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RE: Acceptance/Resistance Among The Believers and The N... - 6/9/2010 10:25:16 AM   
SL4V3M4YB3


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quote:

ORIGINAL: MissAsylum
I didn't side with anybody.

quote:

ORIGINAL: MissAsylum
As far as getting resistance, i'd have to say its a mixture of both groups, but those who do not believe in a higher power tend to give me more grief. I often go towards the path of "we can just agree to disagree" in hopes of moving on, but its more often than not that those who do not believe will keep forcing their opinions on me.I appreciate the passion they typically have, but it does chap my ass a bit when I'm mature enough to respect their opinions, but they tend not to be bothered with doing the same. Again- this is just what I have encountered in life.

Then it pretty much runs on from that bold part, this whole statement is an opinion. If it wasn't for this opinion of yours I probably wouldn't have answered as the op was of no real interest.


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RE: Acceptance/Resistance Among The Believers and The N... - 6/9/2010 10:29:07 AM   
MissAsylum


Posts: 1863
Joined: 1/9/2009
Status: offline 		ok- they give me more grief.

thats it.



i do not side with those who are of my faith more. they just don't give me AS MUCH RESISTANCE.


< Message edited by MissAsylum -- 6/9/2010 10:30:09 AM >

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RE: Acceptance/Resistance Among The Believers and The N... - 6/9/2010 10:29:42 AM   
SL4V3M4YB3


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Musicmystery
How about if he just writes it for you?

I wouldn't know how much gpa to charge.

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RE: Acceptance/Resistance Among The Believers and The N... - 6/9/2010 10:35:29 AM   
Musicmystery


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quote:

ORIGINAL: MissAsylum

ok- they give me more grief.

thats it.



i do not side with those who are of my faith more. they just don't give me AS MUCH RESISTANCE.


Kind of an obvious point, isn't it--they and and you already basically agree. Why would there be resistance?

An atheist could say much the same.

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RE: Acceptance/Resistance Among The Believers and The N... - 6/9/2010 10:36:13 AM   
HypnoPants


Posts: 32
Joined: 1/16/2006
From: Edmonton, Alberta
Status: offline 		well I'm a HypnoDom... hypnosis stems directly from how religion works (such as prayer trance and the subtle brainwashing cults do :P) ... so for me, believers are the easiest to work with... they accept suggestions, even those that would normally be against their morals, because to them the suggestions seem as if they came from a higher power... perhaps through me (you know, the whole holy spirit thing).

Although I'm Atheist, and my pet is now too... she tends to worship me as if I were a God :P but that's out of love... when she lost her faith in christianity... she felt that she wasn't ready... so she requested that her new religion be BDSM, and I be her new 'God' so to speak.
Which is great of course, it's so much easier to shut her up when she tries to tell me she's 'not beautiful' and I grab her collar and tell her all the severe punishments (and a loss of collar for a short time, like corner time for kids :P) she'll receive if she keeps making judgements about herself... she understands now that only her Master can judge her, no one else, especially her...
On that note, she's getting better every day :) just last night she stopped herself from judging her poetry before considering letting me read it... she decided to just let me read it, and I'll make my own judgements of it... I'm so proud of her! *manly tears!* d-( TvT) <-- ICTu (Invincible Cheezy Thumbs-up)

- Alex

d-(¯~¯)

< Message edited by HypnoPants -- 6/9/2010 11:17:45 AM >

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RE: Acceptance/Resistance Among The Believers and The N... - 6/9/2010 11:25:18 AM   
rulemylife


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quote:

ORIGINAL: lazarus1983

My answer isn't going to help your paper much, but I would say both sides are about equal. Both sides contain people that refuse to budge in their position and viewpoint. One of my best friends and a co-worker is a devout Christian, and I am a devout agnostic, and we get along fine. We both understand and respect the other's viewpoints, and neither of us tread on the other.

However, I've gotten into arguments with as many atheists as theists. Those that bother me are those that assume to know what can't be known. Both sides do it, theists assume to know that their deity created everything, and atheists assume to know that that deity does not exist. As an agnostic, I simply preach, "I don't know." Because it's the truth.

