RE: One Doctor's Resonse (Full Version)

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LadyEllen -> RE: One Doctor's Resonse (4/5/2010 7:32:04 AM)

The difference is in who the actor is RML

In your version, the actor is the doctor turning patients away; the doctor is deciding and acting

In the version as written, the actor it is the patient choosing to go elsewhere; the patient is deciding and acting

Not that I dont think the doctor is a class A ass, but.......

E




Mercnbeth -> RE: One Doctor's Resonse (4/5/2010 7:50:58 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: rulemylife

Well Merc, it is so hard to keep up with someone of your intelligence level, so please help me out and explain how:

"IF YOU VOTED FOR OBAMA.....

SEEK UROLOGICAL CARE ELSEWHERE



does not say:

"If you voted for Obama....go away asshole I'm not treating you".  


  • A - Is does not say "I won't treat you". It requires assumption by the reader like 'wet paint'. You don't really know its wet unless you touch it, you don't know he won't treat you unless you walk in, disclose your voting record, and he kicks you out.
  • B - Your voting record isn't historically documented on your urethra. (Please check yours to verify)
  • C - "SEEK UROLOGICAL CARE ELSEWHERE" 27 letters - "go away asshole I'm not treating you" 29 letters; which can not be rearranged to say the same thing. Are you using the most current version of 'The DaVinci Code'?
  • D - Your position assumes facts not in evidence without a place to point to which has absolute authority; unlike the President saying a pre-existing condition doesn't exclude coverage immediately but having a Law he signed say no such thing and it is at least four years.


Concerning 'D' - I just thought of something, maybe Obama has never read anything he's signed and it's why he's accepted that as a reason people with bad mortgage documents shouldn't have to back up their obligations with integrity either. - what do you think?




domiguy -> RE: One Doctor's Resonse (4/5/2010 7:54:55 AM)

Merc you are full of shit.

It is the equivalent of no shirt no shoes no service.

Quit being dense.

Only in this case it is not about breaking some health code. it is about not wanting to treat someone based solely on their political affiliation and their voting choice.

The doctor is a douche. he comes off as a douche in the Anderson Cooper interview.

Just like you refuse to acknowledge when you are wrong, as in you perceived Obama avoiding the mortgage mess because of some how being culpable for a part of the mess...Which was wrong.

now this.

I can see why you need Beth. You could never be with someone that might have the capability to question your horrid logic.




rulemylife -> RE: One Doctor's Resonse (4/5/2010 7:58:20 AM)

Oh for fuck's sake.

Can you possibly try any harder to defend the indefensible just because you dislike Obama?




Mercnbeth -> RE: One Doctor's Resonse (4/5/2010 8:00:11 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: domiguy
Merc you are full of shit.
It is the equivalent of no shirt no shoes no service.
Quit being dense.


Wrong - although I appreciate your one. well documented, area of 'expertise - shit; "dense" requires a person to rationalize a position to make their point. That's a requirement for the other side of the argument - not mine.

quote:

The doctor is a douche. he comes off as a douche in the Anderson Cooper interview.
Hell DG, you of all people should appreciate that being a "douche" isn't a crime. Nor does it inhibit your ability to speak and take a position.




Mercnbeth -> RE: One Doctor's Resonse (4/5/2010 8:03:15 AM)

quote:

Can you possibly try any harder to defend the indefensible just because you dislike Obama?


Another distinction between us I am proud to have - I don't need to agree with a position to defend a person's freedom to say it.

Obama's latest self induced painted corner is a matter of fact too; you apply the emotion "dislike" when it is simply truth. Do you have a problem with that being documented too?




lusciouslips19 -> RE: One Doctor's Resonse (4/5/2010 8:05:31 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: kittinSol

As a patient, I wouldn't want to see a doctor that was so outspoken about his political beliefs - especially in this day and age, when medical access is such a contentious matter. I hope he loses a ton of work out of this little tantrum of his. What a loser.

