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RE: Ethical response to a mentally disturbed individual... - 5/23/2010 12:55:07 PM

MeetTheNewBoss

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lobodomslavery - The American Constitution guarantees free speech, yes - but if you walk into someone's home, that right becomes forfeit. Same with boards such as CM or anywhere else. If it's a privately owned site, you may as well be walking into their house. They can restrict speech all they like. They make take a lot of heat doing it, but it isn't illegal.

Just playing Devil's Advocate.

(in reply to kdsub)

Post #: 21

RE: Ethical response to a mentally disturbed individual... - 5/23/2010 12:57:30 PM

lobodomslavery

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if your a member , you have a right , its a free forum, obviously if your not a member , you cant, it stands to reason
kevin

(in reply to MeetTheNewBoss)

Post #: 22

RE: Ethical response to a mentally disturbed individual... - 5/23/2010 1:01:33 PM

LadyAngelika

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quote:

ORIGINAL: lobodomslavery

Kd sub you are so right. The American constitution enshrines freedom of speech . i dont think CM nor any board has the right to censure that
kevin

CM does advertise that it is a member of the Free Speech Coalition at the bottom of it's main page but that is in terms of allowing people to talk about BDSM.

However, it is a privately owned company and isn't obliged to keep any of us as a member or allow any of us access to the boards. I have been here long enough to know that they try to keep as many people here as possible in the spirit of having a multitude of voices and that the moderators have to put up with a lot of crap in doing so.

- LA

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(in reply to lobodomslavery)

Post #: 23

RE: Ethical response to a mentally disturbed individual... - 5/23/2010 1:01:58 PM

lobodomslavery

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The other point is just because Your a member does not give anyone, me included , the right to send messages to other members or bother them without their consent. That means sending messages to their mail boxes and to their profiles. But simply posting on a forum that is not intruding on anyone's space, its a public forum for kinksters. i would like to clarify i have not sent any messages to any Domme/Dom asking to be their servant, i dont do that, its an intrusion, i wait for the Domme to make the first move
kevin

(in reply to lobodomslavery)

Post #: 24

RE: Ethical response to a mentally disturbed individual... - 5/23/2010 1:03:23 PM

LadyAngelika

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quote:

ORIGINAL: lobodomslavery

if your a member , you have a right , its a free forum, obviously if your not a member , you cant, it stands to reason
kevin

Membership at Collarme doesn't come with rights. It comes with obligations to follow the TOS.

And might I add that you are lucky that TOS is in place because it shielding you from a bigger blast than you are getting.

- LA

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Une main de fer dans un gant de velours ~ An iron hand in a velvet glove

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Post #: 25

RE: Ethical response to a mentally disturbed individual... - 5/23/2010 1:04:38 PM

LadyAngelika

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quote:

ORIGINAL: lobodomslavery

The other point is just because Your a member does not give anyone, me included , the right to send messages to other members or bother them without their consent.

Anybody can send message to anybody here. In response to that, anyone can block anybody. How long have you been on this site?

- LA

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Une main de fer dans un gant de velours ~ An iron hand in a velvet glove

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Post #: 26

RE: Ethical response to a mentally disturbed individual... - 5/23/2010 1:05:41 PM

LadyAngelika

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I give up for today Kevin, but I believe you provided an excellent contribution to prove the point of this thread.

- LA

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Post #: 27

RE: Ethical response to a mentally disturbed individual... - 5/23/2010 1:07:21 PM

Lucienne

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Joined: 9/5/2009
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FR

It's an interesting question and I don't think there is a "good" answer in the sense of one that would be responsive to the sense of concern for the individual in question. Ethical guidelines require behavior that is actually possible. I do not believe it is possible to stage an internet intervention for someone who is mentally ill. The concern may be well-intentioned but the relationships are simply too attenuated. So, really, I don't think this site or its users are capable of saving someone from themselves, consequently there can be no ethical duty to try.