But it's the die hards in each group, that are so inflexible in their positions, that love to hate each other, that I get into arguments with. Neither side is innocent in this area.


So, to summarize your position you believe that anything is possible, even though there is a great deal of evidence to suggest that God is a fiction and very little to support that God is a fact.

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RE: Acceptance/Resistance Among The Believers and The N... - 6/9/2010 11:31:31 AM   
MissAsylum


Posts: 1863
Joined: 1/9/2009
Status: offline 		just because they don't give me as much- it does not mean that i do not get any- which i had said in an earlier post.

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RE: Acceptance/Resistance Among The Believers and The N... - 6/9/2010 11:33:58 AM   
subtee


Posts: 5133
Joined: 7/26/2007
Status: offline 		It seems to me it just depends on who is in one's life and the tolerance of those folks.

My brother is a born again Christian. He feels it is an integral part and expression of his faith to proselytize to me and mine. He vigorously does so. He won't really listen or engage with me about my own beliefs.

I don't know anyone who feels the strength of their atheism to the extent that my brother feels the strength of his Christianity. So.

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RE: Acceptance/Resistance Among The Believers and The N... - 6/9/2010 11:34:09 AM   
rulemylife


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Joined: 8/23/2004
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quote:

ORIGINAL: MissAsylum

As far as getting resistance, i'd have to say its a mixture of both groups, but those who do not believe in a higher power tend to give me more grief. I often go towards the path of "we can just agree to disagree" in hopes of moving on, but its more often than not that those who do not believe will keep forcing their opinions on me.I appreciate the passion they typically have, but it does chap my ass a bit when I'm mature enough to respect their opinions, but they tend not to be bothered with doing the same. Again- this is just what I have encountered in life.


I see.

So those people "forcing their opinions" on you who do not have the maturity to respect others opinions is what forced you to start this thread to let everyone know how disrespectful and immature they are.

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RE: Acceptance/Resistance Among The Believers and The N... - 6/9/2010 11:34:27 AM   
HypnoPants


Posts: 32
Joined: 1/16/2006
From: Edmonton, Alberta
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: rulemylife

quote:

ORIGINAL: lazarus1983

My answer isn't going to help your paper much, but I would say both sides are about equal. Both sides contain people that refuse to budge in their position and viewpoint. One of my best friends and a co-worker is a devout Christian, and I am a devout agnostic, and we get along fine. We both understand and respect the other's viewpoints, and neither of us tread on the other.

However, I've gotten into arguments with as many atheists as theists. Those that bother me are those that assume to know what can't be known. Both sides do it, theists assume to know that their deity created everything, and atheists assume to know that that deity does not exist. As an agnostic, I simply preach, "I don't know." Because it's the truth.

But it's the die hards in each group, that are so inflexible in their positions, that love to hate each other, that I get into arguments with. Neither side is innocent in this area.


So, to summarize your position you believe that anything is possible, even though there is a great deal of evidence to suggest that God is a fiction and very little to support that God is a fact.



nah, it's more of a case of how the majority of humans, theist and atheist, don't understand what 'evidence' actually is.
Nor do most understand what/how scientific method works, and why it's so effective as the 'exam' hypotheses have to go through to achieve 'scientific/empirical theory' status... also known now as a 'Theorum' like the mathematics term 'Theorem'.
What's worse... is that somehow people can believe that it's okay to accept one scientific theory as a fact (such as gravity) and deny others... every theory gained it's accuracy and status via the scientific method... if you deny one theory that has passed the scientific method test... then you may as well deny all of them... afterall, magic doesn't need to be proven... that's why they call it magic, that's the definition of magic really...

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RE: Acceptance/Resistance Among The Believers and The N... - 6/9/2010 11:36:44 AM   
MissAsylum


Posts: 1863
Joined: 1/9/2009
Status: offline 		he said he preaches "i don't know" please don't add to anything to his or any other statement to promote your views on if God or any other higher being exsists. I said to refrain from that- it applies to you as well.

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RE: Acceptance/Resistance Among The Believers and The N... - 6/9/2010 11:41:20 AM   
rulemylife


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quote:

ORIGINAL: subtee

It seems to me it just depends on who is in one's life and the tolerance of those folks.

