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Stupak reaches deal with White House - 3/21/2010 1:16:24 PM   
Thadius


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Status: offline 		Rep. Stupak has just announced a deal struck with the White House. In exchange for his vote the President has promised to sign an executive order, immediately upon approval of the health reform bill, that is very similar to the Stupak language in the House bill.

It will state that no Federal funds can be used to fund abortions.

This story is just breaking, caught the announcement on CSPAN, gonna flip to the "news" channels to see if there is more.

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RE: Stupak reaches deal with White House - 3/21/2010 1:20:46 PM   
slvemike4u


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Status: offline 		They are holding their news conference right now.....
And they stand up there and claim to speak,in one voice and with one central message,for "families all across America".Is there anything scarier than those that claim they know what so many of the rest of us actually want.Be they Repubs or Dems that shit is just scary.

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RE: Stupak reaches deal with White House - 3/21/2010 1:40:08 PM   
MrRodgers


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quote:

ORIGINAL: slvemike4u

They are holding their news conference right now.....
And they stand up there and claim to speak,in one voice and with one central message,for "families all across America".Is there anything scarier than those that claim they know what so many of the rest of us actually want.Be they Repubs or Dems that shit is just scary.

...and goes back as far as Johnson's tragic build-up of the Vietnam war or even to Eisenhower's advice to stay there to protect our 'interests.'


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RE: Stupak reaches deal with White House - 3/21/2010 1:47:19 PM   
LadyAngelika


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Status: offline 		As I mentioned on the women's right thread when you announced this, it is a sad day for the disenfranchised women of the USA. That said, I get the funny feeling it was but a bargaining chip to begin with. I guess the money they save can go to helping bomb other nations and killing their young.

I'm feeling ill at the moment.

- LA


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RE: Stupak reaches deal with White House - 3/21/2010 1:49:56 PM   
slvemike4u


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Status: offline 		Nope LA...with abortion issues here in America always I repeat always look to religion.Not medical issues,not financial issues.....religion and their strnglehold on American politics...it's fucking sad!

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RE: Stupak reaches deal with White House - 3/21/2010 1:58:29 PM   
Aylee


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Status: offline 		With as many "deals" that have been made with this how can anyone see it as a good thing?


I do not know if most people know this, but individually purchased insurance rarely covers pregnancy or pre-natal care with out an extra policy for extra money, and now they will not be able to fund abortions either because all insurance companies will be recieving fedral monies.  Just how much more are women going to get screwed in this?

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RE: Stupak reaches deal with White House - 3/21/2010 1:58:32 PM   
ShaharThorne


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Status: offline 		I foretell that Canada will have people, especially the young adult females, to cross the border in order to have an abortion.  The religious right just made us prisoners of our own government.

Roe vs. Wade was just tossed into the trash.


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RE: Stupak reaches deal with White House - 3/21/2010 2:03:56 PM   
Thadius


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quote:

ORIGINAL: ShaharThorne

I foretell that Canada will have people, especially the young adult females, to cross the border in order to have an abortion.  The religious right just made us prisoners of our own government.

Roe vs. Wade was just tossed into the trash.


Not so sure about all of the blame falling at the feet of the religious right. As far as I know Stupak and the President are both Dems...

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RE: Stupak reaches deal with White House - 3/21/2010 2:07:54 PM   
slvemike4u


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Aylee

With as many "deals" that have been made with this how can anyone see it as a good thing?


I do not know if most people know this, but individually purchased insurance rarely covers pregnancy or pre-natal care with out an extra policy for extra money, and now they will not be able to fund abortions either because all insurance companies will be recieving fedral monies.  Just how much more are women going to get screwed in this?
Aylee,I don't think that is correct...only direct federal funding of abortion is affected by this deal.Still not a good thing but private insurance is not and can not be affected by this deal.
Let me also add,though I detest this particular part of the deal...this is still a step forward big picture wise for health care reform in this country.A first step in a journey that can only end with one destination....single payer!

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If we want things to stay as they are,things will have to change...Tancredi from "the Leopard"

Forget Guns-----Ban the pools

Funny stuff....https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eNwFf991d-4


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RE: Stupak reaches deal with White House - 3/21/2010 2:14:09 PM   
Aylee


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quote:

ORIGINAL: slvemike4u

quote:

ORIGINAL: Aylee

With as many "deals" that have been made with this how can anyone see it as a good thing?


I do not know if most people know this, but individually purchased insurance rarely covers pregnancy or pre-natal care with out an extra policy for extra money, and now they will not be able to fund abortions either because all insurance companies will be recieving fedral monies.  Just how much more are women going to get screwed in this?
Aylee,I don't think that is correct...only direct federal funding of abortion is affected by this deal.Still not a good thing but private insurance is not and can not be affected by this deal.
Let me also add,though I detest this particular part of the deal...this is still a step forward big picture wise for health care reform in this country.A first step in a journey that can only end with one destination....single payer!


Mike,

The individuals purchasing their own health care insurance do not recieve the monies directly to pay to the plan.  The money is sent to the insurance company directly.  Which means that all insurance companies will be recieving federal money. 

I just wish that goverenment would stay the hell out of reproductive choices.  Well, and a lot of other choices. 