PS: as for his freedom of speech... give me a break. Nobody ever suggested it should be suppressed in any kind of way. But as a doctor, he should choose: patients, or the tea party movement.


Really what kind of republican is he anyway????[sm=dunno.gif] Everyone should be smart enough to take anyones money and profit.




domiguy -> RE: One Doctor's Resonse (4/5/2010 8:16:27 AM)

No. the sign is clear..Your logic is not.

just more transparent horseshit from someone that is incapable of defending a position head on.

You routinely try and diminish your poor choice of words and thoughts once they have been proven to be incorrect by obfuscating the argument with more bullshit and never addressing head on the wrongs that have been pointed out.

This is what you do. You are full of shit. You are just another political pawn that cannot differentiate between their party's ideology and what is actually the "truth."

Then you have the nerve to still be arrogant once you find out that you are mistaken. WTF??? You never take responsibility for the lies that you help to spread and propagate.

This is how you operate out here. You are not alone it's the way this thing work now a days. Take solace, you are in the majority with the rest of the Americans that are unable to view the world around them outside of their party's lenses.




lusciouslips19 -> RE: One Doctor's Resonse (4/5/2010 8:26:31 AM)

Word up..




subrob1967 -> RE: One Doctor's Resonse (4/5/2010 8:26:58 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: domiguy

No. the sign is clear..Your logic is not.

just more transparent horseshit from someone that is incapable of defending a position head on.

You routinely try and diminish your poor choice of words and thoughts once they have been proven to be incorrect by obfuscating the argument with more bullshit and never addressing head on the wrongs that have been pointed out.

This is what you do. You are full of shit. You are just another political pawn that cannot differentiate between their party's ideology and what is actually the "truth."

Then you have the nerve to still be arrogant once you find out that you are mistaken. WTF??? You never take responsibility for the lies that you help to spread and propagate.

This is how you operate out here. You are not alone it's the way this thing work now a days. Take solace, you are in the majority with the rest of the Americans that are unable to view the world around them outside of their party's lenses.


Damn...I really hope you are looking  in a mirror with every letter you type here, or perhaps you're being honest with yourself for the first time in your life, but blaming it on Merc.





flcouple2009 -> RE: One Doctor's Response (4/5/2010 8:28:09 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Mercnbeth

quote:

I do understand why they would be phasing out the nursing homes. Who needs them once the death panels begin. I don't know about you but I wouldn't trust a Doctor who bought into all of that.
Needing to bring "death panels" into the discussion because of the fear of taking on point illustrates a very weak position.

Complimentary to having faith and having the delusional belief that Dr. Cassell and his position unique!

Unlike your favorite radio personality, the Doctor can retire, or use his degree in another capacity, or as many Doctors already do in the current wonderful government run medical facility - not take patients which would require him to base his medical care on a government gate-keeper using bureaucratic mandates for what care he can and can't provide.


You so funny.

Why don't you actually try having a discussion one day instead of trying to double talk yourself through whatever you want to make up.

Funny how you tried to point out the "death panel" statement but went on to ignore the fallacy of the government closing out nursing homes which was one of his rants.  It all goes hand in hand because large numbers of people still believe the lies that were spun even when they were shown to be lies.

He's a urologist in Mount Dora.  His living is medicare patients.  I don't think highly of anyone who stops to make claims about what the government should or shouldn't do while they're suckling on the breast of the same government who provides their living.  




rulemylife -> RE: One Doctor's Resonse (4/5/2010 8:29:56 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Mercnbeth

quote:

Can you possibly try any harder to defend the indefensible just because you dislike Obama?


Another distinction between us I am proud to have - I don't need to agree with a position to defend a person's freedom to say it.


His freedom is limited by the ethics of his profession, which he clearly violated.




LadyPact -> RE: One Doctor's Resonse (4/5/2010 8:52:21 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: rulemylife
His freedom is limited by the ethics of his profession, which he clearly violated.


