RE: The Fallout from the Financial Crisis April 8, 2010

RE: The Fallout from the Financial Crisis April 8, 2010 (Full Version)

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variation30 -> RE: The Fallout from the Financial Crisis April 8, 2010 (4/13/2010 9:37:24 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: slvemike4u If they don't SPEND our money....what other use does OUR money have ? well I could SPEND more of MY money on things I want.

slvemike4u -> RE: The Fallout from the Financial Crisis April 8, 2010 (4/13/2010 9:38:09 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: variation30 quote: ORIGINAL: Brain I really don't care if a president bows in order to be courteous and respectful but I would like a president and a political party that has the courage to increase taxes on the wealthy in order to balance the budget. am I getting trolled? why not this: don't spend more money than you have (i.e. cut spending). Where are you cutting it from ?...that part is important yanno.[8\|]

variation30 -> RE: The Fallout from the Financial Crisis April 8, 2010 (4/13/2010 9:38:23 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Silence8 generic-response'd! blah-blah-blah, where-were-you-when-bush-was-spending-to-high-heaven, blah-blah-blah-blah-blah. blah. saying the exact same thing.

slvemike4u -> RE: The Fallout from the Financial Crisis April 8, 2010 (4/13/2010 9:41:00 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: variation30 quote: ORIGINAL: slvemike4u If they don't SPEND our money....what other use does OUR money have ? well I could SPEND more of MY money on things I want. But it isn't your money....if it is tax revenue and you have paid it....it stops being yours....That's sort of how it works....sheeesh,you would think people would know this stuff. By the way I saw in another thread that you are Canadian....so why are you railing against the American tax structure?

variation30 -> RE: The Fallout from the Financial Crisis April 8, 2010 (4/13/2010 9:42:01 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: slvemike4u Where are you cutting it from ?...that part is important yanno.[8\|] closing down all military bases outside of the US would be a start. but most of our bloat is internal so and cutting departments and social programs would be not only necessary, but a real joy.

slvemike4u -> RE: The Fallout from the Financial Crisis April 8, 2010 (4/13/2010 9:44:04 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: variation30 quote: ORIGINAL: slvemike4u quote: ORIGINAL: servantforuse The IRS could take every penny from the top 10% of wage earners in this country and it wouldn't make a dent in this deficit. When you take every penny from the rich, then where do you go ?? Not that I am advocating that silly "take every penny" plan....but I would just like to clarify something.....Are you rich?...I will assume the answer to that is "No"....so my next question,and it is aked because I figure the rich can take care of themselves,......Why do spend so much time championing their cause? Do you see the rich in this country as somehow being beleagured ? I have to confess...the sight of a working man championing the cause of poor opressed rich people....is a big fucking joke! some people are principled, others are not. What does that have to do with the question I asked....perhaps I should rephrase it and repose it to you....Do you feel the rich are unable or without the resources to argue their own interests? It's a simple question....you should be able to come up with something reasonable .

slvemike4u -> RE: The Fallout from the Financial Crisis April 8, 2010 (4/13/2010 9:46:36 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: variation30 quote: ORIGINAL: slvemike4u Where are you cutting it from ?...that part is important yanno.[8\|] closing down all military bases outside of the US would be a start. but most of our bloat is internal so and cutting departments and social programs would be not only necessary, but a real joy. There you go again...you're from Edmonton what the fuck is with all of this "our" shit...we have enough homegrown miserable bastards as it is...we have no need to import more.

variation30 -> RE: The Fallout from the Financial Crisis April 8, 2010 (4/13/2010 9:46:37 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: slvemike4u But it isn't your money....if it is tax revenue and you have paid it....it stops being yours....That's sort of how it works....sheeesh,you would think people would know this stuff. By the way I saw in another thread that you are Canadian....so why are you railing against the American tax structure? the op was discussing raising taxes. the person you responded to was suggesting that the federal government stop spending our money altogether (a sentiment with which I agree). it was in this context I was addressing your 'then what is the point of money'. that is to say, the point of money would be an intermediary good of popular value to use as exchange so that one person can trade what he wants from others. are you suggesting money is worthless without taxes or even a government? I'm not a Canadian. I moved to Canada for a few years after my marriage and am filing to be a landed immigrant. I plan on moving back to my country after a while...although the rampant looting I see on the horizon in the next decade makes me more than a little hesitant to remain anywhere near the states.

slvemike4u -> RE: The Fallout from the Financial Crisis April 8, 2010 (4/13/2010 9:47:58 PM)
Go with the "hesitant " thing.....seems that would be best for all of us.[:)]

variation30 -> RE: The Fallout from the Financial Crisis April 8, 2010 (4/13/2010 9:53:49 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: slvemike4u What does that have to do with the question I asked....perhaps I should rephrase it and repose it to you....Do you feel the rich are unable or without the resources to argue their own interests? It's a simple question....you should be able to come up with something reasonable . yes. the 'rich' are a minority in a very large mass of uneducated and envious voters. throughout history you can see the hysteria that has resulted in the support of anti-trust legislation (while being supported by the citizens, interestingly enough...they are always filed by competitors, not consumers), taking gold away from those who held it to preserve wealth, increasing taxes on the 'greedy' who have 'enough' as it is, controlling how companies who receive bailouts spend their money, forcing natural monopolies to stifle 'dangerous' competition (again, while the layman supports this, it usually is brought about by less capable competitors), outrage against insider trading, this list could go on a long, long time, full of instances in american history where embittered and ignorant people used the power of the government against the minority of the wealthy.