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RE: Stupak reaches deal with White House - 3/21/2010 2:16:55 PM   
ShaharThorne


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Status: offline 		The Religious Right is a powerful lobby front.  They are the ones who boycotts the clinics that provide abortions.  My OB/GYN was boycotted when I had an appointment with him (infertility treatment).  I was called a murderer when the group tried to stop me from my appointment.  If it was not for the doctor, I would of miscarried Lizard.  They did not believe me and I have resented them since then.  They tried to take away my right of seeking medical treatment.

Stupak is Catholic and very pro-life.  There is talk about his association with The Family.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bart_Stupak


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RE: Stupak reaches deal with White House - 3/21/2010 2:18:57 PM   
Thadius


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Status: offline 		**Fast Reply**

It should be stated that the promised executive order may not even be worth the paper it is written on. The current legislation and law trumps any executive order, so this may just be a move to provide cover for some Dems in swing districts.

It will be very interesting to see the actual wording and how it stands up to any legal challenges.

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RE: Stupak reaches deal with White House - 3/21/2010 2:19:02 PM   
slvemike4u


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Status: offline 		My point,and if I misunderstood yours I apologise is that this does not and can not affect all of those who now have their own privat insurance...such as employee based insurance.If they are covered for these procedures now...they will still be in the future...or at least till their insurance company denies them coverage...when they most need it...lol.

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If we want things to stay as they are,things will have to change...Tancredi from "the Leopard"

Forget Guns-----Ban the pools

Funny stuff....https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eNwFf991d-4


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RE: Stupak reaches deal with White House - 3/21/2010 2:23:44 PM   
Aylee


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quote:

ORIGINAL: slvemike4u

My point,and if I misunderstood yours I apologise is that this does not and can not affect all of those who now have their own privat insurance...such as employee based insurance.If they are covered for these procedures now...they will still be in the future...or at least till their insurance company denies them coverage...when they most need it...lol.


The Stupak amendment reads: “No funds authorized or appropriated by this Act (or an Amendment made by this Act) may be used to pay for any abortion or to cover any part of the costs of any health plan that includes coverage of abortion.”

It is the phrase, "any health plan" that worries me. 

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Ceterum censeo Carthaginem esse delendam

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RE: Stupak reaches deal with White House - 3/21/2010 2:24:02 PM   
LadyAngelika


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quote:

Stupak is Catholic and very pro-life


Of course. He needs to ensure a steady stream of young boys for the Catholic priests to diddle.

The weak shall get weaker and the strong shall get stronger. God Bless America.

- LA

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RE: Stupak reaches deal with White House - 3/21/2010 2:25:15 PM   
Thadius


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quote:

ORIGINAL: slvemike4u

My point,and if I misunderstood yours I apologise is that this does not and can not affect all of those who now have their own privat insurance...such as employee based insurance.If they are covered for these procedures now...they will still be in the future...or at least till their insurance company denies them coverage...when they most need it...lol.


That would be true if the current legislation didn't setup a panel to decide on minimum cookie cutter policies that all policies would have to meet or exceed. So theoretically a policy that currently covers the procedure may or may not after the standards are set, not to mention that many employers will be changing policies to avoid paying an excise taxes for offering better plans.

It's a damned if you do, damned if you don't situation. Yet another DC SNAFU. Got to love em.

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RE: Stupak reaches deal with White House - 3/21/2010 2:27:08 PM   
Arpig


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Status: offline 		I fall on the same side as Lady A on this. I think its pathetic that the God squad is seemingly making an end run around Roe v Wade. I rarely  get really patriotic, but DAMN!! I am glad I am a Canadian and live in a modern, civilised country governed by rational debate.

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RE: Stupak reaches deal with White House - 3/21/2010 2:29:51 PM   
slvemike4u


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Status: offline 		And yet Thadius , with all of its faults and all of its warts...it is still a step in the right direction(my opinion of course,I do understand from previous posts that you don't agree)hopefully just the first step in an inexorable process that leads to *gasp* a single payer option.

edited to add a missing j ;-)

< Message edited by slvemike4u -- 3/21/2010 2:30:27 PM >

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If we want things to stay as they are,things will have to change...Tancredi from "the Leopard"

Forget Guns-----Ban the pools

Funny stuff....https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eNwFf991d-4


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RE: Stupak reaches deal with White House - 3/21/2010 2:30:13 PM   
Thadius


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Arpig

I fall on the same side as Lady A on this. I think its pathetic that the God squad is seemingly making an end run around Roe v Wade. I rarely  get really patriotic, but DAMN!! I am glad I am a Canadian and live in a modern, civilised country governed by rational debate.


I am a bit confused here. When Dems make these moves it is still the fault of the religious right? Anyways, the Stupak language was basicly a restating and possible tightening of the Hyde Ammendment that already is law and prevented federal funding of abortions.

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RE: Stupak reaches deal with White House - 3/21/2010 2:31:23 PM   
BeingChewsie


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Status: offline 		I just saw that on the news too. Hopefully folks in those districts are lighting up the phones making it clear that this is not acceptable and it makes what Stupak said a Lie. It makes Obama a liar too. They obviously know it is bullshit. Ugh.


quote:

ORIGINAL: Thadius

**Fast Reply**

It should be stated that the promised executive order may not even be worth the paper it is written on. The current legislation and law trumps any executive order, so this may just be a move to provide cover for some Dems in swing districts.

It will be very interesting to see the actual wording and how it stands up to any legal challenges.


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