Seems to Me that he is entitled to the same freedoms as every other citizen of the country.  He didn't vow to give up free speech when he became a doctor.




Mercnbeth -> RE: One Doctor's Response (4/5/2010 9:01:52 AM)

quote:

This is what you do. You are full of shit. You are just another political pawn that cannot differentiate between their party's ideology and what is actually the "truth."
More 'shit expertise' from DG!

You'd first have to substantiate and document which party is it I can't differentiate from mine by labeling me in one. It seems the difficulty you and others are having isn't a function of the facts disclosed but of the failure of this President and Administration to appreciate the results of their policy on the front lines.

I appreciate its much easier to attack those pointing it out than defending the political party, and President, you obviously identify with and support unconditionally.

Here's another consideration, your response was all about me. Well - nothing I stated was made up or had any emotional or political attachment. I took the Doctor's words without interpreting them in any matter to advance my position. Relevant to the Doctor, I had no position other than the one that I thought funny and had only one other person appreciate - in Florida and as a Republican he dose benefit from Medicare more than most. Getting deeper, I thought the good Doctor was expressing a view that indicated a 'tipping point' for him; which may also exist with many other Doctors, in many other practices, not so direct; or having a wife so involved in local politics representing the opposition party.

However - make it all about me. Delusion regarding the reality around you is a great way to maintain a position that you are not living in it.

quote:

He's a urologist in Mount Dora. His living is Medicare patients.
I live in a house and deduct my mortgage interest expense. Like the doctor, I may not agree or support the government's manipulation of the economy, I'm directly involved with groups seeking to eliminate that and other similar special interest deductions, but in the meantime - I will exploit and take advantage of all of them.

quote:

It all goes hand in hand because large numbers of people still believe the lies that were spun even when they were shown to be lies.
I didn't and don't believe in the representation that there were 'death panels' because as a pragmatist, it would give me cause to support the initiative. I don't believe its a government's responsibility to provide medical care 'at all costs' and believe in allocating whatever government resources to those more likely to benefit long term. Individuals, charities, can and should be making those decisions, but for a government to spend $25,000 per month so a 90 year old, in a vegetative state, can be cared for in facility isn't aligned with my personal view on the subject. I never read any definitive application of 'death panels' in the bill and considered both sides of the argument in Congress to be politically motivated. However if you want to fish for that red herring - go for it. It has nothing to do with the Doctor documenting his opinion on a sign placed on the door to his office.
quote:

It all goes hand in hand because large numbers of people still believe the lies that were spun even when they were shown to be lies.
Yes - it does go hand and hand with the 'faithful'. How about the President's lie "shown to be" one without qualification?

What does the Doctor's sign do to that lie? Or is your position better served by representing the President signing this into Law without knowing what it said?

If you want to talk about lies that are not only documented, but affect the lives of many people - the President's lie to the audience regarding the access to care for pre-existing conditions is a real life and accurate representation of reality.

Another example of "transparent horse-shit" or a representation of me "not liking Obama"?

quote:

His freedom is limited by the ethics of his profession, which he clearly violated.
Now you want 'Thought Crime' to be recognized as a "violation" - you are in line with the Administration and political party represented.




Louve00 -> RE: One Doctor's Resonse (4/5/2010 9:03:34 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: rulemylife

Yes, he said he would not turn patients away after putting up a sign turning patients away.

[sm=wtf.gif]



Ya know...every person on this site demands a link when they hear/read something they don't like or agree with.  Merc pasted a link to what he thought was funny, which lead to this huge debate over a Dr refusing to treat patients who support Obama.  I am still under the impression it was an exercise of the Dr's freedom of speech to put that sign up.  If you read Merc's link, on down in that link the Dr himself said....
"I have plenty of Obama supporters in my patient base and we have a lot of political discussions. I'm not cutting anybody out of their care. I'm not refusing care on the basis of their political beliefs," he reiterated in an exchange with Cavuto. "I hope that more and more Obama supporters come through to find out what all the fuss is about because I think we have to do something about this."

