing left to lose.....

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Once you label me, you negate me ~ Soren Kierkegaard

Reality has a well known Liberal Bias ~ Stephen Colbert

Great minds discuss ideas; Average minds discuss events; Small minds discuss people. Eleanor Roosevelt

(in reply to LadyEllen)

Post #: 14

RE: Freedom (2) - 3/17/2010 6:11:27 PM

popeye1250

Posts: 18104
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From: New Hampshire
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L.E., interesting. Kind of like having your cake and eating it too.

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Post #: 15

RE: Freedom (2) - 3/17/2010 6:29:01 PM

kdsub

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Well what if you have nothing...then you hate those that do... you use their wealth as an excuse for your condition...no... having nothing will not set you free.

Now look at it this way have enough but not too much...but have as much as you need... Then you will have freedom to enjoy life and not worry about survival… but you will most likely not have extreme jealously of those who are rich because you will not be in need.

So as they say “everything in moderation” for happiness.

Butch

< Message edited by kdsub -- 3/17/2010 6:30:15 PM >

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I don't see any use in having a uniform and arbitrary way of spelling words. We might as well make all clothes alike and cook all dishes alike. Sameness is tiresome; variety is pleasing

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RE: Freedom (2) - 3/17/2010 6:32:25 PM

kdsub

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Joined: 8/16/2007
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Damn I just am soooo irresistible.

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Mark Twain:

I don't see any use in having a uniform and arbitrary way of spelling words. We might as well make all clothes alike and cook all dishes alike. Sameness is tiresome; variety is pleasing

(in reply to bo11hhhhh)

Post #: 17

RE: Freedom (2) - 3/17/2010 6:33:33 PM

slvemike4u

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From: United States
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quote:

ORIGINAL: juliaoceania

Freedom's just another word for nothing left to lose.....

and nothing left was all she left me......

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If we want things to stay as they are,things will have to change...Tancredi from "the Leopard"

Forget Guns-----Ban the pools

Funny stuff....https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eNwFf991d-4

(in reply to juliaoceania)

Post #: 18

RE: Freedom (2) - 3/17/2010 6:34:19 PM

LadyEllen

Posts: 10931
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From: Stourport-England
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This isnt about wealth Butch, its about attachment to wealth and freedom only being possible if you have no attachment.

The destitute are truly free, but not if theyre attached to wealth, which is what drives the hate you mention.

E

_____________________________

In a test against the leading brand, 9 out of 10 participants couldnt tell the difference. Dumbasses.

(in reply to kdsub)

Post #: 19

RE: Freedom (2) - 3/17/2010 6:38:50 PM

popeye1250

Posts: 18104
Joined: 1/27/2006
From: New Hampshire
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Jeffff

Does freedom automatically equate with happiness?

Last May, I had a brush with death...... actually more of a knock.... perhaps a nice fore check. I found I was not at all afraid to die.

That made me rather happy, for a while. Then it occurred to Me that my life might be lacking. I am as "Free" as any man I know. I have no onerous debt. I have all of the possessions I need and most that I want. I have a job that I am very good at and it doesn't suck.

While I am not lacking for female companionship, I do not believe I am currently seeing My own true love...:)

It has occurred to me that I am pretty fucking free, My life might be better if I were a bit less free

Jeff

Last June I had Major surgery and I wasn't afraid of dying on the table. I just thought to myself, "whatever happens, happens and a million years from now who's going to give a shit anyway?"

_____________________________

"But Your Honor, this is not a Jury of my Peers, these people are all decent, honest, law-abiding citizens!"

(in reply to Jeffff)

Post #: 20

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