RE: what's in a name?

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RE: what's in a name? - 5/29/2010 10:43:23 PM

LadyEllen

Posts: 10931
Joined: 6/30/2006
From: Stourport-England
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quote:

ORIGINAL: popeye1250

Lady E, in the U.S. most people want to solve their own problems not have the govt. interfere into every facet and sphere of our lives.
I don't know if you could consider that "conservative" or "liberal" though but "liberals" do seem to want "more govt." which is *never* a good thing!
From this thread there are definately differances in the terms "conservative" and "liberal" between our two countries!

Workplace regulation and business regulation isnt government interfering into my life though?

Minimum wage, a maximum working week (esp for goods vehicle drivers), health and safety requirements and all that is a good thing and long may it continue.

Similarly, in my business long live requirements to prove that vehicles have been serviced regularly and get pulled over regularly for inspection too, requirements for vehicle operator licensing and all that.

In fact in my particular sector of this business I'm thinking of drafting a Bill (all by myself) to put to the new coalition government to introduce a requirement for operator licensing in road freight brokerage, to try to drive out the fraudsters and various idiots who either deliberately or incompetently go bust after 6 months, leaving hauliers with unpaid bills that can run into millions.

In short I support liberal ideology to promote a world where yes I can engage in business to make money but yes too it a) doesnt harm anyone else and b) benefits generally according to his contribution he who takes part with me and c) the same opportunity is open to others and d) the excesses possible are curtailed for the common good.

This probably makes me the biggest idiot in the world - there is no doubt whatever that if I abandoned my principles and applied the "principles" of the less scrupulous I should be at least 2-3 million dollars up by this time next year instead of struggling along. I know enough law to avoid paying anyone a penny for their haulage services and enough about this business to engineer that for at least 12 months and maybe longer, and enough about business insolvency to walk away quite unscathed - my credit rating would take a hit thats about all, but who cares about credit rating when you have millions stashed away?

E

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Post #: 41

RE: what's in a name? - 5/30/2010 5:31:00 AM

Moonhead

Posts: 16520
Joined: 9/21/2009
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quote:

ORIGINAL: popeye1250

quote:

ORIGINAL: pahunkboy

Popeye- Moon is an agent for the New World Order.

He LOVES NWO- he eat and dink and sleeps NWO. He wears it like white on rice.

Moon, is PaHunk's accusation true?
Are you one of those sickos?
You *did* say that Greece isn't socialist.

Of course it isn't. I'm not even a Mason, never mind a member of the conspiracy.

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Post #: 42

RE: what's in a name? - 5/30/2010 7:31:06 AM

thishereboi

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Joined: 6/19/2008
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quote:

ORIGINAL: TheHeretic

quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyEllen

Indeed MH - and isnt the silence deafening? One might have thought that with so many experts here on the awful nature of liberal ideas and socialist ideas we might have enjoyed clarification of their interpretations thereof?

"Question too difficult" I think. Still, at least we know in future that when these terms are thrown about by those happy few who use them to mean "bad" that we might disregard their entire opinion, it being based on nothing.

E

Don't read too much into it, LadyE. It seems to be the fate of such threads, or maybe it was your "hand" analogy. I didn't have much better luck with my "fishing" attempt, and that even had a libertarian option.

Yup, that's the way cm swings sometimes, but it did give a couple of posters the chance to crow about how superior they are, so I guess it wasn't a total waste. Personally, I doubt you will ever get anyone to agree on the basic definitions although I liked brainiacs idea of just looking them up. But then again I doubt you will find many people who fall into the definitions on all areas. Some things you might be conservative about and some things will be liberal. There is no one size fits all.

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Post #: 43

RE: what's in a name? - 5/30/2010 10:59:35 AM

Moonhead

Posts: 16520
Joined: 9/21/2009
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quote:

ORIGINAL: thishereboi
Personally, I doubt you will ever get anyone to agree on the basic definitions although I liked brainiacs idea of just looking them up.

Isn't that what lady E was complaining about in the first place? I'm old fashioned enough to agree with her that a noun should be defined by what it says in the dictionary or a similar reference book, rather than some bizarre fantasy meaning shared by nutcases who think that all reference books are propagating an evil lefty conspiracy, and/or published and funded by Zionists.