My brother is a born again Christian. He feels it is an integral part and expression of his faith to proselytize to me and mine. He vigorously does so. He won't really listen or engage with me about my own beliefs.

I don't know anyone who feels the strength of their atheism to the extent that my brother feels the strength of his Christianity. So.


Because the whole concept of proselytizing is integral to many faiths.

I have a close relative who was "born again" who doesn't associate with me anymore because I told him that when we talk we need to keep his religious views out of it.

And that wasn't acceptable.





< Message edited by rulemylife -- 6/9/2010 12:08:40 PM >

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RE: Acceptance/Resistance Among The Believers and The N... - 6/9/2010 11:43:40 AM   
MissAsylum


Posts: 1863
Joined: 1/9/2009
Status: offline 		and no. somebody asked me to site a view- so i gave mine. if i wanted to complain about how immature somebody is for forcing thier views, i would have made you thread about you or sent you a private message.

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RE: Acceptance/Resistance Among The Believers and The N... - 6/9/2010 11:45:53 AM   
rulemylife


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quote:

ORIGINAL: MissAsylum

he said he preaches "i don't know" please don't add to anything to his or any other statement to promote your views on if God or any other higher being exsists. I said to refrain from that- it applies to you as well.


Bullshit!

You start a thread on believers v. non-believers and you expect the topic of belief to be kept out of it?


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RE: Acceptance/Resistance Among The Believers and The N... - 6/9/2010 11:47:25 AM   
subtee


Posts: 5133
Joined: 7/26/2007
Status: offline 		Right, exactly, and my brother is one of the best men ever and so after years of discord I decided to put it aside. I let him give me the books and pamphlets, I let him pray at our meals, I let him express what he needs to express and we have peace.

And just to be clear, I don't mean that there are not atheists who are just as fervent and vocal and intolerant as my brother, because there are. They be here. I mean just that I don't personally know any. I know many atheists and many agnostics, but not preachy ones.

That's why I began by saying, "it just depends on who is in one's life and the tolerance of those folks."

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RE: Acceptance/Resistance Among The Believers and The N... - 6/9/2010 11:56:11 AM   
HypnoPants


Posts: 32
Joined: 1/16/2006
From: Edmonton, Alberta
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: subtee

It seems to me it just depends on who is in one's life and the tolerance of those folks.

My brother is a born again Christian. He feels it is an integral part and expression of his faith to proselytize to me and mine. He vigorously does so. He won't really listen or engage with me about my own beliefs.

I don't know anyone who feels the strength of their atheism to the extent that my brother feels the strength of his Christianity. So.


hehe, like when it's said that this tyrant or that was atheist... I'm sure they were, but they weren't doing their evil deeds 'in the name of nothing' :P it was usually power, politics, control, etc... something neither theists nor atheists can deny has happened in the past on both fronts... moreso on religion's door though since Atheism has only really been this popular since the late 1900s.
Whether theist or atheist... power, politics, all those sorts of things... can have an influence or effect on you, or on your leaders :P etc. (cough, ted haggard, cough cough) but the point I'm making is that theists do what they do, whether it be good or evil, in the name of their religion... Atheists, whether they do good or evil, never do so in the name of 'nothing' :P

To make it a little clearer... humans evolved the ability to have teleology with one another... empathy and such, to understand each other even if just a little... and to try and understand what the other is thinking... it seperates us from most animals...
However, it's called an 'evolutionary misfiring' when a human tries to find the teleology of natural things... that ability wasn't meant to be used on nature, but on other humans... when used on nature, it gives the feeling of understanding things more than just 'where we are' ... even though those feelings can mean absolutely nothing... it's why we have so many crazy religions out there, and why before christianity... we had even crazier ones :P christianity I'll admit has helped humanity along... but only until modern science... it was first tribal religions, then 'pagan' religions, then christianity, and now scientific method... they're steps in humanity's (staircase?) to the future.