Now, as to the timeline the Dr is talking about...and the one Tazzy said she found, I also found a link to the document of the timelines the Dr was talking about.  This document was released by the Dr himself.  I have not read the entire document, but apparently it is something the Dr thinks everyone should read as he gives you the ability to download or print the entire document to read for yourself.  You can choose to read the link for yourself, or not.  You just can't deny its there, though.

http://www.myfoxorlando.com/dpp/health/040210Ways-Means-document-Cassell




tazzygirl -> RE: One Doctor's Resonse (4/5/2010 2:24:33 PM)

Its sad, actually. Everytime i hear about something evil thats within the now law, its coming from the GOP. Soon after, the myth is busted, and we come to realize its not what was stated. People are being deliberately lied too. People are reacting to these lies. People are commiting crimes based upon these lies. They are responsible for their own actions, without a doubt. But what responsibility is the GOP willing to take for the lies that are becoming obviously the basis for many of these actions? How long before the "people" wake up to the fact that they have been, and still are, repeatedly lied too.




Mercnbeth -> RE: One Doctor's Resonse (4/5/2010 3:06:54 PM)

quote:

But what responsibility is the GOP willing to take for the lies that are becoming obviously the basis for many of these actions?
No power = no responsibility. Rhetoric and opinion is not an example of power and no action or policy becomes law without power. Currently, although without the previously indefensible power in place prior to the election of the new Senator from Massachusetts, power resides in one party. Only their lies have impact and consequence.

They understand it better than you and took the cowardly approach to having this Law pass in the first place. That action intensified the polarization of views and provided the source of any accusation the opposition could raise. Where do you want to place blame? I guess fully supporting the Law you would place it in the poor communication skills of the party in power. However is wasn't "mis-communicating" it was a lie that represented that the preexisting condition exclusion was immediately eliminated from health policies.

quote:

Its sad, actually. Everytime i hear about something evil thats within the now law, its coming from the GOP. Soon after, the myth is busted, and we come to realize its not what was stated.
"Busted"? Given the choice of an Administration and Party in power verifiable lying about the impact of this Law and one out of power - I don't think "busted" can be exclusively applied. Which would have been the better option; keep the Bill on his desk and read it while Congress returned to their districts, or sign it and take full 'credit'(?) for passing it and saying "whoops!" when something as basic as the preexisting condition representation is wrong?

How "sad" do you think the people are who relied on the President telling them the truth about their child's preexisting condition not excluding the child from coverage as soon as he signed the Bill?
quote:

People are reacting to these lies.

They should be reacting more vehemently than they are in this latest example of this Administration being caught, within one day of signing the Bill into Law.

It is sad to see opinions so obviously politically motivated. Sadder still to see such obvious attempts to distract from the reality of failure and lies being excused in the process.

quote:

How long before the "people" wake up to the fact that they have been, and still are, repeatedly lied too.
Good question - when indeed?




thompsonx -> RE: One Doctor's Resonse (4/5/2010 6:53:19 PM)

You constantly brag about having learned nothing in school but now you would try to teach English grammar...irony of the first order.




tazzygirl -> RE: One Doctor's Resonse (4/5/2010 7:05:47 PM)

First, Merc, i could care less what your thoughts on this matter may be.. but they are certainly wrong.

Second, im sure you are quite happy that insurance companies are taking the law the way they did, and not as intended. Im quite sure you are happy that children wont "have" to be covered, despite their problems. They dont even have to cover them under the parents policy.

Im quite sure you are laughing maniacly, crowing how corporations fucked the children once again.


quote:

The authors of the law say they meant to ban all forms of discrimination against children with pre-existing conditions like asthma, diabetes, birth defects, orthopedic problems, leukemia, cystic fibrosis and sickle cell disease. The goal, they say, was to provide those youngsters with access to insurance and to a full range of benefits once they are in a health plan.