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Post #: 44

RE: what's in a name? - 5/30/2010 12:50:30 PM

popeye1250

Posts: 18104
Joined: 1/27/2006
From: New Hampshire
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyEllen

quote:

ORIGINAL: popeye1250

Lady E, in the U.S. most people want to solve their own problems not have the govt. interfere into every facet and sphere of our lives.
I don't know if you could consider that "conservative" or "liberal" though but "liberals" do seem to want "more govt." which is *never* a good thing!
From this thread there are definately differances in the terms "conservative" and "liberal" between our two countries!

Workplace regulation and business regulation isnt government interfering into my life though?

Minimum wage, a maximum working week (esp for goods vehicle drivers), health and safety requirements and all that is a good thing and long may it continue.

Similarly, in my business long live requirements to prove that vehicles have been serviced regularly and get pulled over regularly for inspection too, requirements for vehicle operator licensing and all that.

In fact in my particular sector of this business I'm thinking of drafting a Bill (all by myself) to put to the new coalition government to introduce a requirement for operator licensing in road freight brokerage, to try to drive out the fraudsters and various idiots who either deliberately or incompetently go bust after 6 months, leaving hauliers with unpaid bills that can run into millions.

In short I support liberal ideology to promote a world where yes I can engage in business to make money but yes too it a) doesnt harm anyone else and b) benefits generally according to his contribution he who takes part with me and c) the same opportunity is open to others and d) the excesses possible are curtailed for the common good.

This probably makes me the biggest idiot in the world - there is no doubt whatever that if I abandoned my principles and applied the "principles" of the less scrupulous I should be at least 2-3 million dollars up by this time next year instead of struggling along. I know enough law to avoid paying anyone a penny for their haulage services and enough about this business to engineer that for at least 12 months and maybe longer, and enough about business insolvency to walk away quite unscathed - my credit rating would take a hit thats about all, but who cares about credit rating when you have millions stashed away?

E

Lady E, oh sure, you need regulations like that of course.
In this country the states take care of that kind of thing and then the feds (Obama) step in and try to tell auto manufacturers what kind of cars to build based on "fuel consumption" instead of what "the market" needs and wants!
The federal govt. in the U.S. is far too big and far too expensive. They want to do things they're not supposed to be doing and don't do things they (are) supposed to be doing.

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Post #: 45

RE: what's in a name? - 5/30/2010 1:32:01 PM

brainiacsub

Posts: 1209
Joined: 11/11/2007
From: San Antonio, TX
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Moonhead

quote:

ORIGINAL: thishereboi
Personally, I doubt you will ever get anyone to agree on the basic definitions although I liked brainiacs idea of just looking them up.

Isn't that what lady E was complaining about in the first place? I'm old fashioned enough to agree with her that a noun should be defined by what it says in the dictionary or a similar reference book, rather than some bizarre fantasy meaning shared by nutcases who think that all reference books are propagating an evil lefty conspiracy, and/or published and funded by Zionists.

The real rub for me is that this isn't like 20 or 30 yrs ago. I mean, when I was growing up, if you wanted to know something, finding the answer was half the battle. Looking things up in textbooks and encyclopedias was no trivial task, and if you didn't have these materials handy in your home, it meant a trip to the library where one had to also know the Dewey Decimal System and how to use the library card catalogue. One could easily spend an entire day trying to understand the differences between socialism, Marxism, and communism. Now, with the advent of the Internet - the same technology that allows these discussions to take place with people from all over the world in near real time - we have instantaneous access at the tips of our fingers to all the answers contained in 10,000,000 encyclopedias, and people are still ignorant of basic definitions and concepts. I can only surmise that some people don't want to know, or they are just lazy.

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Post #: 46

RE: what's in a name? - 5/31/2010 3:26:04 AM

LadyEllen

Posts: 10931
Joined: 6/30/2006
From: Stourport-England
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quote:

ORIGINAL: popeye1250
Lady E, oh sure, you need regulations like that of course.
In this country the states take care of that kind of thing and then the feds (Obama) step in and try to tell auto manufacturers what kind of cars to build based on "fuel consumption" instead of what "the market" needs and wants!

But regulations to oblige manufacturers to build more fuel efficient cars fall into the same bracket - it is public policy made flesh, and the public policy here is to reduce emissions (not a bad thing even if you dont believe in climate change), and reduce the consumption of a dwindling resource, fossil fuels, as well as the strategic policy of reducing reliance for those fuels on some unstable parts of the world.

The question is (first part) whether you think those policies are valid and worthwhile to pursue? And I cant imagine many saying theyre not.

The question then is (second part) what measures you would prefer to achieve the objectives of these policies that would differ from obliging manufacturers to build more efficient cars?

E

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Post #: 47