Anyways, point being... religion is an immature way of defending your psyche from depression, such as thoughts of death... it was useful back when people had no real schooling at all, and never thought about their beliefs anyways... nowadays, with schooling more common, when you think about your beliefs... it brings back that feeling of depression from being afraid of the 'unknown' like death... when in reality, modern science helps you to quell that fear of the unknown... it makes death just seem like something that's going to happen, so we should try to make the most of our lives while we're here... since this is all we get.

On the other hand, if you believe there is more... you're a lot less likely to care about events that happen here on Earth... you let emotions cloud your logic... it also makes everything seem so... simple. when in reality, nothing is ever truly simple... if you think it is, you just haven't seen enough of it yet.

Lastly, humans all live in their own realities, side by side with the universal reality of nature... I don't mean anything mystical by that, I just mean that if someone takes LSD, you're not going to see what they're seeing... because they're seeing thing through their own eyes, their own reality... and you see things through yours.
Atheism, more importantly modern science, brings us closer to the universal reality... where we see things through the eyes of everyone in that universal reality, from many angles (metaphorically speaking), and we're able to make decisions and interepretations without the private prejudice of our own inner minds. ((private prejudices can be things like... how you feel about a certain group of people, or how you feel about how nature works, etc.)) So that we make reasonable logical decisions about the world and peoples around us... one that everyone can actually share.
((by that I mean, well... take this for example, with theism every religious group has their own view of everything... Atheism has only the universal reality view **and I don't mean those atheists who treat 'no Gods' as if that in itself is a God** or rather, if you take any one religion... and compare it's population to that of Atheism... Atheism always has more, because there are no Atheist sub-groups, as there are in Theism... like Muslim or Catholic, Atheism has only one... Atheism... so there will always be more Atheists than any one religion))



... well, I successfully fought off boredom today.

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RE: Acceptance/Resistance Among The Believers and The N... - 6/9/2010 11:59:52 AM   
HypnoPants


Posts: 32
Joined: 1/16/2006
From: Edmonton, Alberta
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: subtee

Right, exactly, and my brother is one of the best men ever and so after years of discord I decided to put it aside. I let him give me the books and pamphlets, I let him pray at our meals, I let him express what he needs to express and we have peace.

And just to be clear, I don't mean that there are not atheists who are just as fervent and vocal and intolerant as my brother, because there are. They be here. I mean just that I don't personally know any. I know many atheists and many agnostics, but not preachy ones.

That's why I began by saying, "it just depends on who is in one's life and the tolerance of those folks."


tis true, if you're raised like a theist, but taught to be an atheist... generally you'll act like a theist.
Atheist is much harder to work with, we're pre-programmed since birth to not use logic and reason, as they're not needed for survival generally... it's something we learn.
Since most really don't care to learn much of anything at all :P ... heh, if you have an atheist who didn't care to learn logic and reason... well, you get the idea... he'll use his emotions to work things out instead.

Emotions are fine, but they should not be used to make decisions about how everything works, lol.

< Message edited by HypnoPants -- 6/9/2010 12:01:31 PM >

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RE: Acceptance/Resistance Among The Believers and The N... - 6/9/2010 12:06:10 PM   
MissAsylum


Posts: 1863
Joined: 1/9/2009
Status: offline 		you may want to go over my original post again. i did not ask for anything you have been spouting. i am writing a paper- not having fun- not trying to stir the pot. i was very specific on what i'm asking for- and for whatever the reason is- you hijack and diviate from the subject. start your own thread and do it there since you feel so inclined to talk about God not being real. i don't care what you believe in- thats your choice. i'm not asking you to prove that God doesn't exsit- or re-word what i have and another poster has said. i do not care.

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RE: Acceptance/Resistance Among The Believers and The N... - 6/9/2010 12:09:03 PM   
SL4V3M4YB3


Posts: 3506
Joined: 12/20/2007
From: S.E. London U.K.
Status: offline 		This is serious business, stop fucking about everyone!

There is a paper to be written.

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Profile   Post #: 39
RE: Acceptance/Resistance Among The Believers and The N... - 6/9/2010 12:10:42 PM   
MissAsylum


Posts: 1863
Joined: 1/9/2009
Status: offline 		i could almost use your post as is for my paper- too bad it has to be 30 pages :(

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