To insurance companies, the language of the law is not so clear.

Insurers agree that if they provide insurance for a child, they must cover pre-existing conditions. But, they say, the law does not require them to write insurance for the child and it does not guarantee the “availability of coverage” for all until 2014.

William G. Schiffbauer, a lawyer whose clients include employers and insurance companies, said: “The fine print differs from the larger political message. If a company sells insurance, it will have to cover pre-existing conditions for children covered by the policy. But it does not have to sell to somebody with a pre-existing condition. And the insurer could increase premiums to cover the additional cost.”

Congressional Democrats were furious when they learned that some insurers disagreed with their interpretation of the law.

“The concept that insurance companies would even seek to deny children coverage exemplifies why we fought for this reform,” said Representative Henry A. Waxman, Democrat of California and chairman of the Energy and Commerce Committee.

Senator John D. Rockefeller IV, Democrat of West Virginia and chairman of the Senate commerce committee, said: “The ink has not yet dried on the health care reform bill, and already some deplorable health insurance companies are trying to duck away from covering children with pre-existing conditions. This is outrageous.”

The issue is one of many that federal officials are tackling as they prepare to carry out the law, with a huge stream of new rules, official guidance and brochures to educate the public. Their decisions will have major practical implications.

Insurers say they often limit coverage of pre-existing conditions under policies sold in the individual insurance market. Thus, for example, an insurer might cover a family of four, including a child with a heart defect, but exclude treatment of that condition from the policy.

The new law says that health plans and insurers offering individual or group coverage “may not impose any pre-existing condition exclusion with respect to such plan or coverage” for children under 19, starting in “plan years” that begin on or after Sept. 23, 2010.

But, insurers say, until 2014, the law does not require them to write insurance at all for the child or the family. In the language of insurance, the law does not include a “guaranteed issue” requirement before then.

Consumer advocates worry that instead of refusing to cover treatment for a specific pre-existing condition, an insurer might simply deny coverage for the child or the family.

“If you have a sick kid, the individual insurance market will continue to be a scary place,” said Karen L. Pollitz, a research professor at the Health Policy Institute at Georgetown University.

Experts at the National Association of Insurance Commissioners share that concern.

“I would like to see the kids covered,” said Sandy Praeger, the insurance commissioner of Kansas. “But without guaranteed issue of insurance, I am not sure companies will be required to take children under 19.”

A White House spokesman said the administration planned to issue regulations setting forth its view that “the term ‘pre-existing’ applies to both a child’s access to a plan and his or her benefits once he or she is in a plan.” But lawyers said the rules could be challenged in court if they went beyond the law or were inconsistent with it.

Starting in January 2014, health plans will be required to accept everyone who applies for coverage.


Thrilled, arent you. Happy. Gleeful. No damn wonder why you love them so much.

Please, take your bullshit answers and go somewhere else. You are a sad little man, merc. this is the last time i will respond to any post made by you. i would appreciate it if you have at least that same amount of curtesy.




kittinSol -> RE: One Doctor's Resonse (4/5/2010 7:10:03 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: lusciouslips19


quote:

ORIGINAL: kittinSol

As a patient, I wouldn't want to see a doctor that was so outspoken about his political beliefs - especially in this day and age, when medical access is such a contentious matter. I hope he loses a ton of work out of this little tantrum of his. What a loser.

PS: as for his freedom of speech... give me a break. Nobody ever suggested it should be suppressed in any kind of way. But as a doctor, he should choose: patients, or the tea party movement.


Really what kind of republican is he anyway????[sm=dunno.gif] Everyone should be smart enough to take anyones money and profit.


The guy obviously wants to sink his business down the bog. He's obviously looking for an excuse to blame Obama. It's astounding how these tea people constantly look for reasons to justify their failures: "It's the Marxists' fault, Miss!!!".

And all that for a few sick prostates [:D] .




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