(in reply to MeetTheNewBoss)

Post #: 28

RE: Ethical response to a mentally disturbed individual... - 5/23/2010 1:11:16 PM

lobodomslavery

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at the end of the day we are own best guides. No one knows what revolves in anyone's mind except the person him/Herself. Thats why murderers will reach Heaven or spiritual fulfillment whatever. Because ultimately they have done nothign wrong unless they knew what they did was wrong
kevin

(in reply to Lucienne)

Post #: 29

RE: Ethical response to a mentally disturbed individual... - 5/23/2010 1:15:09 PM

kiwisub12

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since this is online, the only way any of us has to deal with mentally unstable people is to ignore them, not react, and hope they go away. What else could we do? - stage a online intervention and force treatment.

There are only two regular posters that i would consider to have mental disorders, and they have , in the time i have been on collarme, been repeatedly told that they are nuts, crazy, insane, need lots of help, should contact a therapist/psychologist/psychiatrist, shouldn't post any more and many other things - some of which i posted myself. Needless to say, i really doubt that any of the suggestions were ever taken.

Unless one of them came online and said they were going to kill themselves or someone else, there is little anyone can do to help them. Heck there is a man in the city i live in who is crazier than either of them could claim to be - he is homeless, dirty and just as crazy as the day is long, and he is still roaming the streets. The police know his name, and unless he is a danger to himself or someone else, the street is where he is going to stay. I hardly think a man who is cognisant enough to maintain a residence and computer is comittment-worthy.

(in reply to LadyPact)

Post #: 30

RE: Ethical response to a mentally disturbed individual... - 5/23/2010 1:16:07 PM

LillyoftheVally

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I think there is a difference between someone with real problems and someone who likes stirring the pot, I think there are people with serious dedication to the latter.

If I was seriously concerned I would maybe message them, or write something on the board, if they don't listen I wouldn't do anything, not here anyways.

There was an instance on IC though a while ago when someone was really struggling, and the community is close knit enough that after a massive effort the group managed to get someone to go and check on the person which was a very good thing.

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Post #: 31

RE: Ethical response to a mentally disturbed individual... - 5/23/2010 1:20:37 PM

LadyNTrainer

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quote:

ORIGINAL: kdsub
To me the mental condition or sanity of any poster is none of my business...If he or she is not disrupting the room then just overlook the posts...if they are then report them. I don't understand why you or anyone else should care otherwise.

The issue is not that I am being a busybody and trying to get someone help when they might not want or even need it. What other adults do in their lives is not my business, nor should it be. The issue is that there is a constant disruption to the flow of discussion on the forum most frequented by the individual in question, in part because of the invariable and frequent responses of "Oh my god, this person is seriously disturbed!" These often turn into meta discussions of how disturbed and how disturbing this person is, derailing the topic. Few or none of the problem posts are directly violating site TOS, they are just so bizarre and reality disconnected that people are inevitably going to respond to them in a way that causes disruption of the original topic.

It's theoretically possible to ask people who already know about him to ignore/block/hide him, or to stop having those meta discussions. Realistically I don't see that happening, since there will always be enough new folks coming in to repeat the cycle.

So yes, it's a material problem, and one that I'm not sure has any single good solution.

< Message edited by LadyNTrainer -- 5/23/2010 1:21:16 PM >

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Post #: 32

RE: Ethical response to a mentally disturbed individual... - 5/23/2010 1:24:04 PM

LadyNTrainer

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quote:

ORIGINAL: lobodomslavery

at the end of the day we are own best guides. No one knows what revolves in anyone's mind except the person him/Herself. Thats why murderers will reach Heaven or spiritual fulfillment whatever. Because ultimately they have done nothign wrong unless they knew what they did was wrong
kevin

Quod erat demonstrandum.

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Your dominant Personal Trainer for fitness and body shaping in the lifestyle. Let my fetish be your motivation.

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Post #: 33

RE: Ethical response to a mentally disturbed individual... - 5/23/2010 1:27:45 PM

kdsub

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Well if you see the posts.. then ignore them and move on perhaps others would too. I don't think you realize you are advocating censure. All you can and should do is complain to the administrator. If they don’t take action then just put that person on ignore.

Maybe mail those that react to the posts and ask them not to and stay on the subject.

