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Genes Say Some Are Part Neanderthal - 5/7/2010 3:47:59 AM   
Sanity


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People of European descent, as well as oriental people and islanders... everyone but people whose lineage is directly African, are part Neanderthal. There is also speculation about other such mixing even further back in time with more ancient hominids, and the genetic research continues.

I wonder about the specifics, how that worked. Was there war, where brides were captured? Or were they friendly exchanges for the most part?

Were the last Neanderthals the proverbial ogres and trolls who lived under bridges, etc?

But I digress. Here's the article:

quote:


WASHINGTON – We have met Neanderthal and he is us — at least a little. The most detailed look yet at the Neanderthal genome helps answer one of the most debated questions in anthropology: Did Neanderthals and modern humans mate? The answer is yes, there is at least some cave man biology in most of us. Between 1 percent and 4 percent of genes in people from Europe and Asia trace back to Neanderthals.

"They live on, a little bit," says Svante Paabo of the Max Planck Institute for Evolutionary Anthropology in Leipzig, Germany.

Researchers led by Paabo, Richard E. Green of the University of California, Santa Cruz, and David Reich of Harvard Medical School compared the genetic material collected from the bones of three Neanderthals with that from five modern humans. Their findings, reported in Friday's edition of the journal Science, show a relationship between Neanderthals and modern people outside Africa, Paabo said.

That suggests that interbreeding occurred in the Middle East, where both modern humans and Neanderthals lived thousands of years ago, he said.

Full article here



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RE: Genes Say Some Are Part Neanderthal - 5/7/2010 4:43:51 AM   
LadyAngelika


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Status: offline 		Interesting read, Sanity. There are two parts to the article I find particularly interesting.

Reich noted that while there was a flow of genes from Neanderthals to modern humans, there is no indication of gene movement the other way, from humans to Neanderthals.

The closest extinct relative to modern people, Neanderthals existed from about 400,000 years ago to about 30,000 years ago. They coexisted with modern humans for 30,000 to 50,000 years in Europe and western Asia.

While many people think of Neanderthals as very primitive, they had tools for things like hunting and sewing, controlled fire, lived in shelters and buried their dead.


Now I'm not a genetic scientist by any stretch of the word, but what I'm wondering is, if the Neanderthals gene was so strong that it flowed towards humans but stayed unaffected in the reverse, how did it die out? They seemed like a pretty resourceful bunch!

Asked if the findings show differences between Africans and non-Africans, Paabo replied that people who want to present data in some sort of racist perspective would find a way to do so. He said, one way to look at this data could be to say people outside Africa are more primitive, while another way could be to say there is something beneficial about being part Neanderthal.


So that is why they focussed half their article on this minor issue that has been criticized to lack of sampling? This could be misconstrued as a hidden agenda on behalf of the individual reporting the news. Either that, or it's just sensationalism rearing it's ugly head.

- LA

< Message edited by LadyAngelika -- 5/7/2010 4:44:53 AM >

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RE: Genes Say Some Are Part Neanderthal - 5/7/2010 5:41:12 AM   
kittinSol


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Sanity

People of European descent, as well as oriental people and islanders... everyone but people whose lineage is directly African, are part Neanderthal.



I heard about this on the radio - it's fantastic news! Imagine how upset it'll make the white supremacists  . I wonder if they're talking about this over at Stormfront.com rofl?

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RE: Genes Say Some Are Part Neanderthal - 5/7/2010 6:28:41 AM   
Sanity


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The genes flowing one way, if thats accurate, couldn't that mean that the ogres captured and raped or otherwise mated with Homo sapiens women, as Neanderthals were being hunted towards extinction? And that Homo sapiens wasn't attracted enough to the Neanderthal women to have sex with them?

I can't help but wonder about their genitalia... how it fit in with this whole mating... thing.

And what it might have been like for a woman with a modern human's body to carry and give birth to a half Neanderthal baby?



< Message edited by Sanity -- 5/7/2010 6:30:58 AM >

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RE: Genes Say Some Are Part Neanderthal - 5/7/2010 6:34:53 AM   
kittinSol


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Status: offline 		Are they certain that the sexual exchanges went only from Neanderthalian men to Human women? Isn't it possible that Neanderthalian women enticed Human guys too? It wasn't necessarily rape, you know. Don't you turn Gor on us, Sanity - you're too perfect the way you are  .

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RE: Genes Say Some Are Part Neanderthal - 5/7/2010 6:40:06 AM   
Sanity


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Maybe I've seen King Kong a few too many times... it just seems to me that it would have been the Neanderthal men with the Homo sapiens women.

The reason I think that is because of the control issue. The Neanderthals were beefier and a neanderthal family could have controlled a modern-type woman far easier than a modern-type family could have control a neanderthal woman.

Then there are looks, and the ability to achieve an erection...

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RE: Genes Say Some Are Part Neanderthal - 5/7/2010 6:42:46 AM   
kittinSol


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Status: offline 		I think your vision of prehistory is way off. Matriarchy ruled, then.