slvemike4u -> RE: The Fallout from the Financial Crisis April 8, 2010 (4/13/2010 10:07:12 PM)
Bullshit the majority (as you call it)is grossly disadvantaged in such a struggle...their one and only weapon is their vote...since they are a large and disparate group that advantage is watered down by the simple fact that they do not speak as one. On the other hand the"rich" have money which buys influence and access.Those two factors outweigh the "majority's" watered down and disparate advantage(the vote) every day of the week. But I'm betting you knew that....now if only the working man would learn it.

tj444 -> RE: The Fallout from the Financial Crisis April 8, 2010 (4/13/2010 10:24:40 PM)
There was an article recently that said nearly half of all Americans wont pay any Federal tax.... hmmmmm Doesnt that mean that almost half dont contribute to what they consume (federally)? And according to the article the "wealthy" already pay about 73% of all the Federal income tax collected now, today. "The result is a tax system that exempts almost half the country from paying for programs that benefit everyone, including national defense, public safety, infrastructure and education. It is a system in which the top 10 percent of earners -- households making an average of $366,400 in 2006 -- paid about 73 percent of the income taxes collected by the federal government." http://finance.yahoo.com/news/Nearly-half-of-US-households-apf-1105567323.html?x=0&.v=1

slvemike4u -> RE: The Fallout from the Financial Crisis April 8, 2010 (4/13/2010 10:32:23 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: tj444 There was an article recently that said nearly half of all Americans wont pay any Federal tax.... hmmmmm Doesnt that mean that almost half dont contribute to what they consume (federally)? And according to the article the "wealthy" already pay about 73% of all the Federal income tax collected now, today. "The result is a tax system that exempts almost half the country from paying for programs that benefit everyone, including national defense, public safety, infrastructure and education. It is a system in which the top 10 percent of earners -- households making an average of $366,400 in 2006 -- paid about 73 percent of the income taxes collected by the federal government." http://finance.yahoo.com/news/Nearly-half-of-US-households-apf-1105567323.html?x=0&.v=1 How many times does this tired old canard need to be shot down....no one that works(on the books) in America pays no taxes despite what your silly little article put forth.... I could shoot it down quite simply for you....but I grow weary of this shit.Do some research look up all of the different payroll taxes withheld...such as social security...unemployment etc etc....and than come back and explain how ,what was it,nearly half of Americans won't pay any Federal Tax....

Silence8 -> RE: The Fallout from the Financial Crisis April 8, 2010 (4/13/2010 10:36:33 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: tj444 There was an article recently that said nearly half of all Americans wont pay any Federal tax.... hmmmmm Doesnt that mean that almost half dont contribute to what they consume (federally)? And according to the article the "wealthy" already pay about 73% of all the Federal income tax collected now, today. "The result is a tax system that exempts almost half the country from paying for programs that benefit everyone, including national defense, public safety, infrastructure and education. It is a system in which the top 10 percent of earners -- households making an average of $366,400 in 2006 -- paid about 73 percent of the income taxes collected by the federal government." http://finance.yahoo.com/news/Nearly-half-of-US-households-apf-1105567323.html?x=0&.v=1 I suspect you might be a computer algorithm. Also, this trash already has a 'merc' thread that runs 10+ pages long. The relevant point is the widening wealth gap, bot dude. If you think the American people are milking the hard-working rich, I got some swampland in Florida to subprime mortgage you. Fucking robots get me every time.

tj444 -> RE: The Fallout from the Financial Crisis April 8, 2010 (4/13/2010 10:39:13 PM)
I specified several times that the article was referring to Federal taxes, as that was what the discussion was about since references were made to the President. If you bothered to read the article it states that there are other forms of taxes that some of those people do pay (but that is still different from Federal taxes).

slvemike4u -> RE: The Fallout from the Financial Crisis April 8, 2010 (4/13/2010 10:45:49 PM)
Than perhaps you shouldn't have referrenced it without mentioning those things...are perhaps we should talk about the unfair burden a working man has in supporting Social Security...yanno where every last dollar the typical working man makes is subject to this tax...where as the CEO only pays tax on a miniscule portion of his income....

tj444 -> RE: The Fallout from the Financial Crisis April 8, 2010 (4/13/2010 10:50:50 PM)
I expect people to be able to read and use common sense and not assume.

variation30 -> RE: The Fallout from the Financial Crisis April 8, 2010 (4/13/2010 10:56:12 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: slvemike4u Bullshit the majority (as you call it)is grossly disadvantaged in such a struggle...their one and only weapon is their vote this is akin to saying that my one and only weapon against an ant is a shoe and a spray can full of poison. the 'vote' is all they need. quote: ...since they are a large and disparate group that advantage is watered down by the simple fact that they do not speak as one. they don't have to speak as one. quote: On the other hand the"rich" have money which buys influence and access.Those two factors outweigh the "majority's" watered down and disparate advantage(the vote) every day of the week. But I'm betting you knew that....now if only the working man would learn it. lobbyists can do a lot, but they cannot, and never have been able to, hold back the tide of the unwashed masses as they surge to an emotional conclusion.

slvemike4u -> RE: The Fallout from the Financial Crisis April 8, 2010 (4/13/2010 10:59:11 PM)
You know pal just your use of the term "unwashed masses" is an indication of what kind of unabashed class snob you are....I'm done with you. You are contemptible and unworthy of discussing issues with.

variation30 -> RE: The Fallout from the Financial Crisis April 8, 2010 (4/13/2010 11:00:16 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: slvemike4u Than perhaps you shouldn't have referrenced it without mentioning those things...are perhaps we should talk about the unfair burden a working man has in supporting Social Security...yanno where every last dollar the typical working man makes is subject to this tax...where as the CEO only pays tax on a miniscule portion of his income.... let's say that minuscule portion is 20 million dollars. how much could he have improved his industry (and hired additional labor, implemented newer means of production, lowered costs, improved quality) with that 'minuscule portion of his income'? and social security is an insolvent joke.

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