Butch

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Post #: 34

RE: Ethical response to a mentally disturbed individual... - 5/23/2010 1:35:31 PM

LadyNTrainer

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Joined: 5/20/2009
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quote:

ORIGINAL: kdsub

Well if you see the posts.. then ignore them and move on perhaps others would too. I don't think you realize you are advocating censure.

I am not advocating anything. I recognize that censure is a very slippery slope, and that there is no way for any Internet site to effectively or ethically set a bar of mental competence. I am saying that I don't have a good answer, and that there may not actually be any good answers.

quote:

All you can and should do is complain to the administrator. If they don’t take action then just put that person on ignore.

A lot of people already have. For reasons I've already stipulated, this is actually unlikely to stop the disruption.

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Your dominant Personal Trainer for fitness and body shaping in the lifestyle. Let my fetish be your motivation.

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Post #: 35

RE: Ethical response to a mentally disturbed individual... - 5/23/2010 1:37:20 PM

LadyPact

Posts: 32566
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Actually, I wonder which applies. The American Constitution was mentioned. Yet, the rights of American citizens are not extended to everyone all over the world, simply because they are not American.

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Post #: 36

RE: Ethical response to a mentally disturbed individual... - 5/23/2010 1:39:45 PM

LadyAngelika

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Joined: 7/4/2004
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quote:

Well if you see the posts.. then ignore them and move on perhaps others would too.

Butch, LNT explained that it's not a question of her ignoring them as she will do that. It is more a question of others not ignoring them and derailing threads.

I get what she is saying now and I fully agree. And I for one will make a more conscious effort to ignore those posts. But there will always be new people who will fall into the trap of answering them and proceed in an exercise of chasing their tail and derailing the thread.

As far as there being a solution, I've had posts of mine pulled for being mildly off-topic before. I've recently had a post pulled where I warned people about feeding trolls because the troll reported it as an insult to him, which I clearly admit it was. I can deal with it, but really, go figure.

So that said, I agree with LNT that there probably is no single solution, not until every poster here is willing to take ownership and responsibility for what they post.

- LA

_____________________________

Une main de fer dans un gant de velours ~ An iron hand in a velvet glove

(in reply to kdsub)

Post #: 37

RE: Ethical response to a mentally disturbed individual... - 5/23/2010 1:42:07 PM

LadyAngelika

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quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyPact

Actually, I wonder which applies. The American Constitution was mentioned. Yet, the rights of American citizens are not extended to everyone all over the world, simply because they are not American.

Not only am I not a psychology expert, but I'm not a legal expert neither ;-) It is however my understanding that a site is governed by the country that it is hosted in, therefore US law applies to sites that are hosted in the US.

- LA

_____________________________

Une main de fer dans un gant de velours ~ An iron hand in a velvet glove

(in reply to LadyPact)

Post #: 38

RE: Ethical response to a mentally disturbed individual... - 5/23/2010 1:45:21 PM

kdsub

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Joined: 8/16/2007
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quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyPact

Actually, I wonder which applies. The American Constitution was mentioned. Yet, the rights of American citizens are not extended to everyone all over the world, simply because they are not American.

I'm not sure if you are addressing me...in fact I have not mentioned any rights. BUT...lol... I believe in human rights and luckily I think The US has done a pretty good job over the years defining them in their laws. So should not all people on this earth have these basic rights?

I don't know how this relates to this thread though.

Butch

_____________________________

Mark Twain:

I don't see any use in having a uniform and arbitrary way of spelling words. We might as well make all clothes alike and cook all dishes alike. Sameness is tiresome; variety is pleasing

(in reply to LadyPact)

Post #: 39

RE: Ethical response to a mentally disturbed individual... - 5/23/2010 1:49:34 PM

domiguy

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Most of the people out here are rather fucked in one way or another. If there was some sort of an evaluation that was to be completed there would only be three people left on the site. Jeffff, chicagosub4u and of course myself.

It would be a much more pleasant place to visit.

None of you have the right to talk about crazy cuz yer all fuckin' nutz.

Are you allowed to even own a spork?

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Post #: 40

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