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RE: Genes Say Some Are Part Neanderthal - 5/7/2010 6:46:22 AM   
Sanity


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Nah, women were thrown around like sex toys, they were traded for sheep and cattle or anything else of value. They were war trophies, quite literally possessions.


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RE: Genes Say Some Are Part Neanderthal - 5/7/2010 6:56:26 AM   
mnottertail


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Sanity


Nah, women were thrown around like sex toys, they were traded for sheep and cattle or anything else of value. They were war trophies, quite literally possessions.



And if the ostensibly 'smarter' homos (which appeared to have survived and therefore must have won the bulk of the battles over the Hengsts and Horsas of the old world) were combat weary joes come slogging in from the field and saw that neanderthal pussy steaming right in front of them, you saying they wouldn't mash their collective megatons of moulten meat into that firm yet quivvering vaginya?

How do you think mankind ever thought up tying a woman up, slapping her around, using her hair for a positioning tool,  and dick pounding the fuck outta her, then?

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RE: Genes Say Some Are Part Neanderthal - 5/7/2010 7:03:45 AM   
kittinSol


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Sanity

Nah, women were thrown around like sex toys, they were traded for sheep and cattle or anything else of value. They were war trophies, quite literally possessions.



You're cute, when you're naive.

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RE: Genes Say Some Are Part Neanderthal - 5/7/2010 7:05:46 AM   
windchymes


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quote:

ORIGINAL: kittinSol

Are they certain that the sexual exchanges went only from Neanderthalian men to Human women? Isn't it possible that Neanderthalian women enticed Human guys too? It wasn't necessarily rape, you know. Don't you turn Gor on us, Sanity - you're too perfect the way you are  .


Since modern women, or some of them, do have that attraction for the "bad boys", it makes perfect sense to me that some of the human women would be attracted to the Neanderthal man. 

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RE: Genes Say Some Are Part Neanderthal - 5/7/2010 7:09:39 AM   
Sanity


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I don't know about you but there are some women I couldn't do...

As for the rest of what you wrote, I think our propensity to rape and war and torture and enslave are but vestigial behaviors left over from a more primitive version of us which is slowly slipping away.

As to women who are Dominant and men who are submissive, I believe the Kinks said it well when they sang

quote:



Girls will be boys, and boys will be girls.
It's a mixed up, muddled up, shook up world,
except for Lola. Lo lo lo Lola. Lo lo lo Lola.



But for the most part, by and large as they say, the male has always been the dominant of the species in my opinion.

< Message edited by Sanity -- 5/7/2010 7:11:40 AM >

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RE: Genes Say Some Are Part Neanderthal - 5/7/2010 7:11:13 AM   
kittinSol


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Status: offline 		Thing is, I seem to remember reading that Neanderthals were pacific and placid individuals that pretty much minded their own business; they disappeared because Humans ate all their food, not because they massacred them.






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RE: Genes Say Some Are Part Neanderthal - 5/7/2010 7:12:16 AM   
kittinSol


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Sanity
But for the most part, by and large as they say, the male has always been the dominant of the species in my opinion.


Wrong - off to Gor you go  !

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RE: Genes Say Some Are Part Neanderthal - 5/7/2010 7:13:29 AM   
Sanity


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They had to be warlike to some extent



in order to have survived as long as they did


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RE: Genes Say Some Are Part Neanderthal - 5/7/2010 7:15:08 AM   
kittinSol


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Status: offline 		Looks like you need a haircut.

And a pair of shorts, at the very least.

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RE: Genes Say Some Are Part Neanderthal - 5/7/2010 7:18:35 AM   
mnottertail


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Sanity
As for the rest of what you wrote, I think our propensity to rape and war and torture and enslave are but vestigial behaviors left over from a more primitive version of us which is slowly slipping away.

quote:



Real slowly in my case, if not at all, I am actually joyous to be a glorious pig of a man; and get my snore on, no trouble at night,  being who I am.

Thanks.

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RE: Genes Say Some Are Part Neanderthal - 5/7/2010 7:18:53 AM   
twistedwillow


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This does not really surprise me.
It is something I have long thought\believed possible.


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RE: Genes Say Some Are Part Neanderthal - 5/7/2010 7:20:22 AM   
Sanity


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Funny you should post that. I used to run around the Owyhee desert  and mountains like that, when I was younger, long hair and naked and everything...  I can relate to that artists' concept.

Only I carried a rifle.


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RE: Genes Say Some Are Part Neanderthal - 5/7/2010 7:30:23 AM   
Musicmystery


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Status: offline 		I heard this on NPR yesterday too.

It's not a matter of genes flowing in one directlon--where'd you get that? Nor the conquering things you're inventing. Homo sapiens and Neanderthal overlap by thousands of years, and it's not surprising they would have come across each other.

If we had Neanderthal DNA to analyze, presumably we'd find Homo sapien genes as well.

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